Oops found something i shouldnt of

[Think About It....]

25 November 2011A R M
ok so like i said slowly slowly keep in touch and when your ready we will meet up, i just got excited about seeing you.
I love you so much xx
do u still love me x

25 November 2011A B
ye but dno

25 November 2011A R M
what ye but dno what?

25 November 2011A B
ergh
i dont no

25 November 2011A R M
ok lets leave it tonight if your getting annoyed dont mean to push you sweetie xx
mwahhh
just know i will not be angry or moan at you we need to become friends again slowly x i know that cuz you are so angry with me
 like i said just got caught up with the fact you have started talking to me xx

25 November 2011A B
byebyeeeeee

25 November 2011A R M
ill back off a bit ok x
love you xx
i know you love me
smile

25 November 2011A B


25 November 2011A R M
no smile
you love me just dont like me and thats fine

babe x
you still there?

25 November 2011A B
ye

25 November 2011A R M
you ok

25 November 2011A B
ye y?

25 November 2011A R M
dont want to have upset u or made you angry again

25 November 2011A B
well if ya stop talking for abit ill be fineeeeeeeeeeeeeee.

25 November 2011A R M
ok speak soon night night x just want you to love me again whenever your ready to meet i will wait for you ok x

26 November 2011A B
been speaking to my dad&he said it'll be good for us to have a day out,so next saturday is that okay?xx

26 November 2011A B
so next saturday we go&get our hair nails done yeah
?

26 November 2011A R M
Ok ill book it and let you know details

26 November 2011A B
okay

27 November 2011A B
heey
have you rang?

27 November 2011A R M
no

27 November 2011A B
okay

27 November 2011A R M
why have you and friend fell out?

27 November 2011A B
long story

27 November 2011A R M
make a short one then

27 November 2011A B
cant
well
in science me&friend&friend we're joking& me&friend squirted water on friend and frined said it was acid?and it wasn't so she had a mardy
 about that&shes just being a btch really&two faced so im not putting the effort in if she isn't shes being soo full off herself
 at the minute and expects everyone too think the world off her&i'm losing her and its annoyed me so im doing it cause i cared but
 not no more

27 November 2011A R M
oh dear, i hope you sort it out she is your best friend, your friends from g side are being very mean to her tho on her wall hope
 you work it out

27 November 2011A B
haha no there not there just showing they care
she shouldn't off been cocky too them

27 November 2011A R M
ok like i said she is a good frined just sounds like you both changeing and need some space but hopefully you will work it out x

27 November 2011A B
hmm probably but if we haven't by the time ive moved schools then i dont think we will:/x

27 November 2011A R M
our right, sorted the new school then?
you*
your** dur me

27 November 2011A B
no not yet haha
im moving *******(scool name) if i move

27 November 2011A R M
i knew that would be the school. would apriecate you keeping me updated please

27 November 2011A B
where else would i go?haha i will

27 November 2011A R M
*******?(another schools name)

27 November 2011A B
oh haha don't no anyone there so i wouldn't want too move & its called the ******* academy now

27 November 2011A R M
ohhhh posh not

27 November 2011A B
ha

27 November 2011A R M
night hun x

27 November 2011A B
nice lye in for my in the morning haha

27 November 2011A R M
its not cool you know about being suspended

27 November 2011A B
time off school tho:)

27 November 2011A R M
but hope you get sorted soon with moving school it will hopefully make things better for you

27 November 2011A B
i know sameee!

27 November 2011A R M
i do love you just want you to get sorted out im always here for yoiu x

27 November 2011A B
Z
X*

27 November 2011A R M
xx
night x

2 December 2011A R M
still meeting me tomorrow?

2 December 2011A B
Yeaah

2 December 2011A R M
cool
im really looking forward are you?

2 December 2011A B
Be a bitt awkward haha but ye

2 December 2011A R M
I know it will but hopefully not for long, i just want us to be friends x

8 December 2011A R M
love ya xx

8 December 2011A B
Thank uu

9 December 2011A R M
how much where from etc xx

9 December 2011A B
how much for what?

9 December 2011A R M
i phone

9 December 2011A B
300

9 December 2011A R M
no thanks then
how are you?

9 December 2011A B
that's cheap n fine

9 December 2011A R M
have you thought about if your coming home at all next week? :Z

9 December 2011A B
no

9 December 2011A R M
can you think about it please

9 December 2011A B
no

9 December 2011A R M
why
thought we were ok
are you ok with me

9 December 2011A B
busy and no, not being funny or ote but just because you spent money no of doesn't make up okay ...

9 December 2011A R M
oh
im confused you said you would think about things you seemed fine with me on sat
and you said you werent using me!
i didnt think spending money on you would

9 December 2011A B
because I dint wanna be rude...

9 December 2011A R M
why are you being like this again i thought we were going to try and get back on track!
so everything you said you didnt mean then?
i want to see you before xmas and so do the kids
dont want to fall out hun xx

9 December 2011A B
o. my god your going on like were a married couple what did . say?

9 December 2011A R M
why are you being funny with me you said you were sorry and that you wanted to try and get back on track as a family
 your my daughter i love you, :
you said you would think about coming home once before xmas and would think about xmas eve x
i dont expect us to be ok straight away or anything thats why i left you alone all week!
giving you space all ive asked is that you meet me half way with things and to think about coming home abit,
 thought you wanted us to be ok!

9 December 2011A B
I didn't say I wanted to get back on track and I'm not comin to your house this week or noon christmas

9 December 2011A R M
noon xmas?

9 December 2011A B
u annoy me too much

9 December 2011A R M
oh my god what
why

you hugged me and everything
thought we were ok im so confused right now
what does noon xmas mean?
does that mean your not coming over at all at xmas !
alana?
speak to me please

9 December 2011A R M
i do love you so very much and miss you very much and so do D#2 and S#1! i dont know what ive done to annoy you,
 all ive asked is that you come and see us before xmas and over xmas thats not asking alot from my DAUGHTER!
what about your xmas pressie etc when do you think youll get them you are not being fair to me or your brother and sister
your pushing me further away and i know you dont want that really! please just stop being so nasty to me when i not doing anything wrong?

9 December 2011A R M
it hurts

9 December 2011A B
Oh my days my phone died jeez
And actually u did so somet wrong? U always blame me for stuff I don't no-.- I don't do

9 December 2011A R M
I havent done that for ages.

15 December 2011A R M
i love you loads and loads always remember that when you feel bad my arms are always open for you,xxxxxxxx

15 December 2011A B
K

15 December 2011A R M
are you ok sweetie do you want to see me for a hug x

15 December 2011A B
no

15 December 2011A R M
ok only asking you sounded fed upi

15 December 2011A B
ok

15 December 2011A R M
ill leave you alone cause every time i try and be nice you dont want it from me so ill just leave things,
 but it goes without saying i will always love you and will always be here for you whenever your ready. xx

15 December 2011A B
ye well ur pathetic

15 December 2011A R M
oh my god why
you are so horrible to me why

15 December 2011A B
shuush

15 December 2011A R M
what have i done that is so bad that you talk to me like this i just dont understand.  do you really hate me

15 December 2011A R M
by the way mamma is coming on saturday if your interested

15 December 2011A B
i know..

15 December 2011A R M
do you want to see her?

15 December 2011A B
yeah but not you&gary

15 December 2011A R M
can you explain what ive done that is so bad that you hate me so much, you dont have to see me or gary ill drop mamma off to see you.
alana do you really hate me or just angry will you ever want to sort things out? please dont be off with me just answer
 me as best you can i mean what about your brother and sister and the rest of your family? please dont look at this as
 me presureing you i just want to understand,

15 December 2011A B
the only people i want out off my life is you&H..

15 December 2011A R M
H fine but im your mum babe i love you you must love me still somewhere in there

15 December 2011A B
no

15 December 2011A R M
why tho just answer that please i thought we were ok the other week what could have changed

15 December 2011A B
nothing,no we wernt fine,get that into your head-.-

15 December 2011A R M
ok ok im sorry

15 December 2011A B
no

15 December 2011A R M
i just hope one day you will want to see me again xx i will always love you cuz im your mum and you cant stop loving
 your flesh and blood x
bye

15 December 2011A B
loool

18 December 2011A B
look mum im sorry i know im no angel but i just wanna stay at my dads till the new year and then ill think things
 through have a good christmas and where r u on christmas day?

20 December 2011A R M
ok chick it would be nice to at least speak to you on xmas day you know and so you can talk to the kids is that ok ?
love you lots xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
ill be at sisters so if we ring you can speak to everyine or even skpe? not sure how to skpe but hey ho xx

20 December 2011A B
no ill just ring and ly2

22 December 2011A R M
does ly2 mean love you too?

22 December 2011A B
Yeye

22 December 2011A B
Can't skype anyway I don't have a webcam

22 December 2011A R M
laptop?
doesnt matter anyway cause our account is on home pc not laptop and i dont know how to do it x so speak around lunch time xmas day x

22 December 2011A B
Broke my laptop & ok

26 December 2011A R M
hey i got a notifcation from you but it wont let me veiw it ?

26 December 2011A B
no?
dno*

26 December 2011A R M
oh ok never mind love ya x

30 December 2011A B
can you dooo me a favour?

[Faded]

25 November 2011A R M
ok so like i said slowly slowly keep in touch and when your ready we will meet up, i just got excited about seeing you.
I love you so much xx
do u still love me x

25 November 2011A B
ye but dno

25 November 2011A R M
what ye but dno what?

25 November 2011A B
ergh
i dont no

25 November 2011A R M
ok lets leave it tonight if your getting annoyed dont mean to push you sweetie xx
mwahhh
just know i will not be angry or moan at you we need to become friends again slowly x i know that cuz you are so angry with me
 like i said just got caught up with the fact you have started talking to me xx

25 November 2011A B
byebyeeeeee

25 November 2011A R M
ill back off a bit ok x
love you xx
i know you love me
smile

25 November 2011A B


25 November 2011A R M
no smile
you love me just dont like me and thats fine

babe x
you still there?

25 November 2011A B
ye

25 November 2011A R M
you ok

25 November 2011A B
ye y?

25 November 2011A R M
dont want to have upset u or made you angry again

25 November 2011A B
well if ya stop talking for abit ill be fineeeeeeeeeeeeeee.

25 November 2011A R M
ok speak soon night night x just want you to love me again whenever your ready to meet i will wait for you ok x

26 November 2011A B
been speaking to my dad&he said it'll be good for us to have a day out,so next saturday is that okay?xx

26 November 2011A B
so next saturday we go&get our hair nails done yeah
?

26 November 2011A R M
Ok ill book it and let you know details

26 November 2011A B
okay

27 November 2011A B
heey
have you rang?

27 November 2011A R M
no

27 November 2011A B
okay

27 November 2011A R M
why have you and friend fell out?

27 November 2011A B
long story

27 November 2011A R M
make a short one then

27 November 2011A B
cant
well
in science me&friend&friend we're joking& me&friend squirted water on friend and frined said it was acid?and it wasn't so she had a mardy
 about that&shes just being a btch really&two faced so im not putting the effort in if she isn't shes being soo full off herself
 at the minute and expects everyone too think the world off her&i'm losing her and its annoyed me so im doing it cause i cared but
 not no more

27 November 2011A R M
oh dear, i hope you sort it out she is your best friend, your friends from g side are being very mean to her tho on her wall hope
 you work it out

27 November 2011A B
haha no there not there just showing they care
she shouldn't off been cocky too them

27 November 2011A R M
ok like i said she is a good frined just sounds like you both changeing and need some space but hopefully you will work it out x

27 November 2011A B
hmm probably but if we haven't by the time ive moved schools then i dont think we will:/x

27 November 2011A R M
our right, sorted the new school then?
you*
your** dur me

27 November 2011A B
no not yet haha
im moving *******(scool name) if i move

27 November 2011A R M
i knew that would be the school. would apriecate you keeping me updated please

27 November 2011A B
where else would i go?haha i will

27 November 2011A R M
*******?(another schools name)

27 November 2011A B
oh haha don't no anyone there so i wouldn't want too move & its called the ******* academy now

27 November 2011A R M
ohhhh posh not

27 November 2011A B
ha

27 November 2011A R M
night hun x

27 November 2011A B
nice lye in for my in the morning haha

27 November 2011A R M
its not cool you know about being suspended

27 November 2011A B
time off school tho:)

27 November 2011A R M
but hope you get sorted soon with moving school it will hopefully make things better for you

27 November 2011A B
i know sameee!

27 November 2011A R M
i do love you just want you to get sorted out im always here for yoiu x

27 November 2011A B
Z
X*

27 November 2011A R M
xx
night x

2 December 2011A R M
still meeting me tomorrow?

2 December 2011A B
Yeaah

2 December 2011A R M
cool
im really looking forward are you?

2 December 2011A B
Be a bitt awkward haha but ye

2 December 2011A R M
I know it will but hopefully not for long, i just want us to be friends x

8 December 2011A R M
love ya xx

8 December 2011A B
Thank uu

9 December 2011A R M
how much where from etc xx

9 December 2011A B
how much for what?

9 December 2011A R M
i phone

9 December 2011A B
300

9 December 2011A R M
no thanks then
how are you?

9 December 2011A B
that's cheap n fine

9 December 2011A R M
have you thought about if your coming home at all next week? :Z

9 December 2011A B
no

9 December 2011A R M
can you think about it please

9 December 2011A B
no

9 December 2011A R M
why
thought we were ok
are you ok with me

9 December 2011A B
busy and no, not being funny or ote but just because you spent money no of doesn't make up okay ...

9 December 2011A R M
oh
im confused you said you would think about things you seemed fine with me on sat
and you said you werent using me!
i didnt think spending money on you would

9 December 2011A B
because I dint wanna be rude...

9 December 2011A R M
why are you being like this again i thought we were going to try and get back on track!
so everything you said you didnt mean then?
i want to see you before xmas and so do the kids
dont want to fall out hun xx

9 December 2011A B
o. my god your going on like were a married couple what did . say?

9 December 2011A R M
why are you being funny with me you said you were sorry and that you wanted to try and get back on track as a family
 your my daughter i love you, :
you said you would think about coming home once before xmas and would think about xmas eve x
i dont expect us to be ok straight away or anything thats why i left you alone all week!
giving you space all ive asked is that you meet me half way with things and to think about coming home abit,
 thought you wanted us to be ok!

9 December 2011A B
I didn't say I wanted to get back on track and I'm not comin to your house this week or noon christmas

9 December 2011A R M
noon xmas?

9 December 2011A B
u annoy me too much

9 December 2011A R M
oh my god what
why

you hugged me and everything
thought we were ok im so confused right now
what does noon xmas mean?
does that mean your not coming over at all at xmas !
alana?
speak to me please

9 December 2011A R M
i do love you so very much and miss you very much and so do D#2 and S#1! i dont know what ive done to annoy you,
 all ive asked is that you come and see us before xmas and over xmas thats not asking alot from my DAUGHTER!
what about your xmas pressie etc when do you think youll get them you are not being fair to me or your brother and sister
your pushing me further away and i know you dont want that really! please just stop being so nasty to me when i not doing anything wrong?

9 December 2011A R M
it hurts

9 December 2011A B
Oh my days my phone died jeez
And actually u did so somet wrong? U always blame me for stuff I don't no-.- I don't do

9 December 2011A R M
I havent done that for ages.

15 December 2011A R M
i love you loads and loads always remember that when you feel bad my arms are always open for you,xxxxxxxx

15 December 2011A B
K

15 December 2011A R M
are you ok sweetie do you want to see me for a hug x

15 December 2011A B
no

15 December 2011A R M
ok only asking you sounded fed upi

15 December 2011A B
ok

15 December 2011A R M
ill leave you alone cause every time i try and be nice you dont want it from me so ill just leave things,
 but it goes without saying i will always love you and will always be here for you whenever your ready. xx

15 December 2011A B
ye well ur pathetic

15 December 2011A R M
oh my god why
you are so horrible to me why

15 December 2011A B
shuush

15 December 2011A R M
what have i done that is so bad that you talk to me like this i just dont understand.  do you really hate me

15 December 2011A R M
by the way mamma is coming on saturday if your interested

15 December 2011A B
i know..

15 December 2011A R M
do you want to see her?

15 December 2011A B
yeah but not you&gary

15 December 2011A R M
can you explain what ive done that is so bad that you hate me so much, you dont have to see me or gary ill drop mamma off to see you.
alana do you really hate me or just angry will you ever want to sort things out? please dont be off with me just answer
 me as best you can i mean what about your brother and sister and the rest of your family? please dont look at this as
 me presureing you i just want to understand,

15 December 2011A B
the only people i want out off my life is you&H..

15 December 2011A R M
H fine but im your mum babe i love you you must love me still somewhere in there

15 December 2011A B
no

15 December 2011A R M
why tho just answer that please i thought we were ok the other week what could have changed

15 December 2011A B
nothing,no we wernt fine,get that into your head-.-

15 December 2011A R M
ok ok im sorry

15 December 2011A B
no

15 December 2011A R M
i just hope one day you will want to see me again xx i will always love you cuz im your mum and you cant stop loving
 your flesh and blood x
bye

15 December 2011A B
loool

18 December 2011A B
look mum im sorry i know im no angel but i just wanna stay at my dads till the new year and then ill think things
 through have a good christmas and where r u on christmas day?

20 December 2011A R M
ok chick it would be nice to at least speak to you on xmas day you know and so you can talk to the kids is that ok ?
love you lots xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
ill be at sisters so if we ring you can speak to everyine or even skpe? not sure how to skpe but hey ho xx

20 December 2011A B
no ill just ring and ly2

22 December 2011A R M
does ly2 mean love you too?

22 December 2011A B
Yeye

22 December 2011A B
Can't skype anyway I don't have a webcam

22 December 2011A R M
laptop?
doesnt matter anyway cause our account is on home pc not laptop and i dont know how to do it x so speak around lunch time xmas day x

22 December 2011A B
Broke my laptop & ok

26 December 2011A R M
hey i got a notifcation from you but it wont let me veiw it ?

26 December 2011A B
no?
dno*

26 December 2011A R M
oh ok never mind love ya x

30 December 2011A B
can you dooo me a favour?

[Faded]

3 JanuaryA B
oiiii! can you do me favour?/

3 JanuaryA R M
im here

3 JanuaryA B
Can you order me something off eBay please? I'll send you the money through the post xxx

3 JanuaryA R M
what

3 JanuaryA B
I'll send you the link later it's a present for someone they brought me some vans so I said I'll get them this it's
 a polo but I'll send ou the link later cuz I'm on my iPod&going out love u x

3 JanuaryA R M
ok how much?

3 JanuaryA B
It's 21 + p n p x

3 JanuaryA R M
and tell you what dont send it in the post come over and stay when its here and give me the money then x

3 JanuaryA B
Depends when then yeah?x

3 JanuaryA R M
Although domnt want it to seem like your only coming to get stuff tho be nice to see you anyway x and when are you back at school x

3 JanuaryA B
Speak later n Monday x

3 JanuaryA R M
ok love ya x

3 JanuaryA B
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Big-Pony-POLO-RL-Mens-Polo-Shirt-PURPLE-MEDIUM-BNWT-/ love youuuu x

Big Pony POLO RL Mens Polo Shirt PURPLE MEDIUM BNWT
www.ebay.co.uk
Big Pony POLO RL Mens Polo Shirt PURPLE MEDIUM BNWT in Clothes, Shoes Accessories , Men's Clothing , T-Shirts |eBay
Share

4 JanuaryA B
you done it for me xx

4 JanuaryA R M
looking now x

4 JanuaryA B
ty x

4 JanuaryA R M
by the way with postage is £25.00 x
not being funny but you cant have til you give me the money x sorry

4 JanuaryA B
it's 2.99 x
it says x

4 JanuaryA R M
yes plus 21.99 =?

4 JanuaryA B
oh yeah
i will give u the money on monday
pleaseeeeee xx

4 JanuaryA R M
like i said i will but i want the money first x

4 JanuaryA B
what if its gone tho  x

4 JanuaryA R M
i will get it but wont give it you til you give me the money x

4 JanuaryA B
yeah ok thank u x

4 JanuaryA R M
its alot of money for you to spend on someone?

4 JanuaryA B
there spending 40 on me

4 JanuaryA R M
ok its your money x

4 JanuaryA B
 x

4 JanuaryA R M
are we ok ? x

4 JanuaryA B
yeah x
well we're gettin better x

4 JanuaryA R M
good x

4 JanuaryA B
you dont mind me moving schools do u?x

4 JanuaryA R M
not any more just want you to be happy you and your dad make those decisions now not me.
as long as you still make the effort to come here and see us thats all i ask x

4 JanuaryA B
cause my dad keeps going on about how he needs to consider your feelings cuz he obvs cares about u alot
x

4 JanuaryA R M
well tell him to look at it like this hes got full custody of you now so all i can say is that its a reversal
 of roles now and that he make the day to day decisions and we get to see you a couple of times a week x

4 JanuaryA B
okay i'm going nowww love uuuuuu

4 JanuaryA R M
love you to sooooooo much xxxxxxxxxxxxxx its been nice just chatting xxxx

6 JanuaryA R M
T shirts arrived

6 JanuaryA B
Woooo thank you soooo much I'll give u money on Monday xxxxxx

7 JanuaryA R M
T shirts here x

7 JanuaryA B
I know you told me x

8 JanuaryA R M
sorry your messages have only just come through are you sleeping here monday?
ill be home after picking D#2 and S#1 up from school xx

8 JanuaryA B
No dads gettin me after dentist but I'll get the bus home from school xxx

8 JanuaryA R M
oh ok

23 JanuaryA R M
Hi you are you coming here on wednesday going for mine and D#2 birthday tea mamma is here to and if you are are
 you sleeping x whats happening with school you jhave updated me for ages x

23 JanuaryA B
Sorry I have no texts left yeah I'm coming on wednesday& I don't they haven't contacted me,are we going out for a meal? X

30 JanuaryA R M
not moaning but dont want to find out about meetings about meeting etc on here chick please send me messages first x let
 me know what happens please x

30 JanuaryA B
Okay sorrreh xox

30 JanuaryA R M
love you and hope it goes well x

30 JanuaryA B
Love u 2 & ty xx

31 JanuaryA R M
Hey chick trying to ring you to find out all the goss on school stuff can you text me when your phone on please so i
 can speak to you no moaning promise just want to know facts x

1 FebruaryA R M
love you hon wont ring you tonight just got in from work and im shattered so ill ring you tomorrow xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

1 FebruaryA B
Can't u ring me now?xxx

6 FebruaryA R M
how was first day at the new school xx
you missed natwest being robbed x

10 FebruaryA B
basically on wednesday this girl was saying stuff too our friend so me and friend went too talk too her and she called
 megan a 'f--king btch' so friend went mad then i asked her if she was the one bullying courtney but she wernt so i left her..
and then her dad was saying he's gonna get people too come and smash our faces in and stuff then the next day he went into school
 and said me and megan we're bullying her..so we both got isolated for the day and excluded (today) and friend blaming
 me for everything and saying its my fault and all this so she hates me and when my dad got in last night he wouldn't speak
 too me so..but now everythings sort off okay  just need too get friend back and ill be happy  xx

10 FebruaryA R M
Hey chick can you ask your dad to give you your phone so i can speak to you please x

10 FebruaryA R M
love ya x

10 FebruaryA B
u tooo x

10 FebruaryA R M
i believe you about the bullying thing sounds like its all out of hand x i will support you no matter what xx

10 FebruaryA B
thanks x

14 FebruaryA R M
love you have a good time at mammas xx

15 FebruaryA R M
you still at mammas xx

15 FebruaryA B
nope

16 FebruaryA R M
you working for sian tomorrow are you looking forward to it xx

17 FebruaryA B
can you remember when we made the fudges ? chocolate ones?&those chocolate balls that tasted off straeberrrys and oranges?x

17 FebruaryA R M
yes would you like to make them again xx

17 FebruaryA B
no i just wondered what the recipe was so i could take em to my friends party haah x

17 FebruaryA R M
oh ill dig it out

17 FebruaryA B
ok

17 FebruaryA R M
you going to work with *****(mums friend) tomorrow?

17 FebruaryA B
yeep

17 FebruaryA R M
enjoy love you do you want picking up on sunday x

17 FebruaryA B
nope

17 FebruaryA R M
you not coming then?

17 FebruaryA B
yh just not sure when

17 FebruaryA R M
oh ok well i dont mind fetching you just let me know S#2 said he missed you last night bless him that must mean he is x

17 FebruaryA B
haha blesss

17 FebruaryA R M
when do you need this recipe by?
love ya you know x

17 FebruaryA B
you too and asap  i wanted too make some anyway..like tonight or tomorrow?so yeah x

17 FebruaryA R M
ok ill sort it for tomorrow cba tonight x although if you google bbc good food and type in on there it will come up
 that where i got them from xx

17 FebruaryA B
okay..what do i type in?xx

17 FebruaryA R M
bbcgoodfood then truffle recipe and choc fudge x
http://www.bbcgoodfood.com/search.do?keywords=chocolate+truffle&pager.offset=10
http://www.bbcgoodfood.com/search.do?keywords=chocolate+fudge

17 FebruaryA B
fankss x

17 FebruaryA R M
no probs xx

17 FebruaryA B
xx

17 FebruaryA R M
you feeling happier now x

17 FebruaryA B
yhyhyh x

17 FebruaryA R M
gd x
see you sunday xx
just let me know what time xx

17 FebruaryA B
no not on sunday

19 FebruaryA R M
hey you so when are you coming over?

19 FebruaryA B
not todayy

19 FebruaryA R M
how was work with ***** (mums friend) will you do it again x

19 FebruaryA B
dnooo x

19 FebruaryA R M
are you coming tomorrow we are all really missing you loads xxxxxx

19 FebruaryA B
not sure yet

19 FebruaryA R M
why we havent seen you for ages?
please D#1 xx

19 FebruaryA B
saturday
u saw me
maybe

19 FebruaryA R M
in know but ideally id like to see you more than 3 hours a week x

[Faded]

19 FebruaryA B
i dno yettttt

19 FebruaryA R M
ok but i told D#2 and S#1 you were coming today or tomorrow so if you say your coming please please come and spend some time with us x

19 FebruaryA B
i dno yet mum

19 FebruaryA R M
ok ill leave you alone
when are you back at school?

19 FebruaryA B
thursday

19 FebruaryA R M
and have sorted things with the people who fell out with you x hey if you not back til thursday you can come over before that yeah x
have you got football tuesday cuz thought could go mds H is away so ill take the kids out for tea ?

19 FebruaryA B
maybe i think i MIGHT come tomorrow so i can go old school in the morning plus that way you can ring up old school & find
 out if im allowed too go for the day?&ive got plannsss for tuesday sorrry
x

19 FebruaryA R M
oh ok no worries just an idea x

19 FebruaryA B
thanks anyway tomorrows prob only day i can come tbf x
cuz ive got plans tuesday and a meeting on wednesday x

19 FebruaryA R M
i know your a busy lady meeting with school x

19 FebruaryA B
yhh x

19 FebruaryA R M
you know i just get like this cuz i miss you so much xx

19 FebruaryA B
yhyhyh x

19 FebruaryA R M
let me know then about when your coming times etc so i know xx

19 FebruaryA B
ok

19 FebruaryA R M
see ya soon i hope all my love mum x

19 FebruaryA B
i do no ur my mum silly

19 FebruaryA R M
xx

20 FebruaryA R M
friends have had the baby x

20 FebruaryA B
Aww cute ok xxx

20 FebruaryA R M
picture on now shes lovely and tiny and perfect x

23 FebruaryA R M
miss you xx

23 FebruaryA B
Thanks x

26 FebruaryA R M
love you xx
whats up chick?

26 FebruaryA B
nothing.

26 FebruaryA R M
just saw your status?
so thought you were pissed off

26 FebruaryA B
ok

26 FebruaryA R M
love you xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

26 FebruaryA B
okkk

26 FebruaryA R M

speak soon xx

26 FebruaryA B
k.

26 FebruaryA R M
are you sure you alright?

26 FebruaryA B
yes!

26 FebruaryA R M
ok see you soon xx

26 FebruaryA B
k

28 FebruaryA R M
hey x

28 FebruaryA B
hi

28 FebruaryA R M
school ok?

28 FebruaryA B
yh

28 FebruaryA R M
good
sorry if i annoyed you yesterday x

28 FebruaryA B
ok

28 FebruaryA R M
i just want to feel close to you x

28 FebruaryA B
ok
why was you being so mardy tho..

28 FebruaryA R M
i didnt think i was

28 FebruaryA B
well u was

28 FebruaryA R M
only cuz i saw that comment you put about me posting your wall that upset me

28 FebruaryA B
cuz u was annoying me

28 FebruaryA R M
i wont post your wall anymore ok x

28 FebruaryA B
k

28 FebruaryA R M
ill just send you the odd message on here just want you to know you can always talk to me about anything i just want you to know
 how much i love you xx and miss you xx

28 FebruaryA B
ok

28 FebruaryA R M
x

28 FebruaryA B
y

28 FebruaryA R M
y ?

28 FebruaryA B
alphabet

28 FebruaryA R M
oh durr me

28 FebruaryA B
ok

5 MarchA R M
hey

5 MarchA B
hi

5 MarchA R M
you ok

5 MarchA B
yh u

5 MarchA R M
got rid of that jls ticket?

5 MarchA B
no

5 MarchA R M
is it just the one?

5 MarchA B
yep

5 MarchA R M
never mind then thought D#2 would like to go but cant if its just one ticket

5 MarchA B
who would off gone with her

5 MarchA R M
me i couldnt let her go with antone else
anyone?

5 MarchA B
oh
even if i had 2 probs woukdnt sell them 2 u
wouldn't*

5 MarchA R M
why?

5 MarchA B
wouldn't want u there with me lols

[GENERAL ANNOUNCEMENT: Are you on the right board?]

GENERAL ANNOUNCEMENT: Are you on the right board? The focus of this board is about understanding the child, their needs, and supporting them in an intelligent and non self-sacrificing way. If your topic is mostly about the other parent and you are divorced, please go to Rebuilding our Life. If your topic is mostly about legal/custody issues, please go to Family law, Divorce, and Custody. If your topic is mostly about the other parent and you are still married, please go to Staying: Improving a Relationship with a Borderline Partner. If you need help moving a thread, please contact a moderator. We are glad to help. :)

[Faded]

5 MarchA R M
oh
i guess not
i wouldnt want to go really just thought it would be nice for D#2
are you coming over this week?

5 MarchA B
prob not

5 MarchA R M
ok
mothers day?
18th?

5 MarchA B
got a while yet

5 MarchA R M
i know just trying to get planned as need to book somewhere to eat atnd by then it will have been over a month since i saw you?

5 MarchA B
oki
doke

5 MarchA R M
do you miss us a little bit?
we miss you xx
what about a catch up in town on sat for a hour or so?
thinking of taking D#2 for the day so in town anyway

5 MarchA B
cant going school shopping

5 MarchA R M
school shopping?
uniform etc?

5 MarchA B
yes
yes

5 MarchA R M
oh ok no worries x
love you speak soon ok xx

5 MarchA B
bye

10 MarchA R M
hi

10 MarchA B
hi

10 MarchA R M
how are you x

10 MarchA B
fine u

10 MarchA R M
yes thanks been shopping with D#2 today did you get your uniform etc x

10 MarchA B
nope got no money too buy anything niether has dad

10 MarchA R M
what do you need?
is there anything i can get that you need?

10 MarchA B
plimsols
plimsols & some polo tops

10 MarchA R M
let me which ones and size

10 MarchA B
plain white ones 12/13 years & size 3 or 4 plimsols

10 MarchA R M
what colour plimsols?

10 MarchA B
black

10 MarchA R M
find a link of which ones you want then ill get them x

10 MarchA B
what you doing tomorrow?
x

10 MarchA R M
not sure why?

10 MarchA B
we could go tesco direct then somet too eat with the kids..up too u?

10 MarchA R M
that sounds nice

10 MarchA B
probably mcondalds
mcdonalds*

10 MarchA R M
been there today

10 MarchA B
have you

10 MarchA R M
yep
so i wont have one but you and S#1 can
and D#2 if she wants

10 MarchA B
okay
broke my phone aha

10 MarchA R M
oh no not agaon have got a spare one?

10 MarchA B
it sort off works
ill show you tomorrow
look on my wall theres a picture

10 MarchA R M
ok will do
just watched your cinnamon challenge
but cant see your phone pic

10 MarchA B
looool
i tagged you in a comment

10 MarchA R M
cant see it?

10 MarchA B
oh
what about now?

10 MarchA R M
yes just seen it?
oh dear how did you do that ?
by the way I LOVE YOU X

10 MarchA B
droppped it so many times
last night
i was a bit tipsy walking home
didn't get in till like 11.30 it
started going pure white couldnt see anything
then i threw it at the wall no it works but no buttons or anything ahahah

10 MarchA R M
oh not good
did your dad know you were drunk?

10 MarchA B
no
wasn't drunk
was tipsy

10 MarchA R M
oh ok be careful hun?

10 MarchA B
dont worry i can handle my drink ahaha

10 MarchA R M
emmmmmm

10 MarchA B
i can

10 MarchA R M
dont mix um and dont have it to often x
what you doing next sat?

10 MarchA B
party
and
i wont

10 MarchA R M
im going to town in the day on sat?
and what time is your footie on sunday?

10 MarchA B
tomorrow or next sunday?

10 MarchA R M
next sunday mothers day?
and tomorrow?

10 MarchA B
erm ill find out 1sec
would you pick friend up on the way tomorrow?
because i miss her

10 MarchA R M
not sure

10 MarchA B
please
haven't seen her in ages and i miss her sooo much

10 MarchA R M
well come over here then?

10 MarchA B
i cant

10 MarchA R M
today/

10 MarchA B
i cant

10 MarchA R M
cant you ring her and see her tonight

10 MarchA B
i cant becuz i have no way off getting back

10 MarchA R M
just that i feel like i want to see you just us if you have friend there then you wont be interested in us?
ill take you back tomorrow?

10 MarchA B
i have football in the morning!

10 MarchA R M
oh poo i forgot that bit?
what time you got football?
ill drop you off before that

10 MarchA B
like 10ish
yeah but then that means we cant get my school stuff tomorrow?

10 MarchA R M
we get your stuff next week/
?

10 MarchA B
i have a massive whole in my plimsols
dm
hole*

10 MarchA R M
whats dm?

10 MarchA B
doesnt matter

10 MarchA R M
i havent got much money either this week and dont want to be running your mates around when i just want to see you?

10 MarchA B
-whatever then

10 MarchA R M
when do you need your plimsols in relation to using them?

10 MarchA B
there my school shoes

10 MarchA R M
oh sorry thought they were pe plimsols

10 MarchA B
nope

10 MarchA R M
dont be annoyed you just dropped this on me?

10 MarchA B
its k
just leave
it
ill see u on mothers day

10 MarchA R M
ill get your plimsols i dont mind that ?

10 MarchA B
its fineeeeeeee

10 MarchA R M
i can transfer money to your account if you give me your bank details?

10 MarchA B
erm

10 MarchA R M
have you asked friend?

10 MarchA B
what do i have too give u?
asked friend what?

10 MarchA R M
not sure account no sort code name of account etc
if she wants/can come over

10 MarchA B
im so confused
tell D#2 phone died

10 MarchA R M
and if she can im not paying for her food etc?
ok

10 MarchA B
ok right

10 MarchA B
my back details are

10 MarchA R M
do you miss me D#1?

10 MarchA B
what made u ask that :s

10 MarchA R M
just like to know you do thats all?

10 MarchA B


10 MarchA R M
i miss you everyday?
!

10 MarchA B


10 MarchA R M
what time will you be ready tomorrow?

10 MarchA B
its doesn't matter noww

10 MarchA R M
why?
ive annoyed you again havent i

10 MarchA B
yh

10 MarchA R M
sorry its just so hard not seeing you sorry
do you want me to come and get you then or not?
i love you thats all x
you still there?

10 MarchA B
yes im still here

10 MarchA R M
im sorry ill take what i can get
if it mean 30mins with you ill take it?
shall i come over or not?

10 MarchA B
i dno yet
i think i might go friends

10 MarchA R M
when?

10 MarchA B
tomorrow

10 MarchA R M
if you come over can we see you please xxx

10 MarchA B
no

10 MarchA R M
and then ill give you the cash you need for your plimsols etc?

10 MarchA B
its fine
you made ur decision earlier

10 MarchA R M
no i didnt just said didnt want to run friend around aswell?

10 MarchA B
its ok
im going friends
then probably for something too eat

10 MarchA R M
why dont you want to see us though?
ill take you back to your dads if you want/
just so i can see you
sorry you didnt say what time footie is next week

10 MarchA B
i know i couldnt be bothered too ask my dad

10 MarchA R M
ignore my moaning and begging ill leave it as i know its peeing you off
sorry again love you and miss you which makes me a bit crazy?
ill accept ill see you on mothers day then and maybe a conversation on the phone in the week?
hey you there
i hate stressing the situation more please speak to me

10 MarchA B
no

10 MarchA R M
no what?
you pissed off ?
do you want me to get those plimsols or not?

10 MarchA B
no

10 MarchA R M
why?
i dont mind
i want to
alana really i dont mind

10 MarchA B
just transfer money into my bank if u want me too get them that much

10 MarchA R M
ive told D#2 we might see you aswell now

10 MarchA B


10 MarchA R M
what time you going to friends?

10 MarchA B
dont no if i am now
but if we go mcdonalds can u get friend or not?

10 MarchA R M
maybe what time?

10 MarchA R M
im confused now?

10 MarchA B
right
we will go mcdonalds and too get my shoes tomorrow
if you can bring my friend

10 MarchA R M
so what your saying is that if i bring your friend youll see us but if i dont then you wont?
?
?
well?

10 MarchA B
1sec im on the phone
my school shoes are expensive so ill wait till dad gets paid ok?

10 MarchA R M
fine

10 MarchA B
your not going too pay 40 for them:/

10 MarchA B
mum
..

10 MarchAmanda R M
what

10 MarchA B
dont matter now ive sorted it

10 MarchA R M
fine

14 MarchA R M
who can i ask to babysit on friday for me? friend is busy.

14 MarchA R M
Hey i havent commented on your status as i know that annoys you but im always here for you. What makes you think your
 losing everyone your family will always be there for you it an unconditional love xx

[Faded]

For me. A good insight into my daughters real feelings to some degree, this knowledge will be so valuable to us and myself as a father.

Also an insight into the twisted push/pull, game playing, mind games. i think this conversation would be better taken in after reading my background.


Anyone count how many times D's mum uses the word 'hate'? 'sorry'? 'you win'?

Hope this gives some insight and can help others see the feelings of their offspring although they are unable to show it at times.

[dah1029]

It just sounds like she harrasses your daughter to have a R/S with her that your dgtr isn't comfortable with right now.  I just found her to be annoying, coercing, conniving, and harrassing.  She wants what she wants. 

[DreamGirl]

It's like watching two teenagers hash out a relationship. It helped that you labeled each message, because it was hard to decipher who was the parent and who was the child.

It does seem to be a window in what your daughter's experiencing... and from where I'm standing, she really does seem to be carrying the weight of the world on her shoulders.

She also admits that she's drinking to her mom?

I'm seeing some pretty decent signs here that your daughter could maybe use some professional help (she mentioned that she was talking to a school counselor already?). I think you have it right when you say that she's telling you that she is "fine" to protect you. That's not really fair to her. She is only 13 and doesn't really need to be worrying about the well being of either of her parents. She obviously really loves you (and so obvious how much you adore her), and might benefit knowing that you are a more then capable adult ~ well equipped to handle all of your affairs, including the fall out with her mama.

From what I've read, she's struggling in this relationship with her mom and has become some sort of go-between when it comes to the zero communication between her parents.  It's not exactly healthy for a kiddo to take that on, it also leaves her to her own triangulating/manipulating behavior (like when she asks mom to buy her things because you don't have any money). My own son does this when it comes to his biological father... who he only talks to when he wants something. It's how he fosters their relationship, only sending him messages when asking for [very expensive] gifts. His dad enables the behavior, even when I've pointed out that it's not how relationships work. My son has a "he owes me" kind of attitude (and I guess his dad think he owes him) because he was absent the first 9 years of his life. It's how they're both making peace I suppose. I disagree with it because it's twisted thinking really that monetary compensation is going to fix anything, and encourage my son to shelve the entitlement - explaining that self worth isn't determined by what other people do for you (and certainly not by what the buy you).

I just think that these kids deserve to just be kids, you know?  It's up to us to help pave the path the best we can in making sure they are allowed to do just that...as often as they can.    

~DreamGirl

[HardDaysNight]

Wow! Who is the parent here?   I suspect later ARM will find a way to bribe AR, just guessing based on experience.

20 September 2011A R M
oh sorry again thought you ment you telling school and your dad im such a terrible mother.

20 September 2011A B
omg k

20 September 2011A R M
you do hate me tho dont you!

20 September 2011A B
no..

20 September 2011A R M
i dont know what to do anymore everything i do comes out wrong im so sorry!
i dont like myself never mind anyone else liking me!

20 September 2011A B
ergh
fgs
no
see

20 September 2011A R M
i think maybe you should stay at your dads until ive got myself sorted out as im just making everything worse

20 September 2011A B
you just started another argument mum
fine

….
20 September 2011A R M
i m the one that need to grow up and stop being so childish i really am sorry

20 September 2011A B
stop saying things like that then
thinks about how i feel
but

……
20 September 2011A B
but you moan at me all the time
i want a break..
not being horrible and you no i cant deal with things at this age

20 September 2011A R M
please come home i need you so much ive got no one else H is never here im sorry i push you away

It would be OK if this was not a parent-child relationship and the “parent” here wasn’t 13.

[luckystrikes]

haven't finished reading the entire thing, though almost, just wanted to echo sentiments of others and throw in my two cents.

BPD aside, the mother REEKS of emotional immaturity. ive seen unhealthier dynamics, and im sure the two of them have experienced unhealthier dynamics outside those convos (im assuming the yelling and the fights that were mentioned, probably among lots of other thing went on) but its functionally obviously unhealthy.

i agree with dreamgirl wholeheartedly. im 25 years old, so im not sure im all that qualified to opine about it, but hey. there is clearly a good deal of anger in your daughter. i dont know that it rises to the level of "anger problem", but if it was causing reprimands at school, suspensions, etc, that obviously poses a problem, though i dont know the whole story.

there are some good signs. shes very perceptive. she gets that her moms nutty. and the willingness to cut unhealthy people out of her life is a healthy sign, but i was kind of troubled by the tone of it. shes 13. she ought not even be experiencing unhealthy people, or having to eject people from her life, especially her mother. yes i get that shes 13, and completely empathize with what she had to deal with, but there was something troubling about the ease she temporarily ejected her mom with. i dont mean this insultingly in the slightest, but theres a certain 'coldness', maybe 'detachment' is a better word, i detected, that is completely understandable, but cant be good for her. however, on the contrary, she seems to care a great deal about you and your feelings, and thats obviously a good sign. even though your daughter seems to have her mother largely figured out, exposure to toxic people is still toxic. i knew my ex was nutty. i still let it make me nutty.

i was with the others on talking to your daughter about this, but i can see why youd hesitate now, and i kinda tend to lean on your side. i still think its something that needs to be addressed. i cant imagine going through all of that at 13. im not saying have this conversation, im not sure itd be appropriate. but at a certain point, i think she ought to know her mother is ill, and that her treatment is not personal, and that her mother loves her the best she can. before i dove into BPD, as well as stories of victims, id see people come from troubled families, and/or parents, and not completely understand why they couldnt just radically accept certain things. i get it now.

anyway, hope this doesnt come off as criticism, or telling you how to parent, far from it. i think youre doing a great job. again, i do not have kids, nor have i ever been married. just wanted to offer feedback.

[Faded]

haven't finished reading the entire thing, though almost, just wanted to echo sentiments of others and throw in my two cents.

BPD aside, the mother REEKS of emotional immaturity. ive seen unhealthier dynamics, and im sure the two of them have experienced unhealthier dynamics outside those convos (im assuming the yelling and the fights that were mentioned, probably among lots of other thing went on) but its functionally obviously unhealthy.

Doesnt she just! And you are very very right, this is so unhealthy but what can i really do other than support daughter?

i agree with dreamgirl wholeheartedly. im 25 years old, so im not sure im all that qualified to opine about it, but hey. there is clearly a good deal of anger in your daughter. i dont know that it rises to the level of "anger problem", but if it was causing reprimands at school, suspensions, etc, that obviously poses a problem, though i dont know the whole story.

Yes D does show signs of anger at times but i view it carefully and really, i put it down to the situation in hand, she is not a naughty child but she is no angel either. Ive expressed to her about certain emotions and tried to validate (or so i think) by letting her know 'its ok to cry' if your upset, 'its ok to laugh' if your happy, 'its ok to be angry if something has made you angry'.
Through the thick of it is when she went off the rails as i expressed in previous threads when i 1st joined here.
Last school suspension was about a month ago when she changed schools and i think between school and myself we have nipped that in the bud, shes more settled at school and seems more settled (than she was) within herself. Clearly that is some front by what ive read but on the outside she seems happier than she was a few months ago.

there are some good signs. shes very perceptive. she gets that her moms nutty. and the willingness to cut unhealthy people out of her life is a healthy sign, but i was kind of troubled by the tone of it. shes 13. she ought not even be experiencing unhealthy people, or having to eject people from her life, especially her mother. yes i get that shes 13, and completely empathize with what she had to deal with, but there was something troubling about the ease she temporarily ejected her mom with. i dont mean this insultingly in the slightest, but theres a certain 'coldness', maybe 'detachment' is a better word, i detected, that is completely understandable, but cant be good for her. however, on the contrary, she seems to care a great deal about you and your feelings, and thats obviously a good sign. even though your daughter seems to have her mother largely figured out, exposure to toxic people is still toxic. i knew my ex was nutty. i still let it make me nutty.

I too picked up on how strongly she set her own boundaries as well as her perception of her mother and the way she is. Having to expel unhealthy people from our lives is a pain but usually (outside of close relationship) doesnt take to much thinking to be able to do. Doing it to someone close to you (as ive experienced) its god damn hard and painful to do and process. Now, our D has ejected or currently ejecting her mother! How painful must that be? not only the feeling of wanting to do it, but also the feeling of needing to do it!
Oh how i wish D was not in this position as i know this is a life long thing for her, not something that could ever be forgotten! that makes me so sad for D!
In a sense i feel i have this burden of the past for the rest of my life but my trauma happened when i was 26. D's trauma started just after she was born (albeit she not concious to it) and will have to live with her mums (and my own) actions for the rest of her life. She has this burden from a younger and will live with it mentally for a longer period that i ever will. So sad to think D was bought into this world under such circumstances!
I remember our initial break up and me talking to the ex and trying to express that this isnt a 'just now' moment and all will be well, we will all get over it etc
The life long investment we both chose in having a child and bringing that child into this world and our world.

i was with the others on talking to your daughter about this, but i can see why youd hesitate now, and i kinda tend to lean on your side. i still think its something that needs to be addressed. i cant imagine going through all of that at 13. im not saying have this conversation, im not sure itd be appropriate. but at a certain point, i think she ought to know her mother is ill, and that her treatment is not personal, and that her mother loves her the best she can. before i dove into BPD, as well as stories of victims, id see people come from troubled families, and/or parents, and not completely understand why they couldnt just radically accept certain things. i get it now.

anyway, hope this doesnt come off as criticism, or telling you how to parent, far from it. i think youre doing a great job. again, i do not have kids, nor have i ever been married. just wanted to offer feedback.

After more thinking i really feel i want to talk to daughter and get her express herself. As for connecting with her mum again... Last year just as it all kicked off and i was trying to be rational i offered to sit down with mother and talk it out, offer and explanation to current situation for D's sake. The ex declined to speak to me.
Last month i offered D (i know, even saying that i know ive made her the messenger!) to keep in contact via email while she on the phone to her mum. To use an email for any circumstances reguarding D and any changes/emergencies etc The ex declined.

So in terms of keeping a parental connection the ex has declined. So i know ive tried to do the right thing and take D out of the middle but i cant do that alone. Parenting a child takes 2 adults to want the same for their child whether they be together or apart, the 2 adults have to have the same priority - the childs welfare... As much as im sure we both want the best for our D the ex is clearly self centred and wants to battle from one emotion to another which is pure manipulation. Im no angel here either, i know during my foggiest moments ive had to recoup and regroup myself, if i hadnt i would of been a mess and no use as a person or a parent. i needed to have my space after all that happened for my own health and for the health of D, It was selfish of me but ive not put myself 1st in over a decade and really needed to get me back for D's sake.

i was with the others on talking to your daughter about this, but i can see why youd hesitate now, and i kinda tend to lean on your side. i still think its something that needs to be addressed. i cant imagine going through all of that at 13. im not saying have this conversation, im not sure itd be appropriate. but at a certain point, i think she ought to know her mother is ill, and that her treatment is not personal, and that her mother loves her the best she can. before i dove into BPD, as well as stories of victims, id see people come from troubled families, and/or parents, and not completely understand why they couldnt just radically accept certain things. i get it now.

anyway, hope this doesnt come off as criticism, or telling you how to parent, far from it. i think youre doing a great job. again, i do not have kids, nor have i ever been married. just wanted to offer feedback.

I wont be talking about what ive read (well not anytime soon) to D but i so much want to talk to her so i can help her. Initially i wanted to try and get them back on track after D left her mums, i was warned and i believe correctly so that if i push daughter in a direction she is not comfortable after making her decision it could be seen that i would be ignoring the D's feelings and choices, making her feel like me as a father will not accept her feelings and choices so in her eyes she will see me as ignoring her feelings, dismissing them etc

Im not sure how or what i can say to help her as such, ive got into the habit of supporting her, making as much funtime for her as possible, keeping her busy with her sport and being part of that with her.
Im really going to have to find some words to say to her...
Should i ask her what she wants from all this?
Should i ask her what she would like for me and her mum?

Where on earth do you start?

I dont think me and her mum have the possiblity to connect face to face again, i just dont want to do that in all honesty, i truly dont want to seeher or have to speak to her. im happy with online communication about D but that was not accepted so again i feel any positive move i make to take D out of the middle will just brushed away. Even recently with D being booked to go abroad with her sport in a competition, the paperwork with all the info on i printed a 2nd copy off so on saturday when she met her mum she could give that too her so she had all the details of where and when etc. What more can i do communication wise?

Such a difficult situation, having to balance my own health and mentality, look after my daughter and support her as well try and figure out just a part of solution fro us all so we can all be comfortable.





You wasnt criticising at all, you was giving your opinion which i very much value. Without others opinions my options can be narrow, with seeing others opinions and experiences it helps no end. 

[Faded]

Just picking up on your point about D knowing that mother is ill and maybe a talk either now if appropiate or in the near future.
I ask myself, who am i to diagnose her mother?
Im still not certain she has BPD but everything at minimum leads me to her mum having at least some personality disorder! How can 1 person have so much upheavel in their life without them recognising it themselves?

Upshot in my eyes is that the mother needs (like she said in her own words) a long hard look at herself. A good talk with a T will no doubt help her no end, but only if she has the correct mindset to do so and accept that.
That will never happen, i tried during the split to get help for us but it was clear she had her own agenda. She doesnt accept help because she is not ill, she is who she is and that is the reality. Even a doctor telling her she is not well was not enough for her to accept that! She does not accept outside help as it hinders her own progress. (thats how i view it)

I cant argue that! I cant fight that? i have no control over her thoughts or actions

[Matt]

Just picking up on your point about D knowing that mother is ill and maybe a talk either now if appropiate or in the near future.
I ask myself, who am i to diagnose her mother?
Im still not certain she has BPD but everything at minimum leads me to her mum having at least some personality disorder! How can 1 person have so much upheavel in their life without them recognising it themselves?

Upshot in my eyes is that the mother needs (like she said in her own words) a long hard look at herself. A good talk with a T will no doubt help her no end, but only if she has the correct mindset to do so and accept that.
That will never happen, i tried during the split to get help for us but it was clear she had her own agenda. She doesnt accept help because she is not ill, she is who she is and that is the reality. Even a doctor telling her she is not well was not enough for her to accept that! She does not accept outside help as it hinders her own progress. (thats how i view it)

I cant argue that! I cant fight that? i have no control over her thoughts or actions

Most of us who have kids, and an ex with BPDish behaviors, have to deal with this issue just as you describe it.

It's probably a mistake to tell your daughter that her mom has BPD, or is mentally ill.  As you say, you're not qualified to diagnose her, and even if you could be 100% sure that she has BPD, the courts don't like it when one parent says things like that about the other one.  Even if you intend it as helpful to your daughter, it's likely to be perceived by the court as a negative accusation against her mom.

Courts generally don't even want parents to share information like that when there has been a formal diagnosis.

It's probably better to focus on her behaviors, and what choices your daughter has in dealing with them.  When your daughter describes those behaviors, you can help her see the patterns, and put names on the behaviors - "Sounds like your mom was seeing things in very black-and-white terms, not as a mix of good and bad - is that right?" or "Sounds like your mom over-reacted to what you told her - maybe she was really reacting to something else that had nothing to do with you - could that be it?".  Mostly listen and let your daughter tell you what she perceives and feels about it, and validate that - "So when your mom gets very upset, you worry about her.  That's very understandable".  Kids in difficult situations like this can wonder "Maybe I'm the crazy one." - they need validation that what they perceive is real, and that their feelings under the circumstances are absolutely normal and appropriate.

Then you can also help her identify what her options are - or if you can get her to a counselor regularly the counselor should help with that too.  Maybe if you have read "Stop Walking On Eggshells" that should give you some ideas - ways your daughter can manage the situation without trying to fix her mom - just practical options for dealing with someone who has those behavior patterns.

[Faded]

Mediation?

Im currently happy and content with NC in all honesty but im happy to look at mediation for daughter and mother but i highly doubt her mum will accept or if she does it will be manipulative.
But even if i look at the possibilty of that it will mean the D taking that scenario back to her mum making me put her in the middle again. Such a tough task to get right and i guess there are no definate ways of getting it right, so all i have is input form you guys at the moment.

As much as therapy in the uk is free im still waiting for an appointment nearly 3 months after going onto the waiting list!
Last T i went to a few weeks ago was all about CBT, i expressed i did the mood gym online and felt that maybe CBT wasnt to correct path for me to be taking so i asked for a more self discovery T to help get me to the bottom of my D's and my own stresses/past/future.

So all i have to go on for now is opinions/experiences here.



Really appreciate you all giving some input and helping us both currently  

[luckystrikes]

well its good to hear shes apparently doing better.

i really wouldnt know where to start either, even trying to think back to being thirteen. i dont know if at that age she can completely 'get' such a disorder like BPD anyway. and yeah, i have to agree, given shes undiagnosed, im not sure itd be fair to tell her that her mother is ill. i mean, you can rest fairly assured either way, but stating such a serious thing as fact wouldnt be fair, and she may not be ready to hear it as a matter of opinion. i dont know, when shes older, maybe 18, im not sure that it would be completely out of line at all, to tell her what you suspect is to blame for her mothers behavior. ive had conversations with my parents about each other, things the other wouldnt be at all comfortable with, and they both hesitated to do in fact, but i never felt it crossed a line. it does not have to be bad mouthing. you can tell her her mother loves her, but theres unfortunately, just not really a WAY to have a stable relationship. boundaries, etc. i think the hypothetical questions you posed would be fine. youd also have to obviously be careful that nothing from that conversation would ever be repeated under any circumstances. that can always be a risk, no matter her intentions or loyalty. for instance, mom pisses her off enough, daughter responds "yeah well i know youre crazy dad told me all about it." even not specifically bringing you into it, the result would not be pretty.

and yeah, i just read what matt wrote, and i agree completely. that sounds like a much better way to approach it, speaking in terms of behaviors, working her through them, etc. i still wish there was a person for whom it was appropriate to broach the illness factor with her. i just suspect, when shes able to intellectualize it, it would help her far more to know what she dealt with was a matter of illness, and not personal. like i said, perhaps when shes around 18 or something, maybe older.

[dah1029]

I'm just curious what events led up to you getting custody of your daughter?  Do you have the ability to limit how much her mother is allowed to interact with her?  She sounds like she harrasses your daughter via texting and has trouble hearing the word "no".  I wouldn't tell your daughter you think the issue is BPD right now.  She's 13 and at an awkward age.  Hearing that her mother has a mental illness may further alienate her from her mom.  I would seek a T to help you with this information.  I'm just thinking of my own teenage daughter who would probably view the diagnosis of a mental illness as embarrassing.  It's better in my opinion to just view her mom as a pain in the a**  right now.

[DreamGirl]

I wouldn't tell your daughter you think the issue is BPD right now.  She's 13 and at an awkward age.  Hearing that her mother has a mental illness may further alienate her from her mom.  I would seek a T to help you with this information.  I'm just thinking of my own teenage daughter who would probably view the diagnosis of a mental illness as embarrassing.  It's better in my opinion to just view her mom as a pain in the a**  right now.

 

[JustSaying]

It's better in my opinion to just view her mom as a pain in the a**  right now.

Yup. My D is 14 and frames it for herself as, "It's just her whole...personality...I don't like." I'm ok with her thinking of it like that. A hitch in that is that her mom brings up her own mental health issues with D--depression, anxiety, anorexia, and more--and so there's a one-sided exposure to issues better left quiet right now.

[DreamGirl]

It's better in my opinion to just view her mom as a pain in the a**  right now.

Yup. My D is 14 and frames it for herself as, "It's just her whole...personality...I don't like." I'm ok with her thinking of it like that. A hitch in that is that her mom brings up her own mental health issues with D--depression, anxiety, anorexia, and more--and so there's a one-sided exposure to issues better left quiet right now.

"You know how mom is..." is my oldest SD's mantra to some of the "off" things her mom does...

I think it's very encouraging when kids let mom (or dad) own her (or his) behavior/thoughts/feelings, rather then take it on as something they've contributed to or could ever have any control over.

I have to admit that the whole involving these kids in adult matters is very difficult for me.

~DreamGirl  

[Matt]

I'm just curious what events led up to you getting custody of your daughter?  Do you have the ability to limit how much her mother is allowed to interact with her?  She sounds like she harrasses your daughter via texting and has trouble hearing the word "no".  I wouldn't tell your daughter you think the issue is BPD right now.  She's 13 and at an awkward age.  Hearing that her mother has a mental illness may further alienate her from her mom.  I would seek a T to help you with this information.  I'm just thinking of my own teenage daughter who would probably view the diagnosis of a mental illness as embarrassing.  It's better in my opinion to just view her mom as a pain in the a**  right now.

Yeah, two good points here - talk about behavior not diagnosis, and consider changing Mom's access to D.

If you have primary custody, you might be able to say, "I'm concerned about how Mom's behavior is affecting D, so I talked with D and we agreed to reduce her time with Mom for now.  Maybe Mom can get some counseling and change her behavior, and then we can go back to the old schedule."

[Matt]

I have to admit that the whole involving these kids in adult matters is very difficult for me.

An interesting comment...

Mine are 13, 15, 22 and 34, so none of them are really "kids".  And these issues are pretty "adult", but that's not a black and white issue either (though surely kids under, say, 10 can't understand mental health issues that aren't super-extreme, like somebody being completely unable to function).

I think the legal system views some of these issues as black and white, like 18 is an "adult" and 17 is a "minor", when we all know that a mature 17-year-old might understand things many adults don't.  And kids who grow up around someone with BPD might understand it - even if they don't know the right terms to use - pretty well, if they get some guidance somewhere along the way.  They can figure out how to deal with the disordered parent, with some help and validation as they learn - kind of the same learning process that helps kids learn lots of things, in school and at home.  "So how did you handle that situation?  And did that approach work?  Well what other approaches might work when that happens again?" etc.

I think in general, we more often make the mistake of hiding the reality, or pretending it's not real, and the kids get confused and think maybe they're the problem...than we do the opposite mistake - telling them too much.  But we need to be careful about both...