How to tell / inform spouse that they may have BPD

[scrambler]

Any history / stories for those trying to get their spouse to investigate/ understand BPD?

At this point in time, my wife thinks that I am the one with the problem, and all of our arguments, issues, struggles are because she doesn't trust me.

She thinks I flirt with other women, etc.

I would like for her to see that she may be the one with the problem, although I fear she will rage over the accusation.

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[NeedHelpPls]

You'll be hard pressed to find a way to get her to listen to you.

Does it ever feel like no matter what you do, how hard you try to let her know how much you care and love her, she always find a way to blame you, and make irrational and crazy assumptions about little things you do and consider it a sign of impending abandonment.

and often you are caught completely off guard and dumb founded. You try and reason with her, explain to her that it isn't so, and its extremely difficult because you have no clue how someone could twist things so much, almost to a point of brilliance (on some occasion, I was actually impressed how someone could arrive at such a crazy conclusion and sound logical and convincing).

Over time, your sense of self and reality alters, and you start to think, "hey, maybe I AM the one with the problem." but, my friend, listen to the people around you, your family, friends who has been there for you for years, because, what you are too blind to see, to an outsider, it will be crystal clear.

Trust your gut, and listen to those outside that cares about you, who can give you objective views on things.

Perhaps you could admit to having issues, and you would like your partner to come with you for moral support, in the hopes that the therapist can bring out the real issue at hand. I tried, it didn't work with me. but maybe, it would for you.

[scrambler]

wow NeedhelpPls... .you are spot on.

I have often found myself wondering did I really flirt with that girl? or did I stare at her across the bar... etc. etc.  My wife has left me questioning my own reality at times, but most of the time I don't even remember what girl she is talking about, or when I did this or that.

I am usually caught off guard after what I think was a fun evening, only to be cussed out on the way home... .

My friends and family tell me I am the best husband, but to her I am the coldest, sneakiest hubby who is always hiding things,

I have tried a marriage counselor, who suggested medication, but never touched BPD... He has suggested seeing a psychiatrist, which may be the next step.

The good news is that I got a hint of her being nice to me today... I feel better,

[NeedHelpPls]

I am usually caught off guard after what I think was a fun evening, only to be cussed out on the way home... .

I can related to this... .few outings where you think everything went well, you weren't walking on eggshell much, and you think, "wow, I actually had a great time tonight" and you turn to look at your partner, and you are dumb-founded to find your partner fuming with anger, or stone walling you. And your mind races, you wreck your brain, rehash everything that evening that could have gone wrong, things you might have said, gestures you might have made... .then you get a point where you realize, "this isn't how it should be".

I wish you all the best, hold on to those good days! One thing that helped me somewhat, while I was in a relationship, was to think of your partner as a three-year old kid. You'll find yourself becoming much more lenient, and just like you would with a 3 year old, you wouldn't bend over backwards to assuage their anger. You have to be a much bigger person, as they are a kids trapped in an adult body... .

[takingandsending]

Hi scrambler. I am in the same boat as you, though for different reasons (my uBPDw doesn't accuse me of flirting/infidelity). I would like for my wife to consider investigating BPD and more importantly working with a T toward treatment. I am interested in the advise out there. Our MC pointed the BPD out to me, but she doesn't want to raise it to my wife, thinking it will drive her hard the other direction. I feel like I am lying orbeing secretive now. She knows I am in a support group (yay, NAMI  ) and that I am building a support network, and she suspects it is about her. I don't know how to answer her questions. I so want to be able to lay it out before her in a non-judgmental way, but I don't think it will work that way.

I think this is the tough part of living with anyone who has any mental illness - from their frame or perspective, they are perfectly fine. I read a report recently that somewhere around 60+% of people diagnosed with a mental illness don't believe they have any illness. I was recently reading a blog from a pwBPD in recovery who insists that there is no real illness and it's made up by the psychiatric association and drug companies. The only thing I know for sure is that whether my spouse decides to get help/treatment or not, it cannot stop me from doing the things that I need to do for myself and my children. It means stepping out of the FOG, really looking at how and why I got here and really working to define (and stick to) my boundaries in a consistent, understandable manner. The rest is up to the pwBPD.

[maxsterling]

A couple of things to consider:

- If you tell her, chances are she isn't going to receive the info kindly.  In fact, I can almost guarantee she won't

- More than likely, someone has tried to tell her before.  An ex, a family member, a doctor, a boss... .  And more than likely, that did not go well, and that is why you never heard about it.

- In the rare chance you can successfully convince her she has issues and needs help, there is not a high probability seeking help will change anything.  But I can say that there is almost zero chance of her behavior changing without professional help.

There are lessons on this website that deal with this issue, but I think if you want to go this route it's first important to read and understand as much about BPD as possible and how she is going to interpret what you have to say.  I can tell you pwBPD react strongly to accusations, to things that sound like ultimatums, and to people diagnosing, blaming or judging them.  I think the best approach would be to pay attention to her moods.  The best time to talk would be when she seems to be vulnerable or feeling like something is wrong with her.  My fiancé goes through these every now and then and it sounds like "why can't I do anything right?  Why do I have such a hard time with?"   That's when you jump in and validate that she seems to be having a hard time, ask her if she wants to talk about it, validate that life is difficult, and then GENTLY suggest that talking to a counselor may be a good idea and could help her sort through her emotions.  Leave it up to the counselor to diagnose and treat.  Your goal should be to persuade her to see someone who can diagnose her, not to give her your diagnosis (which would almost guarantee to end explosively and dangerously).

[Vexed]

It's logical to think that if you show them their problem then it will help them see they are wrong, etc. And that things could look could improve.

They are immune to logic, convincing them they have BPD doesn't really change anything.  They either realized they have a problem before or they didn't.  If they denied it before they will deny they have BPD when you show them.  If they admit they are crazy then giving it a title doesn't change anything. 

Mine has always known she has issues, doesn't make anything better.  I've shown her BPD, she isn't fully convinced but believes it's a possibility, doesn't change anything.  Sure she's willing to go to therapy she has been for years, doesn't mean she's motivated.  There whole life revolves around right now, so when she feels good she doesn't need therapy and she forgets she is crazy when she's depressed she is down to go but as soon as things turn around she forgets that yesterday she wanted to kill herself. 

[mapys]

I am usually caught off guard after what I think was a fun evening, only to be cussed out on the way home... .

Oh my... .how many times have I been there. Theater, Cinema, Restaurant - everything goes smooth, and then o our way home she thinks of some stupid things like - you don't enjoy the snowflakes with me (you ruined my joy), you seem grumpy, you didn't smile at me when we met today etc.

Oh WHY?

And when I told her - you probably have BPD (all signs point towards it) - answer: Maybe you are the one with the problems. Everything you say will be turned on you!

[Ceruleanblue]

Yeah, she probably won't take it well if you tell her you suspect that. I told my husband that I think he likely has it, and like most on here said, it had zero effect. I didn't actually think it would, but I figured I'd planted the seed for him to consider.

My uBPDh saw a psychiatrist last week, for the first time, and was told he may have Intermittent Explosive Disorder. Yeah, I'm sure he could present as that also, but that does not explain all his other BPD traits away. This psychiatrist doesn't live with him to see the full spectrum of his behaviors, and let's face it, my uBPDh probably wasn't totally honest or open about ALL his behaviors.

I guess the label, or diagnosis can help, but what really helps the most is the pwBPD wanting to seek help or work on their issues. We can help, we can learn some tools to not make it worse, but in the end, only they can change themselves, just as we can only work on our issues too. And it feels like if you didn't have issues prior to living with someone who has BPD, you develop them!

[NeedHelpPls]

I am usually caught off guard after what I think was a fun evening, only to be cussed out on the way home... .

Oh my... .how many times have I been there. Theater, Cinema, Restaurant - everything goes smooth, and then o our way home she thinks of some stupid things like - you don't enjoy the snowflakes with me (you ruined my joy), you seem grumpy, you didn't smile at me when we met today etc.

Oh WHY?

And when I told her - you probably have BPD (all signs point towards it) - answer: Maybe you are the one with the problems. Everything you say will be turned on you!

you didnt smile at me... EXACT same thing has happened to me so many times

[Bear60]

As I read this topic I can relate to everything. The jealous rages had become so overwhelming that I told her she needed to get some help with the insecurity that drives it. She admitted to insecurity and sought a counselor yet she still refuses to believe that this is her issue, yes I have contributed to it but she wants to find something I did that started it all, she refuses to accept a snowball affect. She is now telling me that it is all me and my insecurity and giving me the ultimatum to get help and fix my issues (those that can have nothing relating to her issues). Her perception of events and things are delusional,  she says the snowball is BS, that I don't want her secure and that I am sabotaging her, she thinks I am projecting my insecurity onto her.

I have been through this with my first wife, a counselor I was seeing for myself first brought up BPD and this is pretty much the same pattern now as then. I am sure I am not doing everything right myself and that is one reason I am here, to try and do better in hopes of a better outcome. I am not mentioning anything about BPD to her, I am trying to work with her on the insecurity and when things  come up that are her insecurities I try to get her to look at it from that perspective.

[Stalwart]

Hey Scrambler I'd like to reply with my experience in trying to get my wife to recognize her illness and seek therapy. I don't come on here as often as maybe I should but to keep it short I'm one of the fortunate ones here that after eight years of a real difficult marriage my wife was diagnosed, has gone on with therapy and today we are both doing extremely well in our relationship together. Night and day from just two years ago. I don't want to go on about my situation because this is about you and yours. I can tell you my experience getting my wife to go for a diagnosis but I'll do it in a different way to give you some more confidence.

I go on a couple of different sites for people with BPD and converse on them with a lot of people and do a lot of PM conversations. In the course of the last year I've been asked this a few times and on three occasions I've talked with people who have been able to go forward and get their spouses to accept they have problems and to go for diagnosis and subsequent therapy. I'll give you the excerpts from my last experience with Scarlett, someone who I didn't know and got a hold of me with questions. It's a bit long but I hope it helps.

ADVICE NEEDED HERE:

I'm sorry for the inconvenience of this message first and foremost. I was reading up on a response to posts. I have followed you on this site for some time. You are so different from everyone else here and so helpful to the people here. You were giving such great advice on how to maintain a relationship with a victim of BPD and so forth. So I was hoping to ask for an inch of advice if you don't mind. As a very concerned friend I want to help my friend get help. Would it be wrong for me to inform him of his undiagnosed BPD condition? How would I even go about doing that without upsetting him or insulting him? I’ve read so much and followed so much of your stuff that I know that if anyone here knows an answer to this and how not to hurt him and get this done, it would have to be you. You’re wonderful to everyone here and it isn’t just me I’ve talked with a lot of the people and they all think the same about you. You’re exceptional. I’m hoping you can help me if it isn’t too much to ask.

Thanks Scarlett.

_____________________________________________________________________

My relpy to Scarlett:

I'm no expert Scarlett and I only know things from my own experience and reading a lot.

First let me say that I don't mind you messaging me at all. If I can help at all I'd really like to.

The only option you have to show him that he has difficulties is to sit in a really reasonable situation where he is set and ready to open up to you as a result of all the problems he has now (and has always experienced).Try to do a couple of online tests with him. Punch them up: test for Borderline Personality Disorder. There are simple short ones and some are longer and more detailed. Print out one of each and you might even want to remove the headers that identify it as questioning for BPD. If the time comes later and you’re successful you can talk about what it is then. Don't tell him what the tests are for and don't approach it about being about you or the relationship you share. Make it about his whole life growing up and how he feels about that. Ask him to relate the answers to his childhood and other relationships. Focusing on your relationship might not only put him off it might make him quite defensive and you need to let him know he can be vulnerable and trust you with his answers. Make it just about him and his feelings. Help him explain his answers and encourage him. Empathize with his difficulties as he talks about them. The best help always comes from the best listeners not the best doers or fixers.Be close with him and let him be close with the conversation. Feel for him and he will share his feelings with you.

This is exactly what I did with my wife and how I got her to recognize she had a life long problem and go in to get the required testing for a diagnosis. It took a couple of cancelations but she did finally go of her own will without me having to coerce or influence her. Like your boyfriend  has to fix himself so does my wife. I can’t fix her I can only support and carefully encourage her doing that.

If he's borderline he'll fail. Don't make huge notes, just take notes of fails with a mark so you're totally focused on listening. 5 out of the nine criteria is an indication that he MAY have the disorder. It's really not good to self-diagnose because the treatments for some disorders are so different from others. BPD has very specific treatments and designed only for that disorder.

In my wife's case she really opened up but she was really in a bad state of having hit the very bottom of a barrel in her life and our relationship. I don’t think there was anywhere remaining for her but up. She could not have been lower or felt lower about herself than she did at that time. When we were done and she totally failed the tests or passed them however you look at it, she realized that all her life she had these problems. When I told her what it was she said "It's exactly about me and how I feel – it’s as though someone looked into my life and wrote those questions about me…". That was enough for me to say maybe she should go for some testing, it would be so good for you to find out what the problem is and why you feel this way about yourself so we can both work on it and you can try to feel better about yourself and your life. I said nothing about me, us or our relationship. I made it totally about her and her feelings and made certain the entire conversations didn’t stray over to our situations or relationship.

If you decide to try this I wish you as much luck as I had with it Scarlett. I hope however it turns out for you Scarlett that you be careful and give this lots of thought, keeping in mind not just about him, but also what’s good and healthy for you in an emotional relationship or friendship. However I have to say I admire you for staying and trying to help him and not just abandoning him, he’s probably already got enough experience with that. You’re a good person but make sure you stay focused on being good to yourself as well.

All the best.

Rick

Rick

Thank you so much for the advice! He opened right up to me and he was really shocked that for once he was being understood... .or at least felt like it. He talked about the questions and how so many of them he could so relate to and talked about different things throughout growing up. I was really careful as you said not to make it at all about us or me but just about his feelings all his life in other situations. By the time I was done the second test he was so totally convinced that everything in the questions was as though someone had written them just about him.

I also took your advice and when I told him that it was a test for BPD I didn’t elaborate much on what it is or make out that it was a real bad mental illness. I’ve never seen a change like that in a person. He started to talk more and more about his past and problems and recognize he has always felt that way and had those same problems. Just asking the questions and sitting and listening to the answers was so important to him. He has never felt before like anyone listened to him or could understand what he was feeling. He realized himself that whatever this was that it was what his problem was.

He has arranged an appointment with a therapist the 21st. I told him that I was proud of him and that I'll continue to be his friend. I honestly don't know what I'm getting myself into, although I have been reading up on this a lot from the patient and partner's perspective. I've accepted that neither of us can fix one another. But it is okay to support someone just like you advice.

It's a scary feeling because I'm probably just a part of his cycle. As my best friend would say I'm the, "New car smell". In his life. So I'm preparing for the worse... .it's only a matter of time. I thank you for your great advice. I hope things only improve for you and your wife.

Scarlett

I don't know if you have the ability to get into the position of speaking to your wife in a ways that she might open up about her past with you or not but if you can manage that situation it might just work for you as well. I hope so and I hope that this might help you accomplish this for you and your wife.

Stay posting and let us know how you make out. There are a lot of people here that do care.