Ex says I betrayed him. Breakup my fault.

[Beach_Babe]

So my ex introduced me to several friends during a recent trip to Las Vegas. We stayed in touch. Ex did not like that and demanded I stop seeing them completely during the devaluation phase. "Them or me" he would say. He said it was betrayal. I made the mistake of confiding in one of these people, and they ended up showing him our chat conversations. My fault I know. I was just so heartbroken, with no one to talk to. My family and friends are just so sick of hearing about this. Since then this person has taken it upon themselves to act as an intermediary,  to make us friends. This has made the last 2 recycles end within 24 hours. This is the same friend I asked to forward  my "goodbye" letter (to which ex asked him to pass along the message "good riddance" Fast forward a few days and ex meets up with mutual friend for drinks. Mutual friend texts and says ex tried to call me but my number was blocked. I unblocked it and mutual friend calls from his phone (I had no idea they were together) and hands ex his phone. Of course ex was nice and said I could call him the next day... .I did and the phone was blocked.  No response to text or email either. Mutual friend then says ex says to call him a few days later and he will give me closure. I call, and you guessed it no answer. I feel like a fool. Then the mutual friend admits that night he badgered ex to talk to me "because you deserve closure." I feel humiliated.  Mutual friend is never blamed at all for any of this though ex blames everything on me. Now I feel even worse. Can the damage be fixed? Maybe I did betray my ex and should be shunned. I don't know anymore. I get no response to the email or text I sent since apologizing.

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[fromheeltoheal]

Is this mutual 'friend' really a friend?  Doesn't sound like you can trust him.  Anyway, you might want to read up on triangulation, where the introduction of a third person into a relationship changes the dynamic, seems to be happening here.  Not that you asked, but to me both of these guys need to go; decide what behaviors you are willing to tolerate in your life and enforce it.  Take care of you!

[raisins3142]

Are these mutual friends men?  How often were you speaking to them?  When you were seeing them, was it by yourself?

Only the most enlightened men like it when their girlfriend spends alone time in private with newly acquired male friends, especially if said male friends are single, attractive, and not the most trustworthy type.

I feel like you were very terse in describing these new friendships.

In other words, your exbf might have a point, even a blind squirrel and a potential BPD finds a "nut" or bit of reasonableness from time to time.

[raisins3142]

Nevermind, read more closely.  It was a guy.

If I introduced my gf to a male friend and she started talking to and seeing him regularly when I was not around then I would not like it.

Deep down, most men are like this, if they care for their gf that is.  However, men aren't always encouraged to honestly express things like this and it is called insecurity or something, when in fact the insecurity is a natural and expected byproduct of the other person's actions.

[fromheeltoheal]

Deep down, most men are like this, if they care for their gf that is.  However, men aren't always encouraged to honestly express things like this and it is called insecurity or something, when in fact the insecurity is a natural and expected byproduct of the other person's actions.

And the girl has a responsibility too.  It's best to love someone in such a way that they feel free, and treating someone like a possession doesn't cut it, but it's easy to do if a man is feeling insecure in the relationship.  On the other hand, if their bond is strong and there's lots of trust, what she does and who she does it with won't be an issue.  It's about paying attention and considering needs, both ways.

[raisins3142]

Deep down, most men are like this, if they care for their gf that is.  However, men aren't always encouraged to honestly express things like this and it is called insecurity or something, when in fact the insecurity is a natural and expected byproduct of the other person's actions.

And the girl has a responsibility too.  It's best to love someone in such a way that they feel free, and treating someone like a possession doesn't cut it, but it's easy to do if a man is feeling insecure in the relationship.  On the other hand, if their bond is strong and there's lots of trust, what she does and who she does it with won't be an issue.  It's about paying attention and considering needs, both ways.

Sorry, totally disagree.

Not wanting your girlfriend to do something like go to a guy's house and watch movies alone is not possessiveness.  It is expecting them to understand the reality of the majority of heterosexual dynamics.  A perfectly secure man can be made insecure by thoughtless actions.  People that care about their relationship and partner do not put themselves in situations which unnecessarily increase the odds of the relationship ending or have a good chance of giving a reasonable person the wrong idea or make them insecure.

You can talk about trust, but people that are trustworthy and want to show that simply do not do things like go to the movies alone with a newly acquired friend of the preferred sex.  It has nothing to do with insecurity.

Anyways, those are my boundaries they don't have to be anyone else's, but I simply disagree with your characterization of them.  I will not date anyone who thinks that is a good idea.

[Beach_Babe]

Hi. The male mutual friend is gay. He has no interest in me whatsoever. Lol. Ex knows this. Mutual friend did introduce me to another friend though, a female his best friend. I first met her on the Vegas trip and admittedly was not in the best mood because ex hit on her in front of me the entire time. Later when I started talking to mutual friend, both he and the girl later came to visit me after my heart surgery. Ex refused to even take my calls. Mutual friend called when he was in town a few weeks later with his boyfriend for  his best friend (the girls) wedding and suggested we all meet up for lunch. I accepted stupid I guess but I was just so in the dumps. It was nice feeling included. My ex only sent 2 emails when I had surgery, accepted no calls. Not even a card. When I had a seizure a few months before and asked for ex to call me he called and ripped into me for 2 hours what a piece of s^^& I am for bothering him (because of course he had something better). He called me a big baby for crying about that and said it was no big deal grow up. Ex made sure I couldn't come see him in January before my surgery either.  I had a plane ticket , (we live on different ends of the country) and he announced a few days before he would not be bringing a car. We would we walking or taking public transportation everywhere. He said he "did not drive in the snow" and could care less if this made me unable to come (6th attempt since October) because I couldn't risk getting sick. I'm not justifying my actions if they were wrong I own up to that, but I guess I started talking to the mutual friends more after January because I was so heartbroken and lonely. I wasn't in the mood to date obviously. I just wanted a friend. It's my fault for confiding in this person. Dunno.

Ex big thing was that he introduced us and  they were his friends first. Therefore, even though he was also invited on each occasion (and chose not to come- and this man has a multi-million dollar trust fund and no job he can and does go anywhere he wants) he said it was equivalent to betrayal. Because I had no right to hang out with them if he chose not to be there. I made a mistake confiding in the mutual friend one time yes but it wasn't bad mouthing him. I was crying wondering what I did wrong and how to fix it. Before this ex always recycled with limited contact now he is completely gone and thinks im Satan. But this guy is still wonderful and did no wrong. He even asked me to stop torturing him. But this guy continues to call and says he is friends with both of us. I made a mess. And I can't fix it. I feel horrible. I understand if ex does not want contact anymore but it hurts so much just the degree he hates me.

[ShadowIntheNight]

beach, I don't get the impression that you were going out or hanging out with the friend without your ex's knowledge and that wasn't what this question pertained to.  I do wonder though if the ex is really angry at his friend for trying to mediate between the two of you and is instead taking it out on you. I'm not sure how you "betrayed" him by talking to his friend unless it's possible that his friend doesn't know this side of him and he doesn't want him to see or know about it.

I am pretty sure that the friends of my uBPDexgf wouldn't believe me if I ever told them about her behavior. On the other hand, all of her exH's friends would believe me! That's the only way I can see it as an actual betrayal. Usually having a third party act as a go between unless both parties are on board doesn't turn out too well. I'm sure his friend meant well, sadly it didn't turn out that way.

[fromheeltoheal]

We're kind of saying the same thing with a different slant raisins, but let's focus on Beach Babe's concerns, this is her thread.

[fromheeltoheal]

I'm not justifying my actions if they were wrong I own up to that, but I guess I started talking to the mutual friends more after January because I was so heartbroken and lonely. I wasn't in the mood to date obviously. I just wanted a friend. It's my fault for confiding in this person. Dunno.

Understandable.  It's probably better at this point to talk to us and people who don't know him, yes?

[sun seeker]

    Hey all

 

  Beach

one of my non exs(9yr) r/s. Had  a few gay friends. Which also turned in into friends of mine... And I would be pissed if she shared or conversations with ANYONE. (except a T) Dont get me wrong its not betrayal BPDs exaggerate greatly ,  still better boundaries on your part is definite  need of adjustment. Never ever involve friends in these kinds of matters on either side. There are alot of ways to have gotten him that "goodbye" letter.  Your go between seems like a drama queen!

  Try not to be to hard on yourself we are human and we all make mistakes... .This to shall pass!

Raisins

    dam right. STR8 friends of the opposite sex are people you havnt slept with YET!    FACT

Been proven to me to many dam times . Not just with dexBPDgf either.

[Beach_Babe]

 I do wonder though if the ex is really angry at his friend for trying to mediate between the two of you and is instead taking it out on you. I'm not sure how you "betrayed" him by talking to his friend unless it's possible that his friend doesn't know this side of him and he doesn't want him to see or know about it.

Ex hates me, not his friend. The friend lives nearby and they continue to Facebook and talk on a regular basis (things I have been blocked from on/off pretty regularly even before this guy came into the picture.)  He will hang out with him no problem (but made it clear he would never see me again or even show up for say lunch with mutual friend if I was there). He adores this man and specifically told me to stop messing up his friendship with him. I'm who he hates.

And you are right, from heel to heel it was a mistake.

There was no way to get him the good bye letter sun seeker. He blocked email too. It was a kind letter, and All I wanted was closure and I just wanted a goodbye back. Mutual friend told me ex called him and was madder than heck. At me. Said good riddance. Why was he mad though? I was giving him what he wanted ... .I was agreeing to go? I just wanted closure I don't understand. He said not to go through third parties but that's exactly what he did too. And why is OK for him to stay in contact with mutual friend but wrong for me? Not that I want to just the double standard I guess.

So to everyone here I guess what I'm asking is do u think there is a way to make amends for my mistake, even though I know he is gone for good. He did horrible things to me too but two wrongs don't make a right and this eats at my conscience. I'm stuck right now in this mental purgatory because of it  and also the lack of a peaceful closure. I'm angry at the mutual friend for sharing details I didn't need to know about (such as being left out of his birthday soiree again and being told he spent thousands on it when he always made me pay everything ) but who fault for opening that can of worms in the first place right? It's mine.

[Beach_Babe]

I would also like to add he is now smearing me to mutual friend. For example he says I owe him $6,000 from a vacation. We took to Florida in 2007 where I got into an accident with his rental car. We bought  full coverage insurance $1 million worth from car rental company  and I know for a fact that is not true. I have the papers. And this is the first I have ever heard of this. So I contact ex and tell him if he can provide verifiable proof he paid this I will work with him to make things right even if he doesn't want me anymore because it's the honorable thing to do. Coward tells friend I owe that much and to call him then blocks phone.

[Beach_Babe]

Am I crazy to want a peaceful closure? Is there a way to correct my wrongs here so I can?

[Bumpsintheroad]

Beach,

"Am I crazy to want peaceful closure?"

From whom or for whom, may I ask?  If is from you and for you, it's in 100% in your control.  If you're looking to get your closure from him, you are back at the mercy of someone has shown an inability or unwillingness to do so. 

Do you want the serenity of 'closure' be determined by anyone other than YOURSELF?

[Beach_Babe]

No. And I never wanted him to leave.  But in this case maybe my actions had a part in it. Maybe I did hurt him too, and that bothers me.

[Beach_Babe]

How can I fix this? I just learned about BPD. I dont know how to stop making things worse

[fromheeltoheal]

How can I fix this? I just learned about BPD. I dont know how to stop making things worse

Relationships with borderlines go through a pretty predictable cycle, and if yours has reached a point where you are no longer the soother to his emotions, which is what he was using you for to begin with, but now you are the trigger, there is no returning to the bliss of the beginning, although it may seem like it now and then, only to revert.  Look in the 'Articles' tab on this site and read up in the boyfriend/girlfriend section; you will probably be able to relate and a lot of things will become clear.

It will also help to define what you want to fix.  The way to definitely stop making things worse is to stop communicating with him and focus on your future, and also looking at how much responsibility you are taking for the health of a relationship, when if I'm right he left you and won't communicate?  I'm a little confused because this thread used to be on the Leaving board but got bumped to the Staying, so I'm not entirely sure where you stand.

[Beach_Babe]

I wish I didn't have to go. But I do and what keeps me stuck is knowing my actions contributed to the final discard. It weighs on my conscience and there's no way to fix that, without triggering him worse. BPD or not maybe my actions were betrayal. I wish I could make amends and if things had to end it could be peaceful. He thinks I'm worse than Hitler (and he is Jewish so that's pretty bad). I've never had a break up like this before I don't know to process the hate

[Beach_Babe]

I Wondered If The Folks Here Had Any Perspective On How to Do This At Some Point In The future without making things worse. Or if I even should. I guess it is a selfish reason to make contact.

[misuniadziubek]

I wish I didn't have to go. But I do and what keeps me stuck is knowing my actions contributed to the final discard. It weighs on my conscience and there's no way to fix that, without triggering him worse. BPD or not maybe my actions were betrayal. I wish I could make amends and if things had to end it could be peaceful. He thinks I'm worse than Hitler (and he is Jewish so that's pretty bad). I've never had a break up like this before I don't know to process the hate

It seems like you are obsessed with getting closure from your exBf. That's understandable from one perspective. You formed an attachment to him and it's hard to let go.

The main question here is why do you need closure? What exactly are you trying to achieve by getting closure. You have every right to be upset about how things ended. You got accused of a lot of bull and it's hard to decipher which was your responsibility and what wasn't and also where you may have gone wrong and where you didn't.

I wish I didn't have to go. But I do and what keeps me stuck is knowing my actions contributed to the final discard. It weighs on my conscience and there's no way to fix that, without triggering him worse. BPD or not maybe my actions were betrayal. I wish I could make amends and if things had to end it could be peaceful. He thinks I'm worse than Hitler (and he is Jewish so that's pretty bad). I've never had a break up like this before I don't know to process the hate

You feel guilt, because you did some things that left your exBF feeling betrayed.

Was it actually betrayal, though? What motivated you to reach out to this friend? What makes it betrayal?

You say that your ex claims that you attended things with his friends while he wasn't around and that this is also betrayal. Did you have an agreement that you never hang out with his friends when he's not around? What do you think fueled this sort of reaction/assertion from your ex? Is it possible that he feels jealous of you being with his friends? Are you crossing into his personal space? Maybe you are likely to find out something about him from them? Maybe you will affect his reputation with them?

How do you feel about such an agreement? Is it fair for him to limit your exposure to people he considers friends? Did you find things in common with them? Did they give you a sense of belonging?

In my own experience, I was once accused of 'latching' onto my bf's friends. He considered it stalking and desperate. It was majorly due to the fact that he wanted things that he told me to stay private and was worried about triangulation.

Whether or not it WAS betrayal is only for you to judge and decide here. You have to take the time to really analyse the situation and see if it is in line with YOUR values and YOUR boundaries. Not his.

Just because he calls it betrayal does not make it so. Thoughts/emotions are NOT facts. As with any BPD, there is a tendency to overexaggerate the severity of a situation and justify it in his own mind. He FEELS it is betrayal. The only reason that MIGHT be important was if there was any relationship left to salvage. Then you could validate it.

Right now... There isn't a relationship to salvage, though. He has decided to cut you out of his life. The healthiest thing you could do right now for both yourself and in a way to make amends for your 'supposed' betrayal and responsibility in the ending of your relationship is to accept it.

Truth be told, your need for closure being your main motivation for contacting him is a great insult to his boundaries. He has expressed he doesn't want you to contact him many times, but you continuously fail to respect it.

By going through his friends and talking to them are you not deepening his perception of betrayal? Making it clear that you never had any intention to stop.

You're in a very desperate situation. You want something, but he has made it clear he isn't willing to provide it.

What further explanation do you want? You cannot force someone to give you what you want. The only person you can change is yourself.

How can I fix this? I just learned about BPD. I dont know how to stop making things worse

Relationships with borderlines go through a pretty predictable cycle, and if yours has reached a point where you are no longer the soother to his emotions, which is what he was using you for to begin with, but now you are the trigger, there is no returning to the bliss of the beginning, although it may seem like it now and then, only to revert.  Look in the 'Articles' tab on this site and read up in the boyfriend/girlfriend section; you will probably be able to relate and a lot of things will become clear.

It will also help to define what you want to fix.  The way to definitely stop making things worse is to stop communicating with him and focus on your future, and also looking at how much responsibility you are taking for the health of a relationship, when if I'm right he left you and won't communicate?

This. By focusing on yourself and your future, you make this situation less distressing on yourself.

My best bet is, if you really want to eventually talk to him, let a lot of time pass. Months in fact. See where that goes. If there is any hope to it, then eventually he might contact you. If he doesn't, then you have your answer.

You're stuck. You said it yourself. The best way to get unstuck is to work on yourself. You have to let go of the guilt, you have to accept what has happened.

You process the hate, the anger, the guilt, through time and doing things for yourself. Start seeing a therapist if you are having issues functioning.

Your ex is BPD, which means he is prone to lying. He is trying to make himself better to himself and his friends, he wants to make you out to be the bad guy. There is nothing you can do there.

You are being incredibly hard on yourself. Stop focusing on your own wrong-doings and start focusing on how he wronged you and what was dysfunctional in your relationship. Make an inventory of things that you won't budge on but want in a relationship, and see how many of these core needs he was not in line with.

[raisins3142]

I wish I didn't have to go.

The only things you must do is die one day and also pay taxes.

[Beach_Babe]

Misuniadziubek: I want closure because I spent 14 years with this person, he was my best friend but I understand what you are saying. We had no prior agreement I could not hang out with his friends. They included me at a time I was socially isolated and visited me after my surgery. Ex sent 2 emails and refused my call the night before. His email said I could call after my surgery to let him know how I was doing. I tried one week later and he blocked the phone. Just left space for me to leave one voicemail. And it has not been a clear cut "dont contact me" the next message a few days later could be "call". In fact he supposedly called our mutual friend two days after he had him relay the message "good riddance"  that i had permission to call. Ten minutes later I do and phone blocked no response either to text or email. So why the games ? I suspect he likes hurting me and it devastating.

Raisins: hmm my ex never paid taxes. Then cried when the irs came and penalized the crap out of him .

[patientandclear]

BB--his feelings are probably more complicated than a desire to punish you. He probably had fears around your surgery and around being needed. I've often seen that dynamic reported here around the partner's surgery or serious illness. He also probably has very conflicted fight/flight feelings combined with knowing he cares for and misses you. I think often it boils down to just "I can't handle this right now." It isn't against you, if that makes sense.

If you can be patient and wait for his feelings to stabilize, they will probably change. Not saying that makes it obvious how to manage in the r/s.

[Beach_Babe]

How do I know he just does not care if I live or die ... .found something better ? I'm cramping his style. Sure seems like it. How do I know patient this isn't really npd and that is the case?