Perfection as a standard

[Think About It...]

My husband and I were in the car and he sees a car parked in an impromtu type of space, the parking lot was full and this car made itself a parking spot.  This sets him off.  Inconsiderate.  Rude.  Selfish.  I'm a bit tired and I'm thinking, big deal, we had to swerve two feet to the left to get around them, a 1 second hassle that has no lasting impact, who cares.  I didn't say anything, if this upsets him, then it upsets him, right?

He says, is it wrong to have feelings like that?  I tell him, you have a right to feel however you feel.  Feelings aren't right or wrong, they just are.

It was kind of a moment of wow, he self reflected for a moment there. 

I was thinking about how hard he is on himself whenever he isn't perfect per his standard of perfection.  It branches out to other people that trigger him for not being perfect.  I think this comes at me when I'm painted black or a form of it, I didn't meet some level of his standard of perfection.  At the beginning of our relationship, I could do no wrong, I could of juggled kittens and picked my nose and he would of been, you are so cool!

This might be a part of his NPD vs his BPD.  I wonder, how could he overcome this standard at the beginning?  And is being painted black like parking in an impromtu parking spot, like I breathed too loud or did some umimaginable offense that was not in his line of perfection.  He is so hard on himself and everyone else, that constant perfection filter. 

[Rose Tiger]

My husband and I were in the car and he sees a car parked in an impromtu type of space, the parking lot was full and this car made itself a parking spot.  This sets him off.  Inconsiderate.  Rude.  Selfish.  I'm a bit tired and I'm thinking, big deal, we had to swerve two feet to the left to get around them, a 1 second hassle that has no lasting impact, who cares.  I didn't say anything, if this upsets him, then it upsets him, right?

He says, is it wrong to have feelings like that?  I tell him, you have a right to feel however you feel.  Feelings aren't right or wrong, they just are.

It was kind of a moment of wow, he self reflected for a moment there. 

I was thinking about how hard he is on himself whenever he isn't perfect per his standard of perfection.  It branches out to other people that trigger him for not being perfect.  I think this comes at me when I'm painted black or a form of it, I didn't meet some level of his standard of perfection.  At the beginning of our relationship, I could do no wrong, I could of juggled kittens and picked my nose and he would of been, you are so cool!

This might be a part of his NPD vs his BPD.  I wonder, how could he overcome this standard at the beginning?  And is being painted black like parking in an impromtu parking spot, like I breathed too loud or did some umimaginable offense that was not in his line of perfection.  He is so hard on himself and everyone else, that constant perfection filter. 

[Surnia]

Rose Tiger

yes, I know this. Very well. Daily.
Perfection, yes. Only one way is the right way. Zero tolerance for other 99 ways.

My NPDh gets angry about lot of things that are not conform to his way of thinking. Like you, I am thinking: Just feelings, he has the right to have his feelings.
But sometimes I think: It is all about anger. He "wants" to get angry, and shure he can allways find something.

And I, on the other side, feel tired about all these anger things. I try as much as possible stay calm in this, when I see the "next occasion for anger" around. There are a lot! From time to time early validation works or just early mirroring: you looks angry.

[Rose Tiger]

Not sure if my husband is looking...it seems like we are talking normal stuff and then out of the blue, car parked wrong and he is off and ranting.  What the?  I can imagine doing the same thing if say, I saw a small child being abused (anger) or a dog running around on a busy road (fear), those are my triggers, things that can take my emotions from zero to sixty in a second.  A car parked inconveniently, not so much.

It's like he is self appointed sherrif of the world of less than perfect acts of others.  Nobody is perfect and to hold himself, me and everyone on the planet to such standards must be exhausting.  Did his parents hold him to this level?  And it's ingrained?  Children that grow up with criticism and conditional love, learn to condemn.  I wonder how core this is, I mean can this be unlearned?

[Surnia]

Shure, I have this too, get triggered about rules, right or wrong, little things in daily life.
Like other BPD behaviours, it is not that Nons do not have this. At my opinion the difference is how deep or how often this may occur.

From my belief, a lot of things can be unlearnd or relearnd. Are "self appointed sheriffs" (great picture) willing to see a T or a counselour to do so?

Children that grow up with criticism and conditional love, learn to condemn

I could imagine that the parents did set "rules" at the place of her own personel needs. I could say: "I get really angry right now in such a noise. Can you please stop..." insteed of: "It is really impossible to make such noise in this appartement. It is completly forbidden. At your age you should now this!"

[andywho]

yes, I know this. Very well. Daily.
Perfection, yes. Only one way is the right way. Zero tolerance for other 99 ways.


But sometimes I think: It is all about anger. He "wants" to get angry, and shure he can allways find something.

I recognise all of this... and this is also one reason i prefer not to do any carpeting in our home. If its not 100% perfect we should have hired a professional. I have even had professionals i know to come over and check on my work. They say "heck.. we wouldnt even done it that perfect.. its not really necesary".

My GF isnt to fond of making dinners.. at least not alone. Once she almost applied for a 3 year chef school... not to works as a chef. But just to be able to be good at making dinner at home.

Anger... i also always feel she is on the lookout to find something to be angry about. Been thinking to myself that its a way for her, an excuse to vent some of her inner blackness or whatever it is. She very often get mad about little things that i wouldnt spend two seconds of my energy on.

If the neighbour plays a little to high music he is an asshole. She dont even speak to him when we meet him. In her eyes he is not a good person. I know the guy.. he is a great guy. His flaw is that he sometimes forget he has neighbours one floor above.

If he says hi to her she dont respond... and after we have passed him she might say "as if". She wont greet him as he dont deserve it since he plays to high music sometimes.

So i dont know... is it venting? To big expecations on themselves and the world around them?

Andy

[desperate dutchman]

Andy boy can I relate I do home improvements for a living and my w is my most difficult customer.  Imagine the teacher that marks up a paper with corrections you complete the corrections and the they mark it up again. Exhausting. I am working at not JADEing when it comes to my work. I have met other perfectionist in my line of work and try to run away as fast as you can (sound familiar ). Don't let your sense of self be wrapped up in someone else's non qualified evaluation  whenever she baits me with a jab about my work I use SET and the truth part is that I have saved us thousands of dollars doing quality work

Nobody is perfect and to hold himself, me and everyone on the planet to such standards must be exhausting.  Did his parents hold him to this level?  And it's ingrained?  Children that grow up with criticism and conditional love, learn to condemn.  I wonder how core this is, I mean can this be unlearned?

Maybe some insight here. Many years ago before i knew what i know know  My wife in a middle of rage while I was argueing with her logically (kids don't try this at home ) when I told her that it must be terrible being perfect. She broke down crying that it was but she had to be it was all that her FO would accept. I remember this vividly I told her that that must have been awful and she melted   Back when I stuck around for the rage I would usually find some kernal of what she was really trying to communicate which rarely had anything to do with the rage.

[Rose Tiger]

That reminds me of a scene in the movie Broadcast News with Holly Hunter.  She is telling the head of the news dept that he is making a mistake.  He says to her, it must be nice to be the smartest one in the room and always knows better than anyone else.  She replies, no, it's awful.

[Triptoes]

Interesting topic, as I have noticed this in my uBPDh many times before, and even discussed it with him.

I was thinking about how hard he is on himself whenever he isn't perfect per his standard of perfection.  It branches out to other people that trigger him for not being perfect.  I think this comes at me when I'm painted black or a form of it, I didn't meet some level of his standard of perfection.  At the beginning of our relationship, I could do no wrong, I could of juggled kittens and picked my nose and he would of been, you are so cool!

This could be written by me! When we met I was the only person he had ever met to be so perfectly suited for him, such a great individual there couldn't be no other. And then the cotton candy dreams came crashing down, as I let down his expectations.

My husband is VERY hard on himself. He has extremely high expectations of himself personally and professionally. He repeatedly feels like he is not living up to these expectations and feels bad about himself. Usually only for moments at a time, but often. He also has very high expectations of others, and is quick to judge behavior that in his books is labelled faulty. His changed professions and quit friendships over things other people would find minute. This is the root of his black&white thinking, it seems to me, and also a root of many of the problems he has with me: he loves the "perfect" me _

[Salut]

I can relate to the parking lot experience.  I have to listen to the litany about bad parkers every time I am in a parking lot with him. 

Actually, I am not sure that has happened lately -- I may not be hanging around in parking lots with him as much now. 

A friend of mine was telling me the other day she met her daughter in the back of a parking lot.  The parking lot was mostly empty and she was off by herself, so she pulled in without paying attention to the lnes to wait.  While she was waiting, some guy walked by twice and kept shaking his head and saying "I can't believe you took up two parking spaces".  Maybe this is an unhealthy national obsession.

[Carmina]

Dutchman said:
when I told her that it must be terrible being perfect. She broke down crying that it was but she had to be it was all that her FO would accept.

My H insists on always being in control, that he must always be strong, etc.  His FOO was physically abusive and controlling, so the only way he learned to cope was by one-upping them, literally.  (He started body building at age 12: got injured.  Started body building once he was healed, and by age 14/15 was able to beat up his father, and that is how he stopped being abused.  He goes on to point out how, after high school, he got a contract with the company his father worked for and "showed them" how he was more proficient in his father's field of work than his father was.)

And yet...my biggest complaint, my biggest angst about my marriage, is the constant barrage of criticism leveled at my by my H because I do not live up to his internal standard of perfection. 

I do well in school.  I went back to school after a decade of no school and took a biology class -- hadn't taken any biology for 20 years.  I got a 98% out of the class!  And all H says was, what could you have done to get 100%?  WTH?  My grades were amazing! 

I'm guessing that if he got into dbt, he might stop the b/w thinking and splitting so much.  Other than that, I strive to keep my composure, and minimize the impact of his cutting words on the children.  (Sometimes "keeping composure" is not telling him he is wrong and starting an argument, sometimes it means not bursting out laughing...) 

[desperate dutchman]

Just a thought about the control issue my w has to be in control of everything at the house. If I feel that she is going overboard (beating a dead horse) I intervene in an effort to turn her attention toward me and away from child she says that I am not supporting her (semi-rage state) even though I may be agreeing with her on the basic issue w the child...

Carmina your description of H is FOO is very much like my w FOO for them its all about "being a good mother" (whatever that is, her version is unattainable therefore she sets herself up for failure) I strongly suspect that many in her FOO were BPD when we met she was NC with her dad.   She was very close w her mom, brother and sister in the first six years of our relationship ... One altercation (I was not there so I only know wside  and mother went NC for 3 months w extended olive branch, mother shot it down, wife has been NC 14 years... I personally think she is trying to beat her mother on this good mother chart ...so if we cant do all the things that she believes that we need to do in order to accomplish this then its all my fault...

Recently she said something revealing. (this is before she started this great meltdown.) She said that maybe her father was driven away by her mother... I never met the man and he past away about 10 years ago... I sometimes wonder if he was a non who did not know how to handle it ... or they all were PD ...

Looking back at before this last meltdown my wife has strong sense of personal boundaries (as they relate only to her) Any minor transgression and a person is out. Neighbor dont wave back and she labels them rude and stops nice gestures.  Looking back I wonder if the stories about her quiting some jobs was more about her not getting along with the authority figures...

She doesn't seem to understand that we all make mistakes and my mistakes are not a reflection on her although she constantly says that they are.  Everything from not shaving and talking too much to disagreeing with her in front of our friends. She even thinks that if I express my liberal views to our conservative friends I am disrepecting her...

Lately when she is not raging and she is talking poorly about some of our friends I use SET and and he truth line is "everyone thinks that we are a perfect couple look at as now" I dont say it snotty just say it and let it dangle..She usually just gets quiet...


In our pastors surmons he frequently would say perfection is a disease... I wonder if he knew more about BPD than I gave him credit for