Need advice how to help my children

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

Hi, I have recently separated from my BPD wife and we have a 50/50 custody arrangement with our 4 year old son and 6 year old daughter, I need some advice on how to help my children, how do I explain to them that they are wonderful children and the way they are treated when I'm not there to stand up for them is wrong and is not their fault.

My daughter is a very sensitive little girl and it is tearing her apart, she questions her mother's love for her and sobs in my arms about it, it breaks my heart, my son has started kicking and hitting when his mother tries to get a hug and lately they have started to yell at people and being mean to people and even animals.

Any suggestions on how to minimize the damage,  I can't believe that I'm trying to merely MINIMIZE the damage but that's what it's come down to.

Thank you

[Pogo14]

Hi, I have recently separated from my BPD wife and we have a 50/50 custody arrangement with our 4 year old son and 6 year old daughter, I need some advice on how to help my children, how do I explain to them that they are wonderful children and the way they are treated when I'm not there to stand up for them is wrong and is not their fault.

My daughter is a very sensitive little girl and it is tearing her apart, she questions her mother's love for her and sobs in my arms about it, it breaks my heart, my son has started kicking and hitting when his mother tries to get a hug and lately they have started to yell at people and being mean to people and even animals.

Any suggestions on how to minimize the damage,  I can't believe that I'm trying to merely MINIMIZE the damage but that's what it's come down to.

Thank you

[Matt]

Pogo,

I'm sorry for what you're going through.  Many of us here have been through something like this, and it is hard, but there are approaches that will help.

First, I think you're asking the right question - how to help the kids.  Many of us have trouble focusing on that;  we keep getting caught up in conflict with the other parent and sometimes forget to make the kids' needs #1.

I think the most important thing right now is to validate the kids' perceptions and feelings.  That's easy to say but hard to do!  When the kids talk, or communicate non-verbally, you want to make sure they know you're listening, and that you hear what they're saying and accept it.  "It sounds like you're really sad about what your mom did.", or "It sounds like your mom wasn't nice to you this morning.", or "You seem kind of angry right now." - reflecting back to them what they are communicating abou their perceptions and feelings.

That will make a huge difference.  Sometimes the kids are frustrated that nobody seems to hear what they're saying or understand what they are going through;  just being heard and understood will make them feel much better and they'll probably be able to control their behavior better.

Avoid things like "You shouldn't say that!" or "You know your mother loves you don't you?" - things that invalidate them by suggesting that their perceptions are wrong or that they're wrong to feel what they feel.

Lots of quiet time with each kid;  hugs;  doing stuff together;  telling them you love them and that they're good kids.

And... .consider finding the right counselor for the kids - someone each of them can talk to safely.  That's not a quick fix - it will take a long time for the counselor to get to know the kids and to find ways to help them.  And you can't view her as a tool to use against the other party in the divorce;  she has to be a resource for the kids.

Is the 50/50 arrangement a court order, or is it informal at this point?

[david]

I had a difficult time finding a T for the kids. Both boys wanted nothing to do with it.

I found a T for myself, after several tries, that was a good fit for me. She helped a lot in helping me figure out the best way to approach things. I read a lot of books and used the info that seemed relevant for my situation. I learned to listen to our boys better than before. I learned to validate them.

My oldest got the best help from school. They had a program for divorced families. He found that a lot of families were divorced and that kind of helped him cope.

Our youngest was 4.5 at the time ex left. He acted out more than his brother. My take was that he had no way of processing or communicating what was going on in his head. He is 11 now.

My initial fears of our boys being really screwed up because of this didn't occur. They are much better today than I thought in the beginning. My getting better at listening helped a lot. I wasn't a terrible listener but I learned to get better. Their mom doesn't have that ability and even if we were still together the boys would still be having difficulty dealing with her.

Staying focused on the kids needs was the best thing for me to do.

[Mutt]

Hi Pogo14,

My heart goes out to your kids. I hope that you find comfort in the advice that is given.

Matt has given you an easy and powerful tool for the kids. I'm separated for 17 months now and it's difficult to see the sadness in your kids and you feel like there's nothing you can do. A consistent message with validating the valid with both kids is key. It took awhile but sure enough it worked with all of the kids. The change was gradual after a few months I started noticing a positive emotional change with the kids. Be patient and stick with it. You will see the rewards.

My D is the same age and she doesn't like to go to mom. Mom's focused on other things. Her new boyfriend, a narcissistic need, she's dysregulated and she can't see beyond herself. She doesn't validate the kids. My D comes to me because I validate. If she has a problem at school or daycare, she comes to dad because dad pays attention and listens. Trust.

david raises a good point with the schools. What I would also like to add is telling your D that if there's something that she needs to say that's important and she needs to tell an adult and can't tell you. To tell the teacher at school. Maybe speak to the kids teachers and tell them you advised the kids to confide in them. If per chance something is happening at the other home, she may not want to tell dad. She may be loyal to a parent, maybe she doesn't want to hurt a parents feelings. She can go to a neutral adult - cover all of your bases.

I hope that helps. You have been separated for 3 months. I'm sorry that it had to come to this. I'm glad that you have found us. It's not hopeless. Hang in there.


- Mutt

[Matt]

david raises a good point with the schools. What I would also like to add is telling your D that if there's something that she needs to say that's important and she needs to tell an adult and can't tell you. To tell the teacher at school. Maybe speak to the kids teachers and tell them you advised the kids to confide in them. If per chance something is happening at the other home, she may not want to tell dad. She may be loyal to a parent, maybe she doesn't want to hurt a parents feelings. She can go to a neutral adult - cover all of your bases.

Yeah, and maybe also the school counselor.  When we separated, I talked with the kids' school counselor, and she was super-helpful.  She knew my kids much better than I expected, and was eager to help.  Over the next few months she checked in with the kids informally, and invited them with some other kids to sit with her at lunch and just talk.  She couldn't fix things, but it was good to know there was somebody at the school keeping an eye out and who the kids could talk to if they needed to.

[NorthernGirl]

Hi Pogo14 -- this is such a tough issue, but you can make a big difference. You've started on the right path by coming into it with the right attitude about helping the kids. 

You've already heard from a few of the guys on this board (Matt, David, Mutt) who have been in your position and have great advice and ideas. Validation is such a huge issue for these kids, as they have pointed out.

I just wanted to add in my perspective as a stepmom who has seen the positive impact a caring Dad can have when kids have a disorded mom. My stepsons have all had lots of challenges but they are all in a better place because of the effort their Dad puts in. He stays connected with them, listens to them and encourages them to talk about their feelings (something not always easy for guys!)

Keep asking questions and reaching out as this takes some work but it is so worth the effort!

[livednlearned]

The book I read to help me understand validation (it's a therapeutic technique), is called Power of Validation. Here's a book review: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=166930.0

Another book that really helped me was Don't Alienate the Kids by Bill Eddy. It gave me this  moment when I realized that I was so jacked up on anxiety, and that's what S13 was modeling. He learned from a pro. I started to talk more out loud about my thought process, and normalized feelings, made vulnerability ok (not weakness, but vulnerability, very different).

Your kids are young enough, and you are motivated enough, that you can turn this ship around. My son was 9 when I left, and didn't want to live  :'(  My T steered me toward validation techniques because it was initially developed in response to deal with suicidal people. I'm going to do no justice to the story, but from what I understand, therapists realized that suicidal people felt worse when their loved ones told them they were great. When therapists validated how much despair the patients felt, they began to improve.

It can be very counter-intuitive to do as a parent, especially when there is discipline involved. You are essentially validating the feelings, not the behavior. You can do it with kids at any age -- but it does help to have a book or therapist to help you apply the technique.

It also sounds like you're worried that your kids don't have empathy. I would take it seriously and like others suggested, try to get the kids into therapy. They are learning that shutting off their feelings is preferable to feeling their pain. They need to know that someone is paying attention to how they feel. Often, people like us want to protect our loved ones from negative feelings, but kids, especially kids with a BPD parent, need to learn how to manage negative feelings. First they need to know they feel sad, and that it's ok, and then they need to learn that they can manage that sadness in healthy ways.

My son got a lot out of therapy, but I think he got even more out of me going to therapy. I have a really good therapist, and she has basically helped me raise my son. The effect has been profound. Some days, I can barely believe my son is the same kid when we left 4 years ago.

Listen to your instincts -- they're good. You know something is off, and you also know there is help out there. Basically, you're at the beginning of a really profound journey about what it means to raise healthy kids. It's going to change your life... .

[sanemom]

Another book that really helped me was Don't Alienate the Kids by Bill Eddy. It gave me this  moment when I realized that I was so jacked up on anxiety, and that's what S13 was modeling. He learned from a pro. I started to talk more out loud about my thought process, and normalized feelings, made vulnerability ok (not weakness, but vulnerability, very different).

Your kids are young enough, and you are motivated enough, that you can turn this ship around. My son was 9 when I left, and didn't want to live  :'(  My T steered me toward validation techniques because it was initially developed in response to deal with suicidal people. I'm going to do no justice to the story, but from what I understand, therapists realized that suicidal people felt worse when their loved ones told them they were great. When therapists validated how much despair the patients felt, they began to improve.

Validation is a huge thing... .also your kids are so young that it may help you to label the emotions you are seeing so that they are able to use those labels in the future and talk about them better.  Just a simple, "Are you feeling frustrated right now?" or "You seem pretty mad" can do a world of good. 

This is a small example, but it came to mind.  My DD4 this morning got very quiet all of a sudden and had a concerned look on her face.  I asked her, "What's wrong?" and she could not answer.  I thought about it for a minute to try to figure out what may be going on in that head of hers, and I realized that today was going to be her first day of Pre-K so I asked, "Are you nervous about today?"  Then she lit up, agreed, and talked about being worried that she won't have any friends in there, etc. 

They are going to act out when they are confused at this age, but you can help decrease the confusion by giving them the words for the emotions.

[Pogo14]

Thank you everyone for the great advice I have got the book power of validation and have been applying it I can see it will take some practice but have seen improvement already,  it really helps just knowing that I'm not alone in this, I have been using it when my wife is there and she seems confused that they calm down much more easily,  trying to explain it to her and and will let her have a read, hope she takes it on board fingers crossed.

The tip on letting my kids know about my thoughts and feelings without putting a burden on them has helped a lot as well.

Once again thank you so much.

Pogo

[david]

One thing to always keep in mind. If you are doing the right thing and it isn't showing results immediately remember it takes time. Kids change over time and sporatically.