BPD love... You attitudes then and now?

[Think About It...]

MJJ:

I know that my answers were a little more callous than the rest.  They do, however, reflect very accurately my level of total detachment from her.  I realize that she is utterly toxic to me and will protect myself by total detachment and NC.  I appreciate your admiration of my introspection ability.  Thanks!

I harbor no ill feelings towards her nor do I hold her directly responsible for the all things she put me through.  I know she did it, but the way I look at it is that she is like a computer program that operates the way it was designed.  It took me about 3 weeks post r/s to learn of BPD.  Once I realized what I faced, my hatred towards her evaporated almost instantly.  The emotional struggle within myself was very, very intense for about 5 months post r/s.

Releasing the hatred is #1 important for enabling one's self to move on from any situation not just BPD.  Doing that was my first concrete step to healing myself.

She is consciously aware of what she does to people that much she admitted to me.  She once told me she wanted to protect me from people like herself.  I do not know if she was ever formally diagnosed, but she admitted she has spent time in numerous therapy sessions, and was very vague when I pressed for details.  My former HF BPD is fully aware of what she does.

I am of the opinion that I cannot hold her directly responsible for her actions.  The inner turmoil within her, and the fact BPD is a very serious mental disorder mean to me that even though she is aware of what she does the disorder compels her to behave in that fashion.  Others do disagree, but that is how I view it.

The only thing I, as a non, can control is myself and my reactions to what was done to me which I failed in spades.  

You are right wallowing in hatred binds one to the situation in a negative way.  I had an interesting conversation with a close friend who is not a non and also a notorious womanizer tell me that he just loves meeting borderlines for the sex.  He just dumps them immediately.  I warned him that he is playing with a very serious mental disorder and to be very careful.  This conversation drove home the point to me of how I failed to handle my situation.

My next quest now that I have reached absolute acceptance and total detachment from her is to discover exactly why I chose to ignore or rationalize away the  |>.  

The answer lies deep within my core, and I do not know it, yet.  I do have some ideas that I will share in a future post.  I consider myself now to be in phase 2 of the recovery phases where I focus in on my failings as she is water under the bridge.  

This is the gift she gave to me which is a very good gift as painful as it was to acquire.  I will be better in the end.  Honestly, I think it is going to take me longer to get through this phase than getting over her.

[HostNoMore]

MJJ:

I know that my answers were a little more callous than the rest.  They do, however, reflect very accurately my level of total detachment from her.  I realize that she is utterly toxic to me and will protect myself by total detachment and NC.  I appreciate your admiration of my introspection ability.  Thanks!

I harbor no ill feelings towards her nor do I hold her directly responsible for the all things she put me through.  I know she did it, but the way I look at it is that she is like a computer program that operates the way it was designed.  It took me about 3 weeks post r/s to learn of BPD.  Once I realized what I faced, my hatred towards her evaporated almost instantly.  The emotional struggle within myself was very, very intense for about 5 months post r/s.

Releasing the hatred is #1 important for enabling one's self to move on from any situation not just BPD.  Doing that was my first concrete step to healing myself.

She is consciously aware of what she does to people that much she admitted to me.  She once told me she wanted to protect me from people like herself.  I do not know if she was ever formally diagnosed, but she admitted she has spent time in numerous therapy sessions, and was very vague when I pressed for details.  My former HF BPD is fully aware of what she does.

I am of the opinion that I cannot hold her directly responsible for her actions.  The inner turmoil within her, and the fact BPD is a very serious mental disorder mean to me that even though she is aware of what she does the disorder compels her to behave in that fashion.  Others do disagree, but that is how I view it.

The only thing I, as a non, can control is myself and my reactions to what was done to me which I failed in spades.  

You are right wallowing in hatred binds one to the situation in a negative way.  I had an interesting conversation with a close friend who is not a non and also a notorious womanizer tell me that he just loves meeting borderlines for the sex.  He just dumps them immediately.  I warned him that he is playing with a very serious mental disorder and to be very careful.  This conversation drove home the point to me of how I failed to handle my situation.

My next quest now that I have reached absolute acceptance and total detachment from her is to discover exactly why I chose to ignore or rationalize away the  |>.  

The answer lies deep within my core, and I do not know it, yet.  I do have some ideas that I will share in a future post.  I consider myself now to be in phase 2 of the recovery phases where I focus in on my failings as she is water under the bridge.  

This is the gift she gave to me which is a very good gift as painful as it was to acquire.  I will be better in the end.  Honestly, I think it is going to take me longer to get through this phase than getting over her.

[MindfulJavaJoe]

My next quest now that I have reached absolute acceptance and total detachment from her is to discover exactly why I chose to ignore or rationalize away the  |>.  

Why we ingnore the  is an important topic in its own right.

Why don't you start a seperate thread?

There as so many reasons withing us, the pwBPS and the realtionship dynamic which can result in us turning a blind eye to things that should cause alarm bells to ring.

[HostNoMore]

I will do that.  There were Red Flags all over the place.  To make it even worse, I knew her for 9 years and saw the red flags yet still got enmeshed.

That is where I am at.  My philandering friend eats BPDs for lunch, and I get snared..

[cyndiloowho]

I am now horrified to imagine that I ever fell in love with someone who I now see as having a mental health disorder.

Looking back how I could have percieved this relationship as a loving one is beyond me. I was living in  a fantacy of my own making ignoring the nightmare that was all around me.

Yes, looking back, it is frightening how many red flags I ignored! You describe my situation perfectly:
"a fantasy of my own making". Due to my own abandonment and trauma issues from childhood, I desperately clung to any attention and affection I could get. I wanted that 'connection' that had been missing in my childhood, and I put up with a lot of abuse for the trickle of connection we actually had.

What is your current attitude to BPD love? Sick. Like a nauseating roller coaster ride. The fact that I stayed on the ride for sooo long speaks to my own mental heath issues!

Are you still stuck in a fantasy that you were happy and that you were in a healthy loving relationship? There were 3 years that I believed we were very happy, and that that love would last the rest of our lives. Now, I understand that he "tried" to be a loving H, but that it was always doomed to fall apart due to his incapacity to love himself.

I read an article by Maya Angelou recently, about self love. She said in Africa there is a saying that means "never trust a naked man who offers you his shirt".

Are you still stuck in FOG? Sadly, yes. Fear-- a lot of the time. Obligation-- dammit! Guilt--God yes, especially since his cancer diagnosis.

How far have you come? I am not the same person I was 2 years ago. I have come to understand so much. I have grown tremendously.

How far have you to go? I am only a few steps along a very long road ahead of me! But I am trying to make it a happy and purposeful journey.

[GENERAL ANNOUNCEMENT: Are you on the right board?]

GENERAL ANNOUNCEMENT: Are you on the right board? This board is for members with failed or failing relationships that want to detach from their relationship and relationship wounds. If you are still analyzing the decision to stay, please post on Undecided: Staying or Leaving All members living with a pwBPD should learn to use the Stop the Bleeding tools - boundaries, timeouts and other basic tools - to better manage the day to day interactions with your partner. If you have questions on any of the tools, feel free to go over to Staying: Improving a Relationship with a Borderline Partner and ask for help. :-)

[MarshaDole]

A year ago, he was the great love of my life, and I passed chronological youth quite a while back. (I'm in great shape, though, and I'm definitely "young at heart" despite the sadness I still feel about what's happened in my life in the last couple of years.)

Today, he is someone I know to be mentally ill and incapable of steadfast, responsible, enduring love. Emotionally he's no more than a toddler, and I mean that very literally. I've read research reports that BPD brains lack some important neural connections between the emotional and cognitive centers.)

My brain is making my decisions these days, and my heart is slowly catching up. I will put myself back into the dating scene by the end of this summer.

[MindfulJavaJoe]

I am now horrified to imagine that I ever fell in love with someone who I now see as having a mental health disorder.

Looking back how I could have percieved this relationship as a loving one is beyond me. I was living in  a fantacy of my own making ignoring the nightmare that was all around me.

Yes, looking back, it is frightening how many red flags I ignored! You describe my situation perfectly:
"a fantasy of my own making". Due to my own abandonment and trauma issues from childhood, I desperately clung to any attention and affection I could get. I wanted that 'connection' that had been missing in my childhood, and I put up with a lot of abuse for the trickle of connection we actually had.

What is your current attitude to BPD love? Sick. Like a nauseating roller coaster ride. The fact that I stayed on the ride for sooo long speaks to my own mental heath issues!

Are you still stuck in a fantasy that you were happy and that you were in a healthy loving relationship? There were 3 years that I believed we were very happy, and that that love would last the rest of our lives. Now, I understand that he "tried" to be a loving H, but that it was always doomed to fall apart due to his incapacity to love himself.

I read an article by Maya Angelou recently, about self love. She said in Africa there is a saying that means "never trust a naked man who offers you his shirt".

Are you still stuck in FOG? Sadly, yes. Fear-- a lot of the time. Obligation-- dammit! Guilt--God yes, especially since his cancer diagnosis.

How far have you come? I am not the same person I was 2 years ago. I have come to understand so much. I have grown tremendously.

How far have you to go? I am only a few steps along a very long road ahead of me! But I am trying to make it a happy and purposeful journey.

I have followed your story and you have come a long way. 
I think the journey often turns out to be longer than we ever might have imagined. That you had the courage to take the fist few steps speaks volumes of where you are now.

You're doing great.

MJJ

[MindfulJavaJoe]

My brain is making my decisions these days, and my heart is slowly catching up.

Great observation.
Eventually your head and your heart will be in synch with you physical and spiritual self. When all 4 are in balance you will know yourself like never before.
When this happens you will know and trust yourself.
You will have detached and reclaimed your life for yourself.

MJJ

[findingmyselfagain]

Putting all the loose ends together after the fact REALLY opened my eyes to how much I wanted to believe in the fantasy...how much was *REALLY* going on beneath the surface...There were numerous things I overlooked. But it was basically me buying into the words and ignoring the actions.

I can remember things like her telling me that her parents encouraged her to date me b/c I was a "really nice guy." She seemed to indicate that she was wavering at the time. *BUT* she was *STILL* showering me with affection and fantasy romance the whole time! I didn't put that together until after it was over.

Just about a month in I was worried b/c she was telling me basically that I was a horrible communicator, but my life coach encouraged me to stick with it b/c we were only having communication issues (no joke!), that it was good she was being so open with her feelings to me early on. So I think she started to hide her feelings from me when she noticed my confusion, etc., to keep the fantasy alive, or for whatever reason, so I was caught off-guard when it all shattered.

I do feel compassion for her b/c I know she wants "something" but doesn't know exactly what it is, and really can't help her illness. I don't take it personally. I do believe on some level that she knows that my love was true (and that is what is scary for her). It's a sad state to live in. I have to stay NC to keep my compassion from getting me caught in the dance again. I have to realize there are things out there that kindness is sadly/truthfully just wasted on, or as someone posted here once, that it's a little way out there for me to expect kindness to be able to cure a serious mental condition.

[carian]

I've always felt like that she was 5 persons.         

I loved the 2 of them 
But struggled against the other three...   

[oceanblue]

These are good questions MJJ:

What is your current attitude to BPD love?

I realize now that the whirlwind of our initial love was mirroring and my love for my own fantasy relationship mirrored back at me.

BUT - I also realized something about myself in therapy.  We all are, to some degree, hardwired as a result of our relationship with our parents.  My father alternated between NPD/BPD abusive traits and neglect.  I realize that some of the spark I felt with my BPDbf was that he echoed a dysfunctional relationship I had with my father.  I now know to use my head more and not look for a spark.  A healthy relationship might also not feel familiar to me the way the BPD relationship did.  So, going forward I need to put a lot more conscious effort into selecting a partner.  I'm also much happier with my life so I don't need a BPD relationship to make me happy.


Are you still stuck in a fantasy that you were happy and that you were in a healthy loving realtionship?

Definitely not.  I'm mad at myself sometimes for putting up with his awful behavior for as long as I did.  I realize I allowed myself at times to be abused but I didn't see the way out.

Are you still stuck in FOG?

No.  I believe my BPDbf will end up homeless unless he can latch on to another host.  He is getting older and battling depression along with the BPD.  I did what I could for him and I no longer feel obligated to help a man that used me.  Short of living with him and putting up with daily abuse, there is no way I could help him unless he admitted he was part of the problem which wasn't going to happen.  He used me.  It's hard to admit but that is what happened.
 
How far have you come?

The last year and a half have been hard but I have grown tremendously.  I'm not ready to date yet but I am so much more fundamentally happy with my life.  I have new friends and hobbies and take care of myself.  In many ways, the BPD relationship was a gift - I grew so much after the pain of the failure of the relationship.

How far have you to go?

Eventually I would like to start dating again.  I've formed new healthy friendships and have diminished some less healthy friendships.  I think the depression is gone and I have so many hobbies and plans to look forward to.  I plan to start dating maybe in the fall and to go very slowly.  I think I will feel completely healed when I can date comfortably even if the dating doesn't lead to a long term relationship.

[Rayw]

A great and relevant series of questions !

I am not sure that my stbxuBPD/NPDw ever loved me. I suspect that she is incapable of what you or I would call love. - At those high points of idealization she said she was but with the benefit of knowledge of this disorder I dont think she ever was - maybe in love with being in love and for a while the life chemistry of that process drowns out the chemistry of pbd ?

There was a time however that I would have said and would have posted on this forum that BPD love is just amazing. That is felt intoxicating. I am of course referring to the idealisation phase where our needs and interests are mirrored. - yes I agree and with hindsight should have seen the red flags that were present from week one!

I would have to say in retrospect that I could not have been more wrong when I said such things. I now realise that the reason I said what I said was that I was still heavily stuck in FOG (Fear Obligation Guilt).

I am now horrified to imagine that I ever fell in love with someone who I now see as having a mental health disorder. - fell in love with the public persona and the sexuality and from her side i think the disorder was driving the process?

Looking back how I could have percieved this relationship as a loving one is beyond me. I was living in  a fantacy of my own making ignoring the nightmare that was all around me. yes all those red flags ignored - allowing the high times to override the illogical bad times until a point where it made no sense - wake up next to a beautiful woman and not knowing what words or actions will come from her that day - what egg shells need walking on that day in order to wake up next to her

What is your current attitude to BPD love? - informed and aware but with a small element of hope that it all might go away and become the "real thing"

Are you still stuck in a fantasy that you were happy and that you were in a healthy loving realtionship? - in the cold light of day and with acquired knowledge this was not a healthy relationship !

Are you still stuck in FOG? - some elements of it exist as I am only in week 3 of NC

How far have you come? - 18 months with a pbd SO - mmmm backwards in terms of my own mental health but moving forwards with knowledge acquired here

How far have you to go? - have to ride out the NC and the early signals of retribution and anger that are lurking

great thread MJJ