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Author Topic: Possible addiction and withdrawal?  (Read 365 times)
Ceruleanblue
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« on: January 13, 2016, 06:08:03 AM »

I'm pretty upset at BPDh's psychiatrist right now, and myself too. I feel I should have researched what he was put on, the same as I do when I'm prescribed something. Now, BPDh is dealing with what I'm sure is a sleeping pill addiction/withdrawal. Also, I didn't realize that the sleeping pill he is one: Trazodone, is also actually an antidepressant. So, he was already on a super high dose of Wellbutrin, then this Trazodone was added, in place of his nightly Tylenol PM(which was not addictive, and worked fine for him).

He's been off the Trazodone for a few days, and we didn't make the connection. I'd had either stomach flu or food poisoning, so I thought that was what BPDh was experiencing. Plus, he accidentally took one of my Ambien(that I NEVER took because I'd researched them), and he thought it was the Ambien making him sick. I figured it wasn't the Ambien though, because he'd borrowed one once when he ran out of his pills, and he slept fine, and was not sick.

Well, refilled his Trazodone prescription, took one tonight after days off it, and within half an hour, he was shaking, feeling sick, and throwing up. And before this, reading the list of symptoms of Trazodone withdrawal, he had pretty much all the symptoms. He was on a super high dose, and it says the higher your dose, the worse withdrawal symptoms may be. He quit cold turkey on accident, just not getting them filled, and not knowing he was hooked on them.

I went through withdrawal getting of Paxil years ago, and learned I had to really taper myself off. NO ONE told me how addictive Paxil was, and that is why I now research anything I'm prescribed. I'm very afraid of becoming dependent on something again. I'd rather deal with my mild insomnia than get hooked on sleeping pills, which is why I chose not to take the Ambien.

This also may account for some of BPDh's actions lately, and shows how hard he's been trying in the face of how awful he's been feeling. His DBT starts tomorrow, and he's been actively trying to be more considerate, more thoughtful, and owning his actions. I know it may not last, but I'm thankful for the effort, and taking it as a good sign.

I think he might need to call his psychiatrist tomorrow, tell him about how he's been feeling, and figure out what he needs to do: stay on it, or wean off. Right now it seems taking it makes him sick, but so does having gone off cold turkey. When I was hooked on Paxil, if I ran out, when I got then refilled, I'd start to feel better shortly after taking one. That sure isn't what happened with BPDh and the Trazodone.

Has anyone else dealt with this? I want to support him, and be there for him, and I'll definitely need to cut him some slack because I know just how awful this feels... .
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Ceruleanblue
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« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2016, 01:54:09 PM »

The nurse at his psychiatrist office just told him to keep taking it, even though he's reacting severely? He also has an appointment for the end of next week now. I'm just shaking my head over this one. I talked to her too, and she sounded like a drill sergeant. I sure hope taking it again tonight does not make him violently sick again. He threw up last night, and got very little sleep, and when I was researching it, it said sudden withdrawal can lead to seizures.

I know neither of us will be taking any new drugs without us researching them. I think even BPDh is of that view now. He wants off these, but for now, it appears he's addicted to them, or he goes through horrid withdrawal. How was THIS supposed to help his mental health issue?
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Cloudy Days
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« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2016, 03:07:38 PM »

If what he is experiencing is withdrawals then he needs to keep taking them. Hate to burst your bubble but most if not all medications will have withdrawal symptoms, even sugar and caffeine can send you into a loop if you stop using them. My husband was on Trazadone once and had a very bad allergic reaction to it, his tounge swelled up and he couldn't swallow. He never had any vomiting side effects. When he went off of Xanax that he was on for several years he had severe diarrhea and flu like symptoms. The medication he is taking now can actually kill him if he goes off of it suddenly without tapering down, a lot of the mood stabilizing medications are also prescribed for seizure disorders, which can cause life threatening seizures. My husband makes sure to keep taking the meds he is on is about what it amounts to, if he gets low and knows he doesn't have enough to last till the next refill, he starts tapering although we have made it a habit to have a couple bottles on hand Just in case.  

They do help him, you just can't expect no side effects if he goes off of them. It's always best to taper off of something. So if he decides to try a medication he really can't go off of it cold turkey. 
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Ceruleanblue
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« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2016, 04:48:50 PM »

Yeah, I have no idea why he did other than he forgot to refill it. I don't think he actually needs to be on a sleeping pill. He did fine for years on Tylenol PM, and he didn't really complain. I think he just told his doctor he took the Tylenol PM, and the doctor gave him this instead. I don't care if he stays on it or goes off, but I think after the reaction, he's going to want off it.

I'd expected him to feel better today, after last nights dose, but it made him so sick, and he still feels bad today. When I was hooked on Paxil,  when I'd run out, I'd feel much the same, sick, shaky, horrible, but as soon as I got in back in my system, within a few hours, I'd start to feel so much better.

My Paxil experience is why I'm so careful today about what drugs I start taking. Plus, for me, antidepressants didn't help my OCD nor my anxiety. The benefits did not outweigh the side effects for me. I'd love to find one that does, but after trying so many, I've given up. I find therapy, and staying centered do more for me than any drug has.

I sure hope the nurse was right, and he starts to feel better. My fear was that he was having a reaction to it after having gone off. I feel doctors should not prescribe you anything unless they tell you it can be habit forming. You can end up with a much bigger issue than your original issue, which just seems unfair.

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MaybeSo
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« Reply #4 on: January 14, 2016, 02:49:54 PM »

Your husband is an adult. All doctors and pharmacists routinely warn adult patients to not alter or discontinue medications without first consulting the perscribing doc, these warnings are everywhere, in verbal consult with docs office, verbal consult with the pharmacist, along with written information that comes with the medications. A quick internet search provides multiple such warnings and information. your H was using poor judgement to allow a prescribed med to just run out with no action taken on his part. He may also have the stomach flu AND in tandem was experiencing symptoms from cold turkey discontinuation of his prescription for trazadone. This is potentially dangerous and it is his responsibility to take his medication as prescribed and to call the doc immediately if for some reason he is not able to take as prescribed.  This is true of nearly all prescribed meds, that is why (in part) they are prescribed and monitored by doctors. All medications have potential negative side effects and the risks increase when not taken as prescribed. The responsibility rests squarely on your husband. Not the doc, the nurse, or you. You are treating him like a child who is unable to figure these things out for himself. When his low functioning causes you heartache, remember that your reactions here to get angry with the doc sends the enabling message and/or promote the idea that he is some how a victim here and can't be expected to take responsibility for his lack of self care and poor judgement. it also suggests he is too infantile to consult on his own behalf with the doc and make his own measured decisions about his own care. You are moving into codependent territory here.
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Ceruleanblue
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« Reply #5 on: January 15, 2016, 12:49:41 AM »

Well, I'm only feeling and thinking this way because I see this same psychiatrist, and I can see why BPDh didn't question him. The time allotted to see the doctor is so short, and BPDh is not one to question like I am. I didn't used to question, until I got on Paxil, and found out how addictive it was. It was only after that that I really, really question drugs of this nature. I can't you how many prescriptions I've refused to fill because when I ask the pharmacist, even after questioning the doctor initially, I'll find out a drug is more habit forming than the doctor stated.

It's not actually just doctor/drug related issues either. BPDh bought a car recently, and he asked the car dealer almost no questions. It was just so odd. I didn't intervene. I know I'm not to blame, but I do feel the doctor should have told him that the trazodone could be habit forming. When he prescribed me things, he didn't tell me that either, but I ASKED. He doesn't seem to find that to be a big deal, but I do! I'd have to be very sick, or mentally unstable to want to sign back on for that.

I wish BPDh would research things the way I do, but he's not likely to start. I'd think that this experience would teach him that it's good to ask questions about drugs you are prescribed, and to do some research, but I doubt he'll make that connection. He doesn't seem to avoid repeating unpleasant experiences the way I do.

I do feel this was all brought about by some of his low functioning decisions. I guess he just has to live with the consequences of his actions or inaction. It's just hard to sit idly by when a few questions or a google search can spare a lot of heartache... .

He did actually say tonight that he should have listened to me regarding a decision he made(one I'd warned him might be a bad choice as we couldn't afford it).  He's said that a couple times lately. I'm still shocked, and think he might be turning a slight corner. Last year he'd have never admitted something like that. I didn't gloat, I just commiserated, and empathized. It's done now, and I'm just glad that he's at least seeing some of his impulsive decisions differently in hindsight. I think that's a huge step for him.
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Notwendy
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« Reply #6 on: January 15, 2016, 06:59:37 AM »

Well, I'm only feeling and thinking this way because I see this same psychiatrist, and I can see why BPDh didn't question him.

That still doesn't make this not co-dependent behavior. There are many ways to "justify" one's reasons but that doesn't change the dynamics.

The reason I say this, and echo Maybeso, is not the reasons, or the situation, but the dynamics. This is a triangle. People act according to the drama triangle because, it benefits them in some way, they feel they have a good reason for it - for them. There are payoffs to this.

One very strong payoff is the focus of anger off the partner on to a common perceived "enemy". This possibly buys you some loving peaceful feelings between the two of you. You are the loving, forgiving caring person, your H the poor guy who just needs someone to care for him.

The cost of the triangle is drama, and also this emotional lull tends not to last, and the positions change. At the moment, they are

H: Victim "of the medical practitioners"

Doctor/Nurse: Persecutor

You: Rescuer

How do I think this? Because of the emotions- your anger at the practitioner, your soft feelings for your H. Being angry at the nurse/doctor has changed the dynamics for now, but  the triangle roles change.

It isn't a wrong thing to try to help someone who needs it, but when it is done from a co-dependent position- one is usually on the triangle and comes with these kinds of emotions. Three people in the roles of Rescuer, Victim, Persecutor is often a clue.

It is when we can see these potential triangles that we can stop and say "triangle ahead" and think about whether or not to step on to it. One way may be to have asked your H if he wanted your help, and if he agreed, then help without taking on the responsibility or the anger at the doctor. Another way is to place it entirely in his hands. As Maybeso says, he is an adult. Ways to be helpful are to ask if he would like a reminder to refill, if he can't remember, or for you to pick up his meds for him when running errands. These are acts of kindness. I do things like that for my H, for instance he will ask me to pick up something at the cleaners if I am out, or something at the store. If he asked me to run by the pharmacy, I would do that. However what I would want to be absent is emotional drama/anger/resentment at someone. This would tell me I have stepped into co-dependent territory.

It's OK to realize the payoff and to even choose it, but once aware of the dynamics, then it doesn't seem as appealing. I also felt good being a rescuer. I felt needed, and loved, and the anger was directed at someone else. It was only when I decided that I didn't want to be acting on the triangle that I was willing to give that payoff up.
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MaybeSo
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« Reply #7 on: January 16, 2016, 01:40:18 AM »

H: Victim "of the medical practitioners"

Doctor/Nurse: Persecutor

You: Rescuer


Bingo.

You are often in the docs position on the triangle, being seen as the one to blame while hubby can't seem to share any responsibility or ownership for his part in problems.  Your position and tone is dramatic and in alignment with his usual 'blaming' tactics, it's just being directed at someone else right now while you assume a rescue stance. 

All paths on the drama triangle lead to VICTIM.  It's just a matter of time. 

If your husband wants to read up on his product or ask the doctor questions, that's up to him. Not your business. 

The experience of withdrawal is not connected only to 'bad' drugs.  It is ubiquitous. A  person can develop an addiction to just about anything.   

Take a look at the Leaving Board on this site, and you will see a large amount of people going through painful withdrawals from an addiction to the highs and lows of a relationship with a pwBPD.  Even therapy can cause withdrawal symptoms ... .Therapists do not just stop therapy cold turkey with ongoing clients.  When the client begins to improve, protocol dictates the therapist titrate sessions down from weekly to bi weekly etc. Most americans are addicted to something, alcohol, coffee, sugar, the internet, T.V. gaming, pornography, shopping... .and experience withdrawal symptoms when they stop cold turkey.  It's part of the human experience.

Most people do not ask doc about potential for withdrawal symptoms; they want to know how fast the product will work, what the side effects are, will it affect sexual performance, make them gain weight etc. 

Bottom line, doc could spend an hour discussing each product... .and they don't have the time.  The consumer has to be proactive.   
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