Help - Kids and Religon

[Swiggle]

I'm torn about how to approach and go about this. My kids are S8 D12. A background on religion... .

Dad was raised Catholic and by raised I mean he was baptized, made communion and confirmation by doing classes as he attended public school. When he and I met he didn't believe in God and was not into the church thing. The only time we or his parents for that matter went to church were for funerals, weddings. His mom would go on Christmas and Easter but that was it and sometimes she didn't even do that. After her husband my ex's dad had multiple affairs and ran off to another country leaving his family, my MIL became and every Sunday church goer. As a kid i was never baptized, we attended church until I was old enough that my mom couldn't make me go. When ExNPDH got married he insisted it be in a catholic church and I could never understand why since he was never a church person.  Years later I realized he was appeasing his mother.

Our kids... .when they were born my MIL insisted on getting them baptized. ExNPDH kept telling his mom to mind her own business that we would handle it how we saw fit. He and I were of the mindset that if they wanted to be baptized later in life and follow a path to that, they could. He was NEVER into it the religious thing. After we divorced I know my MIL was relentless with my ex and with talking to my kids about baptism and catholic religion and all that jazz. It was a battle in the beginning but since the kids said they wanted to do this I supported it and agreed to the baptism, and classes to make it all happen. Now, my daughter is starting to see that it really means nothing except a way for her to feel like making grandma and dad happy. Dad currently never goes to church. The kids go with my MIL when they happen to be with her but usually insist they don't want to go no one makes them.

Daughter doesn't want to do the PSR classes any longer. This isn't a journey she wants to walk at this point in her life, she sees it as walking the journey for others. I'm torn with what to do. The classes are once a week for an hour and 20 minutes. We have 50/50 parenting so this means on my weeks they also have to go. My MIL (she is my exMIL) but we have a good relationship so I don't want to hinder that but I also want to support what my daughter wants. I feel like religion is such a personal thing and honestly at 12 I'm pretty sure she isn't into the religion like some are. I feel like it is all for show, all to appease Ex's mom and to say look at my kids they are catholic. I mean they aren't continuing the teachings at home, they don't go to church, heck their dad doesn't even believe in God. Of course he won't admit that anymore because he has to mirror the new person in his life.

I always try and look at things in "what is best for the kids" kind of way. But with this I just don't know. It isn't hurting them by going to these classes and doing all that needs to be done. But it is hard knowing that it isn't really for the kids, it is for other people. If I don't take them to the classes on my time then the program doesn't work out. I think to dad and grandma would find a way to have them do it in another way so they end up doing it anyway.  

[livednlearned]

Oof, that's a hard one. I always find myself most stuck when I have two closely related values in conflict with each other.

If you had to prioritize your values here, what would they be?

[Swiggle]

I've always been of the mindset that values, morals and faith aren't just taught in church. One of my values as I've gone through divorce and coparenting with a HC person is to do what is best for my kids, regardless of what their other parent thinks. I also try really hard to teach my kids that other peoples emotional health is not their responsibility and they shouldn't bend into a pretzel to please others when it goes against their values/wants/needs. It is a fine balancing act because sometimes it is about compromise and doing things for others even when it isn't something you might be wanting to do. I feel like I'm not making sense. I guess if I had to list it, it would look like this... .

religion and religious teachings aren't bad, it isn't hurting the kids, they are learning about the beliefs their grandma and maybe their dad hold. Even with these classes and doing all the catholic stuff, I can still teach them about values, morals and faith in other ways.

Knowing that this is all happening not because it is what my kids want or even what is best for them but that it is happening to fulfill someone else's agenda. The last time my daughter mentioned not wanting to go, I said well if you feel strongly about this I think you should have a conversation with dad and grandma about it and support whatever the outcome of that is or support the status quo even if she doesn't have that conversation. Another value I have is helping the kids learn to ask for what they need and not bail them out of difficult situations.

So my values on this... .

teaching the kids not they shouldn't bend and twist to please others.

By not taking them during my parenting time, they aren't learning to not bend and twist. They can still learn that lesson, by talking about the reasons they are doing the classes


supporting my kids in what they want, not what the other parent wants. I stop taking them, the aren't learning how to communicate the difficult conversations.

teaching them to communicate what they need and have conversations, even the difficult ones. By not taking them they wouldn't even need to have that conversation, it becomes me having it for them in the context of "dear Ex, DD doesn't want to take classes any longer so I won't be taking her during my parenting time" It might initiate communication between DD and her dad/grandma but it would be taken by them as me being difficult and not letting her attend.

[livednlearned]

That makes a lot of sense! I think you spell it out clearly.

If I'm following correctly, then you want D12 to make the decision about how she wants to engage in her religion (modeling). You prefer to coach her (the good kind) instead of rescue her (fixing it for her).

I wonder if you can use validating questions to help her work through what she feels and wants:

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=273415.msg12586025#msg12586025

When S14 had to make a difficult decision about whether to report another student to the principal (other kid had pulled a staple gun on S14 in theater), I went back to these questions and tried to focus on asking S14 how he felt, what he wanted, even though I was worried there would be a blowback if he reported this kid. The other kid was popular and socially confident, whereas S13 is neither. I worried that the guidance counselor or theater teacher would not be careful about confidentiality, or would try to manage the situation by minimizing my son's concerns. So I had to ask a lot of validating questions to make sure that S14 was prepared for those outcomes. I also asked S14 how much support he wanted from me, and then had to almost sit on my hands to just let him go and resolve this on his own. It was a school safety issue, and I wanted him to know that if at any moment I didn't think the school was acting responsibly, that I reserved the right to act, and he agreed. First, he wanted to settle things on his own. I'm so proud of that kid. If you knew what he was like! He has come a long way just having the courage to stand up for himself.

Basically, I just coached him through some problem-solving, and validated how he felt. Would that work for your situation with your D12?

We were fairly lucky in how things turned out. S14 was a little disappointed that the kid didn't get expelled, though I was able to explain how the disciplinary action (suspending the Staple Guy for a day) was appropriate, and that the other kid had used up his one chance and expulsion would happen if there was a second incident.

"How do you think Grandma will respond? How do you think dad will respond?"

":)o you feel prepared for how they will react?"

"Is there anything you think I could do to support you?"

"What do you plan to say to Grandma and dad about dropping out of the class?

To help her think through scenarios she might not have thought about.

I've also had to model for S14 times when my decision to be assertive really didn't work out great, so he knows it's realistic to fail at this too.