"Everyone thinks you are this nice guy, yet around me you're a jerk"

[Cipher13]

Ever here this? I hear it form time to time. My W will call her Mom or Dad or text them about something. I come up in the conversation and they something nice about me.  Its not always but from time to time.  Her grandmother told her "He is a nice man and he loves you". All very nice things to hear until she responds if they really knew you they would se you for the jerk you are to me.   I do not change who I am around them.  They have minds of there own and can make there own judgemnts from what they see.  I could maybe understand this is we rarely ever see them.

On time her dad asked her why she demands so much of me and asks me to do nearly everythign for her when she can manage just fine.  I did those things for her back when we dated as nice "I love you" gestures... . now required tasks.

Now that I have had more of a backbone she is fighting tooth and nail to bring me back down to the old servatude level of complacment.  I have not sense of self when I do those things.

How many men will do (or are expected to do because you did it a few times to be nice) the following with out a blink:

1. Buy maxi pads.

2. Hand wash bras.

3. Foot rub (daily).

4. Make dinne every night. (she is afraid of cooking I'm now told).

5. Buy grocceries. (Doesn't liek being around people and kids in the stores).

6. Buys make up, and other bathroom supplies she uses. (Same a s grocceries.)

7. Gas in her car. (She hasn't put gas in her own ca in 7 years I think. She will throw  fit if I ask her to do it herself).

8. Bring her her nightly "pill"

9. Draw her bath before she gets home.

10. Brush the dog. ( she does but will make me re-do it because I should  is what I'm told)

All these items I have done before jinitiall as a nice gesture and it has turen in to a requirement.  On a side not I cook dinner or I won't get to eat plus I like to cook from tim to time. Problem is she has 5 dishes she likes and that about all we eat it seems.

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[SadWifeofBPD]

Wow! 

Oh my!  You're a slave!  Stop this! 

Gee, I've been told that I do too much for my H, but you have me beat! 

I think that you have to say something like:

I want to do some things for you, like cook dinner and maybe rub your feet a couple of times per week, because I love you.  However, I went too far and began a habit of doing too many things for you, and I'm feeling that I have to be your slave instead of a loving husband.

I don't mind picking up a few personal items if I'm already going to the store. 

(Does she do anything for you?  I have to confess, that my H rubs MY feet about once a week.)

If I asked ANYONE to handwash my bras, I'd get my head examined first.

[Cipher13]

I think that you have to say something like:

Well I kind of did last night. I have tried before. I goes very poorly. I say I want to not have to be expected or required. She only hears I don't want to.

I was told also last night I don't get to say no becasue I always have done it. So why all of sudden now don't you. I said its become a requirement and less of a gesture of love.

Still huge blow up like last night.

Then there is the whole issue of have a personale time on an occasion. That sparked an eruption last night also.

[SadWifeofBPD]

I think that you have to say something like:

Well I kind of did last night. I have tried before. I goes very poorly. I say I want to not have to be expected or required. She only hears I don't want to.

I was told also last night I don't get to say no becasue I always have done it. So why all of sudden now don't you. I said its become a requirement and less of a gesture of love.

Still huge blow up like last night.

Then there is the whole issue of have a personale time on an occasion. That sparked an eruption last night also.

You can't let her "blow ups" intimidate you.  That's her big weapon with you.  Stand your ground.  She'll eventually get it. 

You've said your piece.  You want to do gestures out of love, not as a slave.

[Alfalffasgirl]

Cipher I am starting to believe your partner doesn't have BPD she just seems to be an insensitive controlling selfish person who doesn't deserve your attention. I probably should not say this, but this is not a healthy relationship for you. When we decide to stay with our BPD partners it is because we see something worth saving in our relationship. I know that I can not walk away from my husband because for every time he has made me feel bad and I am talking REALLY bad, there are several times he has made me feel AWESOME. And I can't throw that away. Does she ever make you feel good... . because the way you describe you life she makes no effort and actually feels justified not to make you feel good. My husband makes effort to recognize his BPD and no matter how little or how late he recognizes it I get hope that we can work through this. BUT from your posts it does not seem she is giving you that same hope. I know you do not want to walk away first, but I assure you she will break you before she will walk away when she is allowed to treat you this way. Save yourself. Your staying with her will ultimately hurt you emotionally and then future relationships will be tainted by this one. Peace to you!

[SadWifeofBPD]

Cypher... .

what would happen if you nicely did this:

Take two papers, on one paper write down the list of "to do's" that your wife expects you to do (to show your love for her).  On the other paper, write down a list of "to do's" that you'd like your wife to do for you (to show her love for you).

Then, you take her list, and give her your list.  then, one by one, each person selects an item from the list that they'll happily do to "show their love." 

Now, she may say, "but I never did any of these things for you, so I shouldn't have to do them."  You can say, "you're right.  No one should "have" to do any of these things.  As spouses who love each other, we each should want to do some nice things for the other.  The idea is that each of us experiences a good feeling when the other spouse does little things for the other.  Since we're both equals in the relationship, it's nice for each of us to have nice things done for us by the other spouse."

[lostandunsure]

I don't have many suggestions, I just can feel your pain... . I was always taught that when dating, you should do things like open car doors, cook a nice meal, and other loving gestures like you've listed... . Somewhere along the line, and it was pretty quick, it turned into me doing things and not a lot in return.

I do all the shopping, cooking, cleaning, pampering... . Even telling made up stories to help her relax to take a nap... . I would love a foot rub every now and then, I have flat feet and after a long day that would be wonderful, I get promises of one, but rarely do they happen.

I think it was while visiting my sister and having her talk about her relationship problems with her husband (she has severe depression, once attempted suicide) and how her husband expected her to do her share of the housework, even with severe depression, she started realizing that she wasn't doing her fair share (This was done to make sure that she had something to do and let her know that she was still needed, not in a "get back to work" kind of way). For the last couple of months she's been working hard at making sure that the kitchen is cleaned and she tries to do the laundry (she often doesn't fold it or put it away). But it's something.

Now that I think about it, I think we did have a conversation about it. It went something along the lines of "If you expect me to do x, y, and z, it's only fair that I can expect a, b, and c from you. Otherwise, I'm going to burn out. I can't be a loving husband and your servant at the same time and if you want a servant, well, that's another discussion." With the unspoken strong hint that she could lose me if it continued.

BTW, I would recommend that if your wife is anything like mine, you should do the grocery shopping. For my wife it is very overwhelming and she may go with a list of maybe $80 worth of stuff on the list and come home with a car filled to the brim and and a $300 bill with little value to show for it. And no, she didn't do on purpose to keep me going, we've tried several times and once I had to drop everything and pick her up from the store as she was crying in the lounge with two carts full of food that she didn't know what to do with anymore. It's just safer on the checkbook and everyone's sanity if I do that myself... . Your wife may have different "I just can't dos" that you may have to continue. So, it may take some trial and error to figure that out.

Just one other thing, I'm a firm believer in positive reinforcement. So, while I could work a full time job, do all the cleaning, shopping and cooking, all without a thank you... . I will praise her profusely when she does her agreed jobs, making sure that she knows that I noticed her hard work, no matter how small.

Oh, one other thing, there is downside to this as well... . Suddenly, my wife became an expert on doing the laundry and washing the dishes. If I step in to help when she's not feeling well, I'm somehow doing it "wrong". I've gotten a couple lectures about a dirty spoon or the like, even though I've been doing it for years just fine, suddenly, from her perspective, I don't have a clue how to do it anymore. I just put on my best "Thank you for letting me know, I didn't realize I was doing it wrong" face since really, I want her to continue and if this makes her feel good, then I can let her have that.

[Cipher13]

Lostandunsure

Once again another person has opened my eyes a little more into my own life. I thank you for that.

Even telling made up stories to help her relax to take a nap... .

Is this a common thing ina lot of BPDers?   I thought it was just a cute little thing at first. We go to bed and she says tell me a story. So I make one up. Now its not an every night requirement but it seems to be mor efrequent over the last couple years. Never linked it to BPD. It might not be but its strange that you mentioned it.

Also thank you for mentioning positive reinforcement. Good idea and I will try it as best I can. I too can atest to haveing doe something for a number of years and then being told I don't know how to make the bed right. Thats ok I like you say oops sorry i can see youare better and faster at this than me.  I'll take that without being the least upset. Now the groccery thing is about people. My wife might be the opposite of yours.  She is looking to use the smaller cart. If the list has $80 worth of stuff then she will have half a cart with $60 worth of stuff and cross off somethings I added. So I ask her to go to the groccery store so that she can see I want to be with her. When she says no I don't mind in the least. But I don't show her that.

[SadWifeofBPD]

I find the title of this thread very upsetting.  You are a nice guy, and nothing indicates that you're jerky AT ALL around her. 

I am starting to believe your partner doesn't have BPD she just seems to be an insensitive controlling selfish person who doesn't deserve your attention.

I agree.  I'm thinking it may not be BPD, but maybe NPD with lots of anxiety?  Selfish, self-centered, entitled, childish, controlling, etc.  I agree that she doesn't deserve even a fraction of what you do for her. 

the telling stories thing is probably because she has high anxiety so she needs to be "distracted" from the things she worries about so she can fall asleep.

I was thinking about your other post about having to text her every 10 minutes when you're apart (your home, she's not yet home).  If she won't stop that demand and you want to accomodate it (I wouldn't), then see if there's a phone app that will send texts to her every 10 minutes.  ha ha.

[MaybeSo]

This is the problem with facilitating "dependency" in relationships.

After a while, we resent the obligation, and after a while, they resent "changing" the rules of engagement mid-stream.

Who wouldn't want someone to do all those things, especially if the message was that it was out of love.

When these nice things stop, the message may feel just the opposite... . that there will be no more goodies cause I don't love you the same way anymore. Okay, that sucks! No more goodies cause I don't rank anymore?

This just one of many reasons why creating dependency in relationships is unhealthy.

And it took two to get there.

We can feel disgusted by her spoiled insensitive nature, but we teach people how to treat us, what to expect, and about how we roll.

Change is hard. It's hard for both of you. But

it has to be done. Let her dislike it. Let her have her feelings. And you take care of your feelings, too. 

So what if she thinks you are a jerk sometimes. All wives probably think their H's act like a jerk sometimes! When we teach someone to expect special privileges and act like we are their love slaves... . then suddenly stop, it is normal for the recipient  to protest that kind of

dramatic change in the status quo.

Right? She is spoiled. You helped create this. It will feel uncomfortable for both if you to change the status quo, but it needs to be done.

[Cipher13]

Oh I know I help creat this. At the time I didn't see it that way. I was helping her. From everythign see in reponces and from other threads and posts it is that if the non is the weaker "Ill do anythign you wan to t keep you happy and not get angry"  then we feel trapped. Again you are so right.

There is a reason the sign says not to feed the animals. When you do that you create an unnatural dependancy for them to not have to rely on themselves for food.  I can see this in someon elses relationship but not my own until now.

When I first came to this site I would read a post (especially if the 2 individuals were not married) and say how can you stay... . run away far away.  No to relationships are the same so I do not judge.  Many have say for me to do the same. Often times I want to run.  But if this is something I helped make then I need to try to help correct it if I can.

Thank you

[MaybeSo]

This will be hard, but you are doing a good thing. We all deserve a chance to grow up and have a stronger sense of self.

And I love the "don't feed the animals" analogy. Very apropos.

[lostandunsure]

On the story thing... . I'm new to learning about BPD, but I've been doing a lot of research. I read somewhere that pwBPD basically have the emotional development of an 18 month old... . So, temper tantrums if they don't get what they want, the neediness, the I love you, I hate you, not wanting to do their "chores", and the boundary pushing all comes from that. All the emotions of a 2 year old in an adult body with an adult education. Why they get stuck there is still unclear, some think it's genetic others think it's how they were raised (personally I lean towards genetic as I see it in several members of my wife's family, passed down through her Mother's side of the family)

Anyway, if you think about an 18 month old, they need a lot of comfort and reassurance, and parents tell stories to them as a form of comfort to help them relax, this is why I think my wife likes to have made up stories told to her. While I would never open a child's story book directly too her, I think if I had memorized some and told her she'd never know the difference and would be perfectly content. She's looking for comfort, made up children's fairy tales are designed to be comforting, that's what they are there for.

That's the best I can come up with.

[Cipher13]

I just found the telling a made up story strange coming from somone else. Thought it was only me.  But the 2 year old in adult body is accurate at times.