Want to learn how to support a loved one and develop the relationship

[Think About It...]

3 months ago. I re-connected with an old aquaintence from high school. We now live in different states, but commincate daily. We have spent hours and hours on the phone. Sharing stories about where our lives have taken us for the last 25 years. Me a playboy kinda guy, traveling all around the world working and playing. Her raising a daughter and working as a professional in a stable in a career. I have had many realtionships most of them temporary, a few longer but nothing that led to a permenant commitment.

In my conversations with her, she explained to me that she had been sexully abused as a teen. As she was telling me about this she was very upset and as she was starting to go into the details, I told her she did'nt have to go into that with me. I didnt want to hear her hurting so much. So I don't know the exact abuse that took place but do know it last for awhile. She told me she went thru years of counseling in her early 20s and has dealt with alot of the issues that the abuse has caused in her life. She has had the same job for 15 years. Her Daughter is in College. She has a stable life from what I can tell from only talking to her on the phone.

 She has explained to me that she was married for 4 years in her early twenties but not to father of her child. She told me that most all her relationships ended because she was not able to GIVE ENOUGH emotionally. I really did'nt think to much about it at the time. We continued to talk, her and i both really sharing together daily events and deeper subjects as well.
She wanted us to meet again, so we set up a date six weeks into the future when she was going to come visit me. As the date got closer we both were excited to meet again. Talking about things that might happen, etc. The week before her arrival she started to change a bit not keeping her word to call me. Taking off for the weekend and not answering my calls. At first I just thought she was seeing someone else, but this only happened for a few days then she was right back to her usual self. A little sparatic but loving, sharing, etc..

I know this is getting long winded but I am so confused. I need to summarize or this will get way to long.

Ever since our plans to meet didnt work out she has been like a yoyo with me drawing me in close to her then shutting me out. Getting really emtionally close through our converstaions then she shuts me out almost completely. she would not talk to me for a week. Then she calls to tell me that she she wanted to fix things.  So we talked she agreed to keep her word with me and be open and honest with me. So we got close again, talking daily lovingly, sharing emotions, and the daily stuff of life. Then this past weekend, she just out of the blue, shut me out again, it feels like she is abusing me emotionally sometimes, I believe her when she tells me she wants biuld a relationship with me, but she just keeps closing up and shutting me off. This time there was a new twist she accused me a being controling when i have never asked her to anything but keep her own word to me. I don't know what to do. I have grown to care for her deeply and dont want to just walk away. I really believe she wants to biuld something with me, but just does'nt know how? I feel like I am in the twilight zone, please a need some advice! I really want try and love her i have the patience just not the skills! PLEASEHELP1


That's why I am here! To think and to learn if this is something that i can deal with or not. I am not the  kind of person to throw someone away that i care for. I want to learn how to support her as a friend first and see what happens after that! I don't even know if she has been diagnosed with BPD yet! I do know I have learned alot about myself thru her. I feel like she is a gift to my life. She has expanded my thinking on many levels. Specially about myself and my past relationships. Helped me grow spiritually in ways I did not even understand were possible!

My next question for those that understand more about this is:
 How do I find out what her years of counseling have told her?
 Do I just ask her striaght out does she have BPD?
Do i set it up some in steps?
She openly talked with me about her counseling when we first started talking, but i didnt really understand what to ask her about. Will it be diferent now that I have been thru two of these  cycles with her?
She barely is communicating with me at the current time, and only on her terms.
  

[purelove]

3 months ago. I re-connected with an old aquaintence from high school. We now live in different states, but commincate daily. We have spent hours and hours on the phone. Sharing stories about where our lives have taken us for the last 25 years. Me a playboy kinda guy, traveling all around the world working and playing. Her raising a daughter and working as a professional in a stable in a career. I have had many realtionships most of them temporary, a few longer but nothing that led to a permenant commitment.

In my conversations with her, she explained to me that she had been sexully abused as a teen. As she was telling me about this she was very upset and as she was starting to go into the details, I told her she did'nt have to go into that with me. I didnt want to hear her hurting so much. So I don't know the exact abuse that took place but do know it last for awhile. She told me she went thru years of counseling in her early 20s and has dealt with alot of the issues that the abuse has caused in her life. She has had the same job for 15 years. Her Daughter is in College. She has a stable life from what I can tell from only talking to her on the phone.

 She has explained to me that she was married for 4 years in her early twenties but not to father of her child. She told me that most all her relationships ended because she was not able to GIVE ENOUGH emotionally. I really did'nt think to much about it at the time. We continued to talk, her and i both really sharing together daily events and deeper subjects as well.
She wanted us to meet again, so we set up a date six weeks into the future when she was going to come visit me. As the date got closer we both were excited to meet again. Talking about things that might happen, etc. The week before her arrival she started to change a bit not keeping her word to call me. Taking off for the weekend and not answering my calls. At first I just thought she was seeing someone else, but this only happened for a few days then she was right back to her usual self. A little sparatic but loving, sharing, etc..

I know this is getting long winded but I am so confused. I need to summarize or this will get way to long.

Ever since our plans to meet didnt work out she has been like a yoyo with me drawing me in close to her then shutting me out. Getting really emtionally close through our converstaions then she shuts me out almost completely. she would not talk to me for a week. Then she calls to tell me that she she wanted to fix things.  So we talked she agreed to keep her word with me and be open and honest with me. So we got close again, talking daily lovingly, sharing emotions, and the daily stuff of life. Then this past weekend, she just out of the blue, shut me out again, it feels like she is abusing me emotionally sometimes, I believe her when she tells me she wants biuld a relationship with me, but she just keeps closing up and shutting me off. This time there was a new twist she accused me a being controling when i have never asked her to anything but keep her own word to me. I don't know what to do. I have grown to care for her deeply and dont want to just walk away. I really believe she wants to biuld something with me, but just does'nt know how? I feel like I am in the twilight zone, please a need some advice! I really want try and love her i have the patience just not the skills! PLEASEHELP1


That's why I am here! To think and to learn if this is something that i can deal with or not. I am not the  kind of person to throw someone away that i care for. I want to learn how to support her as a friend first and see what happens after that! I don't even know if she has been diagnosed with BPD yet! I do know I have learned alot about myself thru her. I feel like she is a gift to my life. She has expanded my thinking on many levels. Specially about myself and my past relationships. Helped me grow spiritually in ways I did not even understand were possible!

My next question for those that understand more about this is:
 How do I find out what her years of counseling have told her?
 Do I just ask her striaght out does she have BPD?
Do i set it up some in steps?
She openly talked with me about her counseling when we first started talking, but i didnt really understand what to ask her about. Will it be diferent now that I have been thru two of these  cycles with her?
She barely is communicating with me at the current time, and only on her terms.
  

[purelove]

No one seems to want to get involved in this with me.

I have another question, she does not want to communicate with me right now. Do I leave her completely alone till she comes back? or Do I continue to try to contact her, until sfe finanlly responds?

[Steph]

 Well...this is sort of loaded.

We dont know if she has BPD. We dont know what is pushing her away. We dont know what is going on with her.

When you ask her, what does she say?

  My guess is there is a whole lot you dont know about her and she is hiding something..perhaps even a relationship..or shes lied about her appearance, something..

 What truly interests me, however, is why you are hooked into this one. Given your history, what is it about her, about this sight unseen person ( for 25 years) that is drawing you in? Why are you simply just not walking away?

  So, I would back off, if this were me. Something is off,  something isnt right...and do you really want to walk into this hornets nest? I say that those of us in a relationship with someone with BPD have our own issues..instead of seeing the red flags and red lights and burning buildings..we, instead, run right into that burning building loaded with gasoline...Any idea why this is how it is for you with her?

Relationships with pwBPD start of magical and intense and feel too good to be true. This is what tends to grab us and keep us hooked..and its never the same, after a short period of time..is this what you are looking for?

Steph

[jessicapuppy]

Hi there Purelove

Just to say that I have been looking out for your first post over here, and that you will start to get some answers coming in soon.

It might help you to try to answer some of the questions (hard questions) about yourself that we are asking, not because we are trying to make a decision for your or are judging your in any way, but because if you can find those answers, it could really help you to work through this.  As I mentioned on the last thread, you need to be in a very strong place emotionally in order to help this person, whatever her condition.  If you can look at your thoughts and feelings objectively, it will help you know if you are able to be a care-giver to your friend.

The fact that you want to help this friend is wonderful, but you are getting insight into this before you commit, which is (I think) what most of us would have loved to have had!  If we appear pessimistic or defeatist, we really don't mean to be, we are just looking out for you  

You have our support whatever you want to do.

JP
x

[ellil]

Hi Purelove, it is hard even when two people are in town and see each other to actually know whether it's BPD or something else, or just a person hiding something.

Although you can't possibly know from such a distance, both geographically and time-wise, look inward Purelove. It's still so early on and you haven't known her for over 25 years. Long distance relationships between healthy people are difficult enough; why is it you are this invested already?

Whether or not there is a pd, the lady certainly has issues, especially with communication. She has issues that have bothered you enough for you to seek answers. Why do you want to be involved with this rather distant person?

Ok, on to one or two of your questions. Personally, if someone I were involved with gave off signals of a personality disorder, I have already gone on record on another forum saying yes, I would ask if they had a diagnosis. I caution you that I was the ONLY ONE who said that, and everyone else had very sound and valid reasons for not asking.

If I were discussing someone else's counseling, I'd probably ask that if they didn't mind, could they tell me some of the issues that were being handled, but again, I think I am way in the minority on this.

Plus, it's not like people with BPD aren't known to lie.

My thought is you really have not had a relationship with her, and you haven't met in over 25 years. I'd have to ask myself why this is so important to me. Like JP says, whatever your decision is, we are here to help and support you.

M

[JustSaying]

Hi Purelove,

People change a lot in 25 years. I went back to a HS reunion at 10 or 15 years and barely recognized a sole. And yet I still have clear memories of how those people were when we all were 15.

If I toss out for your consideration that your current views of this woman are a mixture of what she's described of herself recently and what you remember of her from 2.5 decades ago, what would you say? And further, because what she is now--a mother, a divorcee, a sexual abuse victim, and more--is rather alien to you in that it doesn't match up with your memories of her, you're building an unrealistic image of her in your mind.

She isn't what you remember. She's experienced a lot. If you met someone for the first time and they described years of abuse, divorce, etc, your impression of them would probably be different from the impression you have of the acquaintance because of all of that history...all of that backstory.

I also reconnected with a past acquaintance, nearly the same gap as you. She also endured sexual abuse. She had failed relationships, physical abuse, eating disorders in that intervening time. But I couldn't really grok that because my head was filled with the rather useless memories I had of her. I subconsciously focused on who I remembered her to be rather than the very different person she had become. My fault, because all those unfortunate events in her life changed her.

So my caution to you is to ground yourself in the harsh reality of today. Separate today from any HS memories. She is what she is, and that's not what she was. You may be fond of the person she is today, and that's ok. But don't think that in any way she'll eventually resemble a grown-up version of your HS classmate...too much crappy stuff has happened. She may be perfectly lovely...I hope she is...but regard her more as a stranger you've recently met than someone you once knew and have a prior impression of.

[Marvin Martian]

Pure, I have some similarities in my R/S. I did not know her years ago, but I am referencing the behaviors. I suspect that when you started to connect with her. Maybe not unlike in a soulmate kinda way. There is likely something that made you really feel connected to her, in a way that you didn't feel in previous relationships. To compound things, there is the distance in time & miles between you [mine is around 5 hours driving]. At best this is a great difficulty on a relationship with a BPD. Their desire for object constancy, and enmeshment can be extreme. This can trigger her fears of abandonment as well. Last year mine was intent on coming up for my birthday, but found a reason to dys-regulate at the last moment. Feeling too close can trigger things as well. My thoughts...
1 the best thing you can do for her is to learn how to take care of yourself first.
2 Learn all you can about borderline personality disorder and its effects.
3 Learn the tools and lessons on this site. [wish I had learned them early on].
4 Read up on APD [avoidant personality disorder]
5 Learn about "Mindfulness" DR Marsha Linehan has some good stuff about this.
I think this is plenty for now, and I hope it helps.

[CodependentHusband]

purelove,
    As Steph pointed out, if she does have BPD, there is a predictable pattern that will play out in your relationship. Those of us on the Staying board have almost all made it to the 'Hater Phase,' as that is usually what brings us here looking for answers. Check out the article below.

http://www.BPDfamily.com/bpdresources/nk_a101.htm

  One thing about your story rings eerily similar to mine and other people's stories. I dated a girl in HS, and got to know her best friend pretty well. We always got along and laughed a lot together back then... We go our separate ways and meet 22 years later... we both were divorced (and me just barely divorced). I ignored some red flags and rushed into marriage after just 4 months. I can't tell you how challenging my marriage has been... It's been really tough for both of us. My wife was diagnosed in November, but she is in denial now and it doesn't appear that she will ever seek treatment for her BPD. If I had things to do all over again, I can't say what I would do... Because I do love her so very much, I don't regret having married her, but to say things have been a challenge would be an understatement.

We don't tell anyone to 'run' here. We support each other to the very best of our abilities. One of the first things we do for new members in crisis though is to help ensure that they are working to educate themselves on the disorder, and then we move on to tools that help improve the relationship. These tools are very effective; however, relationship dynamics run a wide range and 'stable,' even by the best standards without therapy, can be a far cry from a truly healthy relationship. Getting someone to go into therapy is next to impossible unless they have the drive themselves, and a very low percentage of pwBPD seek help.

If you really think she has BPD, you want to put some serious thought into this. If I would have known when I started dating, I don't know for sure what I would have done... I was in an unhealthy mode myself, having just come out of a 12-1/2 year marriage with an alcoholic woman who had an affair on me for the last 6 months. So, please, take in the information and make an informed decision. Watch out for 'White Knight Syndrome.' I had it... many men do... Don't believe that you are the only one that has the patience to save her.

I wish you the best of luck, and I look forward to hearing from you.

[purelove]

First, I wanted to say thankyou, for all your replies!

I need to tell you a little more details, background info that will answer some of the questions you guys have.
 I did not really know her well in high school. I was a jock that ran with the "in" crowd. But a nice person to everyone.
She was a shy, in her words homely girl, who at that time was being abused. She had a crush on me then she says. I stood up for her once or twice, i didnt even remember it but, she sure does.

As far as lying to me about her apperance now, I know that is not the case. We have sent photos all thru developing our frienship. It got to the point where I had to tell her to slow down because of the sexual content of some of what she was sending. She wanted to have a phone sex thing with me very early in getting aquainted. I finally had to tell her that I was not comfortable. That kinda of intimacy for me is to special to share it thru the phone at least for the first time. She did get upset with me, but didnt stop persuing me for it.

She has told me that she has not been in a relationship or sexual with anyone for about 10 mo. now. Her last relationship ended when her BF cheated on her.  He is still in her life at the present time. She talks with me about him as her friend now. That there is nothing sexual between them anymore, he gives her emtional support though.

I am asking myself some of the same questions you guys are asking of me.
 I guess for the last three months the way we shared with each other. Dreams, goals and  deep feelings, we discussed ideas about adopting a child, starting a life together, intamate things...etc. I fell in love, from afar, with her. She has filled me with with a love for her that is pure, based on what kind of a person she is on the inside. She is a really beautiful soul. She is committed to her family. She works a second job to pay for the care of her sick mother. She has stable career caring for others. She is passionate about helping, comforting terminally ill children. She has confided in me her dreams, deepest secrects and fears, she has laughed with me and cried with me.

I lived a life of a playboy like i said before, for many years, all I found in that was the same cycles of  ending up alone. I am 44 years old now and have changed my ways. I am spiritual person now,as in my youth, and my Faith always keeps me patient, non judging and loving with her and all people in my life. I have never gotten angry with her. I have been disappointed when she does not keep her word with me, and have expressed that to her. Right before her first disappearing act, she said that i brought to much drama to her life. Because I was always angry with her? Only once have i raised voice with her and immediatly said I was sorry for losing my patience.

 I was for a short time emtionally abit needy with her when she changed, this happened right after she told me about her abuse, the very next day she surprised me by sending me a text that she was leaving for the weekned. She sent me some pics of the place she was while she was there, but would not answer her phone. She told me that she needed to be alone to deal with all the memories that talking about her abuse brought up for her? I for the the first time in my life realized that i was being co-dependant, seeking my emotional wholeness outside of myself. My faith and spiritual life, as well as, what I have learned from her brought that into light for me. I have had short term co-dependant relationships in the past and finailly now understand what that is!

 After she told me about her abuse is when she shut me out! we talked maybe twice in a two week period. She would not return my texts,nothing. Then finally I texted, look if you are not going to communicate with me I will just disappear like you have. Within minutes, she texted me back, I miss you, I want to fix things, we will talk soon. Two days went by and nothing, the same, would not answer my calls. I finanly sent her a copy of her own text she sent saying she wanted to fix things. Finally, she called me, the next day, and i asked her if she still wanted to try a build something together, she said yes! We decided together that all we needed to do is be open and honest with each other, and keep our word to each other and things would work out the way they were supposed to. She agreed and we planned a trip to meet each other. The next step in biulding something real. The very next day, she wanted to change the plans of meeting, she did'nt want it to be just a short one day visit. At the same time she is always voicing concerns about "what if you don"t like me" etc. I feel like she has a great fear of rejection although I have only been positive about everything towards her. I always respond I love her from the inside out it is not about her apperance. Although she is attractive and I do tell her that as well. She is always telling me when someone compliments her? She is very over sensitive as well. She asked me the other day what nobby knees meant and was it a bad thing? really concerned about it? Someone told her she had nobby knees.

Its almost two weeks now since we made the commitment to start fresh with the grounds rules of openess, honesty, keeping our word. It was really nice for a week almost like nothing ever happened. Even talked about plans to see each other, spend a week together, etc... One week to the day, we were talking about our families and out of the blue she says" I think you are a bit controling I am not used to having to call someone at a certain time all the time"
I told her I never asked her to do anything other than keep her word. Never asked her to call at a certain time anything like that. and that was the end of it.
That same night she worked late as usual and didnt call text or anything. I texted her in the morning to see if she was alright, noon she did call me, for the first time ever I heard her angry with me. She snapped at me telling me she went out after work with friends and i woke her up texting her so early. 10am. She is always up by 7on the weekends. She had been out drinking with friends till around 3 am. This is not something i had seen of her before. Although i have talked to her a few times after she has had a few o many glasses of wine. She yelled at me that she would call me later and did'nt.

This happened last Sunday, she has only texted me a couple of times since then, never being nice always kinda sarcastic, I try to call she does'nt answer, sends me texts to please stop, after only one call. I text her good morning and she does not respond. Last night I texted her asking her to please call me. She texted back she would after she got off work. She called and was really distant gave her usual excuses about being to tired to talk, her life is to hectic to find time to talk, she has alot going on. This morning she didnt return my text of good morning! i sent her another around 12 that said Please, stop ignoring me. Silence only leads to confusion. I would be happy to give her what she wants, all she needs to do is tell me.  She responded once again we will talk soon.

Sorry for the lenght of this, but I was trying to answer every ones questions at the same time. I has always believed that someones actions is the best indicator of how they feel. This is probably the only time I have ever believed in the words of someone and not thier actions. i don't understand it all. i really think there is something like BPD or something close to it behind her behavoir. I want to be prepared when we speak next. I want to ask her about her counseling diagnosis, etc.. i would like some advice on setting better boundries. I love this girl but I will not contiue to be emtionally abused by her. i want to support her somehow? After she told me that everyone has left here because she doesnt give enough I wanted to be the one to have the patience to stick with it. I know all relationships take work. i just dont know exactly what I am dealing with here. if you have any further questions please ask.

[jessicapuppy]

Hi there

You need to keep in mind that what she is telling you, her version of events, may be just that!  People with BPD can re-write history and twist memories.  It's not even as though they are lying to us, because they really seem to believe what they tell us.

You talk about all that she does to help others.  If she has BPD, then normally it is all about them.  They say and do things for others, so that they can look and feel like a great person, and get a lot of positive attention.  You can see some of this when she tells you about someone complementing her.  My ex used to do stuff like that all the time.  He'd try to make me jealous.

I see a lot ofred-flag  in what you have written, in terms of her behaviour.  So please take care.  Ask yourself...how much does she know about you?  Do you spend most of your time talking about her, and if you do talk about you, how interested does she seem?

The only think that will help a person with BPD, is to get them into long-term therapy with a therapist who specialises in BPD.  Preferably into DBT (Dialectical Behavioral Therapy) .

The other thing you can do, is work with senior members over on our Staying Board, to learn all of the skills and tools you will need, in order to be a care-giver.  This is no small task, so please take the time to research this fully.

Boundaries Tools of Respect

BOUNDARIES: Upholding our values and independence

The Do's and Don'ts for a BP relationship

Supporting your BPD partner

Workshop - BPD: How can I get someone to see a therapist or to get into treatment?

TOOLS: S.E.T. - Support, Empathy and Truth

Communication tools (SET, PUVAS, DEARMAN)

TOOLS: Stop Invalidating Your Partner (or the BPD person in your life)

There's loads more.  That's just a start for you.

JP
x

[purelove]

Thank you,
 I do see that there is alot of, all about herself and her control. She never answers the phone when I call, ever. Since the first few weeks of our talking. She always calls me back. She only responds to texts messages when she feels like it.

 I remember one time she was going out to walk her dogs and I asked her to take me with her(on the phone) and she snapped at me NO. I asked her why not, and she said she wanted that time for herself because she is selfish. I had not remembered that until now.

Right now she has devalued me to a point where I dont know if it is even worth it to try anymore. I want to come right out and confront her with the question do you have BPD? and if so what are you doing about it right now?

I can see that she looks for attention about the things she does for others! I have heard her complain about everybody else spends her money but her.

i also want to tell her I THINK SHE IS BEING DISHONEST WITH  ME. That's the part I can't get my head around. They really don't understand that they are lying?

I am still willing to be her friend but on my terms I think? If I give her this hard nosed attitude what do you think she will do?

[jessicapuppy]

I'm certain that some lies they tell are deliberate and recognised by them, but in terms of the past, they can change their memories or blank out (repress) certain things.  

For example, sometimes a pwBPD will tell us that they split from their ex because he was abusive, and it will actually be the case that it was she who has abusive.  Of course, that's not across the board, but it happens.  My ex actually called me an abuser once, not long after I'd pulled him up about abusing me!  The thing is, in his mind, this could be his reality, and so no amount of my protesting would convince him otherwise.

Going by her recent example, I'd imagine that if you back off she will try to reel you in again.  Then, once you're in, she can push you away again - Push and Pull.  Just my guess.

[shatra]

Hi
 Purelove wrote
So we got close again, talking daily lovingly, sharing emotions, and the daily stuff of life. Then this past weekend, she just out of the blue, shut me out again, it feels like she is abusing me emotionally sometimes, I believe her when she tells me she wants biuld a relationship with me, but she just keeps closing up and shutting me off.
-----This sounds like push-pull behavior. And it sounds as if someone (an ex or a parent) treated HER like this in the past.
----What does she say the reasons are that she often doesn't return your calls?

Shatra

[CodependentHusband]

purelove,
   The members of this support group tend to be well-educated on BPD, and also have the added experience of actually having experienced the relationship. Most members did not knowingly walk into a non/BPD relationship, but, rather, found out after the fact... sometimes years or decades into the relationship.

   Do you know that if any of us were warned, I believe that a high percentage would have chosen to stay anyway, even those nons that ended up leaving later? Why do I think this? Because the 'Honeymoon Phase' is sooooo very intoxicating! It's unlike anything most have ever experienced in their lives before... we think that we have found our soulmates... Unfortunately, this is rarely the case. Early in the relationship, the pwBPD mirrors the non... You cannot imagine the powerful feelings this evokes (well, actually, maybe you can if that is in fact what you are feeling now).

   As I posted earlier today, we do not tell people to 'run,' but we do try our best to be honest, and help members the very best that we can.

She called and was really distant gave her usual excuses about being to tired to talk, her life is to hectic to find time to talk, she has alot going on. This morning she didnt return my text of good morning! i sent her another around 12 that said Please, stop ignoring me. Silence only leads to confusion. I would be happy to give her what she wants, all she needs to do is tell me.  She responded once again we will talk soon.

Admittedly hard question here, but has she not told you anything by not returning the texts and calls? With this disorder, pwBPD have been known to typically act in a a way that reflects exactly how they feel at that particular moment in time. This IS confusing, because we can sometimes think that they mean something other than their actions would indicate because the information we get is inconsistent at different times.

I has always believed that someones actions is the best indicator of how they feel. This is probably the only time I have ever believed in the words of someone and not thier actions. i don't understand it all.

What makes you think differently in this situation?

i really think there is something like BPD or something close to it behind her behavoir. I want to be prepared when we speak next. I want to ask her about her counseling diagnosis, etc.. i would like some advice on setting better boundries.

Telling someone that they may have a PD, or asking them if they have a PD can be risky. With all of my best intentions, I recommend that you read a little bit about this topic and consider the different outcomes before you mention BPD to her. Since my wife told me about her dx in November of last year, she knows that I have done a lot of reading on the disorder. She sometimes resents this, and feels that I am trying to "fix" her. One time she even said, "You don't love me... I'm not a wife to you, I'm your 'project!'" When I was painfully honest with myself, I realized that she was right... I had been trying to save her. I'm so much more enlightened now, and I know that there is nothing I can do, despite being such a great guy.

I love this girl but I will not contiue to be emtionally abused by her.

If she has BPD, she will not be able to help her behaviors. If you are in the Honeymoon Phase or already in the Clinger phase, you need to prepare yourself because her behaviors towards you will most likely escalate a great deal from where they are now. I am not telling you this to discourage you. I am telling you this because there is a lot of evidence for this.

I need to tell you a little more details, background info that will answer some of the questions you guys have.
 I did not really know her well in high school. I was a jock that ran with the "in" crowd. But a nice person to everyone.
She was a shy, in her words homely girl, who at that time was being abused. She had a crush on me then she says. I stood up for her once or twice, i didnt even remember it but, she sure does.

...

After she told me that everyone has left here because she doesnt give enough I wanted to be the one to have the patience to stick with it.

It's easy for those of us that are told that we have the patience of Job to think that we will be the one person that can make the difference in her life... Way before I even knew what BPD was, I thought my wife needed 'saving.' Heck, she even told me herself that I was the one man that would save her... maybe the ONLY man that COULD save her. I think that my wife believed this with all of her heart and soul! It WASN'T an act in her reality. I'm convinced of that. Unfortunately, my wife has a mental illness. She made a lot of promises to me. I had no way of knowing that she would not be capable of keeping them because of her mental illness.


I'll tell you something... I love my wife will every bit of my heart, and I will be there for her for as long as I can. I had no way of knowing she had this problem when I met her... Well, actually there were some red flags I ignored, but I didn't know it was BPD, or even what BPD is. If you want to stay, I highly recommend that you learn as much about the illness as possible, don't think that you will avoid getting to the Hater Phase, and start learning and practicing the tools. It's a lot of hard work.

[purelove]

Jp-

She has seemed interested in me. At first a great deal becuase we were sharing where our lifes had taken us since high school. It was actually her idea after we had been talking for a couple of weeks to come and visit me. But, as time goes on and these push pull cycles now have started I feel like she values me at times and other times like right now not at all.

Still waiting for the "we will talk soon" to happen. I am going to wait to hear from her now. Not, going to chase her down to talk to her. It is what I need to do for myself, every time i try to contact her and am ignored it wieghs on me a bit.

Shatra

She has a bunch of different excuses, to tired, to busy, to much going on in her life. But, I am suppose to just except it, and deal with it, no reguard for me or what it does to the trust and the relationship.



Codependant

1.Admittedly hard question here, but has she not told you anything by not returning the texts and calls?

Yes she has, she will only deal with me on her terms,now. It is all about what she wants, my feelings have nothing to do with it right now. This is the second time the cycle has happened. I get devalued by her very quickly I guess. I think it might be because of the distance and the fact that she has other care giver and there is much that i don't have a clue about that goes on in her life i suppose after learnig a bit about how BPD folks live there life. is it common for a BPD female to have multiple care-givers? Is it common for them to have multiple sexual partners as well?

2. Why do i believe differently now?

Great question, wished I had a great answer, but I dont. Maybe because, I just want to believe that when she says she wants to persue a relationship she is so convincing and it seems like she tries to value me. Just recently, we were talking about my family, and she siad she was interested in knowing my mother. So I put them in contact. At first, I thought it would be nice for them to know each other since we are serious about biulding a life together. But, now I really dont understand it. She spoke with my mom on Sunday evening then sent me a text saying how nice is was, and she would talk to me later. I called and she did'nt answer then she sent me a text saying please stop trying to call. I feel like I am in the twilight zone.

 

[jessicapuppy]

Hi there

Yes, we hear quite a bit about infidelity and promiscuity.  Most people tend to find they go between partners for sex (and care-giving), depending on who is painted black or white at any particular time.

JP
x

[CodependentHusband]

 But, as time goes on and these push pull cycles now have started I feel like she values me at times and other times like right now not at all.
 

If she has BPD, these are probably direct indicators of exactly how she does feel about you at those particular points in time. Feelings = reality in the BPD mind.
 
If she has BPD, she can't help it either. You can't love her enough to love the BPD out of her. It's really important to understand that.

 I get devalued by her very quickly I guess. I think it might be because of the distance and the fact that she has other care giver and there is much that i don't have a clue about that goes on in her life i suppose after learnig a bit about how BPD folks live there life. 

Be aware of the fact that BPD symptoms are triggered by intimacy. More/closer intimacy = more symptoms. This is reported by members here and is well established. Typically, with untreated BPD, the pwBPD will be more dysfunctional with SO's than that will be with in-laws, and even less dysfunctional with friends, and finally much higher functioning with co-workers and acquaintances. In knowing this, I would expect that distance (physical and emotional) actually helps the r/s, and the closer the non gets to the BPD, the more intense the push/pull will be. 

 is it common for a BPD female to have multiple care-givers? Is it common for them to have multiple sexual partners as well?

I would say yes to this in many cases. I can't speak to the multiple sexual partners, but I have suspected this in the past, as my wife has become noticeably infatuated with other males in her life. If she has had an affair, I've never detected it in my case, but many others have. That also seems to be true for strictly non-BPD relationships too though, so I'm not sure that there is a direct correlation to BPD in this area.

 Just recently, we were talking about my family, and she siad she was interested in knowing my mother. So I put them in contact. At first, I thought it would be nice for them to know each other since we are serious about biulding a life together. But, now I really dont understand it. She spoke with my mom on Sunday evening then sent me a text saying how nice is was, and she would talk to me later. I called and she did'nt answer then she sent me a text saying please stop trying to call. I feel like I am in the twilight zone. 

My wife used to express a strong desire to be close to my family. Unfortunately, over time, the relationships have degraded to the point that my wife and my family of origin very rarely see each other, even on holidays and special occasions. This is common enough that I think that there is a BPD connection.

[purelove]

Update:

Still the "We will talk soon" has not happened.
Finally yesterday I sent her a message saying.

 Take care of yourself right now. I hope you are currently in counseling. I refuse to be emotionally abused by you any longer. We set boundries, that you broke, then you blamed it on me, and have given me the silent treatment now for way to long. I have to take care of myself. It is what I have to do. We will talk again from what I understand once you have cycled thru thinking I am a bad person. I am learning about you, and I empathize with what you go thru and understand it is not your fault. I will never judge you, or turn you away, but i will not be treated like this any longer. I pray God's peace be with you.

This morning I recieved this reponse:

Never in my life have I been told that I have abused someone...sorry my first is with you. We havent even re-met yet and I have abused you. I am sooo sorry...never ever my intention.

I WANTED to write back and say:

then what was your intention by not answering my calls for the past month only returning them when you felt like it, not communicating with me for the last week after we talked and you expressed to me that you wanted to persue this relationship, that you really wanted to do it the right way. Making a plan for us to get together and then cancelling that same plan in less than 24 hrs. Not texting me back good morning for this past week. Not thanking me for the card I sent you or even mentioning that you recieved it. unfriending me from your mother on facebook. Not keeping your word with me to just do the things you say you are going to do. Them blaming me for being controlling because I mentioned that you had broken your word with me.

 I find it hard to belive that thru all your failed relationships because in your own words you "don't give enough" that someone has not told you that they felt like they have been emotionally abused. When you give inconsistently this push pull thing you do , tell someone something and then don't follow thru it is emotionally hurtful. Connect with them on such a deep level intimate emotional level then turn around and exhibit the above mentioned behavior.


  INSTEAD this is what I sent:

Emtional and physical intimacy (not just sex).
 What have you learned about yourself and what happens to your behavior when someone gets intimatlly close to you?

As of yet, I have recieved no response

[CodependentHusband]

purelove,
    I'm sorry. I know you are hurting right now. Unfortunately, if she has BPD, there really is nothing that we can say or do to fix that. We think that we "get that" as soon as we hear that we can't do anything to fix them... the reality is that it takes a long time for this hard and cold fact to really sink in that we are powerless to even foster making the BPD go away... then we know that we really do "get it" later, and realize that we were in denial before.

      I may be projecting a bit here from my own personal experience, admittedly, but I think that there are an awful lot of nons like myself that once thought that we could provide some type of therapy to our relationships and that we could break through this BPD mess... it simply cannot be done. In my opinion, the best that we can do is to learn the tools here to help improve the relationship to a point of stability, embrace our appropriate role in the relationship, and abandon any hopes of being a therapist for our pwBPD. All of that work is work that we do on ourselves exclusively. If an endless, unconditional love were strong enough to cure BPD, my wife would be cured. We can't be their 'everything.'

[Marvin Martian]

Pure, some more of my thoughts. If she is BPD, its unlikely that she can handle any negative comments, she is well capable of generating those thoughts in her mind herself. Those thoughts seem to trigger her emotions, and the cycle continues. We NON'S tend to expect our favorite BPD to react to logical arguments. But to them, feelings equal facts. Hard for us to fathom. And at times it can really hurt. All things considered, your response was reasonable. I have had some luck in changing the subject to something involving her animals. It can be frustrating to them because it is counter to what they expect, and it can cause an extinction burst. But it does break the cycle of conflict. I agree that we cannot be their therapist, or should we. But we can learn some of the basics, and mine [when well regulated] lets me know that it is helpful to her. Please expect anything involved will take time, and it is only when they choose to learn the skills to overcome the disorder, that it will be successful. There are some sites that are primarily populated by people with BPD. It wouldn't hurt to spend a little time there and learn about their perspective as well. And to repeat myself. Take care of YOU first.