April 25, 2014, 03:02:22 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Today's Feature: WORKSHOP: Do you know the art of WiseMind?  Learn more
Moderators: DreamGirl, P.F.Change, Rapt Reader
Advisors: an0ught, heartandwhole, livednlearned, pessim-optimist, Surnia, Waverider, winston72
Ambassadors: crumblingdad, DreamFlyer99, growing_wings, Kwamina, learning_curve74, maxsterling, maxen, Mutt, peaceplease, scallops, Turkish
Guidelines: Terms of Service, Abbreviations
  Home Blog   Boards   Help Login Register  
What is this?
Pages: [1] 2  All   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Self Control, Emotional Withdraw or Acceptance  (Read 1150 times)
Sir5r
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 1106



« on: March 01, 2012, 11:19:40 AM »

My wife has refused to see the therapist for 3 weeks.  Her excuse is that I haven't improved.  She says I make statements and bring things up that agitate her.  I do bring things up, not a lot but enough for her to know I'm concerned about them.  I don't do this all the time maybe once every couple of days.  Recently some things came to light about her past that are really par for the course as far as what she should have let me in on before we were married.  I've always thought things were not as they seemed and that's been confirmed. 

I've discussed it with my therapist and he has said I must wait until she is ready to explain it all to me and I've tried to wait and wait and wait.

Now I find myself looking at her and feeling disdain. She knows what my issues are and she knows how important these things are to me but wants to forget it all.

I can't do that.  I'm really starting to emotionally withdraw.  I don't want to spend time with her. I get home and have my "Official Contact" and withdraw to my office and leave as soon as dinner is done and cleaned up.

I find myself thinking about my future and whether she is going to be in it.  If she is going to be there all of my questioning must be settled.  It began as a matter of trust and now seems to be a requirement for me to put my full faith in her and the relationship.

This has been an issue for me for a long time and I need it settled or I'm not going to be able to stay around.

For those that need to know. The issues are about her sexual past and the fact it is wildly different from what I was led to believe.


Sir5r
Logged

To enjoy good health, to bring true happiness to one's family, to bring peace to all, one must first discipline and control one's own mind. If a man can control his mind he can find the way to Enlightenment, and all wisdom and virtue will naturally come to him.
-    Buddha
Auspicious
Distinguished Member
Emeritus
**
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 8437



« Reply #1 on: March 01, 2012, 11:33:04 AM »

I don't do this all the time maybe once every couple of days.  Recently some things came to light about her past that are really par for the course as far as what she should have let me in on before we were married.  I've always thought things were not as they seemed and that's been confirmed.  

We've discussed this here before ... this seems to be at the level of obsession for you.

Rather than have that discussion again, let's just stipulate that getting her to "come clean" about her distant sexual past is hugely important for you.

She, however (possibly for reasons that have to do with her mental health issues and/or history of sexual trauma) does not want to tell you what you want.

We don't know how much of the relationship turmoil is being triggered by this focus of yours. It's quite possible some of it would abate if you left off this focus.

At any rate, you are in a stalemate. What are your values, about this stuff? What are your goals?  Is your desire to have the kind of "full report" that you want more important than continuing the relationship?  That's your personal choice, but be aware, that's what it is coming down to.
Logged

Have you read the Lessons?

Sir5r
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 1106



« Reply #2 on: March 01, 2012, 11:46:57 AM »


I don't do this all the time maybe once every couple of days.  Recently some things came to light about her past that are really par for the course as far as what she should have let me in on before we were married.  I've always thought things were not as they seemed and that's been confirmed.  


We've discussed this here before ... this seems to be at the level of obsession for you.

Rather than have that discussion again, let's just stipulate that getting her to "come clean" about her distant sexual past is hugely important for you.
"Distant" was months before we met. It was relevant at the time and discussed,not truthfully, by her and fully disclosed by me.
She, however (possibly for reasons that have to do with her mental health issues and/or history of sexual trauma) does not want to tell you what you want.

We don't know how much of the relationship turmoil is being triggered by this focus of yours. It's quite possible some of it would abate if you left off this focus.

I had taken my focus off of this completely and when I did she dropped a bomb on me on Valentines day when we were out to dinner.  I have to question her reasoning.  If it's so important NOT to tell me about her past them why when I back off do I hear about it?  It may be her way of maintaining chaos and of being able to blame me for relationship issues.  I'm not sure.

At any rate, you are in a stalemate. What are your values, about this stuff?
Only to get the truth, not to judge her, I still love her ver much but can't indefinitely sustain a relationship with her when so much has been left out.   

What are your goals?  Is your desire to have the kind of "full report" that you want more important than continuing the relationship?
I'm finding it hard to trust her without her trusting me.
That's the root of all of this.  I have no secrets with her, she said she had none with me. That's not the case. 


  That's your personal choice, but be aware, that's what it is coming down to.
I see the relationship ending over this if it isn't settled somehow.

Sir5r

[/quote]
Logged

To enjoy good health, to bring true happiness to one's family, to bring peace to all, one must first discipline and control one's own mind. If a man can control his mind he can find the way to Enlightenment, and all wisdom and virtue will naturally come to him.
-    Buddha
Auspicious
Distinguished Member
Emeritus
**
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 8437



« Reply #3 on: March 01, 2012, 11:57:57 AM »

I had taken my focus off of this completely and when I did she dropped a bomb on me on Valentines day when we were out to dinner.  I have to question her reasoning.  If it's so important NOT to tell me about her past them why when I back off do I hear about it? 

Is it possible that you took the pressure off for awhile, and therefore she felt closer to you and more willing to share?


It may be her way of maintaining chaos and of being able to blame me for relationship issues.  I'm not sure.

Is she creating/maintaining an issue that you "have to" dissolve the relationship over?  Or are you?  Thought
Logged

Have you read the Lessons?

Sir5r
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 1106



« Reply #4 on: March 01, 2012, 01:39:01 PM »

I had taken my focus off of this completely and when I did she dropped a bomb on me on Valentines day when we were out to dinner.  I have to question her reasoning.  If it's so important NOT to tell me about her past them why when I back off do I hear about it? 


Is it possible that you took the pressure off for awhile, and therefore she felt closer to you and more willing to share?
That is possible, but it was brought up at a time I certainly wouldn't have expected it to be.

It may be her way of maintaining chaos and of being able to blame me for relationship issues.  I'm not sure.

Is she creating/maintaining an issue that you "have to" dissolve the relationship over?  Or are you?  Thought

I think she uses it to get me to react and in the past I obliged her, I haven't argued with her over this at all I had dropped hints of wanting to discuss it and since stopped.  I think she is using it to color me as having issues with the therapist.   There would never have been any need for discussion if she was honest in the first place.

I don't see this as ending the relationship directly, more as a continuous erosion of any trust I had for her and in the end where there's no trust why continue in the relationship?


Sir5r

Logged

To enjoy good health, to bring true happiness to one's family, to bring peace to all, one must first discipline and control one's own mind. If a man can control his mind he can find the way to Enlightenment, and all wisdom and virtue will naturally come to him.
-    Buddha
united for now
BOARD ADVISOR
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 11111


Talking about solutions create solutions


WWW
« Reply #5 on: March 01, 2012, 02:08:08 PM »

The facts of the matter, as we've discussed, are that she feels shame about her sexual past, hid it, and lied about it, in the beginning.

None of this is a surprise.
You've suspected the truth for years.
You're intense focus on it, even with reassurances, was too scary. She didn't trust you with the truth. For good reason. Your action aren't matching your words...

Sir, you know the truth, you're just waiting for her to tell you to prove yourself, of what?
Logged

Change your perceptions and you change your life.  Nothing changes without changes


Sir5r
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 1106



« Reply #6 on: March 01, 2012, 03:34:38 PM »

The facts of the matter, as we've discussed, are that she feels shame about her sexual past, hid it, and lied about it, in the beginning.

None of this is a surprise.
You've suspected the truth for years.
You're intense focus on it, even with reassurances, was too scary. She didn't trust you with the truth. For good reason. Your action aren't matching your words...

Sir, you know the truth, you're just waiting for her to tell you to prove yourself, of what?

To prove she trusts me with the truth and that it will not matter.
Logged

To enjoy good health, to bring true happiness to one's family, to bring peace to all, one must first discipline and control one's own mind. If a man can control his mind he can find the way to Enlightenment, and all wisdom and virtue will naturally come to him.
-    Buddha
isilme
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 1252



« Reply #7 on: March 01, 2012, 03:35:13 PM »

Hi Sir5r,

Quote
At any rate, you are in a stalemate. What are your values, about this stuff? What are your goals?  Is your desire to have the kind of "full report" that you want more important than continuing the relationship?  That's your personal choice, but be aware, that's what it is coming down to.

This statement here kind of helped me see where you are coming from a little better than I have in the past, and I have a not quite analogous situation I'd like to share a bit - I don't know if it can help but this is a bit how I see your desire for 'full disclosure'.  Bear with me, I know this will seem unrelated as your and my triggers for a similar feeling are kinda different, but I think I might have an inkling as to why you keep beating this particular horse.

Most here know BF and I have been together 16 years in a few months.  We are not married.  This hurts me greatly, even knowing now that his BPD and fears of engulfment are a big part of it.  It makes me feel rejected.  It makes some social situations awkward.  It makes people look a t me with pity and him with disdain.  He has not learned that a lot of his social problems stem from people looking down on him for not making an 'honest woman' of me after so long.  For 'wasting my time' and so on.  Not that these statements do much for my well-being, either, but I know what they mean to say.  

I've been disposed of and abandoned by many who were 'supposed' to care about me and for me.  So this lack of a formally sanctioned, publicly acknowledged relationship cuts me pretty deeply.  Also, having no normal family relationships, also having an unconventional romantic relationship, even knowing about the BPD, bothers me.

And I know a lot of this is I want him to validate me and my feelings by taking this step.  But let's be real.  In 16 years it hasn't happened.  Even in 16 more, I doubt it will, no matter my silly girly hopes that I can't alway quash come the 6 major proposal days of the year.  But I am still here.  

Though I fight it, a part of me feels that if we reach a point where he actually WANTS, on his own, no persuasion, no 'forcing', no unplanned pregnancy, but WANTS of his own volition to get married, I feel we'd have passed a great hurdle in his mental illness, in his treatment of me, and in my own feelings of being a disposable person.  

So while I want marriage for the respect, the formal vows taken to each other and frankly the convention of it being 'normal' I now it also ties a lot into my own hopes to heal my past hurts with my current life.

But I don't want it to be forced.  I don't want it as the result of any outside motivation.  I wasn't it to be from within him, as a sign that he has reconciled whatever past/present and future worries, concerns, regrets he has over it.  The fact that he would do it on his own would be like a sign that he has healed.  That he can put me and my feelings at least on par with his own.  That I am important and worth the effort.  Any measure of outside force or pressure just would mean he did it because he 'had' to.  

So, I think Sir5r, you want this as a sign your wife values your wants and needs in this area above her own squeamishness about it.  I think the way I see BF putting a new last name on me the way you see your W 'fessing up about her allegedly scarlet past.  

I have chosen for a new name to symbolize that my r/s has moved forward to healing.  For me it would be THE sign that he CAN overcome this, he CAN respect my wants, desires and needs along with his own, he CAN put me first at times, above his own emotions.  That he can finally love me they way I want.  That I can trust him, now, to not really mean it when he asks me to leave, that he will not, like my parents, disregard me and dispose of me when I am more trouble than help, when I can no longer (or will no longer) live to serve and manage his emotions.

I think you are fixated on full disclosure of the past to symbolize something like this for you.  You think if only your W can just do this, all your feelings will be fixed.  And in a way, if she ever, ever gets through enough T, and works enough on herself, you may finally get what you want.  But until then, there lies your Acceptance you mention in your post's title.  

I still have my cursed maiden name from my psycho jerk of a father (and still have it recognized as his), and I really, logically when I use my brain and not my heart's hope, think it's the name I will die with in my 80s, unless I go change it to "Banana-hammock" or something.  But I stay, because though that hurts like I can't tell you as an ultimate rejection of my feelings, wants and needs, I am trying to accept you have what you can have.  For me, there is enough most days worth staying - when things are working, when he is not dysregulating every 5 minutes, it can be really good.  It's not an easy thing, staying, but it's not what you have encountered with the violence, and with children involved.  I try to keep my naked left hand from being a big cause for resentment in the day to day, and admit the pain now and then, but then try to distance myself from it.  Because I am choosing to stay, I am trying really hard to give up on this desire.  

So you DO need to ask what makes you want to stay?  Is your resentment over her abusive behavior, her accusations it's all you, her dismissal of T, and her unwillingness to share this Holy Grail of information with you... is this enough straw on the camel's back?  Or can you find any way at all to lessen this need for her past from her own lips?  What do you do to stifle the urge to know?  Do you reason with yourself about it?  And have you a cut-off date, like if she doesn't tell you by, I don't know, July, that's it you throw in the towel?  Even if you get this from her, do you think that knowledge in itself will be what makes you feel like staying?  Or what the message that she is now willing to share means she is showing you respect and care for your feelings that you hope to accomplish by her telling?
Logged
Steph
Distinguished Member
Emeritus
**
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 7849



« Reply #8 on: March 01, 2012, 04:18:39 PM »

 Ok..

So this same issue is on the table. You need her to tell you and she wont. Talk about a huge push/pull dynamic here.. You know how loaded it is, and so does she.

  One myth you have going on is that if she tells you it means she trusts you. NO it does NOT mean she trusts you. It means that for whatever reason, she opted to tell you..but I can pretty much guarantee that it isnt because she trusts you.

So, I think its VERY important that you check your math on that one..

Disclosure does NOT mean she trusts you.

So, having said that, how important is it for you to know what she has to say? If it isnt about trust...which I think we can pretty much agree on that it isnt about trust as to why she holds onto it..then what is it from your end?

She knows she has a power card because you tell her about it. It gets things going for both of you.

The wise thing to do is to stop bringing it up, and when you find it obsessing in your mind ( could be related to your ADD, in fact) is find a way to regulate it again. Distraction, etc..

Take the power away from this stuff...stop assuming that if she tells you that it means she trusts you. Stop assuming that because you told her everything means she has to tell you everything. Yea, I know that doesnt seem fair, but that is reality. Its also super codependant thinking.

Steph
Logged


Sir5r
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 1106



« Reply #9 on: March 01, 2012, 05:15:02 PM »

Ok..

So this same issue is on the table. You need her to tell you and she wont. Talk about a huge push/pull dynamic here.. You know how loaded it is, and so does she.

  One myth you have going on is that if she tells you it means she trusts you. NO it does NOT mean she trusts you. It means that for whatever reason, she opted to tell you..but I can pretty much guarantee that it isnt because she trusts you.

So, I think its VERY important that you check your math on that one..

Disclosure does NOT mean she trusts you.

So, having said that, how important is it for you to know what she has to say? If it isnt about trust...which I think we can pretty much agree on that it isnt about trust as to why she holds onto it..then what is it from your end?

She knows she has a power card because you tell her about it. It gets things going for both of you.

The wise thing to do is to stop bringing it up, and when you find it obsessing in your mind ( could be related to your ADD, in fact) is find a way to regulate it again. Distraction, etc..

Take the power away from this stuff...stop assuming that if she tells you that it means she trusts you. Stop assuming that because you told her everything means she has to tell you everything. Yea, I know that doesnt seem fair, but that is reality. Its also super codependant thinking.

Steph
Steph,

Your experience gives you great acumen for sure. You said pretty much What the therapist said today. She will tell you in time, you make too much of this.

Yes, I'm giving it too much power and obsessing on it. Knowing it will make a difference to me though. A lot less than I believe it will though.

Thanks again.

Sir5r
Logged

To enjoy good health, to bring true happiness to one's family, to bring peace to all, one must first discipline and control one's own mind. If a man can control his mind he can find the way to Enlightenment, and all wisdom and virtue will naturally come to him.
-    Buddha
Sir5r
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 1106



« Reply #10 on: March 01, 2012, 06:11:53 PM »

I just wanted to add things are going well with my wife for now.
It seems that I'm the one looking to mess it up and I have to own that.
If I want to truly make this work I have to learn to accept things the way they are now and they aren't really that bad. smiley

Sir5r
Logged

To enjoy good health, to bring true happiness to one's family, to bring peace to all, one must first discipline and control one's own mind. If a man can control his mind he can find the way to Enlightenment, and all wisdom and virtue will naturally come to him.
-    Buddha
Auspicious
Distinguished Member
Emeritus
**
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 8437



« Reply #11 on: March 02, 2012, 05:32:03 AM »

It seems that I'm the one looking to mess it up and I have to own that.
If I want to truly make this work I have to learn to accept things the way they are now and they aren't really that bad. smiley

 Thought   Thought   Thought 

 Doing the right thing
Logged

Have you read the Lessons?

Steph
Distinguished Member
Emeritus
**
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 7849



« Reply #12 on: March 02, 2012, 07:48:12 AM »

Ok..

So this same issue is on the table. You need her to tell you and she wont. Talk about a huge push/pull dynamic here.. You know how loaded it is, and so does she.

  One myth you have going on is that if she tells you it means she trusts you. NO it does NOT mean she trusts you. It means that for whatever reason, she opted to tell you..but I can pretty much guarantee that it isnt because she trusts you.

So, I think its VERY important that you check your math on that one..

Disclosure does NOT mean she trusts you.

So, having said that, how important is it for you to know what she has to say? If it isnt about trust...which I think we can pretty much agree on that it isnt about trust as to why she holds onto it..then what is it from your end?

She knows she has a power card because you tell her about it. It gets things going for both of you.

The wise thing to do is to stop bringing it up, and when you find it obsessing in your mind ( could be related to your ADD, in fact) is find a way to regulate it again. Distraction, etc..

Take the power away from this stuff...stop assuming that if she tells you that it means she trusts you. Stop assuming that because you told her everything means she has to tell you everything. Yea, I know that doesnt seem fair, but that is reality. Its also super codependant thinking.

Steph
Steph,

Your experience gives you great acumen for sure. You said pretty much What the therapist said today. She will tell you in time, you make too much of this.

Yes, I'm giving it too much power and obsessing on it. Knowing it will make a difference to me though. A lot less than I believe it will though.

Thanks again.

Sir5r

 Many times, an anxiety disorder can be at the root of this stuff. Ideas or thoughts that are distressing..lots of times about stuff out of our control, like illness, death, the state of the world, etc, get locked inside and swim around and around and increase our anxiety. Likely, you are fixated on this stuff about your wifes history  because it is a symptom of your own inner turmoil or anxiety.

Sure, I get that you would like to know...that makes sense. I suspect you are right that even if she came clean with you that you would feel like everything is ok now and all is well. Your curiousity would be relieved, but I suspect other negative emotions would return in its place ( anger, depression, resentment) and your sense of peace would be very short lived.

 I think that there is alot going on with you that needs to keep stirring this pot, as well. I recognize some of myself in you from several years ago. There is a reason we stay in turmoil and many times, its because we feel better than we would if we were left alone with our own mental health symptoms. When my H got well, I was feeling some depression and anxiety that popped up in the calmness and I also found myself thinking about poking the hornets nest( trying to get him going again) as a way to relieve my own pain. Fortunately, I had some dbt skills and was able to observe this in myself and staying in therapy helped alot. So...ya know? Maybe there is some of this going on.

  Glad you are in therapy around this stuff...it makes a huge difference!

Steph
Logged


Sir5r
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 1106



« Reply #13 on: March 02, 2012, 09:21:05 AM »

 Many times, an anxiety disorder can be at the root of this stuff. Ideas or thoughts that are distressing..lots of times about stuff out of our control, like illness, death, the state of the world, etc, get locked inside and swim around and around and increase our anxiety. Likely, you are fixated on this stuff about your wifes history  because it is a symptom of your own inner turmoil or anxiety.
Some of this may be my attempt to "figure her out" and I know that will lead me down the rabbit hole if I'm not careful.
Sure, I get that you would like to know...that makes sense. I suspect you are right that even if she came clean with you that you would feel like everything is ok now and all is well. Your curiousity would be relieved, but I suspect other negative emotions would return in its place ( anger, depression, resentment) and your sense of peace would be very short lived.
I don't think those emotions would return, I just want to be done with it.  Clear the air and let the dust of the past blow away. I've already been there and I don't ever want to go back.

 I think that there is alot going on with you that needs to keep stirring this pot, as well. I recognize some of myself in you from several years ago. There is a reason we stay in turmoil and many times, its because we feel better than we would if we were left alone with our own mental health symptoms. When my H got well, I was feeling some depression and anxiety that popped up in the calmness and I also found myself thinking about poking the hornets nest( trying to get him going again) as a way to relieve my own pain.

I have to say I agree with you on this.  I think my wife has changed a lot. She is in control 95% of the time now.  Where as at her worst she was in control maybe 50% of the time. There still is Provocation from her because she can be verbally harsh.  But the whole family is handling her differently now.  I have learned a lot here and from therapy and that's helped a lot.   

Maybe I have to get used to the peace. She is more physical with me as well, coming over to hug me and more sometimes.   That's a very positive change.


Fortunately, I had some dbt skills and was able to observe this in myself and staying in therapy helped alot. So...ya know? Maybe there is some of this going on.

  Glad you are in therapy around this stuff...it makes a huge difference!

I've used DBT and CBT Techniques to "Chill myself" a lot.  I think I get caught up in the details  and "can't see the forest for the trees" in the relationship.  I ask myself questions to calm down and change my emotional state. 

"Does it really matter what she did 20+ years ago if she shows me she loves me now?" 
"Yes, she must have gotten very hurt by that so long ago, why make her hurt more? Show her YOU care about her NOW."


That's how I do it.  I put it all in perspective, I stop my mind from racing and end the rumination.


Sir5r

Logged

To enjoy good health, to bring true happiness to one's family, to bring peace to all, one must first discipline and control one's own mind. If a man can control his mind he can find the way to Enlightenment, and all wisdom and virtue will naturally come to him.
-    Buddha
Steph
Distinguished Member
Emeritus
**
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 7849



« Reply #14 on: March 02, 2012, 09:29:30 AM »

 Sounds like your wife isnt the only one making significant progress!

 Doing the right thing


 Yea, I had to get used to calm, serene and peaceful...and in its place, I was dealing with my own depression and anxiety. Keep pushing thru..we arent the only ones finding our own discomfort when the pain slows down from the other side!


Steph
Logged


iluminati
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Home Board: SO-Leaving
Posts: 1346



WWW
« Reply #15 on: March 03, 2012, 07:44:14 AM »

It's funny that I go on the board to see what's going on with you, and I end up seeing this.

It's clear to me that your wife knows that she can bring up whatever she wants about her sexual past and have you swooning.  In a way, she's being a jerk because she has figured out that she can emotionally manipulate you by triggering some fears inside of you.  If anything, you usually see the non triggering the pwBPD, not the other way around.  I think you need to recognize her disclosures for what they are at this point: emotional abuse.  Why try to hit you when words don't show bruises in court?  Plus, it's something she has control over and use at will.

Now you're doing a good job owning your part with the CBT and DBT techniques.  You need to improve your skills with that.  Also, when she brings up stuff that triggers you, get the heck out of Dodge.  Why hang around to get abused?  I'm not saying pack your bags for a few weeks.  Just walk away, and live your life.
Logged

He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous.  Matthew 5:45b
Sir5r
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 1106



« Reply #16 on: March 03, 2012, 11:33:28 AM »

iluminati said:
It's funny that I go on the board to see what's going on with you, and I end up seeing this.

It's clear to me that your wife knows that she can bring up whatever she wants about her sexual past and have you swooning.  In a way, she's being a jerk because she has figured out that she can emotionally manipulate you by triggering some fears inside of you.  If anything, you usually see the non triggering the pwBPD, not the other way around.  I think you need to recognize her disclosures for what they are at this point: emotional abuse.  Why try to hit you when words don't show bruises in court?  Plus, it's something she has control over and use at will.
This must be the case.  Last night we were out to dinner again.  She had a few drinks and began talking again about this.  It wasn't a direct discussion of her sexual past.
The meat of what she told me was this.  She said she was never "friends" with any of her boyfriends except me. She said none of her male friends were ever "Boyfriend worthy."
I asked her "Are you saying toy were more intimate with your friends than your boyfriends?"
She said "yes, except for one other that she was friends with that they fell into a relationship" That one was a total BPD affair, it was her friends boyfriend that she pursued when she was out of town for two weeks one summer, then slept with him on and off over the years.

What I learned from this is that she separates intimacy from sexuality, I think she suppressed a lot of this thinking during our marriage and now it's her mode of thought.  When we got home after dinner i expected her to want to be intimate after having this discussion.  Thinking that she was trying to feel closer to me. This turned into a disaster.  She said she was going to call Her girlfriend (she has one) and the police on me if I pushed it.  I said "If you do that I'm going to have you committed for a 72 hour observation."  I left drove to one of my peaceful places I have and sat, I fell asleep and woke up 4 hours later.  Stress has always had that effect on me.

I came home and slept on the couch in my clothes. I sure wasn't going to risk waking her. This morning she woke up and was acting like nothing happened. I said, "I don't think this is going to work. We really should get a divorce, you can't provide the things I need for a relationship. She got into her car and left and has been gone since. 


Now you're doing a good job owning your part with the CBT and DBT techniques.  You need to improve your skills with that.  Also, when she brings up stuff that triggers you, get the heck out of Dodge.  Why hang around to get abused?  I'm not saying pack your bags for a few weeks.  Just walk away, and live your life.
I do just that, I leave her.  I go to a movie, go for coffee anything to get away. I told her at the therapist two days ago that she is looking for a fairy tale perfect relationship before she gets intimate again. Sure she comes and hugs me sometimes, I even had her give me a peck on the lips 3 times in the last month but is that how I want to live?

I feel she is incapable of returning to a normal level of intimacy with me. If we do split up she will do what all BPD's do she will act like one thing get a man and then be what she really is.

I can handle myself now, I know when to get out. I validate her feelings and treat her like the emotional child she is, but I can't survive in a relationship that's based on "platonic friendship" alone.  Not arguing, having small talk and going out to dinner isn't a marriage.  I told her at the last session "I can't take not being able to talk to you about the important things because of how you react.  I'm not walking on eggshells around you anymore."

So here I find myself in my safe room awaiting her return.  I think I'm going to leave today and spend the day out somewhere if she is confrontational or provocative at all. Do you know how many times the phrase "I really need a girlfriend." has entered my mind in the last 3 months?
My needs aren't being satisfied here. The only reason I think I haven't gone outside the marriage is because of my father having done that to my mom.

Sir5r
Logged

To enjoy good health, to bring true happiness to one's family, to bring peace to all, one must first discipline and control one's own mind. If a man can control his mind he can find the way to Enlightenment, and all wisdom and virtue will naturally come to him.
-    Buddha
Sir5r
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 1106



« Reply #17 on: March 03, 2012, 12:26:42 PM »

So, she comes home from shopping with a card that she says took two hours to pick out.  "We can overcome any hurdle, lets be friends"...

I guess she isn't happy about how last night turned out.  We will see how the day goes.


Sir5r
Logged

To enjoy good health, to bring true happiness to one's family, to bring peace to all, one must first discipline and control one's own mind. If a man can control his mind he can find the way to Enlightenment, and all wisdom and virtue will naturally come to him.
-    Buddha
iluminati
*******
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Home Board: SO-Leaving
Posts: 1346



WWW
« Reply #18 on: March 03, 2012, 12:59:15 PM »

First, let me give you credit for doing the right thing.  Once she threatened to call the cops for you trying to get intimate, you did the right thing in getting out of there.  If you hung around, that might have put you in a nasty situation.  Obviously, she knows how wrong she was by her attempts to make it up.  Mission accomplished.

That said, the whole sex without intimacy thing is just Borderline Personality Disorder (tm).  When sex with intimacy is a dangerous thing, you try not to have the two together.  What I would suggest to you is that once you have worked on those trigger behaviors with her bringing up her past, you need to figure out why this triggers you so.  You need to figure out what are you afraid is going to happen if she has sex without intimacy.

Logged

He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous.  Matthew 5:45b
Sir5r
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 1106



« Reply #19 on: March 03, 2012, 04:47:06 PM »

Getting out is what I do now. Thankfully, I haven't had to do that much at all lately.
I was thrilled when she came back in an apologetic mood.

Sex without intimacy is ok with me if we're intimate in other ways. If the only way we can be together is by her splitting that I'm fine with that except I dont think she wants that with me even though it seems to be all she is capable of.

What seems to trigger her is not telling me things about her past. It's when I ask for anymore detail then she gives when she does. She seems to use that as a way to make me look like I'm obsessed with it.  Why bring it up then? Especially when she will deny what she has said.

She says she doesn't remember a lot of her past then blurts these things out only to deny them later.

I'm just going to log them and not respond anymore. I've spoken to the T about this and he is going to work on it with her slowly. In the meantime I'm just going to let her roll with it.

Sir5r
Logged

To enjoy good health, to bring true happiness to one's family, to bring peace to all, one must first discipline and control one's own mind. If a man can control his mind he can find the way to Enlightenment, and all wisdom and virtue will naturally come to him.
-    Buddha
Pages: [1] 2  All   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

index.php?topic=56206.msg913187#msg913187
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.10 | SMF © 2006-2010, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!