Object constancy and recycling

[Think About It...]

The only way I'm pretty sure she's not with someone else yet? She'd TELL me because she knows that it would HURT me. 

Myself- Are you saying you don't think she's with someone because she didn't mention them?

I'm probably going through the same thing as you are. She's idealizing me like crazy but I'm not doing anything about it. I just respond and play along. But I do wonder if she's with someone and whether she'll make any effort of getting back. I truthfully think she's too afraid of being rejected so she won't ask. At the same time, I don't know how she can self soothe without an object. Maybe I'm enough supply to be available and not close? Maybe I'm not the only one? I'm curious.

[nylonsquid]

The only way I'm pretty sure she's not with someone else yet? She'd TELL me because she knows that it would HURT me. 

Myself- Are you saying you don't think she's with someone because she didn't mention them?

I'm probably going through the same thing as you are. She's idealizing me like crazy but I'm not doing anything about it. I just respond and play along. But I do wonder if she's with someone and whether she'll make any effort of getting back. I truthfully think she's too afraid of being rejected so she won't ask. At the same time, I don't know how she can self soothe without an object. Maybe I'm enough supply to be available and not close? Maybe I'm not the only one? I'm curious.

[myself]

The only way I'm pretty sure she's not with someone else yet? She'd TELL me because she knows that it would HURT me.  

Myself- Are you saying you don't think she's with someone because she didn't mention them?

I'm probably going through the same thing as you are. She's idealizing me like crazy but I'm not doing anything about it. I just respond and play along. But I do wonder if she's with someone and whether she'll make any effort of getting back. I truthfully think she's too afraid of being rejected so she won't ask. At the same time, I don't know how she can self soothe without an object. Maybe I'm enough supply to be available and not close? Maybe I'm not the only one? I'm curious.

Mine knows she wouldn't be rejected, that if it could work out I'd choose to help our relationship flourish, so I don't understand it beyond it's an illness and won't make sense. I don't think she's with someone else yet, sexually, but there are others who can fill that need to not be alone, which I do know is going on with her. Other 'objects'. It makes me feel queasy even looking at it that way. It's sad to say, but yes, I know that when she's with a new 'romantic object', she'll try to throw it at me. It's one of the only things left for her to do to really hurt me, to cast those pains out of herself.

Not sure why you 'respond and play along'. Does it help you somehow? You don't want her back? You say you're "not doing anything about it" but you are. You're stringing her along (I don't know your whole story though, sorry if I have this wrong). Doesn't that kind of make her an object to you then? Like you're just toying with her?

[sirhero]

Every time I recycled with my ex, every time she would always ask me.. "Do you think we can go back to how we use to be" and I would always say "Of course, that's what I want". The last time we recycled and she asked that again. I told her I wasn't sure, because there is no change when we get back together. She then asked what needed to be done to improve our relationship and I told her #1 was communication between each other. She agreed, but never followed through.

I'm sure she still longs for that dreams she had with me as it seems out of all her bfs I've had the most impact on her and I feel like she will be trying to recreate the same thing we had with every other guy she is with now. I've said it before, but she has really picked up a lot of traits of mine (the good ones), my hobbies, and my interest.

[sm15000]

Every time I recycled with my ex, every time she would always ask me.. "Do you think we can go back to how we use to be" and I would always say "Of course, that's what I want". The last time we recycled and she asked that again. I told her I wasn't sure, because there is no change when we get back together. She then asked what needed to be done to improve our relationship and I told her #1 was communication between each other. She agreed, but never followed through.

I'm sure she still longs for that dreams she had with me as it seems out of all her bfs I've had the most impact on her and I feel like she will be trying to recreate the same thing we had with every other guy she is with now. I've said it before, but she has really picked up a lot of traits of mine (the good ones), my hobbies, and my interest.

I had a similar type of thing. . .my ex - before I ended it - seemed like he wanted it to "go back to the start".  I think he loved me and claimed he didn't want it to end but had lost that 'up in the air' feeling and was getting it elsewhere  ;p . . .and that is what they need excitement, lust, an ego boost, a 'high' etc etc. . .there is no depth to their feelings, and they cannot maintain love with real intimacy.

I read this on another site from someone who is a BPD sufferer when asked what's behind it when they switch off.  Interesting!

alright if i ever come across blunt then im sorry

i can only speak from my experiences doing it..

sometimes theres been a reason, sometimes there hasnt been

my long term relationships.. one was about 18 months, i just all of a sudden got sick of the guy and was bored and couldnt stand having him around.. there wasnt a real reason for it happening it just did, i wanted something new, i wanted the excitement of a new relationship again, i wanted some freedom etc basically i just wanted out, so the love was instantly gone and everything he did became irritating and i didnt even want to look at him and then he came quite desperate to keep me and was trying everything and that just repulsed me even more

other times ive done it is when ive been hurt.. handle the hurt for a while.. go back for more.. the whole treat em mean keep em keen scenario but then all of a sudden i decide no and i switch it off .. more like splitting black in that scenario

Also in the thread object constancy was mentioned and it was said that: "imagine if the last contact with your ex was the only memory you had of them, and you had to judge what they thought of you from that. . .that's what it's like with BPD"

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GENERAL ANNOUNCEMENT: Are you on the right board? This board is for members with failed or failing relationships that want to detach from their relationship and relationship wounds. If you are still analyzing the decision to stay, please post on Undecided: Staying or Leaving All members living with a pwBPD should learn to use the Stop the Bleeding tools - boundaries, timeouts and other basic tools - to better manage the day to day interactions with your partner. If you have questions on any of the tools, feel free to go over to Staying: Improving a Relationship with a Borderline Partner and ask for help. :-)

[sirhero]

Every time I recycled with my ex, every time she would always ask me.. "Do you think we can go back to how we use to be" and I would always say "Of course, that's what I want". The last time we recycled and she asked that again. I told her I wasn't sure, because there is no change when we get back together. She then asked what needed to be done to improve our relationship and I told her #1 was communication between each other. She agreed, but never followed through.

I'm sure she still longs for that dreams she had with me as it seems out of all her bfs I've had the most impact on her and I feel like she will be trying to recreate the same thing we had with every other guy she is with now. I've said it before, but she has really picked up a lot of traits of mine (the good ones), my hobbies, and my interest.

I had a similar type of thing. . .my ex - before I ended it - seemed like he wanted it to "go back to the start".  I think he loved me and claimed he didn't want it to end but had lost that 'up in the air' feeling and was getting it elsewhere  ;p . . .and that is what they need excitement, lust, an ego boost, a 'high' etc etc. . .there is no depth to their feelings, and they cannot maintain love with real intimacy.

I read this on another site from someone who is a BPD sufferer when asked what's behind it when they switch off.  Interesting!

alright if i ever come across blunt then im sorry

i can only speak from my experiences doing it..

sometimes theres been a reason, sometimes there hasnt been

my long term relationships.. one was about 18 months, i just all of a sudden got sick of the guy and was bored and couldnt stand having him around.. there wasnt a real reason for it happening it just did, i wanted something new, i wanted the excitement of a new relationship again, i wanted some freedom etc basically i just wanted out, so the love was instantly gone and everything he did became irritating and i didnt even want to look at him and then he came quite desperate to keep me and was trying everything and that just repulsed me even more

other times ive done it is when ive been hurt.. handle the hurt for a while.. go back for more.. the whole treat em mean keep em keen scenario but then all of a sudden i decide no and i switch it off .. more like splitting black in that scenario

Also in the thread object constancy was mentioned and it was said that: "imagine if the last contact with your ex was the only memory you had of them, and you had to judge what they thought of you from that. . .that's what it's like with BPD"

Wow hmm that sure does bring some insight into things that's for sure. In the end mine wanted me to make all the effort and one can only do so much.

[sm15000]

Wow hmm that sure does bring some insight into things that's for sure. In the end mine wanted me to make all the effort and one can only do so much.

Yes, they want YOU to provide that 'new' feeling again but that's not possible especially when there is a past that includes a lot of hurt. . .you are never the same two people again  ?

[nylonsquid]

alright if i ever come across blunt then im sorry

i can only speak from my experiences doing it..

sometimes theres been a reason, sometimes there hasnt been

my long term relationships.. one was about 18 months, i just all of a sudden got sick of the guy and was bored and couldnt stand having him around.. there wasnt a real reason for it happening it just did, i wanted something new, i wanted the excitement of a new relationship again, i wanted some freedom etc basically i just wanted out, so the love was instantly gone and everything he did became irritating and i didnt even want to look at him and then he came quite desperate to keep me and was trying everything and that just repulsed me even more

other times ive done it is when ive been hurt.. handle the hurt for a while.. go back for more.. the whole treat em mean keep em keen scenario but then all of a sudden i decide no and i switch it off .. more like splitting black in that scenario[/i]

Also in the thread object constancy was mentioned and it was said that: "imagine if the last contact with your ex was the only memory you had of them, and you had to judge what they thought of you from that. . .that's what it's like with BPD"

This is disconcerting. My longest relationship was 6 years with a nonBPDgf and after 3 years I had that suffocating feeling. I just wanted out and wanted my freedom. She encouraged us to stay together but need distance so I moved to my own place. I was always afraid to move back with her and have those feelings again. I even said those hurtful words, "I'm bored!" I sometimes hate how I said such a mean thing. I didn't think we were actually complimentary personalities but in hindsight and reading here I wonder what really happened or what were those feelings..

Maybe I should start a new thread asking if others have felt the same.

[sm15000]

This is disconcerting. My longest relationship was 6 years with a nonBPDgf and after 3 years I had that suffocating feeling. I just wanted out and wanted my freedom. She encouraged us to stay together but need distance so I moved to my own place. I was always afraid to move back with her and have those feelings again. I even said those hurtful words, "I'm bored!" I sometimes hate how I said such a mean thing. I didn't think we were actually complimentary personalities but in hindsight and reading here I wonder what really happened or what were those feelings..

Maybe I should start a new thread asking if others have felt the same.

I wouldn't panic. . .r/ships can break down. . . I have reflected myself on how I have gone about things in the past. . .and that's a good thing and I have learnt.  Note the person says experienceS. . .thing is with BPD, it's a knee-jerk reaction that they repeat over and over again because of their own fears.

Have you felt like this in all your relationships?

[maria1]

I too have had a feeling of 'switching off' in some relationships previously but I don't think that necessarily means I have BPD. I think I have a tendency to idealise partners because my lonely child doesn't want to be alone. I have chosen people who try and impress me by being something other than they are and when I get to know the real person I question my love for them. But I don't paint them black or devalue them, just lose the idealisation and see something more real.

That's still an issue though.

It's interesting thinking how my ex moved on. He was looking for my replacement for a while I think. This time when he ended the relationship with me I didn't come back asking for more; and he, I think, had more hope that the replacement would tick as many boxes as I did. I think it turned out that she didn't and he came back again trying to keep me where he wanted me as he sensed she wasn't going to meet as many needs.

He would have kept on looking though and always will be. I accept that. He could never have been satisfied with me and he knew that. But in my more 'ordered' world I want to make sense of how our 'fit' together seemed good and yet it didn't suit him in the end. None of that matters because engulfment and abandonment feelings take over and there is no reasoning there. BPD's have to move on even if they physically stay. My ex described it as 'feeling claustrophobic'. But he talked about it as a man and as something men feel in relationships with women.

He said 'You can't overestimate the importance of the newness'.

Somebody on here said my ego wants to be recycled- I'm not sure if that's true exactly. I 'want' to be recycled in the same way I want a knight in shining armour to come along and sweep me off my feet. Sometimes I want to stay in bed all day or eat a huge chocolate cake or drink an excessive amount of alcohol in the day time. But I don't do these things.

I do not realistically want to be recycled.

I just don't want to believe that I was in love with someone who wasn't in love with me. It would be nice to think that he remembers the particular flavour of maria peanut butter as there would be some acknowledgement of me as an individual I guess. That's what I want by 'proof' that he loved me. But I have to think of myself as an object to understand the disorder properly. If he comes back at me he will do everything to make me feel that I'm special and I want to be ready to resist that. I'm not, but he will feel that I am at the time that he says it and that's what can make him so convincing.

I'm trying to seal up my weak spots.

[nylonsquid]

It's sad to say, but yes, I know that when she's with a new 'romantic object', she'll try to throw it at me. It's one of the only things left for her to do to really hurt me, to cast those pains out of herself.

Not sure why you 'respond and play along'. Does it help you somehow? You don't want her back? You say you're "not doing anything about it" but you are. You're stringing her along (I don't know your whole story though, sorry if I have this wrong). Doesn't that kind of make her an object to you then? Like you're just toying with her?

Interesting. I do remember my exBPDgf wanting to have coffee with me so she can tell me she's seeing someone. Now, she doesn't talk about him and she's idealizing me. Don't know what she wants.

I don't know exactly either, Myself. Maybe it's hard to let go completely. I'm just not angry at her any more which makes it harder to let go maybe. I don't think I can toy with her either as much as her emotions toy with her. I don't think it matters what I do as she'll idealize and devalue. I DO love this girl but know it can't work out. Maybe deep down I wouldn't mind another dip in the lava? I'm still trying to work it out with why I'm still responding.

[nylonsquid]

Have you felt like this in all your relationships?

Well, Im 32 so the 6 yr relationship was the biggest one. I don't remember ever having those feelings except with her. Other relationships haven't been as serious. I guess I'm not BPD but perhaps I can relate with my exuBPDgf now. She said she wanted to learn, date others,.. sounded like an escape from something..

[guitarjames]

For those that get dumped on their head by the BPD out of the blue when things seemed so great its important that you understand object consistancy and how the BPD's brain is sending distorted messages. It marks the end of the idealizion phase and brings you into the devaluation phase and it happens on a dime. To the BPD you could be the greatest thing in the world and the very next day, boom, they just dont feel that way anymore. The BPD's brain is desperate at this point to get those euphoric feelings back that they experience in the newness of a relationship. Thats why they attach so quickly to the next person that comes along and gives them a smidgen of attention.

[Gaslit]

All any of us have to do, is to do nothing. So simple, yet so hard, yet so simple.

[tailspin]

I agree gaslit...as soon as I stopped rescuing my ex he painted me black and left me there.  It was a small price to pay for my freedom. 

The fact that their love for us can be gone in an instant only solidifies to me how I will never be anything more than an object to him. 

The truth hurts but it does make it easier to run away as fast as I can 

[sunshinegrrrl]

Hello  Hi!

This was difficult for me to accept although I also know that I know too many truths for him to contact me again.  Those of us who are not ill have a difficult time understanding object constancy and I've come to terms with it like this:

I love peanut butter and jelly sandwiches.  Love them.  Peanut butter is my favorite and and I love that dang jar of peanut butter.  Every day when I reach for it...there it is and I love it.  I take it off the shelf and lovingly unsrew the lid, dip my knife in it, and spread it all over my bread.  When I bite into it...it's the best sandwich I've ever had.  Then I run out of peanut butter, and my once cherished jar is now empty, I throw it away and go get a new jar.  Now, the peanut butter from the new jar makes the best sandwiches I've ever tasted.

Of course this is my love for an object.  When the object is gone...I love the next jar.  I believe this is a simplistic view of how our expwBPD view us because it simply isn't possible for them to see us as people.  We are objects that serve their needs and when we have served those needs and have no more to give/have outlived our usefulness...we are thrown away and a new jar is found.

There isn't an emotional investment in us any more than I emotionally invested in the jar of peanut butter.  I loved the peanut butter because it fed me.  When it failed to feed me...I threw it away and I really don't think about the jar I've thrown away...because I have a new jar and I don't need the empty one anymore.  If I'm broke or too lazy to go get another jar I may reach into the garbage and try to scrape some more peanut butter out but ultimately I will throw it back into the trash.

My ex knows he can't scrape anything else out of me.  I'm done playing his crazy game.

tailspin

Wow Tailspin, I'm sure this is how they feel about us nons . I wish they were not allowed to intermingle with the general public. Maybe ship them off to an island where they can live amongst themselves and not bother anyone. Kinda like what they they do to sex offenders. I just had my BPD friend call me up hinting about how much he would like to go to Las Vegas for his birthday. HA HA. Not going to happen, . I might go myself but I'm not taking him. Then when he realized I wasn't going to foot that bill, he told me he was going to have his birthday with my replacement. I think I am coming to the end of being useful to him, and I am about to be disgarded. I'm not sure if I should be happy or angry. Weird.

[bb12]

Maybe the key to understanding is that it is not that they literally do not remember us, it is more that there is no memory of the good feelings that were once there and hence no missing or longing for the good times.

I think the big difference I see is how they can absolutely sever ties with someone, be punishing and cruel and never look back if there is nothing to be gained.

Marii, your entire post was amazing for the truth I found in it
My ex sees no further use in me so I run zero risk of being recycled. He does feel bad about how some of his past relationships ended and talks quite wistfully about those ones. I can only assume they went NC or had better boundaries than I showed him.
Strangely, I think they respect the person who knows themself... Who abandons them or doesn't come back
In my case, I am the one who has broken NC in search of understanding...answers behind the terrible cruelty he dealt me at the end. But both times... And months apart.. He was angrier, not softer, than the time before
He is not collecting me. Sees zero use for me, has pinted me black, and is so disgusting in his words and treatment of me, that I won't call again.
So, yeah - they don't always recycle. They collect the less challenging exes, miss the ones they respect, and loathe others for out-staying our welcome.
When they "murder" you with silent treatment, as the reading calls it, they want you to stay dead.
Bb12

[yianks69]

But both times... And months apart.. He was angrier, not softer, than the time before
He is not collecting me. Sees zero use for me, has pinted me black, and is so disgusting in his words and treatment of me, that I won't call again.

Don’t mean to hijack the thread, but I had a similar experience with you and was also wondering why after so many months of strict NC they become even angrier and crazier. So my interpretation is this:

1.   They expect us to be punished by their silent treatment and when they realize we didn’t they rage. Punishment can be something immature like begging them with tears in our eyes to come back.

2.   They have not moved on (actually they are incapable) whereas we did and they can sense that.

3.   They don’t know how to solve a problem other than rage.

4.   They are emotionally overwhelmed by abandonment (regardless who left who).

5.   They are afraid of us for reasons that are as complicated as explaining how the human brain functions.

[forgottenarm]

But both times... And months apart.. He was angrier, not softer, than the time before
He is not collecting me. Sees zero use for me, has pinted me black, and is so disgusting in his words and treatment of me, that I won't call again.

Don_

[FriedaB]

Mine  did  literally  forget  me...couldnt  remember  my  name  when  shown  a  picture    3  months  after  she  took  the  money  and  ran...the  scary  thing  is  she  wasnt  feigning  it...I  literally  meant  nothing  to   her. 

[forgottenarm]

Mine  did  literally  forget  me...couldnt  remember  my  name  when  shown  a  picture    3  months  after  she  took  the  money  and  ran...the  scary  thing  is  she  wasnt  feigning  it...I  literally  meant  nothing  to   her. 

Or she was dissociating--more likely.  I think we become potent triggers for pwBPD and they shut down to cope.  My BPDm is like this.  It has nothing to do with your importance to her.  In fact, I'd argue that it's because you meant TOO much.  But not in the way relationships are meaningful to nons.