It's going downhill...

[momtara]

Now xHusb told his lawyer that I said I wouldn't let him have the kids next weekend.  Not true!

He keeps asking to come visit me on MY weekends.  I firmly and kindly said no.  He says he misses the kids and wants to get back together.

This behavior has been happening in the last month. I think maybe his medication changed.

Should I tell his shrink of my concerns?  We also have a parent coordinator.  Should I tell her so she can talk to his shrink?

[livednlearned]

Now xHusb told his lawyer that I said I wouldn't let him have the kids next weekend.  Not true!

He keeps asking to come visit me on MY weekends.  I firmly and kindly said no.  He says he misses the kids and wants to get back together.

This behavior has been happening in the last month. I think maybe his medication changed.

Should I tell his shrink of my concerns?  We also have a parent coordinator.  Should I tell her so she can talk to his shrink?

Everything is documented in emails?

I'm not sure I understand the connection between changes in medication and this behavior. What's the medication for?

[momtara]

He has been on medication for anxiety and such, since the divorce.  For the last year, he was unable to talk late at night because he was tired and the medicine was affecting him.  In fact, if I did catch him late, he was always drowsy.  He also hadn't been pushing me to get back together or change the parenting plan.  Maybe his medicine has been keeping him calm.  Not sure.

But all of a sudden, in the last month, he has asked me about getting back together and keeps wanting to visit the house while I have the kids.  It's a lot of pressure to put me under, and I'm not sure how to respond.  Then to cap it off, this weekend he made up the lie (or had the delusion) that I am not going to let him have the kids on HIS weekend.  I am just wondering if I should tell our PC or shrink about the change in behavior.

It may just because it's warm now and he's lonely on weekends.  But I am not sure how to respond and I don't want to upset him, since he has our kids alone at times.  Just wondering if I shoudl tell one of these parties about the changes in his behavior and how I don't know what to say in response to him.

[livednlearned]

I am not sure how to respond and I don't want to upset him, since he has our kids alone at times.  Just wondering if I shoudl tell one of these parties about the changes in his behavior and how I don't know what to say in response to him.

Why not just say no?

[momtara]

Saying no doesn't stop the continued asking or get to the root of why his behavior is changing.  If his behavior is getting worse or he's not on medication, maybe it will affect how he is with the kids on his weekends?  Should I just deal with him asking and telling me he's sad etc and not tell anyone?

[Boss302]

Now xHusb told his lawyer that I said I wouldn't let him have the kids next weekend.  Not true!

He keeps asking to come visit me on MY weekends.  I firmly and kindly said no.  He says he misses the kids and wants to get back together.

This behavior has been happening in the last month. I think maybe his medication changed.

Should I tell his shrink of my concerns?  We also have a parent coordinator.  Should I tell her so she can talk to his shrink?

He is trying to ENGAGE you emotionally. BPDs thrive on emotional engagement and drama, even if it's negative engagement. You need to shut that down by referring him right back to the court orders. As long as he's getting his time when the kids when he is supposed to, then his "accusations" are utterly, completely irrelevant, and should be ignored. Or you could respond with "You've been getting time with the kids when you're supposed to per our court orders. If you think you aren't, feel free to go back to court."

And leave it at that. He doesn't really want more time with the kids - he wants to ENGAGE you. If you respond properly to this kind of silliness a few times, he'll probably stop. But be aware - he WANTS to have a conflict with you over this. Why? Because conflict is better than nothingness.

As to what triggered this behavior, there's no telling. It could be medication, or it could be some kind of emotional trigger event that has nothing to do with you, or the kids. BPDs often get triggered and respond by trying to engage in emotional drama with other people. I can count on that from my BPDx every time something stressful happens in her life. When she does it, I know something is happening with her that may not even have anything to do with me, or our kids. I don't let her get her "drama fix" with me anymore.

You need to learn how to respond to it. Keep it simple, stick to the facts, avoid emotional engagement, and that's that.

[momtara]

Thanks for the reality check.

I guess I do worry that something bad could happen to the kids when he has them, if he's not on his meds or whatever.  But maybe I overreact in that way.  Maybe not.  Don't really know.

Is it bad to alert the PC?  If someone tells his shrink, I wonder if that would create more drama.

Maybe I just need a shrink to bounce this off... . one who deals with these situations.

[Boss302]

Saying no doesn't stop the continued asking or get to the root of why his behavior is changing.  If his behavior is getting worse or he's not on medication, maybe it will affect how he is with the kids on his weekends?  Should I just deal with him asking and telling me he's sad etc and not tell anyone?

NO. DO NOT BE HIS THERAPIST. His emotional problems are his, not yours... . unless that behavior becomes an issue that affects his ability to effectively parent your kids when they're with him. Then it's your problem. Otherwise, it's not. Leave it at that. Don't even go into his mental state with him - say "You've been able to exercise visitation rights with the children when specified by our court orders. If you feel that hasn't been happening, then it's up to you to bring it to the court's attention." Don't worry... . he won't. That's not what this is about. He wants his drama fix with you. Make sure he knows that well is dry.

As long as you're keeping your end of the bargain, he has no reason to do any of this. Stick to the parenting orders and limit communications to the facts, not his emotional diatribes. Keep it simple, remove the emotion, and leave it at that.

After a while, if you stick to your guns, you'll find this kind of garbage doesn't happen as often.

[Boss302]

Thanks for the reality check.

I guess I do worry that something bad could happen to the kids when he has them, if he's not on his meds or whatever.  But maybe I overreact in that way.  Maybe not.  Don't really know.

Is it bad to alert the PC?  If someone tells his shrink, I wonder if that would create more drama.

Maybe I just need a shrink to bounce this off... . one who deals with these situations.

I think consulting with a therapist would be a good idea here. But to reiterate - his emotional problems are his problems, not yours. If you suspect it's a problem for your kids, then you have a reason to get involved. Perhaps you could just communicate with them a bit more about "how Daddy is doing." Make sure they know they can come to you with any concerns they have. And if there are issues, then maybe get your PC involved.

Hope this helps. Hang in there - this kind of stuff does get better in time.

[Boss302]

Another thought... . you might want to keep a spreasheet or journal detaining when he had the kids... . just in case. 

[momtara]

I wasn't going to get into his emotional stuff WITH him, but wanted to know if I should tip off our parent coordinator or therapist.  I have no idea if the issues could affect his parenting.  The kids are young, so they can't tell me. 

[livednlearned]

I wasn't going to get into his emotional stuff WITH him, but wanted to know if I should tip off our parent coordinator or therapist.  I have no idea if the issues could affect his parenting.  The kids are young, so they can't tell me. 

What would the PC be able to do?

[momtara]

My thought was that she could tell his therapist that maybe he's not taking his meds or the new ones aren't working as well.  But I guess you're right, that's not her place.  She does talk to him, tho.

[david]

"Now xHusb told his lawyer that I said I wouldn't let him have the kids next weekend.  Not true!"

Is that in an email or just something he said to you ?  My ex used to send me emails and cc them to her atty to try to get me to react. The first few had me upset but I eventually learned it was the disorder and it had no substance to it. I've been accused of physical, verbal, and emotional abuse for the last 7 years. I haven't been near ex in 4 years, I haven't spoken to ex a little longer then that. I only communicate through email so she would have to produce an email of abuse and she has none. I have learned to ignore the bs. It takes a while to ignore

"He keeps asking to come visit me on MY weekends.  I firmly and kindly said no.  He says he misses the kids and wants to get back together."

If you have no intention of getting back together then the quickest way to stop the attempts at charming is to say no and then ignore. Negative engagement is still engagement. That took me a long time to understand.

My ex once acussed me of bruising our youngest in a fit of anger. She took him to the pediatrician. She sent me an email with the false allegations. I was furious and scared at the same time. I knew I didn't do it but I was scared the legal system would do something to restrict my time with our boys. I called my atty. She said to lie low and do nothing. That didn't sit well with me. I called a friend that was a doc and he said if a parent brought a child in claiming the other parent was hurting the child, and there was signs of abuse, he would contact children services and report both parents since he wasn't sure what was true. That made sense to me but I was still very concerned. I called the pediatrician and they had nothing to say . However, I didn't think there was anything serious by our conversation. Months later during a custody eval ex brought it up again. I gave the evaluator the pediatricians number for her to call. At a later meeting the evaluator said she called the pediatrician and she said there was nothing in her notes to indicate something like that happened. Her notes did say mom claimed I abused him but that when he was interviewed without his mom he told the pediatrician I didn't hurt him. He was around 5 years old at the time and he would have a bunch of bruises on his body at any given time. He was a little boy that was very physical.

It took me years to get past the reacting phase and just let things play out in ex's head. My ex was very good at pushing my buttons. She knew what was important to me and used that against me. When I learned to detach and stop reacting things got much better.

[david]

charming should read charming

[momtara]

I'm not at all worried at this point about my exH's false claims.

What I am worried about is that he is starting to imagine things like this again, and that this is a change in behavior after a while of seeming to improve. 

I kind of didn't give all the facts above, as I am trying to be anonymous, but I'll get more specific.  He has a lawyer in his family.  He emailed his relative, the lawyer, to say that I had threatened not to let him have one of the kids on the upcoming father's day weekend.  In his email to his relative, who's a lawyer, he asked what his recourse was if I don't let him take our kid.

The relative forwarded me his email and said, "exH says you said he can't have the kid during Father's day weekend.  There must be some misunderstanding.  Right?"

I wrote back and said yes, I never said that.  Relative texted my exH back to say "Yes, you can have the kids for father's day weekend."

So the small problem was solved.  The larger problem is that over the last month, he has been pushing me for more time with the kids, time in the house during drop-offs, and has called me late at night to talk.  He says he wants to get back together, too.  I have told him it's hard for me to talk about these things.  So now he capped off with an email to his relative claiming I was gonna withhold the kids.  I don't know if he imagined it or wants to just get his relatives angry at me or what. 

So my questions aren't about being worried about court or anything like that.  My question is... . his behavior has changed a bit in the last month, he seems really sad and lonely, he tells me he misses the kids and wants more time (he only sees them every other weekend), etc... .

Do I just keep dealing with this, or notify our PC or his shrink?

I know I can say "Buzz off," but we do have to collaborate on kid stuff and I want to keep the lines of communication open because our kids are both under 4 and can't really fend for themselves.

Anyway, I *did* contact our PC.  She said I did the right thing by telling her, and that I should bring it up at our next session so she can call his shrink to discuss. 

I have fears from time to time that he could hurt the kids for revenge, but nothing specific has happened in that direction.  Still, I see him all tightly wrapped and imagining things and going from sad to communicative to angry... . it just makes me nervous.

[david]

I used to be a lot more nervous years ago when our boys were 8 and 4 1/2. They are now 15 and 11 1/2. Things have gotten better because they have learned how to deal with their mom. They have better strategies , etc. Stay focused on the kids. I learned to listen and validate better than I ever was able to before. That only happened because ex and I are divorced. I can thank my ex for making me a much better parent.

It sounds as if his lawyer relative got what he was saying wasn't true. So others around him get that he is the problem. That may help you in ways that you may never realize.

[Boss302]

I'm not at all worried at this point about my exH's false claims.

What I am worried about is that he is starting to imagine things like this again, and that this is a change in behavior after a while of seeming to improve.  

I kind of didn't give all the facts above, as I am trying to be anonymous, but I'll get more specific.  He has a lawyer in his family.  He emailed his relative, the lawyer, to say that I had threatened not to let him have one of the kids on the upcoming father's day weekend.  In his email to his relative, who's a lawyer, he asked what his recourse was if I don't let him take our kid.

The relative forwarded me his email and said, "exH says you said he can't have the kid during Father's day weekend.  There must be some misunderstanding.  Right?"

I wrote back and said yes, I never said that.  Relative texted my exH back to say "Yes, you can have the kids for father's day weekend."

So the small problem was solved.  The larger problem is that over the last month, he has been pushing me for more time with the kids, time in the house during drop-offs, and has called me late at night to talk.  He says he wants to get back together, too.  I have told him it's hard for me to talk about these things.  So now he capped off with an email to his relative claiming I was gonna withhold the kids.  I don't know if he imagined it or wants to just get his relatives angry at me or what.  

So my questions aren't about being worried about court or anything like that.  My question is... . his behavior has changed a bit in the last month, he seems really sad and lonely, he tells me he misses the kids and wants more time (he only sees them every other weekend), etc... .

Do I just keep dealing with this, or notify our PC or his shrink?

I know I can say "Buzz off," but we do have to collaborate on kid stuff and I want to keep the lines of communication open because our kids are both under 4 and can't really fend for themselves.

Anyway, I *did* contact our PC.  She said I did the right thing by telling her, and that I should bring it up at our next session so she can call his shrink to discuss.  

I have fears from time to time that he could hurt the kids for revenge, but nothing specific has happened in that direction.  Still, I see him all tightly wrapped and imagining things and going from sad to communicative to angry... . it just makes me nervous.

I agree, all this is nerve wracking. But you have to understand the personality you're dealing with here - the end of your marriage and all this stress makes you nervous and edgy, but for him, he's feeling utterly abandoned, and BPDs will do just about anything to fill that space. I believe that's why he's so insistent on seeing you and your kids.

You need to focus on YOUR emotional health, and leave HIS to him. He's a grown man - let him take responsibility. If you choose to respond to this stuff, it would be a good idea to briefly validate his emotions, then suggest a solution. How about:

"I'm sorry to hear you're feeling down. I know you're hurting, but I can't offer you the emotional support you need - that would not be appropriate. Have you thought about joining a support group for divorced dads? Here's a link to one near us... . "

And leave it at that. You've validated his feelings, made your boundaries clear, and suggested a solution.

I firmly believe that at their most basic level, BPDs are drama seekers. It fills the empty spaces in them. Wanting to reconnect with you is, at some level, about the drama, the interaction, the ENGAGEMENT. BPDs crave all that. And since you spent so much time with this man, whether you know it or not, that's the role you took on. It's sometimes hard or those of us who played caretaker to a BPD to leave it behind because in a real sense, it's all we know. It's a learned behavior. But you can unlearn it.

This does get better with time, but I think you need to set clear boundaries right now, for your sake and for your kids' sake.