She attempted suicide

[KateCat]

Yes! 

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Turkish]

You're right max. It's the first rule of first responders. Take care of yourself (or ensure your own safety) first. Yardwork sounds good. It's something I find relaxing.

[maxsterling]

I learned the other day that you can get bags of concrete at home depot for half off if they are damaged.  Do right now, I am making a 2-buck concrete planter for some kind of plant that I like dowm near my work - propagating by rooting!  And tomorrow, I may weld a garden gate.  And go for a long bike ride.  Doesn't matter if I don;t get it all done.  Maybe I will start a free blog about all my free and cheap garden ideas.

[Turkish]

Now I feel badly about not pulling out the weed eater last weekend after mowing, looking at the foxtails growing at the fenceline. An actual project is inspiring! I might check into that HD idea... .with the short sales upwind from me, the homes, or even the current owners (grrr) never tend to their green strips in front of their homes. Last year, I sprayed round up at night on the neighbor's grass (weed) strip. Though technically their property, I mow it. The weeds have infested my strip. It's a lost battle. Cement!

[babyducks]

Thanks everyone.   I spent the evening doing a bit of yardwork.  I realized my wife does not have her glasses.  But she did not call and request them, so I a made no effort to bring them to her.  I think that was a good decision.  It's all about taking care of me right now.  Let the doctors take care of her.  I will see her tomorrow, and bring her her glasses.  I REALLY NEED TO TAKE CARE OF ME.  At whatever cost.  I feel like i am dying.  Me taking care of me does not mean I don;t love her or care about her.  It means the opposite.  I can;t be there for her unless I am there for myself first.  

Brilliant Decision Max.  I'm giving you a bunch of thumbs up.  

You've been through a heck of a trauma.  Your body, your spirit and your psyche need some rest and repair time.

In your honor I am going to go weed the front flower bed. 

[Cole]

Thanks everyone.   I spent the evening doing a bit of yardwork.  I realized my wife does not have her glasses.  But she did not call and request them, so I a made no effort to bring them to her.  I think that was a good decision.  It's all about taking care of me right now.  Let the doctors take care of her.  I will see her tomorrow, and bring her her glasses.  I REALLY NEED TO TAKE CARE OF ME.  At whatever cost.  I feel like i am dying.  Me taking care of me does not mean I don;t love her or care about her.  It means the opposite.  I can;t be there for her unless I am there for myself first. 

When you are on a plane, they tell you to put your own oxygen mask on first and then your children's, because if you pass out first you cannot help them.

Don't feel bad about putting your mask on first. Prayers are with you this morning. 

[Notwendy]

I don't know if it is possible to save another person from themselves but sometimes doing what really helps someone feels counterintuitive to those of us who are codependent. I think we think this means sacrificing ourselves. Sometimes another person needs is to think of them first but we do this to an extreme and it doesn't help us or them.

Kudos max for tanking care of yourself and recognizing that your wife is in professional hands and that it may be most helpful to her to not rescue her from them.

[maxsterling]

Yes, I need to look after #1.  The knot on the back of my head and the bruise on my chest tell me so.

I don't know how long they will keep her at the hospital.  She's hopeful it will only be a few days.  I just have to put it in the hands of God and the doctors.  I'm going to go visit her later, then home to relax more. 

I will make no decisions regarding the future of this r/s now.  This is me time. 

[Grey Kitty]

Hey Max, I've got a couple observations (having missed a few days)

Excellent job doing things for yourself. Keep it up. ESPECIALLY when she comes home eventually!

You talked about caring for her, and just wanting to sit next to her on the sofa. Allow yourself to feel that you WANT these things. It is healthy and normal. Then pause and think before you DO anything like this.

You are making healthier choices... .keep at it, and accept that your feelings about her are all over the place, and will come up. A lot. That's OK and normal. You can have the feelings, and not get lost in them or let them drive you to doing something you will later regret.

[maxsterling]

Things to remind myself:

1) This is serious.  It's not just a matter of a "one time thing" that she promises will never happen again.  Suicide attempts are serious.   The paramedic told me had I not called 911 immediately, she would have likely suffered kidney failure.

2) It's up to her doctors to determine whether she is safe to come home:  I will be as open and honest with her doctors as possible.  That means telling them about the bruise on my chest and the bump on my head.

3) Remind myself over and over that I matter and that my health matters.

Her doctors are supposed to call me later.  W tells me she wants to leave soon, but doctors say "no way" and are concerned about her violence, saying she was violent in the emergency room, and violent towards me.  That's on the 911 tape of her screaming and threatening and hitting me in the background.

Her cousin that she has known for decades called me today, and said that she thinks W needs to be in the hospital for a long time.  I agree - a week or two for sure.  I don't want her home unless she is arranged to go to some kind of behavioral/anger program 3-5 days a week for several months. 

If I can, I am going to take the second half of the day off work.

[Cat Familiar]

Max,

I'm afraid a week or two of hospitalization won't make much difference. I think she needs to be institutionalized for quite a while.

I had a friend who attempted suicide and her husband found her and took her to the ED and they released her that evening! Then a year later, she completed the act when he was at work--this time using two methods at the same time--pills and cutting her wrists and ankles.

I'm sorry, these truths can be really hard to accept. What you've told us about your wife leads me to believe that not only is she a risk to herself, she is a risk to you. I think you need a professional evaluation of her safety before you bring her home--the consequences are just too great.

   

Cat

[maxsterling]

Cat, I agree.  Her cousin agrees.  I think her friend agrees. 

When the social worker called from the hospital, and asked me if this was a re-occurring problem, I was honest and said "yes"

I said that there was a period of months that she talked about killing herself or wanting to die nearly every day.

I said this was not the first time she hit me.

I said that she has attempted in the past.

I said that she had twice mentioned killing herself during MC earlier in the  week.

I mentioned that she made comment about killing me.

I mentioned I had called the police before.

I mentioned that I fear her coming home without some kind of structured plan that things will change.

When she asked at the emergency room if she could go home, they were VERY stern with her, that if she did not voluntarily go to treatment, she would be petitioned for being committed for 10 days minimum.  They reiterated that she would have died, and that suicide attempts are very serious.

[vortex of confusion]

3) Remind myself over and over that I matter and that my health matters.

Yes! I just want to repeat this. You matter. Your health matters. Even though she is the one that is sick, you have experienced a major trauma. This is a very traumatic experience for you and you need to worry about you.

   

[ColdEthyl]

Max    

I know you have been trying so hard to keep this r/s together... .my heart hurts for you. Take it one day at a time... .and I am so glad you have told the professionals what they need to know.

I would also agree with pressing charges just so there's some record of what's going on, that way later if something happens, she can't put it on you. You know pwBPD are manipulative, and honestly... .it wouldn't be hard for her to convince police you started the physical abuse since you are a male. I hate to say that... .but I know the stereotype is out there. Do it to protect her and yourself hun <3

[Cat Familiar]

I completely agree with Ethyl. They are so good at rewriting history. I know you've tried to soften the blow of consequences with her about insignificant things, such as the events leading up to your wedding ceremony.

HOWEVER, THIS IS SOO IMPORTANT THAT SHE GETS CONSEQUENCES FOR THIS BEHAVIOR.

I know it's going to really pain you to do it, being the kindhearted man that you are, but please file charges, for her sake and your future safety, both physically and legally.

[formflier]

 

Max,

 

You are a solid decision maker.  You have done the right thing many many times... .many times that was a hard thing.

That's where you find yourself again now.

What is status of police report and filing charges? 

Please keep this process separate from any long term decisions about your r/s.

You did not cause this... .deserve this... .

But... .you are in this position... .and the decisions that you make about police, filing charges and all that will set a precedent for this r/s.

Sometimes the loving thing to do is very hard... .

We are here for you... .

FF

[formflier]

HOWEVER, THIS IS SOO IMPORTANT THAT SHE GETS CONSEQUENCES FOR THIS BEHAVIOR.

I know it's going to really pain you to do it, being the kindhearted man that you are, but please file charges, for her sake and your future safety, both physically and legally.

One thought or idea... .

Many times there are programs for first time offenders... .where if they complete treatment and have no more issues for a period of time... .the charges can be put into a different status.

This could be one of many things that motivate her to get better.

She needs all the motivation she can get.

Please keep up the good posts... .it seems like you are trying to take care of yourself... .keep it up.

FF

[GaGrl]

I'm not sure 4-5 days or even 10 days of hospitalization will be sufficient.  She may need in-patient for 30 to 90 days.  This is not unheard of in such a serious situation.  Your wife has multiple, complicating diagnoses -- the BPD, the eating disorder, addiction -- and now she's violent in a public way that can't be hidden anymore.  This is not a situation that is going to quickly respond to a few days of treatment.

[maxsterling]

I'm listening to all of you.  Believe me.  I guess I am in shock. Most of the time every bit of advice or warning I get on this site is dead-on accurate.  But I am in shock over the idea of filing a police report.  That hasn't really sunk in yet, but it's in my mind, for sure.  The social worker is supposed to talk to me today, and I know they will not discharge her until I meet with the social worker and my wife to ensure no domestic violence situation is involved. 

[KateCat]

Max, is there by any chance a "Mental Illness Court" where you live? There is in my county, and I've got to believe it makes things easier on families when it comes to the tough task of involving law enforcement processes.

[formflier]

and I know they will not discharge her until I meet with the social worker and my wife to ensure no domestic violence situation is involved. 

Can you explain this more... .it's confusing.  Because my understanding is that there is a DV issue... .

It's been building to this for a while... .and it happened.

Hmmm... .I'll hush and let you explain.

FF

[formflier]

I'm listening to all of you.  Believe me.  I guess I am in shock. Most of the time every bit of advice or warning I get on this site is dead-on accurate.  But I am in shock over the idea of filing a police report. 

I understand that... .because I have been there.  Ok... .she didn't hit me... .but she went after three of my kids... .definitely the scariest thing I have ever confronted in my life... .because the lives involved... .including my wife's... .are very precious to me.

Anyway... .the PD aspect of this means they want to run from responsibility... .minimalize.

Next day in counseling (we just happened to have one scheduled)... .she made it out to not be a big deal... .I asked her to commit in writing to a plan for no corporal punishment.)

She insisted she had never... .ever gone back on her word... .(just not the case... .)

So... .still in the "shock" feeling that you mentioned... .I called a trusted person in law enforcement... .and also called my lawyer... .that was a long time friend as well as lawyer.

It was clear... .I had to act.

So... .i made the report to social services. 

The life of my family... .and my r/s with my wife is WAY better!  Much better!

FF

[Turkish]

The social worker is supposed to talk to me today, and I know they will not discharge her until I meet with the social worker and my wife to ensure no domestic violence situation is involved. 

But there was, and you documented it. Based upon how they always took my Ex in for her pre-natal appointments beforehand even when she requested me there, I had a gut feeling of bias. I asked her once, "so do they ask you if I beat you before they let me in?" She responded, "something like that."

Can you call a local DV hot-line for advice max?

[babyducks]

.  The social worker is supposed to talk to me today, and I know they will not discharge her until I meet with the social worker and my wife to ensure no domestic violence situation is involved. 

With great respect Max, please don't rely on the Social Worker and the Hospital to ensure the real threat of domestic violence is adequately addressed.   Mental Health facilities are often understaffed and over burdened.  

Please take action on your own behalf.   I am sure there is a domestic violence hotline in your area.   Why not give it a call and talk to a third, unbiased, neutral party who has been there and walked the situation locally.  

Go ahead and make the call, let them advise you, never hurts to have more information.

[Notwendy]

A characteristic of enabling is protecting an adult from the consequences of their behavior. It's a principle of parenting to protect children, but as they get older, they too need to learn that actions can lead to consequences. A kid might want to smack another kid on the playground, and he/she might try it, but should learn that this isn't tolerated by having some ( age appropriate ) consequence. Even a small child would be put in "time out" for that. An older kid would be suspended from school for hitting a classmate. Serious physical assaults on the part of adults would be grounds for being arrested.

Hitting others, except in situations of self defense is not appropriate- not from strangers, friends, family members or spouses.  I am not a lawyer, but I am not certain if filing a police report would result in arrest unless you pressed charges. However, it is the natural consequences of hitting someone else, and it creates a record in case she were to do this again, or blame you for it, and it may lead to better treatment for her. I don't know all the legal consequences of this.

Would not doing it let her know that it isn't ok to smack others ( because there would be consequences) but if she smacks you, she can get away with it? I am going to leave you to answer that question for yourself.

[waverider]

They are doing this as protocol, it is only covering themselves. If you both play it down nothing will come of it. It will be forgotten

A police report is different, it becomes a factual milestone, it can't be washed away as though it did not happen. It can be a future reference point. It will have a bigger chance of causing change

[formflier]

  It will have a bigger chance of causing change

Important point... .

Because she could get convicted... .do jail time... .and still not change.

Or... .she could finally be "scared straight... ."

No guarantees... .

But... .the basic question is what is the right choice for the relationship... .what is the healthy choice... .?

FF

[KateCat]

Max, did you once say that your wife had had hospital stays of significant length earlier in her life? 

Is there some history there to build on--maybe with the help of her family members--in going about getting this needed help for her now?

[formflier]

 

Max,

 

We are all rooting for you here.  !  Praying you are able to find peace and take care of yourself.

Also praying that your wife gets the care she needs... .

You both deserve it!

FF