Is this ethical or am I being jealous?

[MissTajo]

My BPDbf is seing a therapist that I found him on a free association. She is not at all prepared to deal with a BPD and OCD patient (too young and to inexperienced) but she tries and its free which is all he can afford now (doesn't work). On their sessions they talk about a lot of things. One of the times they even played monopoly... . (don't ask, I don't get it either) and now she sent him an email asking him for a recipe of some hamburgers he cooked and told her (he has a really hard time cooking because of his OCD so he told her he did it and that that was a breakthrough) ... .

Is this normal? Is a therapist supposed to do this kind of things and have this kind of contact with their patient?

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[Louise7777]

My uBPD relative went to this pshycologist (young and inexperienced) and they became friends, went shopping together, etc. I find this completely wrong and unethical.

As far as I was told (from the friend who recommended her to go to the T) the T validated her on everything and joined her on the family member´s bashing. She kept going (and paying) cause the T basically told her she was right and the rest of the world was wrong.

Seemed to me the goal of this T was to get $$$, not to improve the patient. At some point she stopped going, and the reason she gave to her friend was that she was paying but they were just chit-chatting, why should she pay if they both were chatting about their problems?

I personally believe therapy doesnt go well with BPDs, either they manage to get the T to "their side" or they stop going. They dont see anything wrong in their behaviour, to start with, so why change?

[MissTajo]

Well, in this case she is the one getting friendly and he is feeling uncomfortable about it. But hey... . its still attention, right? I don't want them to become close. She seems like somewhat "silly" and he is good looking... .

The therapy is free so money is not the issue.

I decided I don´t want to know about their sessions anymore and I told him I don´t find it correct for her to contact him for other than therapy matters. He agrees. But I am uncomfortable with this.

[MyGreatEscape]

Hi MissTajo... .

    There is a mighty fine line between boundaries. My husband has BPD aaaand I am finishing my degree in Psychology... . I actually just finished my Ethics class last month, ironically! (I got an A, if that helps... . ? Hahaha... . )

    What his T did is probably questionable to you, for one, because she's a SHE... . and then there's the whole out-of-office contact. It's a boundary that some people (T's AND clients, or SO's) are not comfortable with crossing, and she could get herself in a lot of trouble with the APA if she isn't careful.

    Coming from my POV... . I would keep an eye on this for your own peace of mind and because you don't know this T's motives. Because I am in a relationship with someone who has BPD, I know what it's like to live with the what-if's regarding their actual commitment to us... . then... . I'm a female, and yeah... . the T being a female and sending him messages would absolutely make me stop and wonder. It doesn't have to be "jealously"... . we have to be cautious and not naive with them.

    BUT... . here is the tricky part... . knowing what I now know about this disorder... . these people are usually given up on... . therapists see them as hopeless... . so the fact that she is trying to reach him in ANY way is a good thing... . she may be trying to reach him therapeutically - getting him to trust her... . so she can help him overcome his issues. She's gotta be careful though... . and maybe you should be upfront with her and flat out ask her/tell her your concerns. I would want someone to give me the benefit of the doubt in this situation.

    What I am being taught... . crossing boundaries CAN be a breakthrough... . but we have to cover our 'behinds' too so as to not get sued or being tempted to do something CLEARLY wrong... . and some do, unfortunately.

    So... . in summary... . I do not envy your position! Lol... . I would just keep an eye on this. I have already thought about this possibility for myself professionally and know that I would TRY to use boundaries as a tool with a BPD client... . BUT I would also try involving the SO's so there is no question of my "motive"... . I do NOT want to go there or make ANYONE think I would get involved with a client at ALL!

    If she's young (I'm not) maybe she doesn't realize how this appears... . and if she values his life with you, or your relationship with him... . or her licensing (ahem)... . she will hear you and understand. Worth a try!

    Hope that helped... . even a little... . ?

[MissTajo]

    Hope that helped... . even a little... . ?

It does help, a lot, thank you! I would feel A LOT different if she was a he, actually. I do know that if she was older, much older, or a man, I would not have this problem.

I have thought about contacting her to talk about him and the kind of therapy he did before (the highly paid ones) that really helped him (with useful exercises and deadlines that made him commit to a schedule). I don't know if I had the nerves to ask her why she sent that email or others... .

Is it normal for a girlfriend to talk to the bfs therapist? And if I do should he know about it?

[MyGreatEscape]

Hi again!

     He has to give consent (in writing) for you to get any info, or she cannot tell you a shred of anything, not even when or if he has an appt.

     Does he ever want you to come in for a session with him? If so, you could share your concerns in a session with him and her... . ? (or see the dynamics between them that may ease your mind)

     Some therapists WILL say they won't take on couples counseling after establishing a client because they don't want to be accused of taking sides, being biased, etc. etc. I personally don't see things that way and think it's better to get all parties involved if possible to see the WHOLE picture... . but that's my opinion.

     If you are shut out of the picture because he doesn't want you to be involved OR she says she won't bring you in... . obviously you have some decisions to make (like asking him why he doesn't want you involved at all and what that may mean).

     If you think you aren't having a knee-jerk reaction "just" to her being female and her extra contact continues... . I would contact her anyway, even knowing she can't reply... . just to let her know what you see here with the boundaries. You have, after all, been in the relationship with him and see what he's like. If she respects your relationship (and her job) and isn't being inappropriate with him, she may try convincing him to bring you in, or stop contacting him out of the office sessions. Like I said, there is a very fine line with boundaries... . and I would want to get a kick in the behind if someone perceived anything I did as iffy.

     If she's professional and realizes what issues he has, she wouldn't dare tell him you contacted her... . and I wouldn't tell him, either. Kid gloves with this!

[Louise7777]

"Well, in this case she is the one getting friendly and he is feeling uncomfortable about it. But hey... . its still attention, right?"

Yes,it is. And we know how manipulative and charming BPDs can be when they want to. I dont want to burst your bubble but the "he is feeling unconfortable" seems not true to me. If he felt that way he wouldnt be exchanging emails with her. It seems he´s encouraging that behaviour and saying he´s annoyed to you... .

Apart from the jealous thing (I dont blame you) Id be concerned if this therapy is working at all.

I may be way off, of course.

[MyGreatEscape]

Louise7777 has a great point about their charm (and manipulation)... .

I would just HOPE that a professional would be able to see through it... . she should be trained to... . so let's keep our fingers crossed (but one eye open for the therapist's continued "attention", shall we?).

[MissTajo]

Thank you all for you help. 

I have talked to him and asked him if it was normal for a T to send emails about other things other than therapy. He thought about it for a minute and said that his last therapists only sent him emails about therapy with exercises and requests. I said that I found that normal, that what I didn't find OK was she asking for the recipe. He agreed, said that was not normal.

I will keep both my eyes wide open. I don't want to make a fuss just now so I can know more and if I do make a fuss... . well, we all know how good they are hiding stuff from us right?

His last therapist was in contact with me, I went with him and waited in the waiting room while he was having his sessions and in the end we would chat a little. She would call him and me to know is he was alright. His psychiatrist wanted to make some new surgery on his brain for his OCD and she called me to talk to him and told me she didnt agree with the Psy. so she wouldn't sign her paper for him agreeing to do it because she knew therapy was doing good to him . So I was involved and he wanted me to be involved. He tells me all about his sessions, and what they talk about but Im not in direct contact with this new T. And this recipe email really made me think... .

[MyGreatEscape]

That's great, MissTajo! Sounds like he was open to your concerns and that you approached it perfectly for him to receive them. YAY!

[MissTajo]

That's great, MissTajo! Sounds like he was open to your concerns and that you approached it perfectly for him to receive them. YAY!

I always try soo hard not to let my heart speak for my mind like I did in my past relationships. Having a BPD boyfriend, believe me or not, helped me to be much more serene. (it takes patience to deal with some things!  )

[MyGreatEscape]

Oh, I "believe you"... . I absolutely get what you mean.

Have you heard that song "Clarity"... . ? I can SO relate to the lyrics, "If our love is tragedy, why are you my remedy?" and, "If our love's insanity, why are you my clarity?"

Not that enjoy his rages... . but I have certainly become FAR more patient in this relationship than any other I have ever been in. That he's called me Spock may be an indication of my logistical calmness... .

You're the first I've heard say that... . I thought I was the only one!

[waverider]

getting a pwBPD to attend therapy is hard. If it makes them uncomfortable it is even harder. So it is likely he is not as uncomfortable as he states.

If you are uncomfortable, then that needs to be brought up and the therapy approach needs to be changed. That is not unreasonable, especially if he sees it that way also, if that is indeed the case.

My partner is scarred by her Therapy history, in her early years when recovering from a breakdown she was "persued" by her psychiatrist which led to a 7 year on/off affair ending her first marriage. It happens despite best intentions. Many Ts wont handle many BPD cases because even they find it hard to stay completely unaffected.

A red flag is a red flag, doesn't mean the worse, but your fears are real and need to be taken into consideration

[MissTajo]

You're the first I've heard say that... . I thought I was the only one!

At least there's two of us :D

While in the past I would let my "inner brat" come out and make a fuss, now I stay calm, logical, comprehensive and I like myself better this way.

It is a struggle to have a relationship with a BPD but I sure have learned more about myself in this last year and a half than in all my past r/s. 

[waverider]

I sure have learned more about myself in this last year and a half than in all my past r/s. 

Hold on to that silver lining it is worth more than you think

[MissTajo]

I sure have learned more about myself in this last year and a half than in all my past r/s. 

Hold on to that silver lining it is worth more than you think

Thank you waverider. 

[MyGreatEscape]

LOL... . that's funny, MissTajo... . I too, suffered from the inner-brat reaction the first couple of months of our relationship (I had never seen anyone act like him - it definitely brought the worst out in me... . ) but yeah, now I'm Spock... . who chases butterflies and gets distracted by cute babies and sparkly things, that is.

YAY for two of us! Hehehe... .