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Author Topic: Husband sleeping on couch...  (Read 377 times)
Ceruleanblue
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« on: June 15, 2015, 02:16:09 AM »

BPDh went to visit his daughter that won't be around me, and now he's sleeping on the couch. Coincidence? I don't think so. This is the daughter he moved in with when he left me. This is also the only daughter of his three that will even see him.

Maybe I screwed up, because I should know better than ask anything, and I mean anything of BPDh. I made the mistake of asking him if he could ask his daughter something. He'd told me for months that he'd address an issue with her, yet he hadn't done so. What I'd wanted him to ask her was: "why wasn't my apology enough, or did it mean anything to her". Basically address my apologizing. It really, really bothers me, or I wouldn't have asked him to ask. He hounded, guilted, begged, and threatened me in regards to apologizing to his three girls, for three years, until I finally broke down and did it. It was the most humiliating, embarrassing, and hardest thing I've about ever done. I didn't do anything I felt I needed to apologize for, and it went against what I thought was best, but I did it to shut him up, and get some peace. All I got was more hurt, and I didn't even know if she got my long voicemail message.

Well, he told me he'd ask her, but in fact, he didn't. He went by his own agenda, and asked her when I'm going to be allowed around her and his grandson. All he cares about is HIMSELF. He held me in his arms when I cried this morning, and we'd also talked about it yesterday, so he can't claim he didn't understand. He's one of the most self involved, self serving person I think I've ever known.

He got upset when I asked if he'd asked her about the apology, and he got upset right off the bat. That right there let's me know he knew he didn't do as he'd said he would. He almost always goes back on his word, and he always pretends he just screwed up or forgot. I don't buy it anymore.

I know the ideal thing is just to never ask ANYTHING of him. I know that, but it's so hard to have a partner you can't ask anything of. I had sex with him three times this weekend because he's been complaining about wanting more sex, but he doesn't care AT ALL about what I want or need.

This is just getting so old. I want to be happy too. He'll eventually come to me wanting me to make nice with his girls, yet he hasn't done ONE thing to make any of this better for me. I'm not mad over the past, nor hanging onto it, it's THEM that are, yet he'll tell ME to "let go of the past". I told him tonight to not ever say that to me again, that it's his girls he needs to say that to. I'm done with him projecting onto me.

It's almost like he's so enmeshed with his kids, that after he sees his daughter he feels disloyal to her, and he chooses to sleep on the couch. Is enmeshment really common for those with BPD?
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Ceruleanblue
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« Reply #1 on: June 15, 2015, 02:25:36 AM »

Plus, I'm super hurt that her response was that she doesn't want me around her kid. All I wanted to know about was if my apology was received, and why was in not sufficient for peace? Period. Yet BPDh feels the need to tell me that his PD daughter doesn't want me around her kid? SHE blew up in front of her kid, now she'd projecting that onto me. I wasn't the one yelling like a crazy woman, that was her. I was the one who ended up leaving my own home, during her visit, just to deescalate her anger. I'd had no idea she was even capable of that kind of anger, and blow up.

What also bothers me is that this girl wants to say I'm unfit(and I'm clearly not as I used to be a foster parent, and I've raised two kids pretty successfully), BUT she lets her mom take her son for overnights, and it's a fact that this woman stabbed BPDh, and the whole family knows this. He covered for her, and didn't file reports when he was in the ER. He has several scars, and his kids all know and witnessed this violence. I DO NOT think his daughter is using good judgement to allow her son unsupervised visits with this woman. She dares call me unsafe, for NO REASON, yet she allows her son around that? There have been many times I feel like calling CPS, but my husband would be livid, even though he always talks about how awful his ex was to their kids. I don't like to think she'd hurt her grandson, but she clearly has impulse issues.

Every time though that his daughter trots out the "ceruleanblue" isn't safe to be around my son, I just want to call. I feel as if I'm being accused of being unsafe, when in fact her own mother is exactly that, and she's in denial of it. She's clearly not looking out for her kid. BPDh is allowed very limited access, and an overnight with him would never be considered due to ME, but crazy grandma is allowed full access. Ugh, the whole family seems not to see reality. They create their own.

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Notwendy
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« Reply #2 on: June 15, 2015, 06:46:10 AM »

I don't know what to suggest about your H, but I might be able to give you some insight into his family as my mothers FOO is very clannish and doesn't accept people who are not loyal to the family spell- ie think everyone is just fine and everyone else is not. My mother is divisive and if she is angry at anyone, her family is on "her side" against the other person. This is the way it is and you are either in the family or out, and the whole family will band against you.

Growing up I was not completely aware of this, as they all pretended to be my relatives- loving uncles and aunties and cousins. However, since I was more likely to have conflicts with my mother, she has repeatedly painted me black to them over the years, telling them all kinds of stories about me. To this day, they believe that she is fine and that I have been the problem child with serious issues.

This family liked my father, but I didn't realize that he was the reason they had anything to do with me, until he died, and they pretty much have little to do with me.

At first, I was hurt and shocked- I was grieving for my father and then, a whole side of the family disappeared, but then I was faced with the reality that to have a relationship with them as an authentic person was not possible. Who I was was either through her stories or me, and they had chosen her stories and so I let it go.

IMHO, expecting your H to take your side in any conflict with his family might not work because for families like that, you are all in or all out. To choose otherwise in this kind of enmeshed family means being exiled from them. I had the choice of remaining in the FOG with my mother, or not, and by choosing not, I am out of their family.

You can still have a relationship with your H. I do with my mother, and at family events I am polite and cordial, but I also stay out of their family relationships.


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waverider
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« Reply #3 on: June 15, 2015, 07:23:01 AM »

Is the problem that you feel victimized by constantly being made out to be the persecutor in all this?

It is his family and you can say pfft, whatever, not your problem. Except is he keeping the drama going and playing victim in the middle by putting pressure and guilt on you to fix it, but in the meantime running interference? Thus keeping the drama dragging out, with him in the middle, but devoid of responsibility, as though he is orchestrating a real life soap opera for his own entertainment.

If there is chaos around him then the chaos inside him is normalized by the benchmark of the environment he creates.

By not having the apology acknowledged do you feel cheated and manipulated? Is it your pride that has taken a hit?

Could you happily get by not getting on with his daughter if your partner was willing to accept that is just the way it is and not point blame at you.?
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Notwendy
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« Reply #4 on: June 15, 2015, 07:43:04 AM »

If there is chaos around him then the chaos inside him is normalized by the benchmark of the environment he creates.


This is so great. Maybe we need a thread about great sayings. The GURU of life with BPD.

This is also true about people who have trouble with living in clutter. A cluttered house is an outward sign of inner issues. For my mother, though, it was the opposite. Everything has to be perfect and spotless. If we left a toy or a comic book out, she would toss it. One towel on the floor after a shower could provoke a rage.

If one thing is "ruined" in her mind, then she throws it away. Excuse me for the hijack, but I think control also reduced anxiety- control the environment, control people- either through perfectionism or chaos?

With my H, he keeps everything in order and notices anything out of place too. If anyone borrows something and puts it back but not in the same place, he will notice. I am not a super neat person but I keep things clean. It is my job to clean the kitchen, and I do it on my time. My H is the one who will walk in, and not be critical, but say " is that a fingerprint on the wall, or a piece of cookie on the floor? " This is after me being home all day with the kids running around, and I would not even notice those things until I cleaned up later. To avoid issues of " who took my____?" I do not touch his belongings.
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Ceruleanblue
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« Reply #5 on: June 15, 2015, 04:17:14 PM »

I DO feel, not victimized, but I'd say indignant, over always being made out to be the bad guy, and lies being told about me. I mean, I invited his daughter for dinner, SHE blows up at me, before I got a complete sentence out, she wouldn't stop spewing her venom at me, yet she's twisted it to the whole family. His family is fine with me, it's just BPDh's kids, and his family is sucked in, and for some reason, they seem afraid to cross his kids too. They are sick of their lies and drama though too. I don't consider myself a victim, although I've certainly been their target. The things they've done to me have been awful, yet I was coerced into apologizing? Yeah, I'm very indignant, and hurt over that. Plus, I don't have any explanation over why the apology meant nothing. For so long they were saying an apology would fix things, but I knew it was yet another hoop, and would accomplish nothing. I do feel I was totally manipulated by BPDh into apologizing. He wanted me to do it for HIS sake. He threw me under the bus yet again, but now wants me to hide my hurt over it.

I do think he thrives on chaos. He may not always create it, but he could have nipped this in the bud way back, and he should have. If he'd taken a stand with his kids, like his ex did in regards to the guy she cheated with(and they now all accept), we wouldn't be in the mess. BPDh is wishy washy, and the only person he stand up to are me, my son, and random strangers(and several boss' in his past). He can't stand up to those that he needs boundaries with, yet he'll rage at those who support him.

I'm fine with not having anything to do with his three girls at this point. Trust me, I'm relieved he isn't begging me to be around them. I did that for a few years, and I'd always leave hurt, and he'd do nothing. It made me resent him. I'm sure at some point he's going to want me to be around them again, and I know I can be cordial, but I know I'll be tempted to say "no thanks, I already tried that".

I do think he and his kids were totally enmeshed, and I was views as an interloper, and this was the agenda that his ex pushed with the girls too. His son has managed to get along with everyone, but the girls view it as being disloyal to their mother, perhaps? Funny thing is that I urged these girls to forgive their Mom's infidelity, and it sure bit ME in the butt. The minute they forgave their Mom, she somehow got them to turn on me. "

BPDh won't address any of this with his girls, and in fact two of them won't have anything to do with him. He's paying a high price for not having any boundaries. They ran all over him, withdrew several times only to suck him back in, then they cut him off for who knows how long. Only he can break this cycle, but he can't or won't do it. I'm hoping his DBT therapy addressed enmeshment. Anyone know if it will?



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Ceruleanblue
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« Reply #6 on: June 15, 2015, 04:27:53 PM »

Notwendy: Your FOO does sound quite a bit like what I'm facing. I just struggle to understand though why his girls have accepted the man they used to hate: the man their Mom cheated with, yet they vilify ME? I came along way later, and I certainly didn't break the marriage up, the infidelity did. Plus, the marriage had huge issues, as I know BPDh has issues, and his ex used to stab him and hit him with hammers in his sleep. His kids know this stuff, but they aren't allowed to address it with their crazy Mom, so I think BPDh gets all the blame.

This does have a clan like feeling, and it's been made obvious I'm not going to be accepted by his kids. The rest of BPDh's family have been nice to me, and I'm grateful for that, even if it is somewhat superficial. I don't know if they wanted him to end up with a Mexican girl, or someone different than me, but at least they are nice to my face. BPDh has made little effort to engage with my family, yet I'm expected to immerse myself in his, it's just weird.

You gave me a good glimpse into seeing that this probably is enmeshment, and that I'm not the only one who has had to deal with it.
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vortex of confusion
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« Reply #7 on: June 15, 2015, 05:10:28 PM »

You will never understand his children. Don't even try!

Given the fact that they have such a crazy mother, it makes sense that they would take her side. They may not have a choice. Yes, they are adults. Dysfunction runs rather deep, especially in a situation where one person is crazy enough to hurt others and make all sorts of threats. Who knows whether or not their mother has threatened them. I imagine there is a whole lot more to the story than you know. A lot of times, that clannish behavior is accompanied by secret or implied threats. I have a sister that is queen of scaring people. She came to my house one time because she was convinced that I was doing something wrong. I told her I didn't want her to come over because I was busy. She said something about me and my army hiding or conspiring. It was rather twisted. When she came over, I was stand offish, wouldn't let her in the house, and made the kids stay inside. She called the cops on ME and had them do a welfare check. She said that she was concerned because I wouldn't let her see my kids. I don't know what line of BS she gave them.

And, I know good and well that if I don't mind my p's and q's across the board, that people in my FOO will call somebody with a line of crap. Even if everything I am doing is above board, I won't beat the ride.

It sounds like your husband is being put in the middle of a hornets nest of women and has no clue what to do. It sounds like he is offering you lip service about different stuff to get you off his back. Who knows if it is him that pushed for the apology or if it was his daughters or if it originated with their mother? All you see is what happens between you and your husband. If he is a tough guy that has an appearance that he is trying to keep, then there is no way in hell that he is going to tell you that he is scared of his daughters and their mother. It is easier to be a jerk to you and push you around because you are safe. They aren't.

I know how it feels to have your husband choose everyone else over you. My husband used to be so far up his mother's butt it wasn't even funny. I would ask him to stand up to her and get her off my back. I would try to tell him how snotty she could be. I tried my darnedest to get him to hear me. The problem wasn't that he wasn't hearing me. The problem is that he was absolutely, positively incapable of standing up to his mother. It wasn't going to happen. He lacked that ability.
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waverider
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« Reply #8 on: June 15, 2015, 06:29:33 PM »

The best thing you can do for your sanity is to block all interaction with his family and put up strong boundaries about being drawn up int o discussions about them with H. If he doesn't like that too bad, they are not your problem and between H and his family they have created this consequence.

i know how hard this is when your partner obsesses over FOO dramas, I have similar issue. It is hard to stop mulling over it put with practice you gradually adjust. One thing is for sure you are not going to fix it.
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Ceruleanblue
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« Reply #9 on: June 15, 2015, 10:20:53 PM »

Yes, I surely can't change his kids, or the ways they behave. All this dysfunction predates me, so in a way, it's almost funny that they want to pin everything on me. I've always felt that they blame BPDh way more than they should simple because they can't blame their crazy Mom.

At this point, I'm not having to have boundaries involving them because they refuse to be around me. I have a feeling that will come though, and I'll  have to have well thought out boundaries for when I have to be around them. For now, as was suggested, I think it's best to just not talk about them. They've had way too much involvement in our marriage, just because of all their drama and the hate campaign. Just tonight in MC the T pretty much told me that his kids have had too much power(he used another term I can't remember).

All this certainly has brought me a new appreciation for my own family, I can tell you that.
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« Reply #10 on: June 15, 2015, 10:32:50 PM »

 

Hmmm... .there are many... many moving parts to this dysfunctional FOO.  You have a limited amount of energy... .the only person in the FOO that really should matter to you (now) is your hubby.  Focus the energy there... .don't send energy down the rabbit trails... .that takes some heat off him... .it works for him when you focus on daughter...

It's a sideshow... .(for now)

One thing at a time... .

 
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Ceruleanblue
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« Reply #11 on: June 17, 2015, 12:58:47 PM »

Yes, his FOO is somewhat dysfunctional, but I'm finding that the family he raised with his ex is far worse. It's a hornet's nest, and for now, I'm relieved to be out of it. MC has helped with that. BPDh sees less of his kids, because they refuse to be around me, so that's their choice, and at lease BPDh seems to have stopped blaming me now. He's had two therapists tell him I've done all I can, and that seemed to finally get through to him, after three years.

It's just sad because he keeps getting sucked into their dysfunction because they use guilt, and their kids(his grandkids) as pawns. If it didn't effect his BPD behaviors, I wouldn't care, but IT DOES. He will come home after visiting one of his daughters, and he'll treat me like crap. He even does this after FOO functions, and we all get along. It's weird, and I really can't figure it out, so I guess I'll just stop trying. All I can do is set a boundary about how I'll be treated by him after any of these functions. It's like he's different after he's been around any of his family.

My focus for now is on the marriage, but also on ME. I deserve to be happy, and I've been through a lot in the last year. We separated, almost divorced, I moved away from my son(this is the hugest issue), and I'm living in a new community. Lots of adjustment, so I'm trying to find my way.
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« Reply #12 on: June 17, 2015, 02:36:08 PM »

The best thing you can do for your sanity is to block all interaction with his family and put up strong boundaries about being drawn up int o discussions about them with H. If he doesn't like that too bad, they are not your problem and between H and his family they have created this consequence.

i know how hard this is when your partner obsesses over FOO dramas, I have similar issue. It is hard to stop mulling over it put with practice you gradually adjust. One thing is for sure you are not going to fix it.

I totally agree with WaveRider.

My BPDh has a real dysfunctional relationship with his 34 year old daughter, and in my opinion, the BPD'ers love to hold on to the dysfunctional relationships with children b/c the BPD'er maintains a certain level of control. With my husband, he continues to give his PhD'd daughter large sums of money annually, though we can't afford to retire. She, on the other hand, is happy to oblige his gift giving, without much thought to our situation. Dysfunction. Total dysfunction.

I try to stay out of their affairs. I will never understand them anyway, BPD'ers rarely do what you ask of them, and why put them in a position of lying to me?
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