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Think About It... Whenever we refuse to take responsibility for ourselves, we are unconsciously choosing to react as victim. This inevitably creates feelings of anger, fear, guilt or inadequacy and leaves us feeling betrayed, or taken advantage of by others.~ Lynne Forrest
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Author Topic: The Hows and whys of staying  (Read 340 times)
Parrot Pill

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« on: May 29, 2012, 10:56:50 PM »

Hi all.
I posted on the new member board and was advised to start posting here... Though, in my mind, I'm "undecided"... In reality I have stayed this long and have no definite plans for leaving, so I guess this is where I belong.

I have been with DH for 13 years, married for 10.5. In the early days we were both pretty messed up emotionally, but over the years I have really grown up and gotten healthier, while it seems like he has been stuck. Until very recently he hasn't really been able to admit that he has anything to work on, and I've grown more and more cynical about the possibilities for our marriage. Complicating all this are the fact that we have a very intense anxious D8, and I have gone through treatment for a rare and aggressive cancer... I'm healthy now but at high risk for recurrence.
On the one hand, I am highly motivated to enjoy life as much as possible while I'm well, bc I don't know how long it will last.

On the other hand I want to keep the family together for my DD and make sure she has a close relationship with her father in case I don't get to finish the job of raising her.

I don't know for sure that DH has BPD but a lot of the pieces fit. He went to a psychiatrist last week for the first time; two hours wasn't long enough so he had to go back and finish the initial assessment before he gets diagnosed. I don't even know if BPD is on this dr's radar: DH is pretty high-functioning so I am the only one who sees.
Recently I have been trying to figure out how to think about our relationship and it is very confusing. If I detach and try to be objective, keeping track of trends and cycles, he senses it and accuses me of "not putting my heart into it". It also makes it hard for me to accept his affection during the good times.
If I just go with the flow and take each day as it comes I seem to suffer so much more from the downturns: since I started thinking he might have BPd I have been able to predict and understand his negative behavior so much better.
At this time I have no income and I rely on him for my health insurance, so I can't really go anywhere. He is currently trying to do what he needs to do also so I feel guilty thinking about leaving... But I don't know what will happen or how long it will take, and I am keenly aware of all the time that had already been lost.
So. I'm glad to find this site, I've been reading the Lessons and learning a lot, but I still am really in a mixed up place and don't even know how to think about any of this

PP
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« Reply #1 on: May 29, 2012, 11:52:19 PM »

Having mixed feelings is natural.
While you may not be completely committed to staying to make it work, due to your D you will have contact with him for a long time. Learning the skills and tools here can help improve your relationship, regardless of your decision.

Him seeing a T is great news, though getting a diagnosis isn't as important as getting support to help make changes.

Are you in any sort of T?

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Steph
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« Reply #2 on: May 30, 2012, 07:52:19 AM »

 It sounds like things for him are as good as they can be, at this moment. He is seeking help.

  What is it that has you thinking he has BPD vs some other sort of illness, like depression or other issue?

 I also agree with UFN that a therapist for you can help alot..get things sorted out more easily.

   Please do keep us posted!
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Parrot Pill

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« Reply #3 on: May 30, 2012, 09:59:39 AM »

Thanks for the welcomes. I do have a T.  She has been very helpful in supporting me in dealing with DH. She has been helping me see that I am not necessarily the basket case my DH describes me as, and has also helped me step back and identify the cycles we keep repeating. She also gives me a safe place to explore my options. So that's good. dd also has a therapist, for her anxiety issues, and DH and I see a child psychologist to help us with parenting issues.
We have tried four different mcs over the past eight years, and DH has done a few sessions with a T as well. He has told me that he uses his t to help with day to day issues and had never addressed any "core issues" with her.
DH is definitely depressed and has a lot of anxiety but I think there is something else going on too I don't know if it's BPD but looking at things through that lens has brought some clarity that I haven't found anywhere else.
Reasons I suspect BPD:
Cyclic pattern of stability followed by bad mood that comes out of nowhere and builds: he starts picking fights with me, and usually ends up in despair and expressions of low self esteem. Before he was medicated this would often include scary behavior such as banging head against wall. Once he hit the dog. A recent episode ended in thoughts of suicide.

He thinks he has no friend's/ his friends don't really care about him. This despite the fact that he has close friends from college who maintain contact.

He dislikes most of my friends, usually bc of some perceived slight or insult.

He says he can't function on his own: he " shuts down". When he is alone (for hours or days) I return to find him in a state: upset, angry, ready to fight.

He says he will do anything I want/need but he needs me to tell him exactly what to do step by step: a big issue over the past couple years hasbeen me asking him about his "dreams" or "life goals". He doesn't know what I am talking about, obviously feels threatened, and more than once has exploded in rage.

He recently told me that he doesn't deal with his issues in mc bc he doesn't think he has any right to get his needs met, doesn't know what his needs are, and doesn't deserve anything good in life. He has no concept of his "self" as a real or valid concept.

When I ask for support he either says something negative (I asked if he thought I would be good for a certain job. All my friends had been enthusiastic, but he said "I can't tell bc I've never worked with you") or else he makes it about him

He blames me and Dd for all the ways he doesn't take care of himself
Or fulfill his commitments ( we don't "give him time" to exercise, we "can't handle it" if he works all his hours, etc).

He doesn't remember the things he says or does when he is dysregulated. Once he grabbed his keys and told us he was leaving bc he hated living here, etc. Dd was very upset but DH has no memory of it. (he didn't go anywhere, either, tho by that point I was wishing he would). He also seriously underestimates the severity of his behavior: he got a migraine while driving Dd on a day trip ( he had taken her out for the day to "give me time" to get some things done). He was vomiting while driving on highway and had to pull off road and call me. Our 8 year old had to sit on the side if the road for almost two hours until I could get there, with her father totally out if commission in the backseat of the car...  When we got back home he was surprised by how upset she was about it.

I could go on and on  There are some things about BPD that don't fit, and he definitely seems to be pretty high functioning/invisible.

The challenge for me right now is keeping myself going while I wait to see what transpires. We have so many issues right now: medical, financial, etc. I am home with DD for the summer but have also started applying for jobs so I have the ability to make my own decisions.
Thanks for reading all this. Thoughts?
PP
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« Reply #4 on: May 30, 2012, 10:51:01 AM »

The nice thing about most of the tools in the Lessons is that they tend to be good for us in general.  Sure, we come here because we know or suspect our loved one has BPD, but the diagnosis or lack of diagnosis becomes a lot less important as we start to work on ourselves, learn our own boundaries, practice empathy and give validation.  BPD or not, these are good things and worth doing.

I am glad to hear your husband is in therapy and seeking help.  I am also glad to hear you have a T for yourself.  I found that support from this forum, together with my T, and my friends and family helped me reclaim my life.  

Good luck, and keep us posted as you start to apply some of the Lessons in your life!
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« Reply #5 on: May 30, 2012, 01:57:35 PM »

Hi Parrot Pill,
My heart goes out for you & your daughter. Even as adults, it is hard to take it as it is. I can't imagine how your dd might have left being the car with her dad in that condition. Like you I am also confused about whether my h has BPD or not. Watching the movie 'Front of the class' made me think that my H may be suffering from some kind of a disorder which makes him say or do the things he is not supposed to. That is when I learnt about different personality disorders online including BPD. BTW, 'Front of the class movie is about a person with Tourette's syndrome who is misunderstood as a troublemaker due to his symptons & who becomes successful later on in his life. Must watch movie!

Though I learned about BPD last October, I think I was in denial that my h has BPD & just ordered the 'High Conflict Couple' book. But then, I just read a few pages & did not do much about the situation. A big argument last month made me come back to this site. After seeing all the videos & reading the articles, I am having serious doubts that my h has BPD. Sometimes I am convinced since he has most of the symptoms but there are times when I think that maybe my mind is playing tricks in order to think that my h has BPD. I feel that maybe I am missing something & maybe I am also at fault for him to behave this way. So you are not alone in feeling confused about BPD possibility.

I will not come to the conclusion that my H has BPD for sure just by reading articles/books since I am a layperson & h has not been diagnosed yet by a professional, at least as far as I know. He has his own T, so other than the fact that his T gave EMDR treatment, I don't know whether his T diagnosed my h's condition & whether T told H about it). But one thing is for sure. After last month's big argument & after learning about the possibility of h being pwBPD & learning more about BPD, my attitude has changed. I am still in the process of learning the tools for handling pwBPD & have slowly started to implement them. Whether pwBPD is diagnosed or not, it does not hurt to follow the methods of communication & handling them.

Here's a summary of my status & what I have been doing:
- I have a sense of relief that maybe there is some explanation to this crazyness & that he is not a mean person who is doing this knowingly
- To a certain extent, I have an understanding of his behavior & actions & why he cannot control them
- I do not get into no-win circular arguments
- I do not yell back (as I used to before knowledge of BPD) to make the situation worse. As it states in the column on the right side of this page - Before you can make anything better, you must stop making it worse - I guess I am doing just that.
- tried validation once. It worked wonders. I could see his attitude change & tone soften in a flash.
- I do not bring up past incidents
- I try not to stay in the house when he starts dysregulating during the day time. If it happens late in the night, I cannot leave the house. So I stay away from him & try not to take his rants & accusations personally. It is easier said than done especially when he is yelling at the top of his voice.
- have a journal of H's dysregulations & accusations - to keep track for future reference & to see whether there is any truth in it. If he is mad at me for a genuine thing which is rare, I apologize & correct my mistakes. For example, he was complaining about clutter in the house, so I started clearing it up. BTW, decluttering is good to relieve stress even for normal persons, let alone people with POs.
- going to see a therapist tomorrow. I am not going to mention T about BPD since I do not want to bias T. Off course, I understand that T knows better to not be biased. I want to state the facts to T & see whether she can diagnose it without me mentioning it.
- making a list of h's behavior (to give to my T) but careful not to compare it with the list of BPD symptoms in any website so that I am able to state the facts & not try to make them fit to the symtoms.
- no offence meant - but for a while I stopped reading other members' posts in this site since I wanted to concentrate on my problem & have a clear idea as to how to start healing & what steps I should be taking to move on. I was getting overwhelmed as it is & could not bear to read the heart-breaking posts of others. With that being said, this forum has been a lifeline for me since this is the first time I am sharing intimate details of my struggles.
- I am trying to stay positive. Without knowing about BPD, I had no idea why h was behaving crazily. Now with knowledge that h maybe a possible pwBPD, sometimes I am relieved that I know the reason. But there are times when 'why me' question comes up & I wallow in self-pity. Understanding that that is not going to solve my problem, I try to come out of that mode as quickly as possible by listening to music or do some gardening work.
- I got most books about BPD & educating myself. I take care to keep the books out of h's sight & read them when he is at work. I got a Kindle as a gift. I am planning to download the Kindle version of the books so that I can take them anywhere without worrying about others seeing the title. Further I can lock the Kindle with a password & prevent others especially h seeing its content.
- I took a break from reading books as it hit me that it is the nons who has the most of the work burden on their heads to repair the r/s at the same time taking care of themselves. I needed that break to digest all the facts & see what is ahead of me/us.
- I am trying really hard to beat the temptation of telling h about my doubts of his BPD possibility especially when he is in a good mood. But since I can never forsee his reaction & that it is a bad idea to tell a person about their mental condition, it is my secret for now which I will not reveal to him.

Hope this list will be helpful to you. By reading your post, I cannot give my opinion about your h. Maybe senior members can help you with that. Hope you have the courage to go on & give your best to take care of the situation.  Empathy
« Last Edit: May 30, 2012, 02:32:00 PM by Dynamic » Logged
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