Dr Jekyll or Mrs Hyde?

[Depression = 72% of members]

After a 5 day rant and threats of divorce, my separated uBPDw has come down communicating at least. She has even put boundaries of her own in!

Which is the real person? Dr Jekyll or Mr Hyde?

I visited the divorce board for the first time and got a fright about Mr Hyde. The anger hatred and destructive tendencies are life shattering. Given that my wife committed fraud twice last year, gives me concern for what she might do next time she dysregulates.

I have been consistent with empathising, sympathising and validation for 7 weeks now, even after the latest dysregulation, I have tried to support her, and she's showinging some Dr Jekyll. Not much, but some.

[Moselle]

After a 5 day rant and threats of divorce, my separated uBPDw has come down communicating at least. She has even put boundaries of her own in!

Which is the real person? Dr Jekyll or Mr Hyde?

I visited the divorce board for the first time and got a fright about Mr Hyde. The anger hatred and destructive tendencies are life shattering. Given that my wife committed fraud twice last year, gives me concern for what she might do next time she dysregulates.

I have been consistent with empathising, sympathising and validation for 7 weeks now, even after the latest dysregulation, I have tried to support her, and she's showinging some Dr Jekyll. Not much, but some.

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[an0ught]

Hi Moselle,

I visited the divorce board for the first time and got a fright about Mr Hyde. The anger hatred and destructive tendencies are life shattering. Given that my wife committed fraud twice last year, gives me concern for what she might do next time she dysregulates.

Boundaries are critical for your own protection. You can't protect her from her own follies but you do need to protect yourself from being drawn in or getting hit be the fallout. Don't hesitate to get professional legal advice or at least some feedback on the legal board.

I have been consistent with empathising, sympathising and validation for 7 weeks now, even after the latest dysregulation, I have tried to support her, and she's showinging some Dr Jekyll. Not much, but some.

She has to fix herself. You can only provide some support but you don't own her problems. She is not the center of your life - you are!

I know it sounds simple but is not 

[Moselle]

Thanks for the support An0ught. Wise words. It is so easy to get drawn into the drama, and allow it to become centre stage.

But we are indeed, the centre of our own lives

[charred]

After a 5 day rant and threats of divorce, my separated uBPDw has come down communicating at least. She has even put boundaries of her own in!

Which is the real person? Dr Jekyll or Mr Hyde?

I visited the divorce board for the first time and got a fright about Mr Hyde. The anger hatred and destructive tendencies are life shattering. Given that my wife committed fraud twice last year, gives me concern for what she might do next time she dysregulates.

I have been consistent with empathising, sympathising and validation for 7 weeks now, even after the latest dysregulation, I have tried to support her, and she's showinging some Dr Jekyll. Not much, but some.

My pwBPD... when sweet/loving (idealizing)... seemed phony, when clingy... there was a hint of truth to her, but when hating/angry... was 100% authentic/genuine with every fiber of her being.  I had to conclude Mr. Hyde... . buy ymmv.

[Moselle]

My pwBPD... when sweet/loving (idealizing)... seemed phony, when clingy... there was a hint of truth to her, but when hating/angry... was 100% authentic/genuine with every fiber of her being.  I had to conclude Mr. Hyde... . buy ymmv.

Charred, that is insightful to say the least, and I fully understand where you are coming from. I just don't know whether it's in or out for me, but I am about to find out in the next few months as I enter the second half of a 3-6 month separation. I honestly believe that she is a good person, who has adapted her personality to survive emotional abuse in her childhood from her parents. (I don't think she believes she is a good person, which is more of a problem for me than my attitude). This has helped me come to terms with the abuse and even forgive her. I am angry and upset at the nonsense, but I also don't have any malice towards her. Having said that I'm not willing to live with her crossing my boundaries any more - period.

[charred]

Read that the good we see in them is our reflection... and its what we fall for.

[formflier]

I am interested in how you picked which boundaries were "crossable" and which were not.

I'm a couple months into knowing about BPD.  I have set a couple boundaries (leaving when threatened) and not trying to reason with her when dysregulating.  So far... I have done pretty good with them.

I know I need to keep setting more boundaries to get some of my life back.

I can't just leave due to marriage, kids and finances.  Now that my eyes are opened... I realize it is not just about me.  Although I am the only part that I control.

Also interested in how you determined to separate and what you hoped to accomplish. 

This is my 3rd or 4th post.  Glad I found this message board.

[MissyM]

Averyon, I am in the same boat.  My dBPDh keeps escalating.  When he is like this, I feel no love for him but I do feel pity.  He acts horrible and abusive, then turns around and says "See, you don't love me."  Uhm, I can't love someone while they are being abusive to me.  He is severely pushing me away and I am just trying to stay as neutral as possible.  It is a tough place to be.  Of course, I slip and JADE but less and less. Thank goodness, I barely had to see him this weekend.  He showed up at the kids activities, I was detached but polite.  He was sulky and feeling sorry for himself.  He doesn't understand why most of the parents avoid him, the majority of people don't like victims.  They like me and that just makes him cling to some notion that I have told them all about him, which I wouldn't do because I don't want my children to be shunned. 

[Moselle]

I am interested in how you picked which boundaries were "crossable" and which were not.

Hi Formflier, I am also new here, joined in Feb. I've learned alot about boundaries from An0ught (an advisor here), but I also raised boundaries with my therapist. She suggested I go the "bill of rights" or any place where you find "human rights". To determine what rights we have as individuals.

I found most of the stuff in the UN Universal declaration of human rights, and up to that point I had set smaller similar boundaries to the ones you have done. So it is a bit of a mixture, but see the list below if you're interested.

I did not confront her, and say these are my rights, don't cross them, I instead, had the family on the phone and taught the children about their human rights with her present, and had them read each one. In this way I hope I haven't come across as condescending to her, but she is aware of what is and isn't acceptable to me now. When she has crosed one since, I have let her know that I find it unacceptable, but careful to empathise with her at the same time.

I have had people say this is the wrong way to go about setting boundaries, and some have agreed with how I've done it. That's the beauty of life I like to try stuff instead of wonder if something might work or not. So I doubt if I've done it perfectly, but I feel good about my boundaries. I've applied them in the work situation too when people have tried to control me, or belittle me. I feel empowered by knowing my rights.

It has raised teaching moments with the children about #3 Security of personal effects. I have three girls who continually "borrow" each other's clothes. So now when it happens we have a discussion about property rights, and they actually get the concept. I am determined to teach my children as much as I can about healthy relationships as I learn about them myself.

To answer your question though, I have not decided which are crossable or not. I am just happy at this stage knowing what they are.  I think the situation calls for a tailored response. Sometimes it's best to raise it right there and then, sometimes it's best to raise it later in private. But in a BPD dysregulation situation which becomes abusive, it's best to exit in the most diplomatic way possible. And let them know, you are leaving for your own good, but will be available later to dicsuss it. That way they don't feel abandoned, which is what drives alot of the behaviour in the first place, the fear of abandonment.

Our rights as individuals:

Peace

Self determination and autonomy.

Security of personal effects

Truth

Justice and fairness.

Freedom from cruel, inhuman, or degrading treatment or punishment

Right to dignity

Right to be treated kindly and with respect

Security from violence and or threats

Right to privacy.

The right to leave, if persecuted.

The right to freedom of opinion and expression

The right to uninterrupted rest and leisure.

Within a relationship we have the right to understanding, tolerance and friendship.

We have the right to effective remedy for violation of these rights

[Moselle]

Averyon, I am in the same boat.  My dBPDh keeps escalating.  When he is like this, I feel no love for him but I do feel pity.  He acts horrible and abusive, then turns around and says "See, you don't love me."  Uhm, I can't love someone while they are being abusive to me.  He is severely pushing me away and I am just trying to stay as neutral as possible.  It is a tough place to be.  Of course, I slip and JADE but less and less. Thank goodness, I barely had to see him this weekend.  He showed up at the kids activities, I was detached but polite.  He was sulky and feeling sorry for himself.  He doesn't understand why most of the parents avoid him, the majority of people don't like victims.  They like me and that just makes him cling to some notion that I have told them all about him, which I wouldn't do because I don't want my children to be shunned. 

MissyM, this is our challenge, I certainly didn't ask for it, but I realise that we have to deal with it whether we like it or not. She is the mother of my children, and regardless of the outcome of the separation, I would like to have as amicable relationship as possible with her. I also know, I can only do my part, she is responsible for her side and I cannot change or control that, I just accept it (well I'm learning to :-)).

[Moselle]

Read that the good we see in them is our reflection... and its what we fall for.

I'm no expert and there is certainly alot of mirroring going on. Certainly of the negative type in the last 14 years of our marriage, but we have had good times too. That is the torture for me - to know what is possible, but this BPD takes over and kills it. The push and pull is exhausting emotionally, but ironically the personality was developed to defend against the same push pull attachment/detachment of (in my wife's case unwittingly abusive parent/s) in childhood, and actually served a positive purpose to protect them. As I understand this, which understanding is fairly shallow at this point.

Look I'm no fool. I've protected my assets in trust and she may yet go hostile on me about the children, so I'm preparing for the worst and hoping for the best. I have 3 months to go of a 3-6 month separation.

[Moselle]

Also interested in how you determined to separate and what you hoped to accomplish. 

Formflier, I am so sorry to hear about your situation. I can empathise with the diffculty of finances, children, and marriage. It is so difficult. I have three little girls caught up in this.

My wife was hitting, scratching and screaming at me, she had been dysregulating for 3 weeks solid and I was staying in there listening to it, getting deeper and deeper into a hole. I realised that I was going to down into the hole with her. I was empty, spent, I could not do it any more. So we went to our marriage consellor and I asked her to help us separate amicably. We agreed on one month and during that month, she asked for 3 -6 months (I think at the suggestion of her psychiatrist). Self preservation was the goal I'm afraid, and remains the goal. I have tried to put a healing separation in place, but she is refusing to engage, and I am beginning to accept that as difficult as it is, this may be the end of the marriage. She may choose to opt out and that is her choice. I may also choose not to carry on trying.

During that three weeks of dysregulation, she actually came to me with a description of BPD and said I think I have this. However she has since retracted that and instead insisted that I have diagnosed her.  I have since learned that she is indeed BPD (mostly through learning on this forum/ website, but also by going to a therapist who fortunately has experience with BPD) and that I am co-dependent in the relationship. Not her fault, not my fault, but a conflict relationship which had gone through the cycle of idolisation, clingyness and then hatred.  I am determined to overcome co-dependence and recover to the point where I can have healthy relationships. She may or may not choose to accept responsiblity for her issues. So far she has not. People on this site have been a huge support to me as I have been through this.