My new therapist said my BPDw's words were inexcusable

[Samuel S.]

After having fallen down nearby her office, I met with a new therapist today. So, I wasn't in a very happy mood with myself after having fallen down. After getting insurance and vital info written down, she asked why I was there with her. I explained about the verbal abuse and the neglect that I have suffered through due by my BPDw. I gave specifics, all of which she summarized as saying that my BPDw's words were inexcusable. As for the neglect, my therapist said that being a couple means you make time for being a couple. I said that we sometimes have a meal in front of one another, although she quickly eats and goes in order to clean up and to return to her studies. Also, maybe, once a week or twice a month, we walk around the lake for about 45 minutes. Otherwise, she is too busy with her studies, work, and preparing some meals.

After this exchange between me and my therapist, she asked me why I am still in the marriage. I said that I am holding onto hope and that I want to learn how to forgive my BPDw and myself. She retorted that hope works if the two of us can work as a couple, but it is pretty evident that my BPDw is unwilling or incapable due to her past. As for forgiving, she said I can learn to forgive her and myself, but she has manipulated and essentially brainwashed me or mentally abused me.

At the end of our session, we agreed that I would meet with her again in two weeks. Her words of wisdom were very realistic and a lot to process. She was straightforward and is concerned about me and my physical and mental health.

[Samuel S.]

This is a follow-up to my first post. Considering that my BPDw has been happier due to her studies although she gets frustrated and complains about them, she has not been verbally abusive for the past 10 months more or less. I am feeling the PTSD from all of the verbal abuse which my new counselor said is due to having been brainwashed. Thus, my BPDw is happier, and I have PTSD. I have felt neglected due to her busy schedule.

So, all of this makes me doubt myself. You folks have told me that she won't apologize, and she hasn't. It's like she has shelved her verbal abuse for a considerable amount of time due to being so busy and happier. So, I am doubting myself, because my reactions to her verbal abuse haven't gone away.

So, besides working with this new counselor, should I see a hypnotist? I am being serious. I just don't know, and I was wondering if I could get some feedback from you folks. Thank you!

[once removed]

hey samuel s 

to answer your question, i did a bit of research on hypnotherapy. from my vantage point, it is legitimate therapy, though results are mixed. have you researched it, and what would you hope to gain as a result of it?

"She retorted that hope works if the two of us can work as a couple, but it is pretty evident that my BPDw is unwilling or incapable due to her past."

i think this is accurate. perhaps unfortunately, we must accept people as they are, not how we would like them to be. of course you would like an acknowledgment of the abuse and remorse. it may seem trite in comparison, but this is true of everyone, not just pwBPD; i have a very close friend, and id love it if he were more empathetic, but he isnt, and i dont know if he ever will be, and if i expect him to be, it only leads to resentment. on the contrary, i have a close friend who had extremely limited empathy for most of his life, but later into it he developed it and became a very reliable go to. these things depend on the person. you mention the verbal abuse hasnt happened for the past ten months. that is a long time. do you feel the pattern/cycle has broken or changed?

abuse is generally conditioning. its understandable that when it lessens, you step back and see it for what it is, and begin to process it, and really feel the effects of it. i had a hard time receiving raging texts about how terrible i was, then hearing apologies and how great i was; it simply didnt add up. but i was never given the opportunity to really analyze that dynamic. if i tried to discuss with her the extent of what shed just said, and how hurt i was, it tended to trigger a lot of shame, and that was too difficult to deal with. that is likely going on in your case, if not to a varying extent.

[an0ught]

Hi Samuel S.

distance and boundaries tend to be pretty effective in stopping abuse. It is good to see that the immediate abuse has stopped. But since she is not doing so much work her growth will be limited any apology if it will be ever coming is far off. In your position I would rather focus on boundaries that are under your control. The way I see it you got a lot of benefit from her being distracted/distant. That is a working but poor substitute for boundaries - the process of setting boundaries, feeling they are effective can help a lot to restore the feeling of safety and leaves you less at her mercy if attention turns back to you.

To deal with PTSD I would suggest you discuss this with your T as this relates to your treatment with her. A possible source for an overview may be this book: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=213669.0

[Samuel S.]

Once Removed, while getting an apology would be a step in the right direction, the old adage is true that "actions speak louder than words".

As for the absence of the verbal abuse for the past ten months, yes, it is a long time, but the proof will be the next couple of weeks when she is off from school, when she will be around here much more so. Also, I am going to be gone for a week visiting my daughter and her family in another state. I didn't plan it to happen this way. It was a question of when my BPDw's schooling was over, when my daughter and her family were available, and when I would be available. So, I think it will be a good break for her and for me, although I don't know what will happen when I return.

So, is the pattern/cycle broken or changed? I think it has changed for now in that she has two more years of studying. Then, when she is apt to be around more so, then, that will be the key indicator of any significant, permanent change.

It just so happens that my T does practice hynotherapy. She did not mention it in my first visit with her, but I intend to bring it up to her in order to see what she thinks. As for what I would hope to gain from it, I would hope to be able to be at peace with myself, that I am okay, that I am innocent, and that I maybe even erase some, if not all, of her verbal abuse, seeing that she has not been verbally abusive for the past ten months, but I oftentimes will replay it in my mind, especially when I am alone.

AnOught, you are right on about boundaries. In fact, if or when she is verbally abusive again, I am going to leave the room or our home. I need to protect myself, because I have been damaged enough with all of her verbal abuse over the years and the PTSD as well. I will check out the book you have recommended and discuss it with my T. Thank you!

[Suspicious1]

Samuel, it depends on what you're wanting to achieve with hypno. If you want to forget about the abuse, hypno won't help with that - it may help you have a different response to the memory of it. However the best method for reducing PTSD symptoms would be EMDR rather than hypnotherapy. Hypnotherapy is more about changing behaviours. EMDR is very good at reducing responses to trauma, and does so rapidly.

[Samuel S.]

My BPDw wanted to talk with me on the phone while I am visiting my daughter and her family out of state. So, I called her as planned this morning. She informed me that due to her oldest daughter's death 16 years ago, to talk with me even if I wouldn't say anything about my family visit, that she would be triggered to feel sadness each time. She cried and said she would be okay, but she doesn't want me to communicate with her until I return. So, I validated her feelings, and she continue repeating what she said previously. Any comments?

[OnceConfused]

samuel:

I understand the feeling of losing a child, but that is ludicrous that she still brings that up after 16 years as a trigger. I think that is a part of her mental illness. She is incapable of changing, and of living in the moments instead of the past. She is who she is.

Of your part, being aware of your feeling is a part of how to deal with PTSD. In addition to whatever you are doing, you might want to explore Yoga which deals lots with being in the moments and one branch of yoga that is being used to treat PTSD in soldiers after iraq and afghanistan is called YOGA NIDRA taught by RICHARD MILLER. He has a program called Irest. It costs about 20$ for a cd, so you can try at little cost. I personally took a weekend seminar with Richard Miller and was impressed with his uses of Yoga Nidra to help us achieve our intentions. Google Richard Miller Yoga Miller and give it a test

[an0ught]

My BPDw wanted to talk with me on the phone while I am visiting my daughter and her family out of state. So, I called her as planned this morning. She informed me that due to her oldest daughter's death 16 years ago, to talk with me even if I wouldn't say anything about my family visit, that she would be triggered to feel sadness each time. She cried and said she would be okay, but she doesn't want me to communicate with her until I return. So, I validated her feelings, and she continue repeating what she said previously. Any comments?

What she said: Leave me alone

What she did: Reach out to you to feel some sense of connection. She also told you to leave her alone. Yes, it makes no sense. But generally when behavior and talk diverge listen to the walk and not the talk.

PwBPD, at least some, have a very hard time to let go. One reason why your relationship still exists. One reason she has trouble to let go of her dead child.

[Samuel S.]

Cervantes said "the reason of the unreasonable". Indeed, it doesn't make too much sense with my BPDw's reasons, and it is ludicrous. I hope that she realizes that her desire to want to have no contact for the last 5 days completely will have her realize her own irrationality. I honored her request completely. In the meantime, I had a wonderful, very freeing vacation and visit with my D41 and her family.

[Samuel S.]

When I got back from my awesome vacation break, my BPDw informed me that she worked, she cleaned the things that I don't clean well enough for her, and she got sick. Interspersed in her monologue, I validated her feelings, I said that I do the best I can, I said that it was too bad that she got sick. It was her birthday today, and I already had gotten a gift and a card for her which she thanked me, but that was the only positive thing she could say. I then shared some very enjoyable things that I had done which, of course, was belittled, saying that I should have stayed at my daughter's home and how her husband and his family are negative people. I tried to share with her that they are both very loving to one another and to their two very adorable kids. Then, she refuted that by saying that it was an act so that they look good when they really aren't.

Bottom line, she hasn't changed, and she tried to negate all of my positive memories so that she is the only one that counts - again. I can't wait to meet with my counselor on Monday. 

[OnceConfused]

that is so sad that your supposedly best friend/spouse cannot offer any positive support.

That sounds very similar attitude/words by my xBPDgf. She interjected comments with negative tone about my young daughters at the time (even at one point calling them B*tches). Another example is  After meeting with my old friend and his wife , whom I had known since high school (over 35 years), within 1 hour the xBPDgf began to say something negative about my best friend's wife.

Like you, I felt the inability to breathe around her. I could not and did not DARE to say anything of significance for the fear that whatever I said might trigger her BPD. It got to the point where I just stayed very superficial about our conversation, I focused on her stories so that I did not have to share mine. INterestingly, when we first met, she focused on my stories and mirrored my actions - making me feel like I met my soul mate from heaven (all of that as I learned later were the strategy that BPD used to attract others ).

Even as of today, after 9 years away from xbpgf and am married to a very wonderful wife now, I still have cold sweat thinking of what could happen to me , my children and my business HAD I NOT HAVE THE COURAGE TO SAY GOOD BYE and STAYED WITH BPD.

[Samuel S.]

Now that I have been back from my short vacation, my BPDw has had many mood swings, from being very angry to being depressed. She was angry with me due to me not being able to clean according to her specifications. Also, she had to work. Also, a fellow employee got her sick by using the same computer keyboard while being sick herself. So, my BPDw cast her blame and her guilt onto me.

Now, she is being depressed and not angry due to the fact that she is thinking about her own childhood trauma which was bad with verbal, emotional, and physical abuse. So, her "medium counselor" gave her some advice, basically to journal. So, I had a bunch of medical appointments today. So, that worked well that she could remain by herself.

Now that I am back for dinner, I asked her if she would like me to go out again so that she could have that much more alone time; however, she said no.

Bottom line, she is very depressed. She is given some direction by her "medium counselor", but that person is not a professional whatsoever. My BPDw needs a licensed therapist, but she refuses to do that and only believes in her "medium counselor".

I honestly don't know what to do in this situation.

[OnceConfused]

you can try so much to help, but after a certain threshold you should develop an attitude that (i learned this 30 years ago from a seminar):

I care but only that much.

Think about that line for a while and its beautiful implication in our lives.

You should care for your spouse or others because we are compassionate inside, but once we care TOO MUCH than we become frustrated and angry when they dont do it or things don't go the right way. Many times in life, people will do things that are crazy or bizarre, like what your wife has been doing. We are hurt seeing her being depressed or doing non-sense stuffs, but we have to accept that who she is and that what she does. We are all different. An example I use often is that we bring this beautiful rose bush inside the house but its thorns keep hurting us. So we spend time with a file, filing off the thorns. But the new thorns keep coming out. So what is the solution:

1. ENjoy the rose and also enjoy the injury it causes to us

2. keep wasting time filing off the thorn

3. Move the rose bush to the outside garden so we can move freely in our home.

The more you want to change your wife, the more frustrated you are. WHy? Because our own ego (which says we must be better than others), keep us from changing. To her, your frustration and unhappiness do not come from her actions but purely from your imperfection, so she sees that you are the one that MUST change not she.

Ask yourself your philosophical question like : what is the meaning of my life? how can I be happy and peaceful?   - your answers to them will DRIVE you actions. The purpose of your life will determine your path. If you don't have a purpose in life, then whoever enters your life will dictate your path.

I asked those same questions. The answers I found helped me see the impossibility of trying to change someone else and that as FENG SHUI concept dictates , why spend energy trying to AVOID certain things like sharp corners  and why not just get rid of those sharp corners in your house and then move about freely like the wind.

[once removed]

hey samuel s

thanks for keeping us posted. im really glad to read you got a vacation, however short. howd it go? i also wonder, are you able to get regular "me time"? i know its probably harder these days.

im sorry to hear your wife is depressed . i think its great that youre there for her. with a depressed person, sometimes thats all we can do, and sometimes thats what they need the most. i know that can be even more difficult to do when a person is casting blame and guilt onto you, when youre there for her. not letting resentment overcome you is a testament to your strength. this is why "me time" is crucial.

hang in there. you have us here for you

[Samuel S.]

OnceConfused, yes, it hurts to see my BPDw hurting emotionally, and I know it is her own hurt. This is how her life is up to this point and time, and she is the only one who can change her own perspective. I do not want to change her, because that is how she is. She is trying by changing careers through her current studies. Nevertheless, when she starts imposing her hurt onto me with her verbally abusive remarks, then, my boundaries try to come up and rightfully so. I do the best I can not to take on her verbally abusive remarks, but it is very hard to ward them off. It can almost be suffocating. In fact, the next time she wants to be that way, I intend to walk out the door.

As for what is the meaning of my life, it means to me to enjoy the people and the things around my life, to love, to validate, to help, and to see different parts of the world - all of which I value and act upon. These things are what help me be happy and peaceful and drive me to act. That is why I have been successful both personally and professionally.

Once Removed, my vacation was really great, visiting with my daughter and her family, going to Yellowstone National Park, and even experiencing lava hot springs.

I do have regular "me time", thank goodness, with exercising, going to movies, visiting friends and family.

Yes, I have been here for my BPDw over the years, even with her depression at different times and even with her verbally abusive remarks with me. I don't let resentment overcome me, because although I am human and have made minor mistakes, the verbally abusive remarks are a reflection of her, and I never am verbally abusive with her or anyone else. We all need love, respect, compassion, and validation. Having been brought up in a home where my parents argued a lot made me realize that people need these things unconditionally, and this has helped me both personally and professionally.

[once removed]

i think thats just the greatest attitude samuel s, and a real testament to your strength. the tools here have improved me and my relationships too.

doing better today?

[TheRealJongoBong]

Hi Samual S.

My uBPD wife was verbally abusive to me for many years. Also for many years I let all those barbs dig straight into me and it hurt, it hurt a lot. Then it came to me at one point that it takes two people to make an abusive relationship. It's only abuse if I let it get to me, if I accept the words as judgements on myself. Otherwise it's just ranting from an unbalanced mind, screams and cries from a 3 year old. Would I seriously believe anything a 3 year old would tell me? Sticks and stones can break my bones, but names can NEVER hurt me. If/when she starts again, step back an inch and just watch - you'll learn a lot.

Your wife is trying to abuse you because she is hurting inside and most likely believes all those horrible things apply to herself (although she would never admit it). Everything she says is a window into her own emotional world, she's desperate and like a drowning person will pull anyone in to try to save herself.

The hardest thing for me to realize was that the woman I fell in love with was not real. She was an act, a cardboard cutout covering over the real person I see today. The "love" she expressed for me wasn't real either. It was a defensive covering to lure me in so she could keep trying to hide from herself and pretend that everything was OK.

Stay strong and BE yourself!

[itgirl]

Ask yourself your philosophical question like : what is the meaning of my life? how can I be happy and peaceful?   - your answers to them will DRIVE you actions. The purpose of your life will determine your path. If you don't have a purpose in life, then whoever enters your life will dictate your path.

Wow! This is too good not to read again. Thank you.