Bizarro World...

[Think About It...]

OKay.. I am posting this, because I need to see whether I am the strange one or is it my NPDwife..

We are raising two kids together.  We have made friends that also have kids.  So initially, we made family plans with other families and have gone to the beach and amusement park and places that everyone can enjoy.

There is a family who is very very vocal in saying negative things about other families that we hung out with and although I enjoy hang out with them .. I kind of put up a guard.. because both husband and wife seem to exhibit NPD behaviors... and I really don't like to hear trash talk about other parents.  I express this to my wife, she stay quiet and did not respond and I started to notice, she adds material to trash to other parents... I see this is like bullying.. and I find it very disturbing.  I told my wife that, but she continue to do it... anyway, I stay away.  Surprise and surprise, these friends, husband and wife, do not get along... one is always wanting to do activities without the other.. one is always running way from home to the other state and intentionally dropping out of the family activities.  Since my wife has affinity to this NPD friends, she started to make plans with wife and kids and excluded me from those activities.  I told her bluntly, I find it strange that a spouse would block another spouse out for family activities and I only see that in divorced parents.  My wife doesn't seem to get it and call me controlling and making a big deal.  The thing is that my wife works long hours and I do all the chores around the house, she gets home by 8 and sometimes 10... and she refuse to find helps for kids.. so naturally, I do all the busy work around the house.  on the weekend, finally got sometime to do family activities, she now hooks up with this dysfunctional family and she seems to be very eager to cut me out of equation.  Okay.. maybe this shouldn't be a surprise to me provided with that she is NPD .. but it still upsets me.  I have voluntarily left myself out from 4 different memorable activities with my daughter ... and I thought she would think harder this time around before cutting me out.. especially I have promised my daughter that we will take her to this performance a few months ago and she heard it when I said it.  Ugggg... so frustrating.. it never gets old... but it seems that this character flaw will never go away ... I am just concern about we not at least putting time together so my daughter and son will feel at least on the surface level what a happy family can be ... I worry about their developments and do not want to be divisive and always made it clear to our family friends.. the only friends don't seem to get it is this NPD family and my wife seems to be attracted to them.  it is strange.. i thought they would repulse each other.  My wife also doesn't seem to want to make other new family friends... she insisted to be want to be the one in contact with new families ever since I initiated the first wave of friends... but she won't exchange contact info and when they give to her, she doesn't follow up.  when i ask her why not... she stay silent and this worries me.. because my daughter got to have a broader circle.  maybe i should resume to reach out .. but then my wife seems to be very displeased when I do that ... and she can always refuse to attend .. which has already happened a few times... never thought it would be this much drama...   

[Pou]

OKay.. I am posting this, because I need to see whether I am the strange one or is it my NPDwife..

We are raising two kids together.  We have made friends that also have kids.  So initially, we made family plans with other families and have gone to the beach and amusement park and places that everyone can enjoy.

There is a family who is very very vocal in saying negative things about other families that we hung out with and although I enjoy hang out with them .. I kind of put up a guard.. because both husband and wife seem to exhibit NPD behaviors... and I really don't like to hear trash talk about other parents.  I express this to my wife, she stay quiet and did not respond and I started to notice, she adds material to trash to other parents... I see this is like bullying.. and I find it very disturbing.  I told my wife that, but she continue to do it... anyway, I stay away.  Surprise and surprise, these friends, husband and wife, do not get along... one is always wanting to do activities without the other.. one is always running way from home to the other state and intentionally dropping out of the family activities.  Since my wife has affinity to this NPD friends, she started to make plans with wife and kids and excluded me from those activities.  I told her bluntly, I find it strange that a spouse would block another spouse out for family activities and I only see that in divorced parents.  My wife doesn't seem to get it and call me controlling and making a big deal.  The thing is that my wife works long hours and I do all the chores around the house, she gets home by 8 and sometimes 10... and she refuse to find helps for kids.. so naturally, I do all the busy work around the house.  on the weekend, finally got sometime to do family activities, she now hooks up with this dysfunctional family and she seems to be very eager to cut me out of equation.  Okay.. maybe this shouldn't be a surprise to me provided with that she is NPD .. but it still upsets me.  I have voluntarily left myself out from 4 different memorable activities with my daughter ... and I thought she would think harder this time around before cutting me out.. especially I have promised my daughter that we will take her to this performance a few months ago and she heard it when I said it.  Ugggg... so frustrating.. it never gets old... but it seems that this character flaw will never go away ... I am just concern about we not at least putting time together so my daughter and son will feel at least on the surface level what a happy family can be ... I worry about their developments and do not want to be divisive and always made it clear to our family friends.. the only friends don't seem to get it is this NPD family and my wife seems to be attracted to them.  it is strange.. i thought they would repulse each other.  My wife also doesn't seem to want to make other new family friends... she insisted to be want to be the one in contact with new families ever since I initiated the first wave of friends... but she won't exchange contact info and when they give to her, she doesn't follow up.  when i ask her why not... she stay silent and this worries me.. because my daughter got to have a broader circle.  maybe i should resume to reach out .. but then my wife seems to be very displeased when I do that ... and she can always refuse to attend .. which has already happened a few times... never thought it would be this much drama...   

[HardDaysNight]

Pou,
   I know exactly what you are experiencing, both in th ecutting you ouot of activities and in her controlling family friends.

   My wife has doen the same, delibertely giving me the wrong times for events so that I miss them.  Always some plausible deniability story, unitl once she sowre the time for an event was 5:30pm, but she needed to leave early and meet us there.  Never a clear explaination why she needed to be an hour early. Lo andbehold the event started at 4:30 and ended at 5:30.
  My "solution" was to have her put everything on a family calendar.   Not easy and she still forgets things, and "misses" things I put on the calendar, then she agree to a conflicting activity.
   Frustrating and takes a lot of effort to keep the facts foremost; which is the best way to counteract such undermining.

   When it is taken to the extent of driving a wedge between you and the children this is parental alienation.   

  On the family friends, my wife exhibits a simialr pattern.  It is all about control.  Making sure you do not have someone who could validate or support you.  My wife cannot make friends with normal folk, so what she does is after it is clear I have a connection with the other couple.  Especially when inevitably the other wife talks about what a good husband and father I am and she wishes her husband was the same (no really) my wife finds a reason we can't hang with this couple.  Usually something awful about the other husband.  We can't have them over, do anything with them etc.  I noticed after 3-6 months she all of a sudden is all chummy with the wife again, and plans all these things with the other couple.  But never at our house again.  She will go to extreme lengths to sabotage that.  Not all couples go with this.  I'd say the common denominator is the wives that overlook the extended snub are either NPD/BPD themselves or very insecure. 

Based on her and their weird reactions to some innocuous things, and how my wife just doesn't want people over to see our rela life, I suspect she tells others I am the reason our social realtions went all weird when in fact I'm the one who tries to keep them on track.

   I think you are dealing with a classic NPD/BPD person here.  When trashing others appears to be the primary bonding acitvity.  Of course she likes this couple, there is another NPD/BPD that can agree with her world view.  BPD/NPD people work to surround themselves with negative advocates.  It is not too hard to find groups composed mostly of NPD/BPD mindsets.  Any "Real Housewives..." show is a prime example.

You say

I told her bluntly, I find it strange that a spouse would block another spouse out for family activities and I only see that in divorced parents. 

  Have you considered this?  You seem to be living all the detriments of a divorce and none of the benefits.

[HardDaysNight]

Oh, just to confirm...you are not the strange one here.

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[motwgk]

I have voluntarily left myself out from 4 different memorable activities with my daughter ...

I can't comment on your wife's actions, but I personally would make sure I attended every activity with my daughter, memorable or not, no matter who else was there.

[Matt]

Yeah, as motwgk says, the key here is to focus on the kids and make plans with them, and try not to focus on all this drama with your wife and these other people.

Make plans with the kids, and make them very clear to everyone.  "I talked to the kids today and told them I will take them to the baseball game on Saturday.  Do you want to come too?"  If she says yes, great, you all go.  If she says no, you take the kids.   But don't get dragged into drama about it - any answers other than yes or no, just walk away.  "Why did you ask them before you talked to me?  How did you know I didn't have other plans?"  "Well you hadn't told me about any other plans.  Do you want to go?"  More drama - walk away.

This is sad, because it means you're kind of giving up on having the whole happy family thing.  But it's how things are, and your wife isn't likely to change.  You have to focus on the kids, make sure they are OK, and take your joy in them.

[Pou]

Everyone.. sorry for the late follow up.

HardDaysNight:  Thanks for your thoughtful reply and sharing your experience with me.  I really like the sharing experiences part... it helps me for putting my situation in perspective.  Yes, I've tried the calendar thing ... and by email as well.  The problem is that my wife will blatantly ignore things that she doesn't want to do.  If I push the issue, she flips out .. starts to call me controlling and she will call the cops.. and etc.  Pretty crazy.  I sometimes reflect.. and wondered why I never saw this coming.  Feel pretty stupid most of the time ... and to some degree, I wonder if there is something wrong with me.  It definitely is bad for my psychology ... I try to be as truthful regarding my flaws... Maybe when someone falls out of love with someone... that is what happens?  on top of BPD/NPD issues.  Yes, I really start to feel ill hanging out with this BPD/NPD family friends ... the crazy thing is that they have a hyper social life ... but it is very polarized.  When they are in friends with some family, they cling on to them and once fall out, they trash talk about them.  I really don't want my kids to be exposed to that kind of environment... it feels very unhealthy.  My wife tends to add fuel to the fire and would add a few negative things to the conversion .. I often look stupid, because I just won't engage .. so there I am, silent and try to change the topic.   

Matt and Motwgk, yes, I definitely go to every event that I can.  But when my wife is actively blocking me as well and once again, why am I so controlling and throw anything that sticks to attack me and using calling cops as a threat (which she had acted on before) ... i back off, because I am thinking about our kids and the drama that will escalate just not worth it.  Yes, my wife basically gets what she wanted.. thanks for our fine justice system.  I used to get so mad at "men" who are involved in domestic violence... because I have sisters and many female cousins and good female friends... my experience has been an eye opener, I will never so quick to condemn the men, because the capacity of a NPD/BPD to lie and to gain control at any cost is frightening.  I guess my largest issue today is that I live in a fantasy world.  I fantasize that my wife would be normal and she would do the right things eventually, but I keep forgetting that she has NPD/BPD... I don't know exactly how to deal with it.  I sometimes try to block it out ... and just try to be as normal going through the day ... and then when something like this happens again, I am not sure why I still get surprised by it.  I guess I am trying again to find sometype of remedy ... when perhaps, there is just no cure for this?  Even as I typed this out, there is part of me, a good part of me is betting on the miracle to happen. 

[Matt]

I lived with it for 10 years, every day telling myself that she would get help soon.  I only came to my senses when I spent a night in jail because she called 911 and accused me of assault.

It might take something like that to get you to wake up.  Your wife has already shown that she is willing to lie and call the police just to keep you under her control.  And I've lived like that, so I know you are not happy - nobody could be happy in a situation like that.  I can also tell you from experience that it is not best for the kids;  my kids are doing way better now that they don't have to live in a place like that all the time.

I've never told another member here to end their marriage, because I realize that's a huge issue with lots of very personal aspects, like your religious beliefs and what you believe is right.  But I will tell you that continuing to live in the same house with someone who acts like that is playing with fire.  It won't get better and there's a very good chance it will get worse.  There's a good chance you will be arrested and charged with something serious, and then you'll find out like I did just how the criminal justice system really works - whether you are actually consider innocent til you're proved guilty, and whether a trial by jury means 12 thoughtful, intelligent peers or a less capable group holding your fate in their hands.

Just to focus on the kids:  My suggestion would be, establish a drama-free, accusation-free, threat-free home somewhere so they can spend at least some time in a healthy environment.  That will help them more than anything you can accomplish related to your wife.

All your focus on your wife and the fantasy that she will suddenly become a different person is not just wasted, it's hiding reality from you and causing you to make decisions that aren't based in reality.  You need to have a safe place to spend time and think clearly.