Can't detach when his ex harasses me. Not sure if we can survive this

[Crayfog]

Hubby has an uPBDex-wife. I knew something was off early on. If she was happy, she would call all day long to "chat" and the chats would be much longer than any chats with my ex-husband. Then when she was upset, she would blow his phone up (twenty phone calls and 60 or so text messages) with threats of losing custody. Once she found out I was in the picture, her jealousy got insane. She accused me of stealing her children. Then the calls and texts started coming to my phone.

I've read two BPD books. I'm on these forums everyday studying what other BPDs do and how people respond/deal/prevent.

But no matter how hard I try, when she threatens me for not doing her bidding, or blows up my phone, or cyber stalks me and claims I'm a bad influence, I can not reconcile the fact that she's sick. I posted about this next part but didn't get much feedback likely because I didn't put a goal.

She has now cyber stalked my ex-husband to try and stir things about the welfare of my son.

How on earth do I do this? There's no light at the end of the tunnel because she has a live in boyfriend. He sees her doing all this and he's not concerned that she's so jealous of her ex-husband.

I really want to stand up for myself. I want a protective order to keep my son safe and leave my ex-husband out of it.

But beyond all that... .If I can't figure out how to detach when she rains down flaming arrows of hate, my marriage won't survive. I can't control my hubby. Though he has (since me) made drastic changes to set up boundaries. I think she can sense that the boundaries started when she started harrasing me. He used to just take it for the sake of the kids.  And I certainly can't control his crazy ex. So how do I walk the tight rope of protecting MY family while not letting her manipulations affect me. I feel utterly violated.

[Thunderstruck]

I've been in a similar situation. I blocked DH's uBPDx and then she would call me from another number. I've gotten emails, messages on facebook, harassment on pinterest... .everything. Now my privacy settings are as high as they can get and she is blocked everywhere (well, the accounts I know of are blocked anyway). Early on I had the police call and tell her to stop contacting me (it was excessive, she'd call over and over and over). Then it didn't quite stop so I had a lawyer friend of mine send her a cease and desist. For the most part that got her to stop.

I can tell you, there will be times when it gets really really hard. When you and DH set up boundaries and stick to them, it makes things easier.

BPDs tend to make claims on a lot of things (we've been accused of everything under the sun) but the people who know you will know that it's all crazy talk. In the end keep being yourself and it'll shine through.

[Thunderstruck]

Oh I forgot to say... .It's hard to get a restraining order unless her harassments are threatening. Check the laws in your area, there might be something about cyber harassment. I think those are difficult to pursue, though.

[Crayfog]

The only thing I can prove at this point is her texting and calling too many times. At least I have a record of that. We were advised to tell her that gutter contact of myself or my ex husband or anything to do with my son will be harassment and after that we will call the police. But it's a slippery slope. She punishes the children for any unhappiness we cause her by not giving in to her demands. And yes the accusations are insane. To someone with a rational kind, it would never occur to me to pull serious accusations out of thin air. I'm more worried about the people hearing them, if they're not used to this kind of junk.

I'm SO sorry you've gone through the same. You just be one strong cookie! Does your husband understand when it upsets you? Mine tries to but he really wants me to get over it. I honestly think he doesn't realize how bad this all is. 

[Nope]

I guess one important thing to remember is that she is her own worst enemy. This will become especially apparent when she starts to actually try to accomplish a goal. If her goal is to cause discord between your ex and you, then she's going to have to get him to agree to hear her out. Yes, she will be charming at first. She'll probably be very convincing... .at first. But look at you! You are contemplating if you can even stay in a loving marriage if it means having to have any contact with this person. This is how nearly everybody who has constant ongoing contact with a BPD person feels. And your ex will end up feeling the same way. You may have no choice but to let this play out. It sounds to me from reading your post that he really wants nothing to do with any of it. He may change his position for a little while, at first, but DH's ex simply won't be able to hold it together. Once your ex sees what she really is for himself he'll quickly run the other way. And once that happens you'll never have to deal with this aspect again.

Sometimes the only way out is through.

[Crayfog]

The good part is that he and I worked HARD to be amicable and friendly. Something she just can't possibly understand: putting someone else's needs first. And he has said he wants nothing to do with it. I'm more concerned about a letter full of convincing accusations. He's a lot better but he's kind of on high-alert all the time anyway. Diffusing that will take a lot of time and effort and frankly I'm worn out. It's hard enough parenting her kids and managing the the way they act out her abuse. It took me about six hours to let this one go and say I've done all I can do. I let ex-husband know that she's trouble and tried to move on.

Tell me if I was overreacting by feeling violated though. Hubby thinks it should be water off a duck's back, especially with all the research. But it really got to me that she will never stop. And for the record, she cheated to leave the marraige, had several boyfriends, now has a live in boyfriend yet she treats me like I'm the one that wrecked their home. I came on the scene later. I should be able to file the nasty accusations away under "BPD cray cray"... .But I cant. I keep reading about people dating a BPD who can't see beyond reacting and I'm totally one of them only it's THIS. I'm not even in a relationship with her. (Thank GOD.)

[ShaSha]

Crayfrog,

Please remember you are brave and it takes a lot of strength to withstand the gusty gales of BPD.  I have an eerily familiar situation with my SO's uBPDxw and a couple points I try to embrace when we're in the thick of the storm:

-embrace self care (I do pedicures, reading, writing, travel, massage, exercise, etc)

-we are non's and do not have to live in that body/mind/spirit/brain everyday

-she will NEVER accept responsibility for anything, therefore we do not try

-she will dig her own hole or hang herself so we just visualize the shovel or rope within her reach.

-her distorted views of reality are her own-so we let her own them (especially by not responding with any communication)

-we have a countdown until the last child is 18 (it's gone from 3 yrs to 2.5 months)

-I've learned the less attention, acknowledgement, interaction, response leads to her getting bored and moving on.  The contact (email, phone, mail) has diminished greatly as she does not receive a response to continue engagement.  She's also blocked on texts, phone calls, & recently all her email end up as junk or I mean in junk

-our situation has presented with extreme PAS in which we have done everything under the sun (minors attorney, custody eval, counseling, etc) before dropping the case for the sake of the child.  To combat PAS, we keep showing up to school activities, sports, banquets, daughter's work to  SHOW daughter we love & support her.  Also to dispel uBPDxw terrible words about either of us.

-I have learned the more I acknowledge/credit/ fear her-the worse I feel.  I now just look at her pathetic attempts as just that pathetic.  It's sad and I almost feel sorry for her because again I do not have to live that life.  I do not want to give her the power of a reaction from me because that means I acknowledge her when I dont.  She's just this this big storage unit my SO carries around until one day (in 2.5 months) he will be free to stop paying the bill, empty out, and leave it behind.

I have to be careful to not revel in her misfortunes as that's not who I am or what I want to be like.  I just relate it back to karma or the golden rule and leave the rest to the universe.  It will all come around in good time and I don't have to be any part of that! It will take care of itself!

Wishing you the best of luck-keep reading, keep writing, and see a good T if the first 2 stop working!

[livednlearned]

Tell me if I was overreacting by feeling violated though.

These relationships are very violating -- people with BPD have no regard for boundaries. They violate boundaries as a matter of course.

Was it hard for you that your ex said, "It should be water off a duck's back"?  Sometimes when someone doesn't fully validate you, it creates more emotions until that person pays attention. Any sentence with "You should feel... " can be invalidating. Then you feel your emotions getting stronger.

The other thing that often happens is that pwBPD are masters of triangulation. I found it was helpful to read up on Karpmann drama triangle so I didn't feel blindsided and off balance. It doesn't exactly stop the behaviors, but I'm wondering if it would help you and your ex see the dynamic as it affects you. If you step out of the dynamic, he has to readjust, and that might be what needs to happen so he doesn't funnel a lot of effort toward her and away from you.

N/BPDx taught me how much I hated dealing with direct consequences. It was a big eye opener for me when I had to see clearly how 1 + 1 = 2, and stop trying to make it anything except what it was. That's a big adjustment for codependent types like me.

Even though the Dance of Anger books aren't about BPD relationships, they do a good job explaining triangulation. I can't remember the author -- she also wrote Dance of Intimacy, and some other ones. They all have the same theme, based on family systems theory I think, but written for non-psychologists. Applied to your situation, it might mean that your ex can downplay the crisis because you are so helpful. When you feel upset and violated, he can shut down. When you step out of the triangle, he has to handle his own emotions and experience directly what you're going through. If that makes any sense.

EDIT: Crayfog, I just read your other post -- that's really complicated that your H's ex is contacting your ex. Yeesh.

Is she trying to undermine the custody you have of your own kids?

[Crayfog]

I hope I'm thanking you each enough for your support and advice. If I havent, THANK YOU!

ShaSha, since my first post I've been trying do more self care. Your list is awesome. Especially the acknowledgment/credit/fear. In my day to day life, I would never give her the time of day. And she stoops to pretty low levels to get me to lower myself to respond. And I do NOT want to revel. One part of me is of course grateful to her because I wouldn't have my family if her marraige hadn't worked. But the abuse makes me want to at least stand up and say it's abuse and I don't have to take it. So I'm working on just letting it pass. This helps, thank you!

LnL I can understand that they violate boundaries but then when it happens I get so angry. That's the bridge I'm trying to gap. I suppose it takes practice and time.

It was actually my hubby that wants me to not get bothered. He already feels like he and the kids are a burden with her manipulations on top. And I'm truly trying. I'm just not there yet.

I'm stepping back, so I hope that it's done. But now I'm thinking about the Karpmann affect with my hubby. I've done the majority of the research and learning. Including how best to make the kids feel loved. Though he's exceptiobal at that already. He wasn't good with boundaries with her. I think I need to step back there too. This is kind of a huge eye opener for me! I've given him some tools. I'm exhausted from trying to help. So if I step back maybe that whoosh will be my life force coming back?

Thank you LnL. You're such a benefit to this board.

[Crayfog]

Darn I just saw your edit! YES! This was one of the threats she lobbed at me when she made us double date to meet me. Had I known she was this abusive I would never have agreed. But anyway, in that meeting she inferred that if my ex knew how terrible her ex was, my ex wouldn't allow me to keep custody of my son. Basically to get me to move out. I don't know.

[Panda39]

Just wanted to say I can relate to it all the chaos, drama and lies   I've been with my SO with uBPDxw for 4.5 years.  I agree with much of what has already been said. 

When I arrived here I was VERY ANGRY at the ex... .I would just get cooled off and she'd do something else and BAM! I was pissed again... .from 0-100 in seconds!  This was not healthy for me or helpful for my SO.  I have come to realize I can't change the uBPDxw but I can change me and how I react.  I have been gradually letting go of her and the things she does and have found the anger goes with her.  By letting go of the anger I take away her power over me. 

Am I always successful? I would say improving... .I went from **May 2014 to last week keeping my anger at bay/under control.  I lost it last week over an interaction uBPDxw had with D14.  It was something that came as a complete surprise so maybe my guard was down. I also realized that when I feel that kind of anger an irrational anger at SO, D's and his ex it is a signal to me that I need to take some time for myself.  I told my SO that I will be using that feeling as a sign that I need to take a break, before I lose it   I'm learning about me, it's never to late to learn new things 

I guess what I am suggesting is besides trying to "solve" what the ex is doing, be mindful of your reactions, look inward too... .what are you doing or feeling? Can you try to react in a different way than you have been?  Experiment a little.

*************************************************************************************************************************

**During that time period... .uBPDxw did nothing for D14's birthday, sent D18 to the airport to wait for an airline ticket home that never came, disrupted Thanksgiving for SO, D14, D18, me, a friend of hers & her own family, did nothing for either daughter at Hanukkah, failed to pay D18's first semester of college so she could not return, D18 owes $15,000  , ex continues to live in hotels (lack of stability causing problems for D14), she has a Civil lawsuit against her re:money and a felony charge for a large bad check. Because of all of this both daughters have refused to see there mom for a month and a half which is cutting into the time my SO have together.

Both girls saw their mom briefly last week... .triggered D14 to make suicide comments (she's doing ok and dad upped the frequency of her therapy visits to weekly)- thats when I finally lost it.  Time for a break.  Took one last weekend spent a nice Saturday hanging out with my son and Sunday working on my volunteer sewing project for my local hospital.  Needed to get my head out of BPDland for awhile.

[livednlearned]

He wasn't good with boundaries with her. I think I need to step back there too. This is kind of a huge eye opener for me! I've given him some tools. I'm exhausted from trying to help. So if I step back maybe that whoosh will be my life force coming back?

In my current relationship it's kinda like a teeter totter. If I'm particularly wound up about something, I notice he gets super calm. If he gets wound up, I get calm. It's not exactly like taking turns, that's too organized   It's just something I notice, that if there is A Situation, one of us seems to volunteer to channel the tension while the other gets to cruise. I'm trying to volunteer less. When I do, and it's something actually in his wheelhouse, he usually steps in to have the feelings, which is appropriate.

Right now, the big issue is my son, who has this pretty successful rejection campaign going on. He won't come into the kitchen if SO is here, and would rather not eat than be in the same room. I'm trying to manage my feelings about this, but the truth is that it really upsets me. When I'm upset, SO is very soothing and understanding. But one time I relented and kinda sided with S13 on his experience. Then SO volunteered to feel some of the grief. Total teeter totter  

[bravhart1]

I'm living it. I'm so sorry, I too feel like I am not sure I can sacrifice my happiness due to this lunatic. I told my husband last week that the harsh reality is that his ex gets more time, energy and money on a weekly basis in my home than I do. That can not possibly work long term. We have been doing this for four years.

Here's the rub though, she is not allowed to call, email directly, or text. We have sent formal letters of request through our attorney that state we are represented by council and if she needs to communicate with us it needs to be through him. I can't imagine if she were still given carte blanch to keep up the constant verbal harassment. I would have been gone long ago.

She still manages to get her licks in, through the kids, therapists, school and online bullying. There is much written about me online on ugly websites that require no fact check, she uses them all. And yes she even tried to contact my ex, who called me and said she sounds crazy and was worried about her harming me. She wrongly assumed we were no longer friends.

I'm struggling with all of it, I am depressed, exhausted and out of answers. I don't want to hate anyone, I just want to be left alone. I have never responded in any way to her negative accusations, and there have been many. CPS, the police and the therapists all sympathize but she has a right to file whatever crazy charges she feels like.

I love my husband, but to be perfectly honest, my cheese is sliding off my cracker. Self care sounds like a great idea, but I spend all my time working to pay our attorney, on my days off I'm raising her child (full time) and frankly my depression at this whole situation has me wishing I could crawl under the bed, not go for a run.

There MUST be something we can do to rid these albatrosses from our lives, I didn't have a relationship with her, and my husband broke it off. Why can't she go terrorize someone else?

[Nope]

There MUST be something we can do to rid these albatrosses from our lives, I didn't have a relationship with her, and my husband broke it off. Why can't she go terrorize someone else?

She can't terrorize someone else because someone else doesn't have a kid with her with which to keep the door open. The kid's BPD mom has nobody in her life who will stay. Since I started checking in on her social media site two years ago, her friends list has never had more than 25 people and has undergone a 100% turnover multiple times over. She's had ongoing feud after ongoing feud with multiple family members and her entire family wrote her off completely six months ago. It was so bad they said they would accept not having a relationship with her children (two out of three of whom are now in my and their father's full time care) in order to avoid having to have anything to do with her. Yes, she's so horrible and toxic that the kids grandmother and great grandmother walked away from close relationships with the kids rather than deal with her!

So here we (step parents) are. We get the brunt of it because we won't walk away. And everything about us makes the BPD want us to leave. An example is the fact that we are living proof that our partner isn't such a bad person that nobody could have been expected to put up with them. Also, nothing shines more of a light on their inadequacies as a parent then having someone else around their kids doing it right.

And honestly, I think on some level they are just playing out the same crap with us that they do with *everyone* else. They, in their own mind, sick up for themselves and then everyone just walks away for no reason. My DH has a short lived marriage before me and when he told his BPD ex that she was a large part of what destroyed that marriage, she screamed that he was lying because she'd never done anything to the woman. Was his BPDex glad that new wife was gone? Absolutely. But I also fully believe that she doesn't think anything she did had anything to do with it. Why? Because all of her ploys for power and control so clearly stem from feeling powerless. Her own mother was right when she said on the stand in court that she's like a giant screaming, temper tantrum theowing toddler that can't be reasoned with.

My T says eventually I'll get better at detaching from what this woman does. She says I'll get more used to the random crazy attacks and over enough time I'll start to take them in stride because ultimately they don't matter. But in the meantime I shouldn't be hard on myself for getting so angry and frustrated .That's a truth I want to pass on.   

[Panda39]

Can I just say it really helps to know that I'm not the only one with a "crazy lady" in my life.  I wouldn't wish this on anybody but it is nice to know that you all are out there and get it. 

[Crayfog]

It's been a warzone from his ex so I haven't had a chance to respond. Panda, that's A LOT on your plate! Especially recently! Is everyone ok? Are you in therapy yourself? Sending good thought.

LnL that has to be breaking your heart. I'm so lucky, when I my son struggled I had a chat with his dad and asked him to let our boy know it was ok for him to love his step-dad too. And bless him, he did. I can't imagine what your son's dad is filling his head with. Or how that's all making him feel. I hope time and kindness will help him see what's real.

Braveheart I hear you on every level. With our latest smear/threat/bs campaign I'm really losing my zen. And center and calm. I don't have any words of wisdom as in asking myself most of the same questions. Just letting you know you're not alone.

Nope I need I to print this out! This whole thread actually! She's a terrible mother (I've heard from multiple family members and friends) and she has said since I entered the picture that I'm trying to steal her children. I'm not! I'm even nice about her to them. EVEN in the face of extreme abuse like yesterday. But I think you hit the nail on the head. She hates herself so much, she struggles to put the kids first (our biggest complaint) so a step-mom who gives the kids the kind of mothering they've never had would be extremely threatening. And I've also heard that they can feel crappy because they justified their behavior because our current husbands were somehow beneath them.

Then they upgraded. A perfect BPD storm.

Nope, I hope we all get better at detaching.

Panda "you are not aloone. I am here with youuuuu."

[Panda39]

Panda, that's A LOT on your plate! Especially recently! Is everyone ok? Are you in therapy yourself? Sending good thought.

Surprisingly I'm doing well.  Much of what has happened over the last 6 months did not come as a surprise.  The longer I've been with my SO and here on these boards I can better anticipate what types of things to expect. 

Not getting gifts or celebrating the girl's birthdays and Hanukkah doesn't surprise me (makes me sad for the girls) because mom's world is about her... .now if she spent Hanukkah with her family the girls would get all kinds of gifts because it would be all about how it reflected on uBPDmom.   

D18's college situation was D18's choice.  Her dad very clearly explained their financial situation but D18 really wanted to go to the school of her choice that she chose to believe mom's story about a "family trust".  This was a case of letting D18 learn the lesson the hard way (very sad and very difficult to let happen) but it was like a wind machine came and blew the FOG away.  She has minimal contact with uBPDmom via email only at this time.  D18 with the help of her dad landed on her feet and is currently going to our local State University temporarily while looking for a more permanent school to attend (that is affordable!).  Even if mom is incapable of learning D18 can!

Thanksgiving was lousy for both daughters so it bled over into dad and my Thanksgiving but again not completely unexpected.  UBPDmom has a history of screwing up travel plans, promising trips when she can't afford it etc.  This is also what happened when D18 spent the day at the airport waiting for the ticket home that never came.  (D18 has since expressed the desire to go to school where she can either take the bus home for the holidays or her dad can pick her up and not have to rely on mom for travel)

UBPDxw's legal troubles are the culmination of her own actions for years and the fact that she no longer has a codependent spouse trying to "manage" or "rescue" her.  She is now living the consequences of her own actions.  Again this affects her daughters especially D14 who is really sensitive to mom's instability. (again sad for daughters)

Now I've just realized something in writing this. Part of my anger... .besides the hurt she causes those around her (the people I care about!)... .is I really don't like surprise.  The most recent issue... .D14 being triggered by her mom to make suicidal statements was a surprise! 

The surprise of uBPDxw's crap is a trigger for my anger. Good realization  Recognizing this trigger will help me manage my anger.

What I've learned and/or strive for... .

Learn about BPD - what does it look like in general and in the specific person in your life

Set boundaries around you and the kids

Communicate primarily by email - keep interaction minimal when possible

Don't engage in the drama when avoidable/not required

Sometimes the kids will just have to negotiate stuff on their own - you can give advice if asked/validate/offer support/listen

Create an alternate reality for the kids - my SO has become the home for wayward girls    his daughters and their friends love hanging out at his place

Learn to detach/let go of trying to control it all/let the anger go - this one is tough/still struggle with this but have had some successes too.

Slow down, be mindful try to control those knee jerk reactions

As a couple be supportive and understanding of each other No one is perfect 

Ask for help when you or the kids need it/Vent - BPD Family  read, friends, family, church, therapist... .

Look at yourself/look inward What can you do better or differently? Why do you react the way you do? Are you part of the problem or part of the solution? 

Take a break!/Get back in touch with you. Like to hike? Go!  Want to read the latest novel? Do! Want to go out with "the girls"? Go!... .whatever floats your boat 

I know as soon as I post this I'll think of something else to add to my list but here it is.  Does anyone have anything else that they can add to the list that might help Crayfog?

Crayfog hang in there   It's a journey learning how to deal with this situation we have found ourselves in.  Some days are harder than others I know but some days are really sweet.

[NorthernGirl]

I thought I'd join in on this thread as I can relate. DH's uBPDex has caused so much chaos in our home that I wondered many times if I had made a big mistake in believing DH and I could make this work. For the most part, we have come through all of this since my SS's are all adults.

The issue for us is that the youngest SS20 has special needs, so DH has agreed to joint guardianship with his ex for this son. Basically he has agreed to tie himself to his ex for life, unless one of them fights for and wins to have sole guardianship or SS20 is assessed as not needing a guardian. Also, SS22 is an addict and his mom enables him and is currently on a big campaign to blame SS22's addiction and troubles on DH, SS24 and me. SS22 is glad to have an excuse. One of SS22's Ts said years ago that until SS22 comes to grips with his relationship with his mom, he will struggle with addiction. He is miles away from that.

I think one of the biggest challenges for me is seeing the harm she does to her children, and realizing that she isn't changing. So I have had to learn to let some things go. Sometimes I just imagine how hard it must be for her to live in such fear. And deep down I know her actions has absolutely nothing to do with me. I just need to remind myself once in awhile. 

Crayfog - I realize it is hard to imagine doing much self-care, but sometimes it is just means doing small things like having a few minutes of quiet time, talking with a friend, etc. I find posting on here and connecting with others who understood was a great help for me. 

I also suggest you carve out time for a date with your husband each week. When a coach first told me to do that, I couldn't imagine fitting that in our wild schedule. Now I am so thankful we made the effort. ":)ates" were often something simple -- a walk, a chat over coffee, etc. We had rules for our dates -- no talking about the kids, our schedule and especially no talking about his ex. Connecting helped us remember why we are together.

And believe it or not, I think some days having a common "enemy" helped us be a better team.

Take one day at a time.  Focus on what you can control. End each day reminding yourself about what your grateful for.