another annoying decision with BPD exH...

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

So some of you know that my uBPD exHusband is difficult to coparent with and gets angry and scolding, and makes me nervous since he takes our 2 young toddlers every other weekend.  (Luckily he takes them to his parents' house, but still.)  He may be bipolar too.  He recently had two episodes where he kept scolding me and being cruel in front of the kids.  In the last few weeks he has calmed down.  I think recent court stuff had triggered him, but it's over for now though and I think he's getting calmer.  

Anyway, each year the one thing we do together is take the kids trick or treating.  They enjoy it, and I feel like it's only an hour or two so it allows them to be with both parents without my giving up a whole lot.  ExH mentioned doing it this year, and I'm fine with that.

However, it's on Friday this year.  His parenting time is normally noon Saturday to evening Sunday.  He asked to take them on Friday night instead becaue he'll be in our area anyway.  This does make a lot of sense logistically.  Also would give me a rare extra night off.  I generally always have the kids on Fri night.

However, right now is a time when I'm trying to set boundaries and stick with the parenting plan because it's less disruptive.  I fear that if I let this go, then he may later ask again to take them on a Friday and say "Well, we did it after Halloween and it was fine."  This has happened with other boundaries I've loosened.  Also, if he acts up again in the next few months and I have to go to a judge to ask for supervised visitation or something else, maybe the judge would ask why I gave him an extra night if I worry about him so much.  (It's really not much more time since they'll probably sleep in the car that night and he'll mostly just have them a few extra hours Sat morning, but on paper it may look that way).

My plan is to say no and that I want to stick with the parenting plan.  It seems a shame, petty, and silly I have to make him come down here the next morning after he'll be here the night before.  But it's just too soon after that other stuff happened and I'm trying to keep boundaries.  (I thought of asking him to bring the kids back earlier on Sun, but it will remain that I let him take them an extra overnight.  I can also stress that this is a special circumstance and not something to do routinely, and he will understand that.  Just not sure if that's a good idea.)  Normally I would be happy to do this, but it seems soon.

I don't think there's any safety danger in him taking them that night.  He may be more pissed off if he has to come back Sat.

What do y'all think - stick to the parenting plan 100 percent right now, or am I being too severe by not allowing a slight deviation?

[momtara]

So some of you know that my uBPD exHusband is difficult to coparent with and gets angry and scolding, and makes me nervous since he takes our 2 young toddlers every other weekend.  (Luckily he takes them to his parents' house, but still.)  He may be bipolar too.  He recently had two episodes where he kept scolding me and being cruel in front of the kids.  In the last few weeks he has calmed down.  I think recent court stuff had triggered him, but it's over for now though and I think he's getting calmer.  

Anyway, each year the one thing we do together is take the kids trick or treating.  They enjoy it, and I feel like it's only an hour or two so it allows them to be with both parents without my giving up a whole lot.  ExH mentioned doing it this year, and I'm fine with that.

However, it's on Friday this year.  His parenting time is normally noon Saturday to evening Sunday.  He asked to take them on Friday night instead becaue he'll be in our area anyway.  This does make a lot of sense logistically.  Also would give me a rare extra night off.  I generally always have the kids on Fri night.

However, right now is a time when I'm trying to set boundaries and stick with the parenting plan because it's less disruptive.  I fear that if I let this go, then he may later ask again to take them on a Friday and say "Well, we did it after Halloween and it was fine."  This has happened with other boundaries I've loosened.  Also, if he acts up again in the next few months and I have to go to a judge to ask for supervised visitation or something else, maybe the judge would ask why I gave him an extra night if I worry about him so much.  (It's really not much more time since they'll probably sleep in the car that night and he'll mostly just have them a few extra hours Sat morning, but on paper it may look that way).

My plan is to say no and that I want to stick with the parenting plan.  It seems a shame, petty, and silly I have to make him come down here the next morning after he'll be here the night before.  But it's just too soon after that other stuff happened and I'm trying to keep boundaries.  (I thought of asking him to bring the kids back earlier on Sun, but it will remain that I let him take them an extra overnight.  I can also stress that this is a special circumstance and not something to do routinely, and he will understand that.  Just not sure if that's a good idea.)  Normally I would be happy to do this, but it seems soon.

I don't think there's any safety danger in him taking them that night.  He may be more pissed off if he has to come back Sat.

What do y'all think - stick to the parenting plan 100 percent right now, or am I being too severe by not allowing a slight deviation?

[Swiggle]

That is a tough one and I've been there with both my ex and my DH's ex. You have valid fears about all choices but try not to "what if" every scenario, I know easier said than done. Look at this purely from the "what is best for the kids" in this one situation. Would it be better for them to go home with you and sleep or to go home with dad and sleep. Don't think about it as a night off for you or extra time with dad, think about it from that perspective and your answer may be easier. Then whatever you decide you know that you made a decision based on what is best for them. If you that ever came up in court and a judge said something, your position would be at the time given the current circumstances, I did what was best for them, not dad, not me but them.

[Ishenuts]

A few things I would consider is how far is he traveling to come trick or treating? Do you have a routine after trick or treating - going through their candy, etc. Your children are young so what time would they be done trick or treating? They will probably so pumped up that getting them to sleep will be difficult (at least it was when my kids were the same age as yours - mine are now 12yo twins). AND he gets them at noon? That's pretty late. We do our exchange at 8 am because the uNPDexh works EO Sat morn.

I'd be inclined to say, "No" unless he is driving a long distance. Would you let him have them if he were coming in on a Friday night for a school event, or a sporting event? (I know they aren't there yet, but something to consider if he's inclined to use precedence as an argument)

I hate holidays like these. My uNPDexh has to be always involved. Halloween has fallen on his time for the last 3 years since the divorce. We usually trick or treat with the kid's friends and a few parents - which I am friends with and they can't stand him, so it's very uncomfortable for everyone. I just hope it's winding down - they are 12 yo! When do they stop trick or treating? He hates when I am around on his time, but I'm just hanging with my friends and our kids, who happen to be in costumes!

[momtara]

Thanks - the nice thing about this board is that I get ideas and perspectives I never would have thought of.  What IS best for the kids?  They tend to stay up late, so I don't think it would be bad for them go sleep in their dad's car on the way to his house and then get to sleep late the next morning.  He's 45 minutes away.  it's only one day.  So I don't think that makes a big diff.

In the long run it's better for them to have consistency in their routines.  I think letting him take them will set a bad precedent.  Yes, next time he may say he has to come pick up his dry cleaning on Friday so by the way can he take the kids that night.  Unfortunately I have to think about these things with him. 

I guess the whole thing would be avoided if I don't take them T-or-T'ing with ex at all!  But the kids loved it last year.  Geez, try to do something nice. 

[Swiggle]

I don't think one time is a precedent but I do know that give an inch and they might take a mile. Sometimes I think though giving a little can show flexibility. I also always try and put myself in their shoes, how would I want them to look at the situation if it were reversed. If he is coming for the Trick or Treating and and driving 45 min, to then have to turn around and do it again 12 hours later I would be inclined to make the exception but of course I don't know your ex. 

[Ishenuts]

Momtera - if he will use the precedence arguement - be careful. This what my uNPDexh did. Our first summer of the divorce, he planned his vacation flights so that he needed to have the children during my parenting time. I kept asking for his itinary. I finally got it about 2 weeks before his vacation was to start. We went to the parenting coordinator and he lied (surprise!) and told her we had discussed it and I agreed... .not! So I said, "OK (the PC was believing him) instead of getting the children at 8am to start my vacation (i was driving, not flying) I'd like them at 7 pm the prior day so they'd have an extra night at our rental cottage" So the PC that was fair. He freaked out! She's not flying, she doesn't need them early, etc. Apparently, the "best interest of the kids" is to have as much time as possible with him.

So his next vacation, he tries to pull the same thing! Not remembering that I was basically coerced into agreeing the last time. I said, "No". Back to the PC. We worked out another deal.

The vacation after THAT one, he tries it AGAIN! I said, "No, and I am not going back to the PC on this. It is my parenting time and you can arrange your flights on your time. Getting to their destination (Disney Dad - all vacations are either FL, Aruba, Atlantis) a few hours later, when they are going to be there 7 days, doesn't seem to really affect their vacation. But I'm sure he'll keep trying it, and I'll keep saying, "No".

I never ask for a change in parenting time because I know the first time I do, I will be selling my soul to the devil, and we'll start the vacation stuff all over again. It's not worth it.

[momtara]

Yup.

My therapist said I need to focus on myself more - what is healthiest for me?  That way, I can be the best mom.  I'm the sane on in the relationship.

So I told him I want to stick to the parenting plan.  I was flexible in the past and it only caused problems.

We are starting with a PC next month.  The last one I had was 100 percent on my side and we switched because he had such a hard time.  I'm hoping this new one won't be so diplomatic that she lets him off the hook all the time.

Really, I'd love a Friday night off for a change!  But I want to wait until things get more stable.

Thanks for all of your input.

Ishenuts, that is ANNOYING.  These guys are so manipulative!  And we look bad if we try to point it out.  And saying No makes us look bad and feel bad.