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Skills we were never taught
98
A 3 Minute Lesson
on Ending Conflict
Communication Skills-
Don't Be Invalidating
Listen with Empathy -
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Setting Boundaries
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Author Topic: Help me sort out the confusion  (Read 930 times)
vortex of confusion
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« Reply #30 on: July 22, 2015, 12:18:52 AM »

Do you feel lonely?

Absolutely!

The funny thing is that I don't feel as lonely when he isn't home. When I am at work or when it is just me and the kids, I don't seem to have those feelings of loneliness. When I sit on the porch by myself, I don't feel lonely at all. I am able to sit and enjoy the silence. When I am out there with him, the loneliness sometimes feels like it is going to engulf me. That makes no sense to me.
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« Reply #31 on: July 22, 2015, 02:30:26 AM »

It makes perfect sense to me... .Been there... .yearning to be loved,  seen,  heard,  acknowledged or appreciated hurts.
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« Reply #32 on: July 22, 2015, 06:35:49 AM »

 

Tell him you want to sit on the porch... .hold his hand... .and not talk.  That you might ask him a question or two... or mention a shooting star you saw... .but you don't want to chatter.



Might also follow up with sometimes I like to chatter... .sometimes I like to be silent and enjoy the peace.  Right now... .I want to enjoy the peace WITH YOU!

VOC,

I totally get what you enjoy.  Many times I am the same way.  A bit odd for me... because I am a big talker and extrovert.

Some of my favorite times with my kids are when we are mostly quiet... .but talk about random things we see.

I remember this trip with my daughter... she's now 18... .was probably 10 or so at the time.  We were driving along and the only thing she or I would mention was when we saw a horse.  There would be a couple comments about that horse... .the pasture... .then we would enjoy the countryside again.  Totally not planned... .

Last thought... .your husband is trying... .and is clueless.  You are the one with the clue... .share it with him... .tell him your expectations... .

 

FF
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« Reply #33 on: July 22, 2015, 06:39:00 AM »

 

VOC,

Wanted a separate entry about the hurt that you are carrying... .

Can you let the hurt give you energy to press ahead?  I'm guessing that at this point forgiveness is off the table (I'm still processing that article... .it's an interesting point of view... )

What have you been doing with that hurt since it happened?

FF
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vortex of confusion
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« Reply #34 on: July 22, 2015, 07:53:38 AM »



Tell him you want to sit on the porch... .hold his hand... .and not talk.  That you might ask him a question or two... or mention a shooting star you saw... .but you don't want to chatter.

I have tried to tell him this on several occasions. I have tried to tell him that I don't always like to talk. Sometimes I just want some quiet.

Excerpt
Might also follow up with sometimes I like to chatter... .sometimes I like to be silent and enjoy the peace.  Right now... .I want to enjoy the peace WITH YOU!


That doesn't really work. He is very uncomfortable with the silence. If we are outside, he will get up and go in. If he is sitting in the living room with me, he will nod off and fall asleep.

Excerpt
Last thought... .your husband is trying... .and is clueless.  You are the one with the clue... .share it with him... .tell him your expectations... .

 

<sigh>

I know he is trying and is clueless. I try to tell him what I want. I have sent him articles. I have told him every way I know how. I have written poems and blog posts trying to tell him what I want. I have tried to use every word that I know to use.

And there is also this tendency for me to tell him what I want only to have him do it once or twice and then that is it. I know that you have complained about your wife acting like it doesn't count because she had to tell you to do it. I have those same feelings at times. I recently sent my husband an article about things that are relationship building. He seems to prefer me sending him reading materials. He doesn't seem to take it as personally when I send him articles about things both of us can do to build the relationship. I forget what was on the list at the moment. Most of the stuff is stuff that I already do. One of the things that I know was on the list was writing notes. A couple days after that, I would wake up and find little notes. That lasted for a week or so and then he hasn't done it again. No, I didn't fall all over myself about the note. I quietly enjoyed it. The whole point of the article was to do nice things for your partner without expectation. And, I was irritated because writing a note was one of the things on the list that was the absolute easiest thing to do. It felt like a real cop out to me.
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« Reply #35 on: July 22, 2015, 08:04:07 AM »

Wanted a separate entry about the hurt that you are carrying... .

Can you let the hurt give you energy to press ahead?  I'm guessing that at this point forgiveness is off the table (I'm still processing that article... .it's an interesting point of view... )

What have you been doing with that hurt since it happened?

I have been pressing ahead for years. My hurts are mine. I try not to bring them up. Sometimes I bring them up. I have worked really hard at trying NOT to bring them up. If I do bring them up, I try to make sure that I am owning that it is my hurt.

I don't know what to do with the hurt. It is there. It is what it is. I have a lot of hurts about things that my husband has done. I have no clue what to do with them. I was trying to talk about them with that coach but she decided to report me. I will be the first to admit that I said a lot of ugly things about my husband. I was trying to let out all of the stuff that I have stuffed down.

I tend to use my hurts as motivation for me to improve and do better.
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« Reply #36 on: July 22, 2015, 08:48:21 AM »

Report you? I hope you have found a different coach.
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« Reply #37 on: July 22, 2015, 09:04:33 AM »

I know that you have complained about your wife acting like it doesn't count because she had to tell you to do it. I have those same feelings at times. 

Yes... .but I did them... .and if she hadn't communicated to me that she wanted xyz done... .most of that stuff would have never happened.

The reason I brought this up is there has been a time or two where you mentioned your hubby was doing well at doing what you said around the house... .you didn't say he was "obedient"... .but that is how I took it.

My guess is that he realizes (on some level) that he is cludo... .and that you aren't.

So... .he is looking to you for leadership.

Get more specific... .I'd like to spend 15 minutes with you on the porch... .holding hands... .where we can be quiet and be together.  If needed... ask him to bring a fresh cup of coffee (for the other hand) to help him stay awake.

This is about you and your feelings.  Let him figure out how to deal with is uncomfortableness with the quiet... .that's not your issue.

FF
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« Reply #38 on: July 22, 2015, 09:38:46 AM »

Yes... .but I did them... .and if she hadn't communicated to me that she wanted xyz done... .most of that stuff would have never happened.

The reason I brought this up is there has been a time or two where you mentioned your hubby was doing well at doing what you said around the house... .you didn't say he was "obedient"... .but that is how I took it.

Obedient is a good term to use. I am not sure how to explain this. I think the bottom line is that I am tired. I know I am whining and complaining a bit here. I work two part time jobs and homeschool 4 kids. My days are spent managing everyone and everything. I am sometimes overwhelmed and tired and the last thing that I want to do is have to manage a relationship where I have to tell my husband what to do. I know that a lot of this is my own fault because there are times when I just don't have the energy to tell him to come sit with me in silence for 15 minutes. It is easier to sit and listen to him drone on.

Excerpt
Get more specific... .I'd like to spend 15 minutes with you on the porch... .holding hands... .where we can be quiet and be together.  If needed... ask him to bring a fresh cup of coffee (for the other hand) to help him stay awake.

This is about you and your feelings.  Let him figure out how to deal with is uncomfortableness with the quiet... .that's not your issue.

I don't get as specific as giving a time frame.

He does deal with his uncomfortableness. He deals with the uncomfortableness by talking or finding a reason to get up and do something else.

The fact that I don't like it is on me, not him. It is about me and my feelings. He isn't capable of seeing how I might feel rejected by this. A lot of times, I get tongue tied or am at a loss for words when trying to communicate with him.
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« Reply #39 on: July 22, 2015, 09:59:25 AM »

 

Or... .if he likes to read things... .you can email him your request... .

Be specific... set the bar higher... .

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« Reply #40 on: July 22, 2015, 11:00:43 AM »



Or... .if he likes to read things... .you can email him your request... .

Be specific... set the bar higher... .

I have done that in the past.

When I am at work at night, I e-mail back and forth with him and give him things to do. . .take out the trash, check the laundry, I want to eat X when I get home.

I think RA is what is needed. I don't know that it is possible to give him specifics with regards to emotional needs. They are mine to deal with. Trying to give him directions and telling him exactly what to do and how to do isn't something that comes anywhere close to meeting my emotional needs.

I seem to recall you mentioning the energy sucking. Trying to give him directions about so many things sucks my energy and creates an even bigger black hole. I get frustrated when I read the suggestion to be more specific and raise the bar higher. I can do that about house cleaning and things that do not require emotional input. What I want is the emotional element and I know that I am NOT going to get that from my husband. It isn't him being abusive or neglectful or mean. It is him lacking the skills and ability. If he wants to gain those skills and abilities, then he needs to try to work that into his counseling sessions. I don't see it as my circus. Yes, it impacts me but I have to find healthy ways to deal with it.

I don't think some of your suggestions are all that healthy for me because they have a hint of magical thinking. It puts me back on that wheel where I am thinking that I am not enough. If only I could find a better way to communicate. . .If only I could be more specific. . .If only I could this or that or the other. . .I can't and won't get back on that wheel.

Further up in the thread, Phoebe said something about who you are should exude through your pores or something like that. I have made no secrets about who I am or what I want. My husband is incapable of seeing it for whatever reason. I have made a commitment to stay with him as long as possible and am trying to figure out how to stay the course without losing my mind. He isn't a bad guy at all. One of the kids asked me if he has asperger's or autism because of his inability to understand things that seem so basic to others.
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« Reply #41 on: July 22, 2015, 12:48:34 PM »

 

VOC,

 

Hang in there... .I think you are great... .let me come at this from a different angle.  And... .if you are interested in venting, being heard, being validated... .and not dealing with action steps (fixing)... .that's cool too.  I'll hush

Your hubby meeting your emotional needs... is too big a leap... .I'm trying to break it down into smaller steps.

Step 1... .spend quiet time together.  Where he is quiet and responds to what you say... .if you choose to say. 

As far as energy... .don't worry about what he will do.  Think about what you would like... .say it clearly... .stop spending energy.  You are responsible for what comes out of your mouth... .nothing more.

Last thought:  I've talked to many counselors about wooing women... .improving the r/s and most of the time... .the advice is to engage them in conversation... .talk... .be in their world.  There is nothing wrong with spending quiet time together... .but I think if you left it to counselors to educate your hubby that you want that.  I don't think he will ever get it.

Hang in there!

FF
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« Reply #42 on: July 22, 2015, 02:00:07 PM »

VOC,

I may be wrong, but what I'm reading between the lines in your communication is that you are just not attracted to who your husband is. Part of that may be due to the history you've shared with him and the dysfunctional way he has behaved due to his sex addiction.

You would like him to be as interested in you as he was with women he was sexting, but that's unlikely to happen because you see each other daily and your routines with each other are established. In other words, he's not painting you white as he did with the women he wanted to meet--or as he did when you were a new couple, without the responsibilities of household and children.

I don't have any advice for you as I'm dealing with a similar feeling with my husband. It is difficult indeed to get past previous bad behavior on their part and it certainly changes the initial attraction, as we get to know the dark side of their personality.  
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« Reply #43 on: July 22, 2015, 02:56:36 PM »

VOC,

I may be wrong, but what I'm reading between the lines in your communication is that you are just not attracted to who your husband is. Part of that may be due to the history you've shared with him and the dysfunctional way he has behaved due to his sex addiction.

This is what I am reading too. You have lost the love and respect.

Leading him by the noise is one thing, but the driver in the seat in his car has little chemical appeal to you. To much damage has scarred your view of him.

You can't force this. Trying to get him to mould into someone you like takes too much energy. So does worrying about whether he will try or not. I think FF is right though in that you need to communicate you needs clearly and dont waste energy seeing if he meets them or not, that is his choice.Thinking "I wishing I could say this or that" is also draining.

It may take time, which you are still willing to give, and your thoughts may drift back again when more water has passed under the bridge. Let that unfold as it will, for now don't try to overthink it, and just put your efforts into polishing up you daily life so that you get the most of it, don't focus on the end goal, its not decison time yet.

Your future is still just a seed, keep watering it and see what new life grows from it. Tomorrow is a mystery, don't let todays doubts infect it before it has had time to develop properly. You may just feel like a caretaker today, but it may not always be so.
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« Reply #44 on: July 22, 2015, 04:08:14 PM »

Hey VOC,

Sorry for these struggles but sure acknowledge your willingness.    Regarding your request for specific suggestions on how to increase intimacy,  you might read the book Passionate Marriage by David Schnarch (www.amazon.com/gp/aw/s/ref=is_s?k=Passionate+Marriage).   It gives both a paradigm of intimacy and specific tools for helping to achieve intimacy.   This would be an enormously worthwhile endeavor whether you stay with your husband or not.   If you pursue this earnestly,  you will grow and gain as a result.   If those gains lead you and your husband towards each other in a satisfying and fulfilling way,  then amen.  And if those gains lead you away from him,  then amen.   Because if pursued,  this paradigm will lead you to you.  And that is the you who will decide with whom to best share the intimate self you are.   This is not for the faint of heart.   I tried with my ex-husband who wasn't totally into it.   But,  truth be told,  I was too scared myself and was happy to use him as an excuse to not do this deeply uncomfortable and profound work.   I do not make this suggestion as one who has succeeded.   Just as one who is hungry for the journey.   Hope you'll take a serious look.   Would love to know your thoughts.  

Big hug,

rml
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« Reply #45 on: July 22, 2015, 05:28:49 PM »

Hang in there... .I think you are great... .let me come at this from a different angle.  And... .if you are interested in venting, being heard, being validated... .and not dealing with action steps (fixing)... .that's cool too.  I'll hush

I feel like I have done my part with the action steps. The ball is in his court at the moment. I am trying to keep myself in a place of balance. In all honesty, I am feeling the urge to pick a fight with him because I know that I can get him to engage if I pick a fight. I don't want to do that. I haven't done that in a long time and I don't want to go back to that.

Excerpt
Step 1... .spend quiet time together.  Where he is quiet and responds to what you say... .if you choose to say. 

Bwahahahahaha. . .the man can't even be quiet in his sleep!

Excerpt
As far as energy... .don't worry about what he will do.  Think about what you would like... .say it clearly... .stop spending energy.  You are responsible for what comes out of your mouth... .nothing more.

Yep, I am responsible for what comes out of my mouth. The first thing that comes to mind is the phrase, "If you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all." 

Excerpt
Last thought:  I've talked to many counselors about wooing women... .improving the r/s and most of the time... .the advice is to engage them in conversation... .talk... .be in their world.  There is nothing wrong with spending quiet time together... .but I think if you left it to counselors to educate your hubby that you want that.  I don't think he will ever get it.

You have a very good point. If he tried to woo me like one would woo the typical woman, that would likely drive an even bigger wedge between us. Without the woo, some better communication skills would be helpful.
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« Reply #46 on: July 22, 2015, 05:37:36 PM »

VOC,

I may be wrong, but what I'm reading between the lines in your communication is that you are just not attracted to who your husband is. Part of that may be due to the history you've shared with him and the dysfunctional way he has behaved due to his sex addiction.

This is what I am reading too. You have lost the love and respect.

Exactly! It is difficult to love and respect him at this point. At this point, it has become a choice that I am actively making.

Excerpt
You can't force this. Trying to get him to mould into someone you like takes too much energy. So does worrying about whether he will try or not. I think FF is right though in that you need to communicate you needs clearly and dont waste energy seeing if he meets them or not, that is his choice.Thinking "I wishing I could say this or that" is also draining.

I don't feel like I am trying to force this. I feel more like I am trying to keep myself in check and that is where I feel like a lot of my energy goes.

Excerpt
It may take time, which you are still willing to give, and your thoughts may drift back again when more water has passed under the bridge. Let that unfold as it will, for now don't try to overthink it, and just put your efforts into polishing up you daily life so that you get the most of it, don't focus on the end goal, its not decison time yet.

I am trying to be patient and let time pass. I know me. I have to talk about this stuff somewhere and get it out so I don't blow a fuse with him.
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« Reply #47 on: July 22, 2015, 05:46:25 PM »

Sorry for these struggles but sure acknowledge your willingness.    Regarding your request for specific suggestions on how to increase intimacy,  you might read the book Passionate Marriage by David Schnarch (www.amazon.com/gp/aw/s/ref=is_s?k=Passionate+Marriage).   It gives both a paradigm of intimacy and specific tools for helping to achieve intimacy.   This would be an enormously worthwhile endeavor whether you stay with your husband or not.   If you pursue this earnestly,  you will grow and gain as a result.   If those gains lead you and your husband towards each other in a satisfying and fulfilling way,  then amen.  And if those gains lead you away from him,  then amen.   Because if pursued,  this paradigm will lead you to you.  And that is the you who will decide with whom to best share the intimate self you are.   This is not for the faint of heart.   I tried with my ex-husband who wasn't totally into it.   But,  truth be told,  I was too scared myself and was happy to use him as an excuse to not do this deeply uncomfortable and profound work.   I do not make this suggestion as one who has succeeded.   Just as one who is hungry for the journey.   Hope you'll take a serious look.   Would love to know your thoughts.  

Could you give me some more information about what this paradigm is that you are referencing?

I went and looked through the table of contents and it seems to be a book that is primarily focused on sex. Can you give me some ideas from the book? What specifically didn't work with your ex husband? I would like a little more information about the book.
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« Reply #48 on: July 23, 2015, 01:05:24 PM »

Sorry for these struggles but sure acknowledge your willingness.    Regarding your request for specific suggestions on how to increase intimacy,  you might read the book Passionate Marriage by David Schnarch (www.amazon.com/gp/aw/s/ref=is_s?k=Passionate+Marriage).   It gives both a paradigm of intimacy and specific tools for helping to achieve intimacy.   This would be an enormously worthwhile endeavor whether you stay with your husband or not.   If you pursue this earnestly,  you will grow and gain as a result.   If those gains lead you and your husband towards each other in a satisfying and fulfilling way,  then amen.  And if those gains lead you away from him,  then amen.   Because if pursued,  this paradigm will lead you to you.  And that is the you who will decide with whom to best share the intimate self you are.   This is not for the faint of heart.   I tried with my ex-husband who wasn't totally into it.   But,  truth be told,  I was too scared myself and was happy to use him as an excuse to not do this deeply uncomfortable and profound work.   I do not make this suggestion as one who has succeeded.   Just as one who is hungry for the journey.   Hope you'll take a serious look.   Would love to know your thoughts.   

Could you give me some more information about what this paradigm is that you are referencing?

I went and looked through the table of contents and it seems to be a book that is primarily focused on sex. Can you give me some ideas from the book? What specifically didn't work with your ex husband? I would like a little more information about the book.

Hey VOC,

Yes(!), sex is involved but it is much more than sex.  This link (www.crucibletherapy.com/approach-marital-sexual-therapy) more about the paradigm though this being its own therapy is new information to me.  I would give it a serious look and not throw the baby out with the bathwater because it seems to be about sex.  From what I gather from your posts, you and your husband are still sexually active together, despite any short or long-term dissatisfactions, so this will hit upon the sexual intimacy and the emotional intimacy.  As I said, I have not successfully implemented this (and yes, I could have done much of it myself without my then-husband's participation) but I aspire to do so.  I took the easy way out and threw in the towel because I said he wasn't into it.  It would probably be more accurate to say if I had truly pursued it he would have gone along with me and we both could have benefited.  I think it would have had much merit for each of us individually and as a means to developing good r/s skills whether or not we had stayed together. 

I wonder if anyone here has had personal experience with Passionate Marriage?

I would love to hear your thoughts should you choose to read it.  If I had it on a kindle I would loan it to you but I bought the hard copy many years ago.  There is a newer edition since then which I have not seen.

Best wishes towards this end, VOC!
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« Reply #49 on: July 23, 2015, 07:17:48 PM »

Yes(!), sex is involved but it is much more than sex.  This link (www.crucibletherapy.com/approach-marital-sexual-therapy) more about the paradigm though this being its own therapy is new information to me.  I would give it a serious look and not throw the baby out with the bathwater because it seems to be about sex.  From what I gather from your posts, you and your husband are still sexually active together, despite any short or long-term dissatisfactions, so this will hit upon the sexual intimacy and the emotional intimacy.  As I said, I have not successfully implemented this (and yes, I could have done much of it myself without my then-husband's participation) but I aspire to do so.  I took the easy way out and threw in the towel because I said he wasn't into it.  It would probably be more accurate to say if I had truly pursued it he would have gone along with me and we both could have benefited.  I think it would have had much merit for each of us individually and as a means to developing good r/s skills whether or not we had stayed together. 

Thanks for the information! I was wanting more information about the book as it is 448 pages long.

I have read similar information in other places. The bottom line is to commit to working on yourself and becoming differentiated in order to grow the relationship. I recently listened to some recordings from a marriage therapist that said some of these same things. Instead of focusing on being committed to the relationship, you have to be committed to personal growth. With the help of people on these forums, I think I have done pretty well at focusing on myself more.

I wonder if this book is mentioned in the book review section of this forum. Maybe you could start a thread over there to discuss the book. It looks really interesting.
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« Reply #50 on: July 24, 2015, 06:35:40 AM »

Excerpt
It may take time, which you are still willing to give, and your thoughts may drift back again when more water has passed under the bridge. Let that unfold as it will, for now don't try to overthink it, and just put your efforts into polishing up you daily life so that you get the most of it, don't focus on the end goal, its not decison time yet.

I am trying to be patient and let time pass. I know me. I have to talk about this stuff somewhere and get it out so I don't blow a fuse with him.

As important as it is having a safe place to vent our feelings and frustrations (Thanks bpdfamily!) and realizing that it's hard finding ways to carve out "me time" when there's a real life family to tend to, it is so very important to find that quiet place for just you, Vortex.  A place where there is no venting or trying to figure stuff out; a place to feel your own vibrations.  I know that sounds hokey, but it's the best way I can describe it.  To me, it is the essence of self soothing.  Not needing others to validate what's within me.  Validating myself that what's going on within me needs a little TLC.  TLC that only I can provide.

When I can tap into that quiet place within me, the rest of the outside stuff just kinda becomes noise and confusion that I can see my way through.  This too shall pass... . 

And it does!  While also creating and opening up a safe harbor for bf to sail into.





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« Reply #51 on: July 24, 2015, 04:24:38 PM »

Thanks for the information! I was wanting more information about the book as it is 448 pages long.

I have read similar information in other places. The bottom line is to commit to working on yourself and becoming differentiated in order to grow the relationship. I recently listened to some recordings from a marriage therapist that said some of these same things. Instead of focusing on being committed to the relationship, you have to be committed to personal growth. With the help of people on these forums, I think I have done pretty well at focusing on myself more.

I wonder if this book is mentioned in the book review section of this forum. Maybe you could start a thread over there to discuss the book. It looks really interesting.

Hey VOC,

Here is an overview of the book:  www.passionatemarriage.com/passionatemarriage/overview

And a review:  www.crucible4points.com/book-review-passionate-marriage-dr-david-schnarch

I think what struck me so much about this book was the paradigm of "holding onto myself" WHILE literally holding onto my partner in the midst of the intimate act of lovemaking.  The discomfort of being so very intimate with myself in that moment... .even when he was or wasn't  being his most intimate with me or himself. 

I am wonderfully independent and easily fashioned a happy life of my own even while co-existing with my husband.  So in some ways I felt very differentiated.  But when push came to shove, maybe (certainly) I was less so than I thought b/c I was very uncomfortable and unwilling to be that intimate with him... .that intimate with myself while with him.  I guess it feels like it was easier to be intimate with him when there was distance; but could I be really intimate with myself and with him while he was that close?  I could do all the good sex stuff.  But that was radically different than the intimacy I read about in the book (which does not promote lame sex, btw).  Whatever it was, it was a serious growing edge and I didn't go there. 

As I write about it, I realize I need to go back and read the book!  It resonated with me so my encouraging you to read it is likely also an invitation for me to read it again.

I look forward to hearing more from you - what works and what doesn't - on your quest for more intimacy!
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« Reply #52 on: July 24, 2015, 06:33:43 PM »

Looking back, I can see that it was my body/mind/soul's way of keeping me from seeing something/dealing with it. I was completely unaware at the time.

I think you may be on to something with this. I have often questioned his tendency to fall asleep. He can stay awake to play games, read books, and do other stuff. It feels like he can't stay awake to talk to me unless we go sit on the porch, which is less than stellar due to summer heat and mosquitoes.

I think he is in complete denial. There is something going on with him that he cannot or will not confront because he is too afraid. He doesn't deal with things as they come up. He tends to wait until there is no option but to deal with it. I think that it is a deal where "If I ignore it long enough, it will go away."

Yep, I believe the denial / if I ignore it long enough it will go away thing is happening.

This bit of insight into what is going on underneath your H's awareness at these times is err ... .not actionable on your part, I don't think.

You can't really shake him out of denial. He'll have to find his own way out. I know when *I* did things like that I didn't figure it out 'till months or years later, although mine was less of a repeated pattern than his, I think. Dunno if that means it was easier or harder for me to figure it out though!



Unrelated Note: I really liked the book "Passionate Marriage" and I'd say that it dealt with sex and relationships together, mostly because sex is an important part of relationships, and one that usually isn't talked about very well between the partners. What I got out of it was more about relationships, personal growth, and differentiation. (Perhaps I'm not remembering the parts specifically about sex as much right now. It has been a while since I read it.)

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« Reply #53 on: July 25, 2015, 11:38:36 AM »

Yep, I believe the denial / if I ignore it long enough it will go away thing is happening.

This bit of insight into what is going on underneath your H's awareness at these times is err ... .not actionable on your part, I don't think.

You are right. It isn't something that is actionable on my part. What recognizing this does for me is allow me to stop wondering and ruminating and asking the question of "Why isn't he doing something about this?" He isn't addressing some things because he is unable to acknowledge their existence. Being aware of that helps me to not take things so personally and it helps me to be more patient.

That is a far cry from when I was convinced that he was or wasn't doing things based on his love for me. His love for me is not really in the equation at all and it does me no good to sit and fret about it.

Excerpt
You can't really shake him out of denial. He'll have to find his own way out. I know when *I* did things like that I didn't figure it out 'till months or years later, although mine was less of a repeated pattern than his, I think. Dunno if that means it was easier or harder for me to figure it out though!

And I know from personal experience how invalidating it is to have somebody else try to describe your reality for you and then insist that you are in denial. (What happened with my coach) I wouldn't wish that kind of invalidation on anybody. Knowing that helps me to be more patient.

I want things fixed and I want them fixed right now!  Smiling (click to insert in post)

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« Reply #54 on: July 25, 2015, 02:03:12 PM »

  (What happened with my coach) 

At some point... .I'd love to hear more about your thoughts on your experience with a coach. 

The concept is new to me... so I'm curious.

However... my understanding is there is some painful stuff there... .so... .if you would rather skip it... .or wait... I understand!

FF
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« Reply #55 on: July 25, 2015, 03:37:44 PM »

  (What happened with my coach) 

At some point... .I'd love to hear more about your thoughts on your experience with a coach. 

The concept is new to me... so I'm curious.

However... my understanding is there is some painful stuff there... .so... .if you would rather skip it... .or wait... I understand!

I will give some cursory thoughts about the coach. This thread will be locked soon as it is reaching its post limit. Maybe I can post about it some more in the personal inventory board.

First off, I didn't really see much difference between what the coach was doing and what I have done with counselors in the past.

I thought she was supposed to help me set goals and stay motivated to do small stuff like take regular walks. I am not sure how or when things got so convoluted. She was a trauma coach. As I reflect back on that, I am not sure how that is possible. How can somebody that doesn't have extensive training in pscychology, trauma, etc. coach somebody through something traumatic.

She was working with me pro bono. Her normal fee was something like 125 an hour. If I had that kind of money, I would completely bypass using a coach and go to a trained professional.

Another problem with the coaching stuff is that, in my state and many others, coaches are not regulated. I had a similar problem with a licensed professional, I could have talked to the state regulators. When I called them, they said that I had no recourse as they are not regulated.

I wouldn't recommend using a life coach in all honesty. She was supposed to NOT be a counselor and not venture into areas where a licensed professional would be better. I can't fathom a counselor or anybody saying, "What I see is a woman that is being physically, emotionally, and sexually abused and is in deep denial." I think my experience with`a coach is very skewed and not likely representative of other people's experiences with a life coach.
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« Reply #56 on: July 25, 2015, 06:27:10 PM »

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This thread has reached its post limit, and is now closed. This is a worthwhile topic, and you are free to start a new thread to continue the conversation. Thanks for your understanding... .
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