Detaching through dreams

[Think About It...]

Yesterday I felt awful. I'd had a few good days and then just felt horrible again. Tearful, empty, really alone and lonely. Tried to keep busy and it got a bit better as the day went on but it was pretty crap. I don't think it was helped by drinking with friends on Friday (I don't drink much as a rule and I only had 4 beers BUT I think the depressant effect kicked in the next day). It also wasn't helped by looking at his facebook page and trying to work out just how many women he was sleeping with when we were together. He has no pictures of himself on Facebook and doesn't post, he does make friends though and put likes on so I wanted also to check if he's been active. His last activity on there was around the time I got the Police to go round with a pre harassment warning and I've been worrying he may be suicidal. in looking through facebook on Friday I noticed he has a few women friends in the state we were going to in the US on a planned trip in September.

He had ended the relationship with me in May saying he still wanted everything to be as it was except we wouldn't have a sexual relationship. He still wanted us to go on this trip. Then I found out he was seeing someone else. He said it made no difference; we should still go on the trip. In the end I found out about more and more lies and I broke contact altogether. He was still saying right up to the end 'I love you. Please come to America'.

That was a month ago. he pestered me with emails that started to get a little menacing and he has a history of violence. I have 2 young children and I got the police involved. I've heard nothing since.

One thing I cannot get past is the fact that he presented himself to me as somebody who had had THREE relationships in his life and slept with hardly any more women. I do not know whether to believe that is still true in terms of sexual partners and it's eating me up a bit.

I don't understand why he had to lie about it. I absolutely believe in being faithful when in a relationship but I don't have a problem with sex early in a relationship or outside of a conventional relationship if both are comfortable with it. I slept with him quite early in our relationship but it felt very much a mutual decision. He always talked as if I was the more experienced sexually and it really did appear that way in the way that he was with me.

But all that's been pulled apart now. When I found out about my replacement he initially lied and then said 'I can't lie to you- she does exist, there's been nothing sexual'. Then as we discussed it more he was very clear that nothing sexual had taken place yet. He said to me at one point- 'You don't understand how sacred all that is to me.' But he told me she was messed up sexually and intimate things she had told him about sex. I can't believe a woman would tell somebody these things if she hadn't slept with the man, but then he's very good at getting women where he wants them. I also saw condoms in his wallet. Not long after this he was becoming more and more bizarre in his behaviour, less in control. He was saying all sorts of stuff to me about sex. He kept suggesting we should have sex but I always said no. I felt that he wanted me to be the one to actually instigate it so that he could deny responsibility somehow.

Last night I dreamed about him. Only it didn't look like him, it looked like a much more handsome, 'dream' man. We were in a hotel. I asked him to tell me truthfully how many women he slept with during his 13 year marriage (He told me in real life he had never been unfaithful to his ex wife). He said 127. I was so angry. I said have you never thought to get tested? He looked at me with the look he gave me several times toward the end of our time together. It was a look that hated me for knowing the truth about him. He said I mustn't tell anybody, that he needed to be married and I mustn't wreck his chances. I threw a glass at him. The glass smashed. We wrestled. I picked up a piece of glass and was trying to cut him with it. He was trying to reach glass to cut me.

I couldn't cut him but I absolutely felt he could cut me, and would. I woke up.

So... where's that dream taken me?

It doesn't matter how many women he slept with. What matters is he did whatever he wanted to satisfy his needs, emotional or physical. The trip was all about his needs and he would have used it to abuse me in the guise of showing me a great time.

I'm left with the fact that I couldn't really hurt him despite the huge anger I felt. He was absolutely ready to hurt me though. Sums up the whole relationship.

[maria1]

Yesterday I felt awful. I'd had a few good days and then just felt horrible again. Tearful, empty, really alone and lonely. Tried to keep busy and it got a bit better as the day went on but it was pretty crap. I don't think it was helped by drinking with friends on Friday (I don't drink much as a rule and I only had 4 beers BUT I think the depressant effect kicked in the next day). It also wasn't helped by looking at his facebook page and trying to work out just how many women he was sleeping with when we were together. He has no pictures of himself on Facebook and doesn't post, he does make friends though and put likes on so I wanted also to check if he's been active. His last activity on there was around the time I got the Police to go round with a pre harassment warning and I've been worrying he may be suicidal. in looking through facebook on Friday I noticed he has a few women friends in the state we were going to in the US on a planned trip in September.

He had ended the relationship with me in May saying he still wanted everything to be as it was except we wouldn't have a sexual relationship. He still wanted us to go on this trip. Then I found out he was seeing someone else. He said it made no difference; we should still go on the trip. In the end I found out about more and more lies and I broke contact altogether. He was still saying right up to the end 'I love you. Please come to America'.

That was a month ago. he pestered me with emails that started to get a little menacing and he has a history of violence. I have 2 young children and I got the police involved. I've heard nothing since.

One thing I cannot get past is the fact that he presented himself to me as somebody who had had THREE relationships in his life and slept with hardly any more women. I do not know whether to believe that is still true in terms of sexual partners and it's eating me up a bit.

I don't understand why he had to lie about it. I absolutely believe in being faithful when in a relationship but I don't have a problem with sex early in a relationship or outside of a conventional relationship if both are comfortable with it. I slept with him quite early in our relationship but it felt very much a mutual decision. He always talked as if I was the more experienced sexually and it really did appear that way in the way that he was with me.

But all that's been pulled apart now. When I found out about my replacement he initially lied and then said 'I can't lie to you- she does exist, there's been nothing sexual'. Then as we discussed it more he was very clear that nothing sexual had taken place yet. He said to me at one point- 'You don't understand how sacred all that is to me.' But he told me she was messed up sexually and intimate things she had told him about sex. I can't believe a woman would tell somebody these things if she hadn't slept with the man, but then he's very good at getting women where he wants them. I also saw condoms in his wallet. Not long after this he was becoming more and more bizarre in his behaviour, less in control. He was saying all sorts of stuff to me about sex. He kept suggesting we should have sex but I always said no. I felt that he wanted me to be the one to actually instigate it so that he could deny responsibility somehow.

Last night I dreamed about him. Only it didn't look like him, it looked like a much more handsome, 'dream' man. We were in a hotel. I asked him to tell me truthfully how many women he slept with during his 13 year marriage (He told me in real life he had never been unfaithful to his ex wife). He said 127. I was so angry. I said have you never thought to get tested? He looked at me with the look he gave me several times toward the end of our time together. It was a look that hated me for knowing the truth about him. He said I mustn't tell anybody, that he needed to be married and I mustn't wreck his chances. I threw a glass at him. The glass smashed. We wrestled. I picked up a piece of glass and was trying to cut him with it. He was trying to reach glass to cut me.

I couldn't cut him but I absolutely felt he could cut me, and would. I woke up.

So... where's that dream taken me?

It doesn't matter how many women he slept with. What matters is he did whatever he wanted to satisfy his needs, emotional or physical. The trip was all about his needs and he would have used it to abuse me in the guise of showing me a great time.

I'm left with the fact that I couldn't really hurt him despite the huge anger I felt. He was absolutely ready to hurt me though. Sums up the whole relationship.

[Rose Tiger]

Whew, the dreams.  I think out psyches are so FED UP with not being able to communicate with these folks that we use our dreams to say what we really want to say, and hey, it's our dream so they can't run away.

I think the ability for him to hurt you, while you couldn't hurt him says A LOT.  It's like we know how damaging and dangerous they are, subconsciously and how little of an effect we have on them!  I had dreams of being on top of a 100 foot ladder that was unsteady and I was about to fall.  Stuff like that.

Sex and the partner that takes their bad feelings about themselves and project it on to us.  More of I hate you, let's hang out!  I guess they can overcome their replusion of us enough to hang out but not be *intimate*.  My husband sent me a picture of a cactus and said, this is how I see you.   ;p   They will turn you into the critical parent in their heads, there is no avoiding it.  The good thing is they can't see 'you', the real you, I'm a cuddling soft bristle cactus, dab nab it!   

Avoid FB like the plague when it comes to them.  We are all yearning for pretend person, pretend person isn't real!  Put a sticky on your monitor, "I rock, I love me" or something to remind you that looking is hurtful and sets us back.  Anytime you start yearning for pretend guy, watch the one star movie Honey with Jessica Alba, she takes no crap! 

[maria1]

Thanks Rose Tiger

I hear what you say about Face book. I absolutely hate it and the way people play a false life out on there. My ex doesn't do that though. He just uses it for supply and there are no pictures of him on there.

I suspect he may have made a suicide attempt or a parasuicide attempt. I want to know if he's dead or alive. If he's making friends on facebook he is alive or not in hospital and I'm looking for some confirmation that he is carrying on as usual.

I know that's not detaching but im not going to break NC in any other way to get that confirmation.

[Rose Tiger]

   10% of BPDs do commit suicide and I can't deny that I haven't thought about my ex taking that step.  I also know I did not cause his illness and I can't fix it.  It's like the last step in letting go, giving them up to the universe with come what may.  Is it holding on to a hope that he will get better and death would end that, forgive me, dream?  Dang, they work us so well, to worry, to care, to be concerned.  I still see it in my ex's emails, that thread of hope, I'm so lost, help help help.  I realized the best thing I can do is to not pick up the rope anymore.  His rope, his life.  What do you think is driving your need to check up?

[GENERAL ANNOUNCEMENT: Are you on the right board?]

GENERAL ANNOUNCEMENT: Are you on the right board? This board is for members with failed or failing relationships that want to detach from their relationship and relationship wounds. If you are still analyzing the decision to stay, please post on Undecided: Staying or Leaving All members living with a pwBPD should learn to use the Stop the Bleeding tools - boundaries, timeouts and other basic tools - to better manage the day to day interactions with your partner. If you have questions on any of the tools, feel free to go over to Staying: Improving a Relationship with a Borderline Partner and ask for help. :-)

[maria1]

It's the feeling that I let him down. I know I didn't, that I couldn't do anything else. He could well be happy with my replacement now not giving me a single thought. But he could be totally uncomprehending where I went or why I behaved in the way i did. His projection on me was marked and I really saw his personality fall to pieces in our last interactions. He was lost and terrified.

I know I cannot help him. I know that I would not help him by being in his life in any way. I also know that he may well take his own life and I feel I need to know if he does. I can't know though so I just have to get used to not knowing.

I'll sleep- maybe a dream will tell me.

[Rose Tiger]

The brain is a totally awesome thing, his mind developed all these coping mechanisms to survive.  He survived through the invalidation and neglect.  That is a mighty little miracle, how a brain can take steps like that to keep a kiddo going when there is no one there to help.  His coping mechanisms served him well as a child, they don't work so well now.  It's weird hoping for rock bottom but knowing it could very well lead to a very bad outcome but it could also lead to a great outcome.   They have a choice, we can't make it for them.  We can't save them, just like they couldn't save us.  We have choices, too, in our own healing. 

[forgottenarm]

So... where's that dream taken me?

It doesn't matter how many women he slept with. What matters is he did whatever he wanted to satisfy his needs, emotional or physical. The trip was all about his needs and he would have used it to abuse me in the guise of showing me a great time.

I'm left with the fact that I couldn't really hurt him despite the huge anger I felt. He was absolutely ready to hurt me though. Sums up the whole relationship.

Yes!  That's the bottomline, isn't it?  All that really matters is that you discovered he was capable of deception and didn't mind hurting you if it served him.  The details of how he deceived you or to what extent are unimportant.  You know all you need to know.

It's amazing how dreams can crystallize impressions that way.  I think they're very important and it's great you got so much out of this one.  I have to say, though, I've been having many dreams about my ex lately and it's making me dread sleeping.  It can seem so real---I've been waking up feeling very confused and distraught     Hopefully, it's all leading somewhere . . .

[krista8521]

This is a dream that is exactly your subconscious speaking up.
The 127 number could have been something as mundane as a price tag on a grocery self that you saw last.
If he is in the US and you know the exact city he lives in, you could google up the local news paper online and check obituary listings up to several years or days.
I am not sure if I am giving you good advice, or should be encouraging you to move on.
I have been there and I know how the mind wonders, what are they doing?, what are they thinking? etc...we are all human.

you may like this site call dream moods, many time expert dream interpreters will analyze a dream for someone.

[emdily]

I had a panicky ex dream last night-- one of those nights where you are semi-asleep and hallucinate things you see. I half woke up and thought water was coming into my apartment from two different windows and soaking my things on the windowsill and floor. Then I went back to sleep and dreamed I was in my ex's apartment, looking through her sex toy box and saw she bought some duplicates/new toys of ones that were mine. This confirmed my (dream) suspicion she had a new lover. Just then she and her new lover came into the room. It was weird- we bantered about and I said some kind of jokey bitter things, then we all ended up on the bed. I was kind of lying there while they carried on and felt scornful for her choice of new lover and what they were doing.

I woke up feeling a kind of relief that she had moved on and that I was free to move on as well. But then that turned into sadness.

I also hear you on the suicide concern-- she made sure we didn't have very many friends in common. The only way I could hear about something bad happening to her is through a specific person who I don't' know well. I have an urge to get to know this mutual friend (who my ex has painted black btw, but they have other friends in common) better solely to keep tabs.

But I know with me it's just trying to find a way to cling to the past. I have no control if she starts doing drugs again and has another breakdown. It has nothing to do with me. I tried to help. Then she pushed me away.

[myself]

Dreams can help us make better sense of things our mind, while awake, was already processing. Allowing us to experience our own possibilities in other ways, leading us to new understandings. Sometimes they're just filled with random clutter from our past, but very often it's what's going on right now. Helping to put more of the pieces together of what's in our lives at the time. To face what we may have been denying. To realise what we'd feared can actually be faced. They don't always spell it all out for us, but sifting through your own personal symbols and information regarding the people/places/things involved can help with insight and release. Good, bad, sad, strange, etc. All coming from and going through the one common aspect of them all: Ourselves.