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Think About It... A person with Borderline Personality Disorder often presents with a characteristic relationship pattern over time. This pattern usually evolves through three stages: The Vulnerable Seducer, The Clinger, and The Hater. This evolution may take months, and sometimes even years to cycle through. In the later periods, the personality often swings back and forth from one phase to the next. ~ Roger Melton, M.A..
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Author Topic: Statistics on BPD relationships and divorce?  (Read 2158 times)
mermaid8
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« on: February 28, 2012, 09:47:40 PM »

After coming across some photos of my ex and my replacement...I had a bit of a setback last week. But I am doing better. Each time the wound is re-opened I seem to come out of it and heal a little bit more. Granted, a lot of tears were shed and it knocked me for a loop since my ex told me that "he didn't want anyone else" when he broke up with me...and that "he just couldn't be a boyfriend"... barfy

Anyway, of course the photo's look like they are just soooo happy together and in the honeymoon phase which I admit is hard to see! But I am trying my best to understand that the r/s will likely take the same path down the same road that mine did. And this is what helps me to cope.

While thinking about the "probable" demise of their r/s which is on borrowed time, as I would like to think, I was wondering if there were any valid statistics on the "divorce rate" or "failure rate" of BPD relationships?

I have read in several places that the divorce rate or probability of a Bi Polar relationship failing is 90%. Just wondering if there were figures that documented BPD relationships as well?
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modelc
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« Reply #1 on: February 28, 2012, 09:56:32 PM »

http://BPD.about.com/od/forfamilyandfriends/a/BPDmarriage.htm



35% from what I've read...this is just a site a saw it on recently
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mermaid8
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« Reply #2 on: February 28, 2012, 10:06:10 PM »

Wow, quite surprising actually! Thank you for that link. I wasn't expecting those statistics...I figured the statistics would have been closer to those of Bipolar.
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modelc
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« Reply #3 on: February 28, 2012, 10:11:52 PM »

Yah... I was kinda surprised too because with all of the research and how well known bipolar is...the treatment is more common so you would think there would be more success rates.   
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“Never forget that once upon a time, in an unguarded moment, you recognized yourself as a friend.”
GENERAL ANNOUNCEMENT: Are you on the right board?
This board is for members with failed or failing relationships that want to detach from their relationship and relationship wounds. If you are still analyzing the decision to stay, please post on Undecided: Staying or Leaving
All members living with a pwBPD should learn to use the Stop the Bleeding tools - boundaries, timeouts and other basic tools - to better manage the day to day interactions with your partner. If you have questions on any of the tools, feel free to go over to Staying: Improving a Relationship with a Borderline Partner and ask for help. :-)
beyondbelief
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« Reply #4 on: February 29, 2012, 01:49:59 AM »

I would be very skeptical about these kinds of statistics.  Of the millions of divorces that occur each year many of those people suffer from BPD and don't know it. What likely happened is they did a census of people who have been diagnosed and missed the vast majority.  I would bet that most people who have been divorced many times suffer from a mental issue or are attracted to those who are.

Eddy notes that only 10% of divorces turn into a custody battle and the court system is clogged with people suffering from some PD or another.  Since it is estimated that roughly 10% of the population suffers from a PD, I doubt it is a coincidence.  I am not saying everyone in a custody battle has a PD nor am I saying that everyone with a PD gets involved in a custody battle however I would be willing to bet there is a considerable overlap of the two sets.
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Clearmind
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« Reply #5 on: February 29, 2012, 03:31:29 AM »

80% of statistics are made up  wink ~ and I would agree I am always sceptical about probabilities let alone stats.

I only need to think of the divorce rate for 'non' BPD r/s...too many anomalies ~ not all pwBPD may be diagnosed would put a major ? over any stats.
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modelc
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« Reply #6 on: February 29, 2012, 01:29:10 PM »

Especially in BPD cases because so many of them really aren't diagnosed or are diagnosed incorrectly.  But I would assume this is a statistic based on what they can prove.  To be honest, I think it all depends on the Non BPD anyway...

I know I would have stayed with my BPDH and done everything I could to help, support and work through the disorder.  Not every Non BPD would or could do that and then you have the situations like I do have in which my BPDH is the one ending the marriage because of his own emotional instability and his desire to imagine that the grass is always greener.  It never turns out that way, but he truly believes it will.

Which is also why I think bipolar statistics are so much different.  That disorder is easier diagnosed and I'm wondering how many diagnosed with bipolar are actually BPD instead.
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mermaid8
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« Reply #7 on: February 29, 2012, 06:43:58 PM »

Thank you for your thoughts, everyone...it does make more sense considering how many pwBPD are undiagnosed.

I came across more information on BPD diagnosis from the link that modelc provided above. In it it explains that in T, BPD traits don't often arise (or at least not during the beginning of T) because many of them are linked directly with close/intimate relationships. Therefore, if a pwBPD bails on T too soon, which we all know they usually do...those behaviors are not yet uncovered and may go undiagnosed. This truly helped me understand why so many go undiagnosed and this seemed to make a lot of sense!
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Clearmind
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« Reply #8 on: February 29, 2012, 06:55:19 PM »

I would agree with that Mermaid. Bonding is what triggers BPD behaviors. Many IMHO may go un-treated for this reason.

To my knowledge a revised DSM is in tow which is less black and white than DSM 1V in the sense it refers to degree of 'impairment' rather than the 1-9 criteria. It confused me at first and I now see clearly how this may assist with dx'ing/level of treatment required etc.
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mermaid8
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« Reply #9 on: February 29, 2012, 07:14:03 PM »

I would agree with that Mermaid. Bonding is what triggers BPD behaviors. Many IMHO may go un-treated for this reason.

To my knowledge a revised DSM is in tow which is less black and white than DSM 1V in the sense it refers to degree of 'impairment' rather than the 1-9 criteria. It confused me at first and I now see clearly how this may assist with dx'ing/level of treatment required etc.

Regarding the revised DSM information, Clearmind...My ex has 8 of the 9 criteria but he is still high functioning. His struggles are kept very hidden and he is literally tortured internally. I would honestly say that not even his family members or close friends have a clue as to the extent of his "issues". I believe to this day, that I am the only one that he allowed to get so close to see him without the "mask"...And that in effect is why he has to also get rid of me.
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Clearmind
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« Reply #10 on: February 29, 2012, 07:35:52 PM »

My ex is a Waif and while I thought he was high-functioning he actually isn't. Its not to suggest that Waifs are all low functioning - however because he was so so closed off  emotionally and as you say the mask was certainly clear to me - I really had no clue what was going on until I was out of it myself. Putting on a brave face for others was certainly evident.

SO's family have no clue either - they have their own dysfunction and the FOG is thick. They all fed each others dependency issues.

I am not familar enough with the new DSM to be saying too much Mermaid - no doubt there will more info on FTF soonish. It appears that there is more room or a sliding scale in the new DSM - which makes sense.
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mermaid8
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« Reply #11 on: February 29, 2012, 08:01:47 PM »

Clearmind,

What is interesting to me, now that we are talking about high functioning and lower functioning pwBPD...I think it has boiled down to my assuming that my ex is high functioning because of his career success and how he has literally, and I mean literally fooled hundreds of thousands of people. I won't go into detail, but my ex is a local celebrity and makes his living from his "personality". How ironic is that? BUT that personality that he portrays is an act and it is a mask...I have assumed he is high functioning because he can pull this off... When truthfully, on his down time he is often spending his weekends in bed or curled up on fetal position, or sulking. That is not high functioning but that is hidden as well.

Anyway, you bringing up that thought made me take another look at the term and how I have applied it to my ex.

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Peace4ME
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« Reply #12 on: March 01, 2012, 08:47:13 AM »


Regarding the revised DSM information, Clearmind...My ex has 8 of the 9 criteria but he is still high functioning. His struggles are kept very hidden and he is literally tortured internally. I would honestly say that not even his family members or close friends have a clue as to the extent of his "issues". I believe to this day, that I am the only one that he allowed to get so close to see him without the "mask"...And that in effect is why he has to also get rid of me.

Mermaid, sounds like we were/are in a relationship with the same person. He was in a long term relationship before me that was chaos at best. Multiple breakups, flying across the country, she pulled a knife at him at one point when he was in her face. In the beginning I felt sorry for him that someone would act that way with him, but its become very obvious that it probably wasn't her. And its not me. I'm not perfect, but I've never had such a volatile relationship like this. Its exhausting. My uPBDso is high functioning and to me exhibits 8 traits as well. His parents know that he has "issues" but as you said, I feel that I am the one that gets its all. They just think he's depressed. It makes me sad that he "trusts" me enough to open up about all that is torturing him inside, but then when I can't make it better, I bear the brunt of it all. Nobody can really know what its like. I know I don't know what he feels like. But I just can't handle the push/pull crazymaking behavior anymore. I'm losing my spirit for life, and I know I'm not making his any better either. And like you said, now he/we will have to get rid of each other. Because the ugly is on the table and its too painful for him to bear. He just wants to put it away again and blame our issues on me.
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« Reply #13 on: March 01, 2012, 09:15:33 AM »

Quote
Anyway, of course the photo's look like they are just soooo happy together

I got a message from an old friend on facebook saying that she was really glad to see me and my family so happy...that is one week before I left my BPDgf.  Nobody knows what goes on behind closed doors and facebook is not a real glimpse into anyones real lives.


Quote
I wasn't expecting those statistics...I figured the statistics would have been closer to those of Bipolar.

The numbers don't mean much, your chances of divorce in any relationship is around 50% and of those that don't get divorced I am guessing another 50% are miserable.  With BPD the divorce rate is probably about the same but I am guessing 95% of those that remain together are very unhappy.

I tried really hard to figure out a way to be even mildly happy with my BPDex but the way I described it is that BPD covers your family in a dark cloud and sucks the life out of everyone.
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HardDaysNight
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« Reply #14 on: March 01, 2012, 05:30:31 PM »

...Eddy notes that only 10% of divorces turn into a custody battle and the court system is clogged with people suffering from some PD or another.  Since it is estimated that roughly 10% of the population suffers from a PD, I doubt it is a coincidence.  I am not saying everyone in a custody battle has a PD nor am I saying that everyone with a PD gets involved in a custody battle however I would be willing to bet there is a considerable overlap of the two sets.

I'd say everyone of those custody battles involve a PD on one or both sides, or someone with a serious substance disorder who just can't see how they are unfit.   Two reasonable loving parents would never drag their kids through a custody battle and would agree to start at 50/50.
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Simpleone
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« Reply #15 on: March 01, 2012, 05:41:53 PM »

I thought mine was SOOO happy based on their FB pictures and I thought the honeymoon would last longer than ours- not a chance. They are done. I never thought it would happen, but it did, and it will with yours, too.

What about those BPD's that dont get married, based on attachment issues? They wouldnt fall in that study.
I'm amazed by those that were married for YEARS. Mine was married for 10 years to his 1st wife, but he was gone a lot (military) and I believe his BPD has gotten worse over time.
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beyondbelief
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« Reply #16 on: March 01, 2012, 06:15:10 PM »

I'd say everyone of those custody battles involve a PD on one or both sides, or someone with a serious substance disorder who just can't see how they are unfit.   Two reasonable loving parents would never drag their kids through a custody battle and would agree to start at 50/50.

Not always the case.  For instance sometimes parents want to live in places too far apart to allow 50-50.  Serious differences in parenting styles or values.  There are probably thousands of reasons that do not involve impaired mental health.  However absent something readily explainable, the odds do probably go way way up.
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mermaid8
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« Reply #17 on: March 01, 2012, 09:08:26 PM »


Regarding the revised DSM information, Clearmind...My ex has 8 of the 9 criteria but he is still high functioning. His struggles are kept very hidden and he is literally tortured internally. I would honestly say that not even his family members or close friends have a clue as to the extent of his "issues". I believe to this day, that I am the only one that he allowed to get so close to see him without the "mask"...And that in effect is why he has to also get rid of me.

Mermaid, sounds like we were/are in a relationship with the same person. He was in a long term relationship before me that was chaos at best. Multiple breakups, flying across the country, she pulled a knife at him at one point when he was in her face. In the beginning I felt sorry for him that someone would act that way with him, but its become very obvious that it probably wasn't her. And its not me. I'm not perfect, but I've never had such a volatile relationship like this. Its exhausting. My uPBDso is high functioning and to me exhibits 8 traits as well. His parents know that he has "issues" but as you said, I feel that I am the one that gets its all. They just think he's depressed. It makes me sad that he "trusts" me enough to open up about all that is torturing him inside, but then when I can't make it better, I bear the brunt of it all. Nobody can really know what its like. I know I don't know what he feels like. But I just can't handle the push/pull crazymaking behavior anymore. I'm losing my spirit for life, and I know I'm not making his any better either. And like you said, now he/we will have to get rid of each other. Because the ugly is on the table and its too painful for him to bear. He just wants to put it away again and blame our issues on me.

Peace4me, It sounds like you are still in your r/s? Or perhaps you are figuring out when and how to leave? As you said, you are losing your spirit for life. I think these r/s's can suck the life out of us. We give until there is nothing left of us. And is this workth it? What are we getting in exchange for our compassion and understanding? I believe that the pwBPD will always have to blame their issues on something or someone. That someone is usually us, the person they are closest to...and the thing that helped me to put this into perspective was that people with this disorder "distort or create facts to match their feelings". Meaning, that the bad feelings they have need to be blamed on something...so they create scenerios and blow things out of proportion to match how they feel. It is not at all true or logical but it is part of the illness. They are sick and this won't get better no matter what we do. It si really sad...
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mermaid8
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« Reply #18 on: March 01, 2012, 09:11:42 PM »

I thought mine was SOOO happy based on their FB pictures and I thought the honeymoon would last longer than ours- not a chance. They are done. I never thought it would happen, but it did, and it will with yours, too.

What about those BPD's that dont get married, based on attachment issues? They wouldnt fall in that study.
I'm amazed by those that were married for YEARS. Mine was married for 10 years to his 1st wife, but he was gone a lot (military) and I believe his BPD has gotten worse over time.

Good point your brought up about the BPD's that don't ever get married...I know that according to my ex who has had already had two failed marriages and a string of failed r/'s ...which where ALL the other person's fault, right? Well, he told me that in his two marriages, they had to "beg him" to get married. He didn't really want to, but they pressured him. When my ex asked me to marry him, he made a big deal of telling me that he has NEVER asked a woman to marry him despite the fact that he has been married twice. I guess I should have seen that as  a HUGE Red Flag  ! I believe my ex's BPD has gotten worse ovet time as well.
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mermaid8
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« Reply #19 on: March 01, 2012, 09:14:54 PM »

Quote
Anyway, of course the photo's look like they are just soooo happy together

I got a message from an old friend on facebook saying that she was really glad to see me and my family so happy...that is one week before I left my BPDgf.  Nobody knows what goes on behind closed doors and facebook is not a real glimpse into anyones real lives.


Quote
I wasn't expecting those statistics...I figured the statistics would have been closer to those of Bipolar.

The numbers don't mean much, your chances of divorce in any relationship is around 50% and of those that don't get divorced I am guessing another 50% are miserable.  With BPD the divorce rate is probably about the same but I am guessing 95% of those that remain together are very unhappy.

I tried really hard to figure out a way to be even mildly happy with my BPDex but the way I described it is that BPD covers your family in a dark cloud and sucks the life out of everyone.

Great point, I appreciate you reminding me. I guess I should think back to ALLLLLL of the photos my ex posted of me and of us together on FB. To the world we looked really happy too and no one would have guessed him to be the tortured mess of a man that he is...So even though things may look one way, these people are masters of disguise! 
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