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sweetillusions

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« on: July 31, 2014, 03:28:47 PM »

My boyfriend and I are on holiday at the moment and we're going out a lot, drinking at bars. Every time we do it ends in disaster and it is almost always because he thinks I have been looking at men who are looking at me - catching eyes, whatever. We've been on holiday for 2 months and it has been ongoing so I'm thinking about it extremely often and putting in SO much effort to look at absolutely NO ONE. I mean looking at the ground, looking at TVs, looking at anything that is not a person. We went out tonight and he went to get a drink so I watched the TV. He then suspected that something was up as I was fidgeting (because I get nervous when we drink because it's basically guaranteed that something will go wrong). He attributed it to a man sitting vaguely in the direction of the TV and once he started talking about it he couldn't stop and was not paying attention to anything I said, even though I had rationally explained that I was nervous as I thought there would be a blow up and I had made a promise to him that I would not look at men so he had nothing to worry about, I only have eyes for him, etc. I tried my best to explain things but as he was humiliating me in front of two people that we had just met I made the decision to leave - after asking him to calm down and trust that I made a promise that I would stick to and I was not doing anything remotely like what he was saying. So I left and I'm back at the hotel writing this.

I would really appreciate any advice on how to deal with this ongoing situation... ? It is clear to me that he watches me like a hawk and creates things in his mind, I don't know what more I can say or do to help the situation.
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byfaith
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« Reply #1 on: July 31, 2014, 04:01:40 PM »

 

I wish I could give advice that would make things simpler. I have to deal with this type of situation. I still do to a degree. I find myself glancing at someone even when I am not with my wife and looking away. My advice would be to deeply evaluate whether this is something you can handle in the long run. It is a very stressful way to live. If I had to go back and do it all over? I can't change the way my wife thinks. In my case the only way for my wife to "not worry" about who I was looking at was to detach herself from me in an intimate way. I am sorry you are having to go through this. I feel the same way about my wife as you do about your BF. Trying to convince them of that is almost impossible.
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maxsterling
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Relationship status: living together, engaged
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« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2014, 05:10:39 PM »

sweetillusions - I'm so sorry you are having to deal with this.  being accused of things you didn't do and constantly having to alter your behavior to avoid conflict is tiresome, and certainly no way to live.  What you described, unfortunately, is typical BPD behavior.  I'd be willing to bet 90% or more of us on this website have received unfounded accusations of looking at or flirting with someone else.

I think it helps to examine the real reasons this is happening:  He has an emotion in his head that is not based on facts or evidence.  He has a low self image, so he sees no reason for you to stay with him.  He thinks you will abandon him for someone better or better looking.  He assumes you are plotting every day to run away from him. What's important here is that HE HAS THESE FEELINGS ALREADY NO MATTER WHAT YOU DID OR DIDN'T DO.  So, he's constantly looking for "proof" to back up his abandonment feelings.  That means, there is no way you can alter your behavior to satisfy him.  He will find SOMETHING you did as proof.  Or maybe he will see someone else looking at you, and blame you for that.  You can't win by altering your behavior.

You also can't win by getting defensive.  If you JADE (Justify, Argue, Defend, or Explain) you are

almost guaranteed to make things worse.  You don't have to explain your actions.  And if you do, you have fallen into his trap, and he sees your defense as proof of your guilt.  I'd suggest responding with some form of the SET method (Support, Empathy, Truth).  And if he continues with the accusations, it's time for boundaries. 

It's a tough situation to navigate.  Just remember, you have no control over his feelings. And since this problem seems to come about when he is drinking, perhaps that is an area where a boundary is necessary - to find something else to do by yourself when he is drinking.   
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ColdEthyl
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Relationship status: Married 2 years
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« Reply #3 on: July 31, 2014, 05:14:40 PM »

THIS! My husband does the same thing, though to not the severity you are dealing with. When we first starting dating, we would fight about my male friends on FB so much I ended up deleting them all. Now over time he has gotten better, but he still says things like "I don't know why you married me, you could do so much better" and "Someday you will get tired of me and that will be the end of it"


sweetillusions - I'm so sorry you are having to deal with this.  being accused of things you didn't do and constantly having to alter your behavior to avoid conflict is tiresome, and certainly no way to live.  What you described, unfortunately, is typical BPD behavior.  I'd be willing to bet 90% or more of us on this website have received unfounded accusations of looking at or flirting with someone else.

I think it helps to examine the real reasons this is happening:  He has an emotion in his head that is not based on facts or evidence.  He has a low self image, so he sees no reason for you to stay with him.  He thinks you will abandon him for someone better or better looking.  He assumes you are plotting every day to run away from him. What's important here is that HE HAS THESE FEELINGS ALREADY NO MATTER WHAT YOU DID OR DIDN'T DO.  So, he's constantly looking for "proof" to back up his abandonment feelings.  That means, there is no way you can alter your behavior to satisfy him.  He will find SOMETHING you did as proof.  Or maybe he will see someone else looking at you, and blame you for that.  You can't win by altering your behavior.

You also can't win by getting defensive.  If you JADE (Justify, Argue, Defend, or Explain) you are

almost guaranteed to make things worse.  You don't have to explain your actions.  And if you do, you have fallen into his trap, and he sees your defense as proof of your guilt.  I'd suggest responding with some form of the SET method (Support, Empathy, Truth).  And if he continues with the accusations, it's time for boundaries. 

It's a tough situation to navigate.  Just remember, you have no control over his feelings. And since this problem seems to come about when he is drinking, perhaps that is an area where a boundary is necessary - to find something else to do by yourself when he is drinking.   

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« Reply #4 on: July 31, 2014, 06:04:27 PM »

Hello, ColdEthyl &  Welcome

You've gotten some very good advice on this thread, and I'd like to give you the link to: Communication: Using the S.E.T. Technique. It's part of the communication tools & techniques that you can find at all the links to the right-hand side of this page------------>

I'm really sorry for the stress this is putting on you, and I hope that the information on this site, and the advice and insights you will find from the many caring members of this Board, will help you figure this out and make things better... .Remember: Before you can make anything better, you must stop making it worse 

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Jacq189

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« Reply #5 on: July 31, 2014, 06:06:46 PM »

Hi sweetillusions,

I feel for you on this one. I am lucky my partner doesn't have that particular insecurity but she certainly isn't short of others and I know exactly how hard it can be to deal with that anxiety of expecting a blow out. In this case I think you have found out already that trying to change your behaviour to live up to your bf's unrealistic expectations doesn't work. So my advise to you would be to stop trying and just relax, enjoy your holiday. He will have whatever reactions he will have regardless of how much you exhaust yourself trying to please him. I find that when I relax into a situation and focus on enjoying myself then the anxiety of waiting for a blow out subsides. This actually removes a lot of the tension between me and my partner and the likelihood of a blow out reduces dramatically.

I think in the long run the most important thing for you will to be to establish some boundaries around his jealousy and suspiciousness. I certainly haven't perfected how to establish strong boundaries yet and maybe others can give some more advise. But perhaps if you were to talk to him using SET before you go out next time to validate him and to set up your expectations and boundary.

Maybe something like: "I know it can be hard for you sometimes when we go out if you think I am making eyes at other men and I can totally understand why. It must be really difficult for you to feel that is what is happening. I really do care about how you feel and I don't want you to feel that way. I want you to understand that I only want to go out to spend time with you and for us to enjoy ourselves together as a couple. That is all I am interested in and nothing more. I love you and I love spending time with you. So lets just go out tonight and have fun. What do you think?"

That way you have already said everything that you would normally try to say after he gets upset. but you have done it when you are both calm so hopefully he will hear it. Then if he does get upset you don't have to engage. If he persists you can simply get up and say "I'm leaving" without getting upset yourself. If you don't engage then it gives him the chance to self sooth and with any luck he (and you as well) can start to realize that this is his issue not yours.

I hope that helps. Best of luck and remember to enjoy your holiday :-)
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sweetillusions

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« Reply #6 on: July 31, 2014, 08:15:47 PM »

byfaith, maxsterling and Jacq189 - thank you for your wonderful advice and kind words.

ColdEthyl - I experience the same things! I deleted my facebook altogether to avoid any arguments about male friends or photos that I was tagged in, etc - if I hadn't there would be even more arguments and it seemed the easiest option as I don't care for facebook much anyway.
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sweetillusions

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« Reply #7 on: July 31, 2014, 08:43:19 PM »

He came back raging and grabbed me by the throat, lifted me off of my feet against the wall and yelled in my ear basically that he knew FOR SURE that I had been looking at this guy (who I am yet to identify myself). I gave him chances to see that he was wrong, but he was SURE of what had happened and I ultimately got a separate room in the hotel (declining the hotel's offer to call the police).

I am concerned about the level to which I put up with ill-treatment (and how often I return after such treatment) and I am concerned about how isolated I am when I have to talk about my deepest concerns to an online forum and cannot discuss this with family/friends. I love him an incredible amount, I want to have his children - this is also a concern. My mind plays the most amazing tricks on itself to make me feel this way. He may have BPD but most of the time I feel more messed up than he is. Does anyone else feel this way?
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« Reply #8 on: August 01, 2014, 08:51:49 AM »

He came back raging and grabbed me by the throat, lifted me off of my feet against the wall and yelled in my ear basically that he knew FOR SURE that I had been looking at this guy (who I am yet to identify myself). I gave him chances to see that he was wrong, but he was SURE of what had happened and I ultimately got a separate room in the hotel (declining the hotel's offer to call the police).

This is really concerning, sweetillusions... .Have you got a Safety Plan in place for the next time this happens? It's great that you were able to get another room at the hotel, and removing yourself from the situation is one of the things to do on the list; if you read this Article: Safety First you will find other suggestions and options for your safety... .

I am concerned about the level to which I put up with ill-treatment (and how often I return after such treatment) and I am concerned about how isolated I am when I have to talk about my deepest concerns to an online forum and cannot discuss this with family/friends. I love him an incredible amount, I want to have his children - this is also a concern. My mind plays the most amazing tricks on itself to make me feel this way. He may have BPD but most of the time I feel more messed up than he is. Does anyone else feel this way?

This concerns me, also... .We have a great Article here that might help you put your situation in perspective, and find the insights that will answer some of the questions you have regarding your entanglement with your boyfriend, despite his actions: TOOLS: Domestic Violence Against Women. I want to assure you that though your feelings are confusing and possibly even detrimental to your well-being, they aren't unusual; lots of us are (or have been in the past) in Co-Dependent relationships, and Codependency can be understood and then overcome... .

The book "Co-Dependent No More" by Melodie Beatty is the book that initially changed the way I handled my relationship with my Husband years ago when he was having a 2.5 year affair, and eventually I got strong enough to kick him out of the house (having 2 young kids made it very hard for me to get to that place of strength prior to reading that book). Weirdly enough, finding my strength and being willing to end the relationship was the turning point for our relationship, and we are still together today, 27 years later... .

I encourage you to check out the links I gave you, sweetillusions (if you have the time to read anything while on your vacation), and to take care of yourself. Please make a Safety Plan, and if you feel unsure of your safety, take advantage of protection, OK? You deserve respect, kindness and peace of mind and body; there are ways to find that and I hope you can seek out what is available to you for that 

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maxsterling
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« Reply #9 on: August 01, 2014, 11:45:46 AM »

Sweetillusions -

I, too, am worried about your situation.  Please do what you can to stay safe.

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bruceli
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« Reply #10 on: August 01, 2014, 01:15:39 PM »

My boyfriend and I are on holiday at the moment and we're going out a lot, drinking at bars. Every time we do it ends in disaster and it is almost always because he thinks I have been looking at men who are looking at me - catching eyes, whatever. We've been on holiday for 2 months and it has been ongoing so I'm thinking about it extremely often and putting in SO much effort to look at absolutely NO ONE. I mean looking at the ground, looking at TVs, looking at anything that is not a person. We went out tonight and he went to get a drink so I watched the TV. He then suspected that something was up as I was fidgeting (because I get nervous when we drink because it's basically guaranteed that something will go wrong). He attributed it to a man sitting vaguely in the direction of the TV and once he started talking about it he couldn't stop and was not paying attention to anything I said, even though I had rationally explained that I was nervous as I thought there would be a blow up and I had made a promise to him that I would not look at men so he had nothing to worry about, I only have eyes for him, etc. I tried my best to explain things but as he was humiliating me in front of two people that we had just met I made the decision to leave - after asking him to calm down and trust that I made a promise that I would stick to and I was not doing anything remotely like what he was saying. So I left and I'm back at the hotel writing this.

I would really appreciate any advice on how to deal with this ongoing situation... ? It is clear to me that he watches me like a hawk and creates things in his mind, I don't know what more I can say or do to help the situation.

I set up a boundary around this behavior.  I just don't go out in public with her anymore until I feel she is ready through the therapy she is doing.
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JohnLove
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« Reply #11 on: August 02, 2014, 12:58:00 AM »

Hello sweetillusions. I feel you are somewhat aware of your situation but are really here seeking clarity. There must be so much confusion surrounding you at the moment. I too have been torn between my emotional mind and my logical mind.

This is my interpretation of your post.

You are on holiday. This is supposed to be a happy time. This is you having a break from the mundane situations and regular environments in every day life. How does your post consolidate with these simple facts. I'll tell you. It doesn't.

"Evertime you go out drinking it ends in disaster"... .?. So don't go out drinking. You know the result. What is it they say about performing the same action repetitively and expecting a different result?. By your own admission it would not seem to the observer that this behaviour will change in respect to you. What did you do?. Looked at a guy?. I dont believe you even looked at a guy. A "guy" may have been in the room. It is not you.

Having a person by the neck and lifting them off the ground can cause serious injury and even death. It is called hanging. It is terribly abusive. Know this.

You have tried to be rational and reasonable. Problem. His behaviour is NEITHER rational or reasonable.

Please consider very carefully the advice and tools offered by the participants on here. We have experienced all sorts of behaviour from pwBPD. Appreciate that your situation is at the EXTREME end. There is not much worse. This is from someone that "loves" you?.

I don't believe ANYONE on these forums wants to see you treated this way. I don't want you to treat YOURSELF this way. Take care of yourself and stay safe. 
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