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Author Topic: I saw her last night on a date  (Read 494 times)
In Pain
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« on: September 14, 2014, 09:25:23 AM »

My borderline doesn't act like your borderline... .Why ?

After last night, I'm starting to wonder.

I understand that every person is different but either I'm confused, disappointed or just wrong.

Please please, don't tell me I'm lucky she isn't stalking me, calling me etc. Please stay on "MY " point for this thread.

Thx

I was getting ready to break 8 weeks of NC this week to call her, now I can't after this past Saturday nite.

To recap:

18 month relationship

She is mid 40's

I don't know if she was ever diagnosed with BPD, but I was convinced she was a borderline.

I have experienced many different traits:

Splitting, clinging, adulation, and devaluation, uncontrolled raging, substance abuse, impulsive behaviour... cheating, lying, reckless driving, high risk behaviour, anxiety attacks, cutting, childhood up bringing that was perfect for abandonment issues.

She hated when I would go out of town for business, accusing ME of cheating, projection of her issues on me.

Push pull, push pull.

She ended the relationship abruptly.

She has shown 7 out of 9 symptoms and fits the BPD diagnosis perfectly.

I am convinced that she was a classic borderline with very large abandonment issues.

She seemed to be a text book borderline. No doubts. Except... .No stalking, no texting or calling, no recycle yet in the 8 weeks. I know it's still early for a recycle.

The truth is, I want her back and I have been waiting to contact her as I work on myself. I have also been holding out hoping she contacts me.

We live in a small community. Twice, within 30 days after we broke up, while she was out with a date, and me with no date, she found herself in the same local watering hole as me.

I never approached her. Upon seeing me, she bolted out of the club... .with date in tow.

But tonight was different.

Tonight, she stood her ground with a date, same as me. No drama, no leaving... .She stayed on her side of the bar for 45 minutes and then she and her date and group left to go to another bar.

FYI... .The guy was in no way as tall, good looking and all the other BS as me, not that that's really important. But it's how we guys measures things.

It's not like she was dating a "better" guy than me.

She is not stalking me, or hasn't called me or text since the break up.

It seems that she said that she is done with the relationship... ., and that's that.

Bottom line is that I still want to see her and I was thinking that SHE would come back in contact.

My questions:

Why didn't she bolt out of there as usual ?

Is she totally over me ?

Her friends I'm sure gave her encouragement  to stay. My friends sure held my hand, seeing I was on edge, with her in the same room.

Yes, she may have had as much resolve as me.

She's NOT a borderline ?

Then what is she with all those characterises ... .even the cutting ?

It was actually carving. She carved her name in her skin.

Is she still a borderline, just without the  contacting, stalking and recycle trait ?

Look... .The bottom line is, all the things she did to me in the past DID  happen, so she does have emotional issues.

She is not normal.

Your thoughts

Thx
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maxsterling
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« Reply #1 on: September 14, 2014, 09:59:16 AM »

Why didn't she bolt out of there as usual ?

Could be a number of reasons.  Maybe the emotional anguish with seeing you is gone.  Maybe she *did* want to see you and make you jealous.  Maybe it was her friends' push.

Is she totally over me ?

If she has BPD, the reality is here she was never really into you in the same way you and I understand that term.

Not all borderlines recycle and stalk.  It's not a defining characteristic of this disorder. 
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formflier
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« Reply #2 on: September 14, 2014, 02:28:08 PM »

 

Hopefully some math whiz can help us "do the math"

How many different combinations of traits are there that make up a "bordreline".

That assumes a diagnosis... but let's assume that for sake of argument.

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christoff522
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« Reply #3 on: September 14, 2014, 03:03:25 PM »

My borderline doesn't act like your borderline... .Why ?

After last night, I'm starting to wonder.

I understand that every person is different but either I'm confused, disappointed or just wrong.

Please please, don't tell me I'm lucky she isn't stalking me, calling me etc. Please stay on "MY " point for this thread.

Thx

I was getting ready to break 8 weeks of NC this week to call her, now I can't after this past Saturday nite.

To recap:

18 month relationship

She is mid 40's

I don't know if she was ever diagnosed with BPD, but I was convinced she was a borderline.

I have experienced many different traits:

Splitting, clinging, adulation, and devaluation, uncontrolled raging, substance abuse, impulsive behaviour... cheating, lying, reckless driving, high risk behaviour, anxiety attacks, cutting, childhood up bringing that was perfect for abandonment issues.

She hated when I would go out of town for business, accusing ME of cheating, projection of her issues on me.

Push pull, push pull.

She ended the relationship abruptly.

She has shown 7 out of 9 symptoms and fits the BPD diagnosis perfectly.

I am convinced that she was a classic borderline with very large abandonment issues.

She seemed to be a text book borderline. No doubts. Except... .No stalking, no texting or calling, no recycle yet in the 8 weeks. I know it's still early for a recycle.

No she is acting like a typical borderline. Mine used to visit the shop where I work all the time, then she finished me and never came in again (until very recently). Yes as someone said the anguish is gone, if she finishes you it means that she has already begun the process of devaluing you, and seeing you on a more platonic level. Basically one foot out of the relationship. So she is weeks, maybe months ahead of you in recovery. Also if she is with someone else she is idealizing them. Also the relationship seems to have ended suddenly but it hasn't for her. She would have been planning it for a while. She IS a textbook BPD. The folks getting stalked and calls etc ended the relationship and thats why thats happening, but as soon as they take her back they'll get dumped.


Excerpt
The truth is, I want her back and I have been waiting to contact her as I work on myself. I have also been holding out hoping she contacts me.

Best advice anyone can give you here is this: stop waiting for her. If you're waiting for her you're NOT working on yourself.

Excerpt
We live in a small community. Twice, within 30 days after we broke up, while she was out with a date, and me with no date, she found herself in the same local watering hole as me.

I never approached her. Upon seeing me, she bolted out of the club... .with date in tow.

But tonight was different.

Tonight, she stood her ground with a date, same as me. No drama, no leaving... .She stayed on her side of the bar for 45 minutes and then she and her date and group left to go to another bar.

FYI... .The guy was in no way as tall, good looking and all the other BS as me, not that that's really important. But it's how we guys measures things.

It's not like she was dating a "better" guy than me.

A BPD isn't bothered about looks, a BPD is bothered about having someone to worship (idealize).

Excerpt
She is not stalking me, or hasn't called me or text since the break up.

It seems that she said that she is done with the relationship... ., and that's that.

Bottom line is that I still want to see her and I was thinking that SHE would come back in contact.

I think that when a BPD leaves, its going to be extremely hard to get that idealization back. My (formerly mine) BPD said to me today that "when you're in love you sorta ignore all the bad things and just focus on the good". Then about 10 minutes later she mentioned she had a big love-bite (hickey) on her neck that really hurts. This basically explains BPD love in a nutshell - idealization and sex. But you have to understand, they're crazy. You can manipulate that crazy, but not when you're weak, and sorry inpain but you are weak right now. This is what I've been trying to get you to see. BPDs adore narcissists, you have narcissistic tendencies as do I, as do quite a lot of people here - and thats not a bad thing, but when she sees you weak and shivering and freaking out, well she ain't gonna go for that. You need to be more puffed up, head straight, feeling damn good about yourself. Until then theres no way this girl is gonna interested in anything more than being a friend.

Excerpt
My questions:

Why didn't she bolt out of there as usual ?

She's idealizing someone else now so she doesn't have to worry about dealing with anything connected to you

Excerpt
Is she totally over me ?

Yes... kinda, but it doesn't mean she won't impulsively contact you in the future.

Excerpt
Her friends I'm sure gave her encouragement  to stay. My friends sure held my hand, seeing I was on edge, with her in the same room.

Nope, as sad as it is to say, she wouldn't have been bothered too much by it. Yes she would have said something, but it wouldn't have been the same as your reaction, notice you said "on edge", YES, you were afraid of her. Thats a typical response to a BPD.

Excerpt
Yes, she may have had as much resolve as me.

You're trying to define the situation that she's in from your own perspective. Trying to empathize with crazy. Let me tell you something, if you got her back, you wouldn't want her.

Excerpt
She's NOT a borderline ?

Well, she's with a new guy just a few weeks after you've broken up. She doesn't react in any way, shape, or form to your presence. She's basically dumped you and just ignored you - and you're here on this forum looking for answers. Yep, she's a borderline.

Excerpt
Then what is she with all those characterises ... .even the cutting ?

It was actually carving. She carved her name in her skin.

Typical BPD trait. Others are anorexia, heavy drinking, drugs, and chatting a lot of ___ very quickly, also finding validation in others. Like "they make me happy" instead of just being happy from your own self.

Excerpt
Is she still a borderline, just without the  contacting, stalking and recycle trait ?

No she has that trait, but it's reserved for people who reject them, not people that they reject. If this new guy dumped her, she would stalk him, but not because of him, because he dumped her. Also, she probably WILL contact you.

Excerpt
Look... .The bottom line is, all the things she did to me in the past DID  happen, so she does have emotional issues.

She is not normal.

Your thoughts

Thx

Good, go with your gut!
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In Pain
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« Reply #4 on: September 14, 2014, 05:03:29 PM »

From my previous posting on my contacting her to re-engage ... .From what you

now saw of last nights event... .

Text her a hello ?

Call her this week to have lunch ?

Wait 2 weeks and try any of the above ?

Just F- ing leave it alone !  But I'm kind of determined to cause myself more pain !

( I know you will suggest this option )

Thx
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123Phoebe
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« Reply #5 on: September 14, 2014, 09:02:52 PM »

Just F- ing leave it alone !  But I'm kind of determined to cause myself more pain !

( I know you will suggest this option )

Thx

Well, if you're determined to do this, then you might just get your wish = borderline behaviors coming your way.  Will they be real or perceived?  She's seeing someone else?  You were both in the same bar for 45 minutes yet pretended not to notice each other?  How are you sure her group left to go to another bar?

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waverider
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If YOU don't change, things will stay the same


« Reply #6 on: September 14, 2014, 09:28:15 PM »

The behavior is typical borderline. Black and white. She has closed your book. 8 weeks may as well be 8 years as far as she is concerned.

Not impossible that she might open the book again, if it suits her, but odds are she wont, and she wont have it half open wondering "what if".

Think of a pwBPDs life as a series of open and shut books rather than a series of chapters that flow in an evolutionary way.

My observations from your postings so far is that "if' for some reason she does recycle, your desperation, for want of a better word, to regraft, will leave you vulnerable and you will get trashed and trodden on. You are not mentally equipped at the moment to deal with the whole behavioral cycle of BPD.

You have to really focus more on simply getting on with your life and replace what was with what can be. I believe you need recovery in order to find better clarity.
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Skip
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« Reply #7 on: September 15, 2014, 08:38:14 AM »

In pain,

Seeing her on a date has to be hard.  We all feel for you.

Shifting this to you for a moment.

You don't want to lose your head right now.  That is not going to help you get her back or move on.  You have separation anxiety.  It's not uncommon when a relationship goes bad.  Before you do anything more, you need to deal with the anxiety.  As long as you are in a high anxiety state you are going to think and do non-constructive things.

Have you had a meds evaluation?  :)o you have anti-anxiety medication?  Are you still seeing  therapist?  If not, it's probably time to look into it.  If you call a suicide hotline, they will know where you can go today to get an low cost med evaluation and script.

What do you think?

OK, back to the topic at hand.

1. Waverider is right.  This relationship probably didn't end abruptly. It most likely went down in stages. You can't predict her behavior or thoughts using a "BPD map". The DSM is group statistically relevant symptoms - it very sophisticated - but no where near as sophisticated as you are seeing it.  You can't predict her behavior or thoughts using a "BPD map".  

2. There is another guy involved. This has to play out on its own. This could play out a lot of ways and whatever you do is only a partial influence on that.  :)ating advisors will tell you this is a waiting game now and being needy (or falsely aloof) is the worst thing to do.  You've stayed away and given her space - this is the best thing.

3. She responded to your note a few weeks ago. She said "I'm glad you know what you want and don't want in a relationship.  We had some good times and some bad times, but the reality is you never committed to me or the relationship."   Before you fire off another, which probably is not a good idea, it might help to share and break down the last one.  Her words were "you're not hearing/connecting with me".

To understand what is going on in their head, I must come to a logical conclusion. And then reverse my thinking 180 degrees, and accept something that makes no sense to a normal person.  FYI... .The space shuttle flies in space... .Upside down and backwards !

3. This is not bizzaro world.  It will help to write more respectfully and think of her as a human being and a women.She is. I read your history and if you are subconsciously conveyed any of this, its an uber-turnoff.

The problem with my letter is she can't show it to any friends because a normal girl would say: This man loves you, this man respects you, don't throw this letter or this man in the garbage just yet. She also can't paint me black if a friend sees the letter.  She received the letter at 10 am. A normal person would read the letter, at least twice, digest it and then respond. She responded 15 minutes after signing for the letter.

4. A "normal" person, any person, can read and assess a post break-up letter in 15 minutes.  Sure, if it was a real estate contract it would take more time, but this is a matter of the heart.  And, I wouldn't assume that her friends would advise her any differently than she is advising herself - they are mostly in tune with what she is saying, not what you wrote...  This type of thinking will not  you.

My suggestion is to step back right now (get on terra firma), organize your posting/thoughts a bit more, and start inventorying with the members here what happened in the relationship, how you reacted, and try to understand it. What did the letter say last week?  What is the back story on her comments about commitment?  You mentioned couples counseling - what happened there?

I'd really suggest setting aside for a week (and I really mean set aside) and have a moratorium on planning of your next action, text, email.  Let this go right now.  A "have a happy life" text will not buy you anything.

You need to rethink this on a lot of levels.  :)oing more of the same is going to get you more of the same.
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maxsterling
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« Reply #8 on: September 15, 2014, 09:00:21 AM »

Think of a pwBPDs life as a series of open and shut books rather than a series of chapters that flow in an evolutionary way.

An excellent analogy.  From what I have seen pwBPD don't learn from their experiences.  IN the dating world, that means they never grow, and when one relationship fails they just try the same exact thing again with a new person.  And when/if that fails, they may recycle, claim they learned, but obviously have learned nothing.  It's not just dating relationships - it happens with friendships and jobs, too. 
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formflier
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« Reply #9 on: September 15, 2014, 09:29:50 AM »

   Doing more of the same is going to get you more of the same.

Critical point! 

I don't think Skip is talking about texting instead of sending a letter... .I think he is thinking about a fundamental shift in the way you approach the issue. 

Just like you suggested she should think through the letter before sending a response... .a fundamental shift in how to approach anything in life needs to be well thought through. 

Hence... then advice from some to take a few days and to set things aside.

Hang in there!  Sorting all this out can be hard... .   
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