Is there an answer?

[Think About It...]

Thank you all so much for all the wonderful suggestions.  I so want to relax and enjoy the summer.  It seems that each day brings more stress and aggravation.  Just when I think things are going well and its a good day, she turns around and does something that shows me the selfish hateful person she really is.   I am trying so hard to be patient.  Whenever I try to explain why I'm upset she screams at me that she has done nothing wrong. Would I be wrong to just sit her down and tell her the truth?  To tell her how she upsets everyone?

[kellygirl601]

Thank you all so much for all the wonderful suggestions.  I so want to relax and enjoy the summer.  It seems that each day brings more stress and aggravation.  Just when I think things are going well and its a good day, she turns around and does something that shows me the selfish hateful person she really is.   I am trying so hard to be patient.  Whenever I try to explain why I'm upset she screams at me that she has done nothing wrong. Would I be wrong to just sit her down and tell her the truth?  To tell her how she upsets everyone?

[mikmik]

kellygirl,

I recall when one of my sibs was in a very very bad place.  She is an alcoholic.  She was nasty, argued, belligerent, in denial, hateful.  I recall after we did an intervention, which failed, that I could not reason with someone who was unreasonable.  It was not like speaking with a friend, my mom, or other sister.  Words just did not register with her the same way.

I think it is much like this with our pwBPD.  The more we try to impose rational (to us), reasonable (to us), and cleary understandable expectations (agian, to us) the more they resist. 
 
I have tried a few new things with my dd18 (she did go to classes for summer session this week, after experiencing anxiety and threats of not going).  One suggested by our dear Heronbird, from Valerie Porr's book.  I apologized.  I did it in person, and in a letter.  I said I was sorry for the mistakes I had made, I was sorry if I was not present as her mom as she needed, I was sorry that I did not understand, and how scary it must be to be a child and have a parent who can't figure out how to make things better, I was sorry for any pain I caused her. It was not I am all wrong, and you are all correct.  NO.  I am just sorry for her pain and any role I had in it.  She has made a bit of progress, but has slipped as well (since her T left on maternity leave 8 weeks ago).  The apology seemed to make her feel better, understood, she is a bit less defensive.


As hard as it may be to do, perhaps it would be a starting point.  My dd has not used my apology against me yet.  She just seemed relieved.

mikmik

[kellygirl601]

What is the pw in PWBPD?

[cfh]

I think it's "person with"

[vivekananda]

Hi KellyGirl,

Could I add to the suggestion that if your dd is in an anger range of 6/10, there is no hope of her calming herself down - according to The Essential Guide to Borderline Personality Disorder, Randi Kreger. In that state there is nothing that can be said, it will not be heard.

I would like to add to your reminder list to reinforce boundaries, or limits. Eg, 'if you yell at me, I cannot continue this discussion, we will have to talk later when you are calm'. Name the behaviour, state the consequences and set a date to try again. A re read on setting biudaries may be helpful for you and I do recommend Kreger's work.

cheers,
Vivek

[qcarolr]

Hi KellyGirl,

Could I add to the suggestion that if your dd is in an anger range of 6/10, there is no hope of her calming herself down - according to The Essential Guide to Borderline Personality Disorder, Randi Kreger. In that state there is nothing that can be said, it will not be heard.

I would like to add to your reminder list to reinforce boundaries, or limits. Eg, 'if you yell at me, I cannot continue this discussion, we will have to talk later when you are calm'. Name the behaviour, state the consequences and set a date to try again. A re read on setting biudaries may be helpful for you and I do recommend Kreger's work.

cheers,
Vivek

I really love the 6 power tools in this book. Very easy to read, understand and apply. And remember, this type of boundary is about taking care of your values (ie. not being yelled at - disrepected), not necessarily changing your D's behavior. That is sure a nice gift when it happens though. This often works with my DD26 - have been doing the 'turn my phone back on in x number of hours. I am hanging up now' has worked. And if she is still too angry to hear at that time, I set a new call-again time.  Or I leave the house for x amount of time - like take a walk or go the grocery store as she usually refuses to leave the house to 'punish me'.

Good luck.

qcr

[INFORMATION ABOUT THE 'SUPPORTING A CHILD' BOARD]

INFORMATION ABOUT THE 'SUPPORTING A CHILD' BOARD Our objective is to learn how to support our loved ones and to find peace and understanding in our own lives. There is real help and real hope available for families. For information and guidelines please click here :

[kellygirl601]

Well,  the past week has been quite difficult with BPD dtr 19.  Blaming me for anything and everything.  It really escalated today.  She started in about why she doesn't have a drivers license and on and on,  even though we paid for driving school. She is convinced that if she had her license and didnt live here, all would great.  This progressed all day until she sent herself into a rage and then insisted we take her to the hospital.  Shes been in the hosp 14 times in the last 5 yrs.  We are so in debt over this and shes no better.  Finally her dad took her but I feel that she can not come back here.  Her Dad said we cant do that.  She recently applied for ssi but I have no idea how long that takes. Are there any good resolutions to this of are we forever in chaos? ?

[cfh]

kellyg
My son gets SSD and is now on Medicare.  Whether you are applying for SSD or SSI...if the first letter comes back denied don't worry. It's so common to get a denial on the first or second try but just keep at it.  A guy who works for social security told me that they routinely deny hoping that people will just accept it...it's just how they weed out.
Have all your paperwork in order and don't give up!
From start to finish it took us about 9 months to get approved for SSD  then my son had to wait another 29 months to be eligible for medicare.
BUT if you are applying for SSI and get approved medicaid kicks in right away.  I never really got the logic in that.
Good luck!  My son just turned 29.  Baby steps but there has been progress.  Never give up hope.

[kellygirl601]

She has not worked so its my understanding she had to go for ssi...

[cfh]

True if she has not worked she is only eligible for SSI but the good news is once approved she has health coverage immediately and may also be eligible for other benefits like food stamps, reduced metro fares, supportive housing etc.

[kellygirl601]

Thank You.  That's encouraging.  She is 19 with 14+ hospitalizations so I figyred she would get the ssi...

[seekinglight]

As I read your post, I feel so frustrated for you.  It must be awful, and I can sense how fed up you are...

If your daughter is in hospital now, her bills are not your bills now.  That is the first thing.  She is over 18.  Now a hard suggestion.

Contact the social worker at the hosptial, it is my understanding all have one or a dept to help, State clearly you are unable to handle your adult daughter at home any more.  This could even be a bluff, but state it firmly.  Ask what needs to be done so she can be elsewhere.  In my state she would need to be declared homeless before a lot of emergency help kicks in, but then she is in the system and it goes MUCH smoother and quicker.  It is such a 'game' but you need to play by the rules or help is slow to none.

If she is living at home, cared for, fed, there is no reason for the 'system' to get interested.  They are overwhelmed with needs, and the lesser need situations are not taken care of because of the sqeekey wheels.  Most of us are not used to do things this way, but it works.

[cfh]

kgirl.
seekinglight is right.  I volunteered for NAMI and learned quite a bit about the rights and laws in effect for the mentally ill.  Wherever you live they would be a great resource for you.  Just look up the local chapter and they can help walk you through the steps of what to do.  But if your d is in hospital they are technically not allowed to release her to the street or a shelter IF she has no safe place to go.  Many parents opt to tell hospital that their s or d has no safe place to go (like back home) so that they can get their kid into the system and case management, supportive housing, treatment etc.  Yes the squeaky wheel does get better services.
The only wrinkle is that since she is 19 she can check herself out and lots of hospitals coerce them into signing release forms just to move them out.  Sad but true.  I highly recommend contacting NAMI.
You are not responsible for her hospital bills.  My son was sent a bill for $24,000 for a hospital stay when he was 20.  I called the business office of the hospital, told them that my son was disabled, no work and they lowered the bill to $210.00

[kellygirl601]

Thank you so much for suggestions and support.  Even though she is 19, she is still on my ins and we get billed for what is not covered.  Ive also been told that they would send her to a shelter if we did not pick her up.  Her dad refused.  She went to the er last night.  For whatever reason they released her.  They said nothing.  Another bill and she didn't even get help...  Honestly I don't know how families deal with this.   Luckily we don't younger children.

[cfh]

kgirl
If you have a local NAMI chapter call their "Helpline" or whatever they have to assist in answering questions.  They have people on staff qualified to answer legal questions, others about treatment options, support groups, benefits, entitlements, hospitalizatons.  And just as important you will always get a very empathetic person on the phone.  Just tell them your story.

[cfh]

It's so frustrating when they release them from the ER or psych ER.  In our case they always let my son go because they said "he didn't cut deep enough".  Unbelievable!

[mikmik]

That is just so sad.

mikmik