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Author Topic: Dealing with nonstop heightened emotions?  (Read 456 times)
thisagain
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« on: August 12, 2015, 01:59:32 PM »

What do you do on those nights when your SO is bouncing from one intense emotional reaction to the next, and you just want some peace?

This is a pretty mild example but it's the freshest in my memory. Last night my partner had a few rounds of desperately begging me not to leave her, and also had a weird episode of basically raging at a TV actress for leaving the TV show (like "I hate her! I can't ever watch the show again! how dare she? she should go to hell!". And her stomach hurt, and she wanted to show me pictures of lizards (which she loves and knows I don't care for, so even being supportive of her excitement about the lizards takes emotional effort for me). So she was pretty much constantly asking something from me emotionally for several hours.

I did my best to validate throughout that, especially because I know she's been feeling invalidated lately. And I guess I should be glad that the rage wasn't directed at me. But it still got exhausting. How could I use a boundary without triggering her fear that I don't care about her?

Last night I was trying to work so it was a little easier--I could just say something like "I'm really sorry your stomach hurts, I have to work now but please let me know if you want me to get you some ginger tea." But sometimes I don't have a good excuse like work and I really just want to rest.
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Ceruleanblue
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« Reply #1 on: August 12, 2015, 02:03:34 PM »

Well, I have no advice, but it sounds like you are doing really well in the face of it all. My BPDh had been dysregulating for a while now, and after a while, it's so much harder to deal with.

It sounds like you are doing what you need to do, but what happens if you just need some down time? How does she react to that. Does it come at a high price for you? Can you maybe warn her that you need some time for yourself? Does that help, if she has time to know it's coming?
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thisagain
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« Reply #2 on: August 13, 2015, 01:04:48 PM »

Thanks for your kind words. I hear you on it getting harder after a while. I feel very fortunate that we aren't married and that I found bpdfamily after 2 years instead of 20!

I'm kind of scared to ask for down time, because I think it will trigger a full-on dysregulation that will end up taking more from me than the series of needy moments. I can't really do down time when she's dysregulated anyways. It's pretty impossible (and feels kind of cruel) to just sit around reading a book or something while she's sobbing.

There are also things that she doesn't view as putting an emotional burden on me, so she'd probably keep doing them unless I told her I didn't want her to talk to me at all (which again would trigger major abandonment fear dysregulation). Like telling me her stomach hurts. The emotional burden happens because she can't soothe herself about it, so she just keeps looking to me for comfort.

Or sometimes she'll get really silly and try to get me to go along with it even though she should be able to tell that I don't think it's funny. Same idea with showing me pictures of the lizards she wants as a pet, when she knows I don't like them. It's like she sometimes becomes incapable of connecting with me in a mutual place so I have to work really hard to connect with her on her terms. Which is emotionally draining, both because it takes effort and because it reminds me that I have this partner who sometimes can't connect with me unless I'm pretending to be excited about her lizard plans.

Next month we're moving to different places (about an hour apart) for work/school, so I'm looking forward to having more down time. But then I'm also concerned that when we do see each other, the abandonment fear is going to be so overwhelming that she won't be able to connect with me at all.
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ptilda
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« Reply #3 on: August 13, 2015, 02:05:21 PM »

It's about control. In the crazy BPD mind, they must control and manipulate you because it's the only way for them to ensure that they won't lose you. They constantly test their ability to continue to control you, to ensure that you are still there for them. What is making this continue is your continued patience. While I agree that you're doing great work, I also agree that you need to take some "you" time.

Let her know, "sweetheart, I love you very much, and I assure you that I'll be back, but I'm feeling a little stressed right now, and I don't want to take it out on you, so I'm going to take [period of time] to grab a coffee and read a book. See you soon."

Don't ask permission. She'll likely stress and panic, but when you return, you'll feel better, and your return as promised can help to solidify your commitment to her outside of her normal manipulations. This could be the beginning of her emotional recovery. Understanding that love does not have to be manipulated from someone, but is given out of their free will.

My advice as a "newbie."
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« Reply #4 on: August 13, 2015, 02:43:11 PM »

Let her know, "sweetheart, I love you very much, and I assure you that I'll be back, but I'm feeling a little stressed right now, and I don't want to take it out on you, so I'm going to take [period of time] to grab a coffee and read a book. See you soon."

Use some trial and error... .

If she is mad at YOU... .then skip the affection (I love you will most likely invalidate... .almost a certainty)

If she is mad at the TV (which I deal with... .)... .then try it a few times each way and see if one is better than the other.

Think of it as demonstrating a good coping mechanism...

She is mad at TV... .ropes you into it... .you are stressed... .and tell her that YOU need a break... .(don't fix or suggest anything for her)... .give her timeframe for you to be back... .

If she lashes out at you...

"help me understand how it can be upsetting for you... .but not for me... ."

Then...

"we each deal with our emotions in different ways... ."  no judgement to her... .DO NOT ACCEPT ANY BACK FROM HER...

FF
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thisagain
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« Reply #5 on: August 13, 2015, 07:35:12 PM »

Thanks for the tips FF! Good reminder that "I love you" can feel invalidating when she's mad at me. It's important to remember that she thinks really differently sometimes. I used to spend a lot of time trying to convince her to at least say "I love you and I'll be back soon" before she ran off during a fight (I've since realized that's not going to happen consistently although sometimes she volunteers it).

Sometimes when I try to take a break like that, she freaks out and starts begging me to tell her if she did something wrong, if I'm mad at her, am I going to leave her, etc. It can be inconsolable. Should I just say my part and then literally walk out the door while she's losing it like that?
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formflier
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« Reply #6 on: August 13, 2015, 09:12:30 PM »

Should I just say my part and then literally walk out the door while she's losing it like that?

Very general advice here... .

Say that you need to take a break... .

Or sometimes "we" need to take a break... .

"you" need to take a break... .is almost always a recipe for disaster...

When it's time to exit... .the less you say... .the better... .

Give it a time frame... .I'm going to take a break... I'll be back in 10 minutes... .stick to it.

When you come back... .test the waters... .if she hasn't calmed... .go for longer... .again... name the time.

The reason you name the time is to attempt to lessen her fear of abandonment.

If she claims you are abandoning her... .even after naming a time... .ignore it.  Don't debate it...

You need a break... .she can feel abandoned... .

FF
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Mel1968
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« Reply #7 on: August 14, 2015, 07:33:53 AM »

Thanks for the tips FF! Good reminder that "I love you" can feel invalidating when she's mad at me. It's important to remember that she thinks really differently sometimes.

I hope you don't mind me joining in, but please can you explain why my saying " I love you" can seem invalidating? I always assumed it was reassuring and made an effort to try and remember to say it!

Thank you

Mel
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waverider
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« Reply #8 on: August 14, 2015, 07:38:52 AM »

Chaos shared is chaos normalized. It is a way of avoiding the need to soothe. It becomes self perpetuating.

She needs time alone to practice self soothing, this is what she is avoiding, and your continued presence prevents it. It is not easy and it feels harsh, but it is necessary.

You need your space for your own mental health, otherwise you wont be able to offer effective support which in itself will become triggering.
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waverider
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« Reply #9 on: August 14, 2015, 07:49:22 AM »

Thanks for the tips FF! Good reminder that "I love you" can feel invalidating when she's mad at me. It's important to remember that she thinks really differently sometimes.

I hope you don't mind me joining in, but please can you explain why my saying " I love you" can seem invalidating? I always assumed it was reassuring and made an effort to try and remember to say it!

Thank you

Mel

Depends why they are mad at you, if they are essentially trying to say you dont and xyz is the reason. By saying you do is a direct contradiction which to them is saying they are wrong and you are ignoring or dismissing their "evidence".

It is reassuring if they are actually asking the question. But to simply state the counter is an opening to up the anti debate, they have to win, to prove their point, so they bring out more "evidence" to prove you dont.

This applies to anything, if they are emotionally charged and say XYZ is a fact, if you say that fact is wrong, the reaction will be the same. They will not go from anger to 'ok, thats right if you say so". Its an auto defensive reaction
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thisagain
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« Reply #10 on: August 14, 2015, 01:53:20 PM »

Chaos shared is chaos normalized. It is a way of avoiding the need to soothe. It becomes self perpetuating.

She needs time alone to practice self soothing, this is what she is avoiding, and your continued presence prevents it. It is not easy and it feels harsh, but it is necessary.

This makes so much sense! Thanks for the insight. She always gets really upset and anxious when I'm not around.

On a related note, how should I respond when we've spent a night apart and once we see each other, she goes on and on about how much she missed me, she couldn't sleep at all without me, she was so scared because I wasn't there to keep the bad guys away, etc? Are there valid things in there to validate? I don't want to come across as agreeing that her response is normal or okay. Like if I said "aww I'm sorry you couldn't sleep," I'm worried she'd interpret that as agreement that depending on me that much is okay.

Personally I can't say I miss her THAT much when we're apart. I mostly just do my thing. When we're doing well then I sometimes miss her more, because I want to share something with her or miss our snuggles at bedtime, but still nowhere near as intensely as she misses me.
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« Reply #11 on: August 14, 2015, 02:20:09 PM »

I think don't say anything. Just hold her. That's really what she wants anyhow. . . I think?
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waverider
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« Reply #12 on: August 14, 2015, 06:33:23 PM »

Chaos shared is chaos normalized. It is a way of avoiding the need to soothe. It becomes self perpetuating.

She needs time alone to practice self soothing, this is what she is avoiding, and your continued presence prevents it. It is not easy and it feels harsh, but it is necessary.

This makes so much sense! Thanks for the insight. She always gets really upset and anxious when I'm not around.

On a related note, how should I respond when we've spent a night apart and once we see each other, she goes on and on about how much she missed me, she couldn't sleep at all without me, she was so scared because I wasn't there to keep the bad guys away, etc? Are there valid things in there to validate? I don't want to come across as agreeing that her response is normal or okay. Like if I said "aww I'm sorry you couldn't sleep," I'm worried she'd interpret that as agreement that depending on me that much is okay.

Personally I can't say I miss her THAT much when we're apart. I mostly just do my thing. When we're doing well then I sometimes miss her more, because I want to share something with her or miss our snuggles at bedtime, but still nowhere near as intensely as she misses me.

I have seen my wife's councellor respond to this type of thing which he calls catastrophizing, and hes says things like,

" I know this triggers fears, but what is the worst that actually happened? Don't focus on the what ifs, what was the worst that actually happened, and what was the worst thing that happened last time, and the last time before that? Why is this time any different and why would you expect it to be worse next time"

>>Reality reinforcement. By asking rather than telling you are not directly invalidating. When she starts to waffle on about small things and what ifs, bring her back to what was the worst that actually happened, did anyone come to any harm? Don't go into endless reassurances of minor issues, otherwise you set a precedent for making a fuss just to elicit reassurances from you, and the pattern becomes set in stone.
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thisagain
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« Reply #13 on: August 15, 2015, 10:56:11 PM »

I have seen my wife's councellor respond to this type of thing which he calls catastrophizing, and hes says things like,

" I know this triggers fears, but what is the worst that actually happened? Don't focus on the what ifs, what was the worst that actually happened, and what was the worst thing that happened last time, and the last time before that? Why is this time any different and why would you expect it to be worse next time"

>>Reality reinforcement. By asking rather than telling you are not directly invalidating. When she starts to waffle on about small things and what ifs, bring her back to what was the worst that actually happened, did anyone come to any harm? Don't go into endless reassurances of minor issues, otherwise you set a precedent for making a fuss just to elicit reassurances from you, and the pattern becomes set in stone.

Have you ever tried that technique in your relationship? Sometimes if I'm fretting about "what if X happens," my therapist will respond "SO WHAT if X happens? What is the worst thing that could result from X?" ... .but I'm a generally stable and healthy person so I'm able to see that my feelings don't line up with reality. Can a pwBPD do that?

I think the worst part for her is just being alone with her thoughts (and without an easy target to project or otherwise dump all her bad feelings onto?). It's not that she's afraid something bad will actually happen. When she mentions keeping the bad guys away, sometimes I remind her that I'm a physically disabled, unarmed woman and would do a terrible job of fending off bad guys. That sometimes puts a stop to the fussing, because we all know she's really talking about the "bad guys" in her own head but she won't admit that directly.
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thisagain
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« Reply #14 on: August 15, 2015, 11:06:16 PM »

I just started moving into my new apartment today--around an hour and a half away from where she'll be living--and I can already tell it's going to be very relaxing. She was pissy about various little crises of the day (e.g., air mattress won't inflate but she refuses to go buy a pump for it) and so she didn't want to talk to me much. But instead of having to be in the same room with her while she pouts or rants, I just worked on setting up my new place exactly how I want it and then ordered a nice dinner and watched a movie  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

It feels like a bad sign for the relationship that I'm happy about not living together anymore. I guess I see living apart or taking lots of time-outs as more of a temporary fix while waiting for the permanent improvement. But I also don't want to rely on just hoping she'll get better at self-soothing and regulating her emotions.

In the long term, assuming she doesn't get better, are there other ways to make this less draining on me? Other than just leaving the room or apartment when it's too much? Five years from now, I'd like to be living with my partner and I don't want to be spending almost every evening at the coffee shop or in separate rooms because she couldn't shut up about being mad at the TV. You know?
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« Reply #15 on: August 16, 2015, 12:18:45 AM »

Have you ever tried that technique in your relationship? Sometimes if I'm fretting about "what if X happens," my therapist will respond "SO WHAT if X happens? What is the worst thing that could result from X?" ... .but I'm a generally stable and healthy person so I'm able to see that my feelings don't line up with reality. Can a pwBPD do that?

I do it all the time now. Is it a quick fix reassurance? Not always, but the thing is it stops the spread onto bandwagon issues. Crisis containment if you like. Once a crisis is allowed to spread it can set fire to all sorts of dramas, which you will find more exasperating to deal with, all opf which deflect from the real issue.
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