Two negatives make a plus?

[ziniztar]

Funny thing. I know that a lot of people have issues here that their BPD SO either restricts them from seeing friends, demands them to stay at home, are incapable of spending time alone. I think my dBPDbf is not very well at being alone either, however his coping mechanism is to drive himself into overload. We started counting the number of projects/stuff he is trying to accomplish, and there are 17 (!) general activities in one week he’s working on. Two types of therapy, three types of jobs with completely irregular shifts, seeing his own friends, hockey practice, band practice… I could go on for a while. And they’re all equally important. And I’m one of them – and therefore 1 out of 17 things he has to deal with. And that’s exactly how I feel, sometimes. 1 out of 17.

With a mother that died at age of 5 and a father that worked a lot and was not very emotionally available (unless he needed it), I obviously have issues as well. Fear of abandonment is one, feeling emotionally neglected a second. The above scenario does not really help me feel good about my relationship. It seems like this is becoming a bigger issue than dealing with his BPD, which we can manage quite well nowadays. He even admitted needing all the activities because he’s avoiding spending time alone, feeling like a failure, and feeling depressed.

Where do I draw the line? If I read in Young’s book on the pitfal of fear of abandonment, I should avoid partners that are…:

-   Married or in a relationship. Check. Never did that, never will.

-   Travelling a lot, a workaholic or living in a different city. Uncheck. He works a lot and lives in a different city. We’re working on that last part and will probably move in together in 6 or 7 months.

-   Unstable (drinking, using drugs, depressed or incapable of working) or in other ways emotionally unavailable. Uncheck. Allthough his BPD behaviour is getting a lot better, his ADHD medicin has given him a lot more focus and therapy is working.

-   A Peter Pan; coming and going whenever he wants, afraid of attachement, seksual freedom. Check. He is committed to the relationship and allthough he as attachement issues and there’s a definite push-pull cycle, I feel he’s doing everything he can for me and that is worth a lot.

-   Ambivalent. He wants you, he wants you not. He’s madly in love and then you’re non-existent. Uncheck. He has his push-pull cycles.

So then what. Because I’m aware of my pitfall and he matches too many criteria I should just leave him? Even though he puts in a lot of effort to change (and so do I to understand where I’m coming from)? 

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[an0ught]

Hi ziniztrar,

If I read in Young’s book on the pitfal of fear of abandonment, I should avoid partners that are…:

-   Married or in a relationship. Check. Never did that, never will.

-   Travelling a lot, a workaholic or living in a different city. Uncheck. He works a lot and lives in a different city. We’re working on that last part and will probably move in together in 6 or 7 months.

-   Unstable (drinking, using drugs, depressed or incapable of working) or in other ways emotionally unavailable. Uncheck. Allthough his BPD behaviour is getting a lot better, his ADHD medicin has given him a lot more focus and therapy is working.

-   A Peter Pan; coming and going whenever he wants, afraid of attachement, seksual freedom. Check. He is committed to the relationship and allthough he as attachement issues and there’s a definite push-pull cycle, I feel he’s doing everything he can for me and that is worth a lot.

-   Ambivalent. He wants you, he wants you not. He’s madly in love and then you’re non-existent. Uncheck. He has his push-pull cycles.

Such a list seems easy to do - list the negatives and put a wrapper around it. It sells well as it validates all the people who are struggling which will be probably the majority.

I'm not buying into the view that others are static. Nor that we can figure it out from the outside where there are problems easily - all of us hide our weaknesses - we all do. Nor do I subscribe to the idea that if only the other side would be perfect I would be happy.

It is good that you took the extreme bullet points and tried see a more balanced picture.   Thinking in b&w blocks deeper thinking and hides solutions.

Where do I draw the line? If I read in Young’s book on the pitfal of fear of abandonment, I should avoid partners that are…:

Your partner is triggering abandonment in you. And constantly being triggered may be too much for you and if that is truly the case you may have to leave - leaving because abandonment is triggered all the time is an extreme step and a bit self defeating. As he is working on his side a possibly better option would be working on your side and trying to build more resilience with respect to your abandonment fears.

Funny thing. I know that a lot of people have issues here that their BPD SO either restricts them from seeing friends, demands them to stay at home, are incapable of spending time alone. I think my dBPDbf is not very well at being alone either, however his coping mechanism is to drive himself into overload. We started counting the number of projects/stuff he is trying to accomplish, and there are 17 (!) general activities in one week he’s working on. Two types of therapy, three types of jobs with completely irregular shifts, seeing his own friends, hockey practice, band practice… I could go on for a while. And they’re all equally important. And I’m one of them – and therefore 1 out of 17 things he has to deal with. And that’s exactly how I feel, sometimes. 1 out of 17.

Wonderful example of what can go wrong when going to extremes. For fear of failure he is working on everything at the same time and thus almost guaranteeing failure most of the time. He is keeping himself busy and for sure this is a lot more functional than many other alternatives but the way he goes about it is not truly healthy. Not much you can do here for the time being except nudging him to complete some projects, keeping an eye out on projects with large negative side effects and maybe making sure some projects benefit both of you.

You are sure you are just 1/17? I suspect you would not have display of anger in your relationship if that is truly the case. You are much too close and much more important for him for better or worse.

See the 16 projects as dysfunctional coping and not as a judgment of your worth.

[Love Is Not Enough]

As he is working on his side a possibly better option would be working on your side and trying to build more resilience with respect to your abandonment fears.

I think an0ught really hit the nail on the head. This helped me a lot. Thanks.

It's not really two negatives, but two positives making everything better. I think it is great you bf has activities to focus on. Hopefully as he continues to improve he can shorten the list some and balance things a little better. This gives you space to work on your things. Something I wish I had more of and still struggle to ask for. Like an0ught says, keep working on yourself. That is what I am going to do.

[Stalwart]

Sounds more like two positives to me as well in most sense, although I can understand you want more from him on a personal level althought the third unknown positive of the situation is just around the corner. Moving closer together will affect the dynamics to some degree, have you considered what you expect from that change of events?

I wish you luck with this and both of you can find the balance that makes for a good relationship you both enjoy living in.

[ziniztar]

Nor do I subscribe to the idea that if only the other side would be perfect I would be happy.

I agree with you and I'm aware of it... .part of me is attrackted to his active lifestyle so sometimes it's two sides of one coin.

And constantly being triggered may be too much for you and if that is truly the case you may have to leave - leaving because abandonment is triggered all the time is an extreme step and a bit self defeating.

It is isn't it. Thanks for saying that.

Not much you can do here for the time being except nudging him to complete some projects, keeping an eye out on projects with large negative side effects and maybe making sure some projects benefit both of you.

You are sure you are just 1/17? I suspect you would not have display of anger in your relationship if that is truly the case. You are much too close and much more important for him for better or worse.

See the 16 projects as dysfunctional coping and not as a judgment of your worth.

I know I'm not 1/17 of importance to him, but I am when it comes to how he devides his time. He was supposed to go to me tonight, and this morning called me that his colleague is in a serious relationship crisis and asked to work for him. He always asks me what to do, which allows me to become the one to say no to him (and he can get mad at me for it). I never allow him to pull me into that role, but it's difficult.

Sounds more like two positives to me as well in most sense, although I can understand you want more from him on a personal level althought the third unknown positive of the situation is just around the corner. Moving closer together will affect the dynamics to some degree, have you considered what you expect from that change of events?

Not yet, we'r talking it through right now. Discussing what we love/hate to do around the house so we're discussing stuff before actually moving in together. It seems as though I'll take care of cleaning, he'll do the laundry and garbage.  

When I said two negatives I meant: fear of being alone (his side), and fear of abandonment (my side). We have different coping styles and they don't match, although I think it's quite good we're both aware of it. I think that living together will decrease my fear of abandonment, as we'll always be together at night. My loneliness decreases when I know I can count on someone to be there for me on set times. I know he'll be just as busy as he is now, and maybe not that much around the house... but if he tells me now he has hockey practice planned on wednesday it feels like he's choosing hockey over me (as it entails he can't come to my city). If we live together, it means he'll not be at home all evening, but we can have dinner together and he'll sleep next to me, freshly showered.

By the way, I read a great article posted by Skip on the https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=76487.msg12455746#msg12455746. It was about how BPD traits used for diagnostics evolve over time, patients were monitored for 8 to 10 years. It appeared that affective/dysphoric consequences when alone (i.e. getting depressed or anxious when perceived as alone), was the toughest one to crack. It was the only one still persistent after 6 to 8 years. Please mind that these were inpatients so people that were hospitalized, usually the more severe cases. It kinda gave me a scientific reason for his behaviour and helped me understand him a little bit more... for people interested, here's the link: www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3222950/

Thanks for responding all, it really helps to know people are here with support and answers  .