S5 Very Angry, Wants Mom, God, and Himself To Die

[Turkish]

I just talked to their mom for over half an hour.

S5 has had anger issues, a lot towards his little sister D3. He hits her and knocks her down a lot. He did this yesterday when we were at a movie theater. Not seeming angry, he s over her down. I got mad and grabbed him. People looked at us. I told him to not do that. We went to the bathrooms, then went home.

She had them tonight, the first of two days. The other week, she told me that he was so angry at her, that he said that he wished that she would run into the street, get run very by a car and die... This was before she went on vacation for 4 days, so I had the kids for most of her weekend. I have them again Thursday through Sat evening, most of her weekend again. So I've had them for mostly 5 weekends in a row. .

Tonight, she told me that she had to put him on timeout for hitting his sister. He said that he wished that God would kill him because he was a sinner. She asked why. He said because he hit his sister. She tried comforting, him, but he said he didn't want him to touch her. She was rubbing his back. I said that sometimes he did that with me (though not saying it), and I hugged him anyway, and that seemed to calm him. The church we go to isn't cultish, but he's associating something herd. If not Sunday School doctrine, then I don't think his feelings would change. They'd be the same, with a different context.

He's emotionally sensitive. I've noticed that since he was 2. I observed holes in his moms attempts to vslidate him (she tries; and I'm not perfect either). The obession with death concerns us, as well as the anger, not as much directed at me. Called the T... .what else to do?

[Sunfl0wer]

Sorry Turkish, I know, as a parent, it is quite upsetting to worry about our kids.

Have you considered a Behavioral Specialist?

My experience was when my S7 was having trouble with class tasks.  The behavioral specialist did a study, observation, and her approach was very "scientific" like vs judgmental, in elliciting behaviors S needed, while trying to extinguish ones that were not serving him well.  She educated us on specific approaches, and created a structured system for handling specific things.

The result was great!  I had no idea what ABA's do and was at first feeling that a behavioral intervention meant my S was "bad" and in my head, he was more scared/withdrawn vs a behavior problem, so I was a bit cautious going in.  After following her plan, S7 appeared to feel much more in control of things as he could predict them and see the cause and /affect easier.  He became enthusiastic about following through with desired tasks and was just more motivated.

[Ulysses]

Wow, Turkish, that sounds difficult.  It sounds like you understand your children and I don't think it's unusual to have to leave an event when they're young and misbehaving.  It sounds like the children have been with you a lot lately and you're doing the heavy-lifting.

When my son was 5 he asked a lot of questions about death and heaven.  He also had meltdowns but was not mean to his sister (she was an infant and he understood "babies break" and he needed to be careful).  He's always been sensitive and prone to angry outbursts.  When he was five we made a list with him about what he could do when he feels angry (e.g. run outside, lay on the couch until calm, pet the dog, etc.).  We hung up the list where he could see it.  I've had some recent issues with him and he's 12, which worries me.  My D7 sometimes cries and talks about being a bad person, being worthless, etc.  At those times I sit with her, hold her if she lets me, and follow the advice below.

One thing my S12 former therapist said, who also consulted with me about my D, is to help the child understand that they have yucky feelings inside of them.  They feel yucky (worthless, mad, sinful, etc.), but they are not yucky.  The feelings are there, they're real.  They will work their way through them, and you will be there for them.  They aren't yucky, they have yucky feelings. 

A VBS my kids went to this summer addressed what to do when things don't go well for you, you have a disappointing day, etc.  They talked about talking to a friend, keeping busy, praying, etc.  That's probably too old for your children, but maybe when they get older it will help.

My D7 hit my S when she was about 4 or 5.  It was on a night I was going to leave them alone with their dad (we were still married).  D had been crying for over 2 hours for me not to leave, something that she did frequently.  She hit her brother, then laid down and cried.  Her dad wanted to "punish" her.  I said no way, we argued.  I took care of S, let D cry.  I didn't go to work that evening.  Over the next few days I talked to S and explained D has difficult feelings inside of her, was mad/scared, etc., shouldn't have hit you, and she didn't know how else to express it.  I also worked with D and she, on her own, apologized to her brother, and drew him a picture.  I think it worked much better than cracking down in the moment.  They were older than your children.

S12 I notice gets mean on the mornings he's going to go to his dad's.  I've talked to him about it.  I do crack down a bit when he's mean to his sister (as in, she's young, she didn't do anything to you, we don't speak like that to each other, etc.).  When he's mean to me, I talk to him in a sense of "wondering about it."  Like, I've noticed this and I wonder about it... .Again, that might be too old for your kids.

I like the idea of a behavior specialist.  That might be a very positive way to go.  If both households don't follow-through your son might still have some difficulties.

[Turkish]

The BS (I'll try no not think like that   is a good suggestion.

S5 attended a VBS last month (Vacation Bible Study... .study,.but with crafts and games. He made his mom a bracelet. Me? Nothing, the little  ). His cohort were kindergarteners, of course. He didn't talk much about it. He never has about things. Whatever they quizzed him on during his placement test is still a mystery. I had other people ask him, too. No answer. He's often in his own world.

I was telling a friend today and he remarkrd that S5's rationalizations were advanced. I thought so too when his mom told me what he said. Their mom's going out of town again, so I'll have them for one of her nights and two of her days. I set up the T appt for early next week. His first day f kinder is tomorrow. I'll pay extra attention to him the next 5 days.

I'll process your validation advice, Ulysses.

[livednlearned]

Hi Turkish,

Is there a peer group for kids going through divorce in your area? Maybe at the school?

Validation can take many forms. Talking to other kids his age and a little older might be like super soaking him in validation that he can only get from other kids. He can hear them express feelings, and with the help of a group T, realize that these feelings are shared by others, and are ok, and ultimately can be regulated.

S14 had some outbursts, and the school really wanted him to join a group at school with other kids whose parents divorced. I wish I had him do it, despite his protests. He was so clingy at the time, and the custody battle was in full flame. I look back now and wonder if that was a key outlet that passed us by.

[Turkish]

His first day of school went well today. She brought them since she had them overnight. When we picked them up, he wanted to drive with me to get ice cream (D3 wanted to go with Mom). I cancelled the T appointment (If I hadn't already spent thousands of dollars over the past two years, I'd still go, but I have to draw a line at some point).

I was talking to their mom as we were waiting to pick him up and she basically figured it out: She wasn't giving him enough attention. Sometimes it's the simple things. She initially criticized his choice to go do Mickey D's, but then relented, realizing that it was his day and she may have been invalidating them. He actually just wanted a toy.

She left D3 with grandma the other day and she and S5 went out on a "date." He was really, really happy to be spending time with his mom, and I could see that he was very happy today (I last had him Monday morning).

Of course, their mom is going to some training for her MLM for the next few days, so I'll be keeping them now for two of her days and two overnights, until Sunday afternoon. Everyone seemed cool, so I said that we'd call her, something we stopped a year ago because it was causing issues with S then 4.

His new school has resources for counseling and referrals. If problems crop up, I'll take advantage of them.