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Author Topic: Left the house to stay in hotel at 1 in the morning  (Read 391 times)
formflier
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« on: January 09, 2016, 12:39:18 AM »

My guess is that this is all related. https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=288724.0;  We have been living in our new house in new location for about a week.  Owned it for several weeks but logistics of holidays and moving meant that we have lived here for about a week. One of the features of this house that was the reason to select it and we were both onboard is that there is a TV room in the basement, really nice projector thing (if you are into that). Wife bought a really nice entertainment center and installed it in the family room right outside the master bedroom door.    There has been one other incidence of her staying up late and having TV on loud so I couldn't sleep.  There has been no, zip zero nada, tv watched in the TV room.    I'm fine with all of this as long as it doesn't impact my sleep.  Long story, I have several disabilities that center around sleep.  My sleep hygiene is a pain in the rear for me to deal with and I'm sure a pain for her to live with.  Well, I was dozing around 1am and her slamming and banging in the kitchen.  TV came back on and was louder than normal. I went out and asked her how long she was planning on watching TV as I needed to figure out my sleep plan.    Without looking at me she said "I'm not sure". I asked if we could have a quick conversation.  She glared at me with hatred in her eyes. I was composed and even as I talked to her. I walked into the room and got my "go bag", gathered another thing or two.  She starts hollering at me that we don't have the money for a hotel room "just because you want to be a jackass".  She demanded I get downstairs on the couch in the TV room.  I said "I'm going to take care of my sleep needs.  I would like to have a conversation with you."  She then started talking about how I should have had a conversation with her earlier, hadn't tried, it trailed off as I left the house. I get to hotel room.  She calls.   I tried to answer.  I tried to call back. We had two texts that crossed each other in sending.  

FF wife: Accidentally dialed u when plugging in my phone 12:22 AM  Me: tried to answer your call and tried to call back. Very sleepy, don't feel well, about asleep. Would like to find time tomorrow so chat. 12:22 AM For the curious, I need to adjust my time stamps, actual time was 1:22.  Have to figure that out.  Strangely, I'm not angry or emotional.  I feel resolute.  I won't fight with her. I will get my sleep.  Anyone have thoughts on this? My initial thought is I'm ok to do the hotel thing for a while if this keeps happening. Do I ever move the TV to the TV room like the original plan?  

FF
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« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2016, 04:05:51 AM »

Hi ff

What are the alternatives for you both with regards to the TV situation ? The basement sounds like the perfect solution.

How come the TV is next to your bedroom given that you have the basement TV set-up ?

My h likes to stay up watching TV through the night and I love my sleep, so for us having the TV next to the bedroom would become a potential flash point of conflict for us.

I'm sure you will find a way through your resoluteness that helps you both navigate an area of potentially ongoing conflict.

Moving house is a stressful time. For you sleep hygiene is all important, it will ensure you are at your best each day in this new chapter of your lives. For your w, TV might be her way of distressing and dealing with the new challenges she will be facing. I know my h's ability to cope is compromised with any changes. When we moved home three years ago, he had a psychotic breakdown.

How do you forsee yourself positively moving forward with the situation today ?

What will your w need from you today to help her effectively navigate this ?
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« Reply #2 on: January 09, 2016, 04:26:44 AM »

I think you should, but obviously there's no point in arguing when she is on the brink of dysregulation. Have the conversation when she is the right frame of mind and detail the reasons it needs to be done. Hopefully it will be fine.

I have to say, I really admire your planning and resolute behaviour. It's really hard not to dig yourself into a mental blackhole when you have to 'go'. You've got a great attitude and your determination to avoid the fight is key. From a financial perspective it's obviously not great to keep forking out for hotels, but you also shouldn't have to sleep on a couch because of her dysregulation. You take care of yourself!

I'm sure most of us would rather have the joint-money spent on counselling for our partners and see them become happier in life rather than fork it out on hotels. But, such is life!

Good luck! Keep up the strong mental resolve Smiling (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #3 on: January 09, 2016, 05:38:47 AM »

  What are the alternatives for you both with regards to the TV situation ? The basement sounds like the perfect solution. How come the TV is next to your bedroom given that you have the basement TV set-up ?

  My wife did not follow what we had agreed up as far as the TV setup.  In my opinion, the basement is the perfect solution.  The other bedrooms in the house st have similar "noise issues" if someone wants to be up using the tv in the "family room" (where TV is now).  
How do you forsee yourself positively moving forward with the situation today ? What will your w need from you today to help her effectively navigate this ?  

 My plan for today. If my wife will have respectful conversation, I will, be happy to discuss it with her.  If not, I will press on with unpacking and building shelves. I have no idea what my wife will need today.  She probably "wants" me to fight with her, but I won't.  

FF
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« Reply #4 on: January 09, 2016, 05:56:54 AM »



I'm sure this feels right at 1 AM in a hotel with a CPAP machine.

    ... .maybe too aggressive.

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« Reply #5 on: January 09, 2016, 06:00:00 AM »

How about a blue tooth wireless headphones (her), earplugs (you) and a rose for all the work she has been through with the relocation.

You both have been through a lot with this job change. Sending her to the "man cave" or "kid pen" (basement) probably isn't going to go over well.

The trick is presenting this in a way that doesn't reward bad behavior. You might say that, "hey, we can recover that hotel money by just skipping a dinner out" and make a point of doing that (having a non-event in a week or two).

   
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« Reply #6 on: January 09, 2016, 06:10:19 AM »

Skip beat me to the headphones suggestion. I forgot to put it in my first post.

My h likes to listen to v v loud drum and base, we have a small house and the music area is in our bedroom.

When my son and I are in he always uses headphones, unless he is already stressed and then he expresses this through 'acting out' behaviours like playing loud offensive music.

At night he uses his tablet with headphones if he wants to watch a film  It took a while and it has teetered on the edge of many dysregulations, but we have settled in to a way of living that for the most part works for us both.

It took a while though.

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« Reply #7 on: January 09, 2016, 06:54:34 AM »

  Headphones for her have been discussed before and she has rejected it and refused to do it.  It's been a year or two since that has been discussed.  I see the thought about just getting them and presenting it (with the flowers).  Note:  I've already done, just the flowers coupled with long massage and some other goodies.  In other words, no agenda other than showing that I cared.  I've tried various earplugs before and they keep me awake.  I could go into a long jade but plugging my ears is a non-solution.  The cpap provides some white noise.  She will raise the noise level she creates until it causes an issue.    I'm a light sleeper which provides benefits as a parent.  My wife is heavy sleeper once she gets to sleep.  So, when there is some kid drama in the middle of the night.  I'm the first to hear it and respond.  White noise (and earplugs in addition to the personal discomfort) eliminate this "benefit".      There has been a lot going on, and I don't know if her unilaterally changing the TV plans is an effort to get me to fight with her or a genuine desire to do something else (set up house differently).  I don't care about location of TVs, up until the point it impacts sleep.    No plan on trying to address this until she has calmed.  

FF
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« Reply #8 on: January 09, 2016, 07:02:18 AM »

  but we have settled in to a way of living that for the most part works for us both.  It took a while though.  

 This has been an issue at several of the houses that we have lived in.  It's one of her "go to" tools to act out.  2 houses ago she agreed to go downstairs to watch TV and hang out with kids if she was going to keep them up to 2-3 am in the morning "having fun".  This was in counseling, sounded completely reasonable.   How it actually worked out was quite different.  In a 1500 square foot basement, the "only" place that the TV and speakers could go was immediately under the bedroom that I was sleeping in.  Other rooms in the basement were completely empty but she claimed they wouldn't work.  She went round and round with my and the MC at the time claiming that she honored her agreement.  I suppose I should have seen this coming with the purchase of this house.  She was the one that wanted the house because of the TV room in the basement, her idea to reserve the family room for non-TV activities.    Sounded great to me, because it seemed to be a plan that worked for both of us  Sigh,

FF
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« Reply #9 on: January 09, 2016, 07:38:37 AM »



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« Reply #10 on: January 09, 2016, 09:01:03 AM »

Am I understanding correctly your comment above that the kids' bedrooms are also affected by the current location of the TV, not just yours?
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« Reply #11 on: January 09, 2016, 10:06:58 AM »

Am I understanding correctly your comment above that the kids' bedrooms are also affected by the current location of the TV, not just yours?

 Correct.  They are a bit further away but they are affected as well.    TV is placed about 10 feet, straight line distance, from where my head lies.  On drywall wall in between.  
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« Reply #12 on: January 09, 2016, 10:15:50 AM »

I went home and was reading a book on the couch when she woke up.  She walked past and I said hey in a pleasant tone.  She walked past a few more times without speaking.  She then started ranting about kids cleaning up toothpaste and that she expected me to "make" them do it.  I let her know I would be happy to have a conversation with her about solutions for the kids bathroom.  She said we just had a conversation and threatened me that I better do what she says.    I walked out of room to bedroom and closed the door.  She pushed through the door before I thought to lock it.  She blocked the exit with her body.    I said I was leaving the house.  She did step aside but not enough that I could pass without touching her.  She followed me to truck flinging words.  I drove away.  Currently doing some shopping at Lowes.  

FFj
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« Reply #13 on: January 09, 2016, 10:38:35 AM »

My sympathies, man. I've been exactly where you are -- exactly. And it's so hard to keep your equilibrium when you feel under attack and unsafe. It must be twice as hard having just relocated to a new community where you don't have your familiar settings and support system.

As a high-level observation, I've noticed with my wife that her mood instability (to put it kindly) became more extreme when she was subjected to life stressors -- things like moving, job losses, economic downturns. These affect everyone, of course, including nons like ourselves, but as with everything emotional, this is taken to an extreme (and projected on others) by the BPDs. This doesn't help with your immediate problems, but it's better to be forewarned that you may be entering into an extended period of hair-trigger dysregulation and blaming. 

For the short term problem, I can think of a handful of solutions -- some are better or more feasible than others. I'm just putting these all out there so you can reflect on what options you think can work. Bear in mind that if she is in stress-triggered dysregulation, options that involve negotiating or compromise might not be feasible. These are in ascending order from "no cooperation on her part" to "mutual compromise."

1. You accept the new normal and find a way to deal with disrupted sleep. You might consider a white noise machine, fan, sleeping pills, a glass of wine before bed, or changing your bedtime.

2. You sleep elsewhere. It sounds like the basement might be the only place in the house that will work for you. You might also consider setting up a sleeping area down there just in case this happens again, regardless of what solution you implement. It's easier and cheaper than getting a hotel room, and I think it's probably a good idea to reserve hotel room escapes for situations of serious, threatening boundary-busting. (Your escape today when she pursued you when you tried to disengage is a good example of that.)

3. You implement a solution that lets her have her TV in the living room without noise -- headphones are a really good option. Some TVs can have volume limiters programmed into them (possibly not as effective, but might work in combination with a white noise solution from option 1). This requires a modicum of cooperation/compromise on her part.

4. You set up the home theater system in the basement and make it an comfortable environment for TV watching. (I have a similar set up in my house -- we have a main floor master, adjacent living room with TV, and a finished basement with projector, screen, and home theater system.) She agrees to use the basement instead of the living room for nocturnal TV.

I can think of a few other variations, but I think that's the basic spectrum. What do you think is the minimum you can get her to generally go along with that will make you more comfortable?
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« Reply #14 on: January 09, 2016, 11:51:40 AM »

I am getting rusty.  I came back home.  Wife is out with some of kids.  My laptop is gone.  Pretty sure I was completely logged out and it was off.  So little chance of compromise.  On the good side.  I have made contact with a local T.  

FF
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« Reply #15 on: January 09, 2016, 12:01:30 PM »

If I remember correctly, your wife does not acknowledge she has BPD?  Is she aware you are on this site? 
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« Reply #16 on: January 09, 2016, 12:36:54 PM »

FF, this sounds like a storm that has been brewing, and added to it is the stress of the move.

Did she discover you on this site? Could this be adding to the situation?

I think you have the right to get the sleep you need, however you do it. This is the basics of self care.

However, I will challenge you a bit on this situation. Her recent outburst could also be an attempt to get you to hear her. She may have been sending you more subtler signals, but if she doesn't feel heard, may have resorted to this out of frustration.

Families with members with BPD also have typical stresses like any other family. The difference is how the people in the family respond to this. Consider that you do too- many children to raise, financial issues, a recent change in the parent roles with wife working and you staying at home, a recent move. In any family, these changes would require communication and agreements. This can me harder in a family with BPD.

Your wife may have BPD but this doesn't explain all her emotions and frustrations at the recent changes. Framing her reactions as BPD and seeking to manage them could feel very invalidating to her. She has a point- coming home from work to find the family went to IHOP could feel hurtful to a spouse. How she reacted may be influenced by BPD, but her feelings are not necessarily because of that.

While boundaries and protecting yourself is important, it is possible too that she feels frustrated and unheard.
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« Reply #17 on: January 09, 2016, 01:30:48 PM »

  I think a turning point was reached today.  Won't know for sure until time passes.  I am working in garage with kids.  Not sure where wife is.  We were trying to do a shelving project to clear out some more space in the garage from the move.  Wife comes home and orders kids into the van to go to water park.  I asked to speak with her to make plans for the day.  She spewed some emotional vomit and then a rant about all the things she has to tell me and what has to happen.  All in front of kids.    She is rummaging around upstairs, and older kids are in kitchen S20, D18, S15.  I asked them if they were interested in going back to family counseling to sort through some of this stuff or if they wanted it to be over.  I said it evenly.  Looking back, the "over" part makes me cringe a bit.  They said seems like a good idea and they were willing.  This is good.     Wife rolls back into kitchen.  She said something about me wanting to get her in private to trick and manipulate her.   All in front of kids mind you.  I said that I wished to discuss in private because they were private matters that kids should not be involved in.    There is more to it, I'm not trying to do word for word.  She was "aggressive".  I was even and calm.  She claimed I was trying to make her look bad.  Once again orders kids to van and they leave.  Oldest is sticking around packing.    I just got a call as I am typing this saying she has decided to come back home and help with shelving.  She was calmer.  She is going to go by lowes and get some more things that are needed.  She asked questions about what I needed.  Listened.  Sigh,

FF
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« Reply #18 on: January 09, 2016, 01:37:27 PM »

  While boundaries and protecting yourself is important, it is possible too that she feels frustrated and unheard.  

 She says as much.    I will not compromise my boundaries to accommodate her being heard.  I'm also not responsible for her lack of clear communication.  Her answer is in what she says.    Today she said she was tired of telling me what to do and me not doing it.  I said my opinion is that the issue is being told.  I'm available to be her partner and discuss and jointly decide things, I'm not her boss and my desire is to avoid acting that way and that I will not be bossed.  She said it was her job as a wife to tell me what to do.  Again, all in front of the kids.    I said that I hear that she wants to tell me what to do, that I have a different opinion about how the marriage should work, and that I was open to discuss it further.  I will do lots of work to help her "be heard".  I'm open to ideas.    Functionally, her version is that she walks in a room, barks orders at me and I do what is said.  My answer is NO.  No wiggle room on allowing this to happen.  

FF
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