To you female Nons, I need some advice... please :)

[Think About It...]

Hi, I`ve moved myself to this board as i feel I am moving on! I have started seeing a new woman for 6 weeks now, my first "proper" person since the split with my exBPDgf 6 months ago. She was married for 6 years to a BPD and finished with another one also 6 months ago, so we have so much in common just with that and it is truly refreshing to be able to chat to someone who knows all about this "disease", the problem is she has been broken properly by her last BPD`s and is literally terrified of committing again, we have both been looking for red flags in all we say to each other and are both confident the other is "normal", she has been through so much and has so many fleas, I really dont know if I should carry on, I really like her and she does me, but feel there might be too much damage, Im through with "rescuing" people, thats why I got caught up with my ex, I have enough problems with looking after myself, to you damaged ex nonBPD ladies, what do you suggest?   

[brokenspring]

Hi, I`ve moved myself to this board as i feel I am moving on! I have started seeing a new woman for 6 weeks now, my first "proper" person since the split with my exBPDgf 6 months ago. She was married for 6 years to a BPD and finished with another one also 6 months ago, so we have so much in common just with that and it is truly refreshing to be able to chat to someone who knows all about this "disease", the problem is she has been broken properly by her last BPD`s and is literally terrified of committing again, we have both been looking for red flags in all we say to each other and are both confident the other is "normal", she has been through so much and has so many fleas, I really dont know if I should carry on, I really like her and she does me, but feel there might be too much damage, Im through with "rescuing" people, thats why I got caught up with my ex, I have enough problems with looking after myself, to you damaged ex nonBPD ladies, what do you suggest?   

[LoveNYC]

I suggest taking everything slowly.

Physical, emotional, etc.

If you feel you're making progress (albeit slow), then great. If you don't, then maybe move on.

[Want2know]

I agree with LoveNYC...definitely take it slow and make sure you both keep your independent activities.  That will give you both some time to process everything, and keep your r/s in perspective. 

Is she in therapy?  If she is, then that is a good buffer for you.  If not, it might be something that could help her if you feel comfortable suggesting it.  You'd have to word that one carefully, as you don't want to invalidate her.

It also might good to practice communicating in the SET format when issues do arise.  It can help with non communication, as well. See link for more info:  TOOLS: S.E.T. - Support, Empathy and Truth

[Happiest]

It is tricky isnt it.
As a woman I relate to where she might be.
I have a new friend and he would like me to move in...no can do I'm affraid.
Just too soon, and even if it was a year down the road, its still too soon. Thats me though. I know I have some fleas to address.
So for me, having someone I like is lovely, but I so need that person to not expect anything more than a couple of get togethers for movies and simple things.
friendship first and transparency. I would have to be sure that I could trust him in a lot of situations and yes I would be taking stock of how he behaves in situations.

The other thing is I really have to know that I can actually love again and I dont want to lead him down a path of maybees. I cant guarentee that I will have what it takes to love deeply in a way that a partner would like to be.

Perhaps thats what she is affraid of. But dont back off too far...just be patient
Good luck with it.

[1brokenwing]

Hi Brokenspring: 
 Was it simply a coincidence you guys met and BOTH of you have exes that are BPDs?  Could that fact be factoring into the attraction? Ok, confession time.  I sometimes find myself feeling "attracted" to some of the men's posts on here as they express and reveal themselves on this forum (is that weird y'all?)  Maybe it's the trauma bonding or something.  Anyway, back to you, .  If she is an aware, evolved woman who has benefitted and grown from an experience with a BPD, she may have one up on other women, you know what I mean?  Of course, the flip side of that is that BOTH of you will likely be be all paranoid and looking for pathology in one another! Lols. 
   I too agree with taking it slow (unlike the warp speed of BPD relationships right?).  I think not engaging in sexual intimacy keeps the mind clear and we are better able to discern what's REAllY there.   In any case, it sounds lovely and you guys should gently explore what's there and enjoy each other's company!      Trust yourself.

[GENERAL ANNOUNCEMENT]

GENERAL ANNOUNCEMENT The objective of this board is to learn and apply healthy emotional practices to the rebuilding of our love life. This board is about the discipline and strength of making those hard choices in life for good sustained emotional health. It is about not repeating the problems of the past; it is about understanding the wounds and baggage we carry forward, it is about healthy and practical ways to build new relationships. Click on "more information" for access to the lessons.

[bengaltropicat]

Take it slow and build.  There is life after BPD, believe me; and it is fabulous.  I feel like I have been released from a prison. I'm nine months out and not looking back.  My 28 year marriage to a BPD is summed up this way: somebody that I used to know...

[jessicapuppy]

Friendship first.  That'll mean neither of you feel pressured.  See how it goes and then where it goes 

JP
x

[Rose1]

DH and I are both nons  - met on this board but were friends during the nearly 8 years before our various other issues/commitments etc subsided. We have been married for 2 years now. I was separated and a single parent for 15 years, DH was in a nasty divorce for 5.  And it works very well - largely because we were friends for long enough for us to know we have a lot in common apart from BPD exes.  We have the same values, religious beliefs, family values, geekiness and ideas about bringing up children, although we do come from opposite ends of the earth. However we still both of us have some fleas and issues that require dealing with (some financial and children) from our previous relationships. We knew we would have fleas and made a deal that we would try to identify them and work on them. In 2 years we have had very few disagreements or issues (mostly because we have a lot more in common that ex BPD's) but those we have had have been fleas which are sometimes difficult to identify.  There is a huge bonus in that we are both nons and therefore have a pretty good understanding of each others' previous traumas. I will say however, that neither of us did it twice!

Hope that helps - time is a really good thing. Getting to know each other very slowly without going into a relationship was also a very good thing. I learned how he dealt with some pretty severe issues, managed very provoking situations and how he dealt with his kids, and he learned how I dealt with exBPD frustrations, and child issues.  These are quite huge things and imo if someone can come away from a major BPD meltdown without completely losing their temper that's a very valuable thing to learn about someone.

Take care
Rose

[brokenspring]

Thanks very much for your comments and suggestions, all pretty much what I was thinking, so all good and going slow! 

[Want2know]

Definitely keep us posted and let us know how it's going. 

[pallavirajsinghani]

Do understand the definition of "friendship" and 'being friends".  Being a friend does not imply becoming responsible for the residue of their past...same as they are not responsible for the residue of our past.  Only then it is friendship.

The purpose of friendship and also the boundary/limitation of friendship is to help each other overcome past by deliberately creating good moments, good memories.

The purpose of friendship is not to expect each other to be our counselors/priest confessors/recipients of regurgitated traumatic secrets/psychiatrists...the appropriate vehicles for these are:  counselors fo counselling, Priests for confessions etc. etc.

Friends are a spiritual emotional and mental sanctuary.  It is better to keep it sanitized enough so that it remains a sanctuary.

For instance, it is enough to say,  "I had a difficult time with my X".  Rather than blurting it all out and then enjoying the relief of sharing while making the other a sharer of the residual pain also.

Does it feel as though I am describing BPD behavior?

Yes, I am.  I see nons in pain doing this as well all the time...especially unhealed nons.

Everybody has an important role to play in our lives.  Counselors, this board, psychiatrists, psychologists, attorneys, social workers...they have their own appropriate and effective roles, family and friends have another.

So, use your friendship well...focus on creating good moments, focus on enjoying the sun and the scenery and biking and hiking and exercising and sharing thoughts ideas books...give each other a healing space.

Meanwhile each one of you ought to pursue your own healing...with the help of people who are detached enough from you so as not to get dysregulated out of their love for you.

Hope my perspective is not too heretic.  Remember, this is what the BPD sufferers do with extreme efficiency with drastically negative results.  So we should not do it ourselves unconsciously.

Friendship and love does not mean trauma bonding.  It should not be based on a foundation of pain and negativity.  It has a chance to blossom into love if it is based on small shared pleasures, gentle shared moments, shared laughter, shared peace.

Love is a plant best nourished by laughter, not tears of pain, but the gentle rain of mercy (Oblique reference:  Portia--The Merchant of Venice--Shakespeare).

[brokenspring]

Hi pallavirajsingha, thanks very much for your breakdown of friendship, very insightful, just one question, when we met it was a physical attraction, we went out a few times, then she told me she really really likes me but  wasnt ready for intimacy yet and wanted to be friends for which I was happy with, as we have both come out of BPD relationships and do discuss and compare our exBPDs does that now mean that our "friendship" is now being built on a negative foundation? We are as you mentioned building pleasant memories and times with each other, If this is the case I will stop talking about it, so that positive feelings can be formed?

[pallavirajsinghani]

I think your own intuition will tell you where to draw the line.  When you sense that by your sharing her pain is increasing or by her sharing your pain is increasing, it is time to explore other areas of conversation.

There is no cut and dried formulaic equation.  Trust your gut instinct.

If the BPD issue comes up naturally, it is one thing, vs. it becoming the very focus of your life together.

Then when you both are in closer to healing, then suddenly you will find that you have much more in common than a similar trauma...that your coming together is not trauma bonding.  That it has its own merits and its own beautiful foundation.

So at first, it will seem odd to take the interest off of the past...and to the present...especially to the pleasantness of the present...focus on physical beauty around you first...deliberately...like if it is a sunny day...draw her attention to the beautiful sky and tell her how it reminds you of the color of the ocean when you went there as a child and ask...hey have you ever played the game as a child when we tried to find shapes in the clouds?  Hey...look at that beautiful wild flower growing in a crack in this dirty pavement...I wonder what it is called.  I wonder if it is one of those edible flowers...

Small things like that...a golden thread of one small weaving knit leads to a big beautiful tapestry...

Focus on small flavors...like if you are eating an icecream, mention your favorite cooking show, the spices that have such a nice fragrance, the healing power that many cultures hold to be hidden in spices...

I mean, take the conversation to as positive areas as possible.

For BPD comparisons...don't hesitate to come here and throw it at us...that's what we are here for...

:=))

[brokenspring]

Thanks for that, those explainitivies? were way to blousy for me, but I get the picture! Cheers