supportive or too much co-dependency?

[Gina1960]

Hi I have been with my husband for many years. our relationship has been volatile but overall we both agree rich, exciting and loving. Over the last few years, here has been a great deal of uncertainty and disruption with many moves, new projects and family illness to deal with.  Respectful, calm communication is essential to the myriad of decisions this has presented us with. Instead, however, there has been a severe escalation of argument and conflict, causing us both a lot of distress.

I took a long while to come to recognise that my sense of treading on egg shells, the hopelessness of trying to keep discussions and accommodate his hyper sensitivity etc etc might be because he was a high functioning BPD. It has also taken a long while to convince my husband that his short fuse and the long periods he need after to get over his rage are a barrier to us improving communication and our relationship. He tells me he will speak to someone and that whilst doing this he doesn't want us to continue to engage with relationship counselling. Because of work commitment, there was a case to consider having 2 domestic bases and spending time together on a part time basis. I was in favour of this because as well as the practical reasons, it would have given us space, autonomy etc. My husband was much more strongly in favour of living together full time. I guess because he found the courage to say unequivocally he wanted us to live together and that he would seek therapy, I agreed to the living together full time plan. Since then however, there has been more horrible verbal onslaughts. I find myself focusing on finding a route to peace which means placating and soothing. And I seem incapable of finding/creating a place for my needs and vulnerabilities.

I am growing weary.  I only have the opportunity to discuss the issue with a counsellor occasionally. I don't want to discuss with folks who know both of us. And it often feels like the responsibility for the health of our relationship is left to me - if I don't get the communication right, if I don't do enough listening and validating, if I don't get over the latest spat it will drag on etc etc. So, on the one hand I believe I have to find the inner strength to stay the course whilst he explores therapy (he isn't keen to tell me what he plans to do /aim for). But on the other hand I am sure I need to get better at looking after myself and not being complicit in his BPD traits. I think my lack of taking the opportunity for us to live part time in the coming months whilst he hopefully sees a counsellor is indicative of my co-dependent tendencies. Recognising this, I want to work on how I can set boundaries that we can both abide me in the coming months.

All comments that can help me to reflect and work towards a constructive period of improving our relationship and supporting my husband's efforts to deal with his 'dark side' warmly invited

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Thread]

I'm so sorry your at this place. I read this and hear my exact self. I am also codependent.

I have tried DBT therapy for him. Regular therapy and couples therapy. Nothing has worked. He just finished DBT and the old behaviors came rolling through immediately.

I'm in the process of leaving. Get a good therapist that is crucial. One who knows what borderline is. My body is falling apart from the stress my back is out my depression is hard core. Sorry I can't offer help. Nothing I did helped.

[Icanteven]

I'm so sorry your at this place. I read this and hear my exact self. I am also codependent.

I have tried DBT therapy for him. Regular therapy and couples therapy. Nothing has worked. He just finished DBT and the old behaviors came rolling through immediately.

I'm in the process of leaving. Get a good therapist that is crucial. One who knows what borderline is. My body is falling apart from the stress my back is out my depression is hard core. Sorry I can't offer help. Nothing I did helped.

This is, I think, a huge gap in my emotional health right now:  I feel like, if she could just get all the diagnoses out on the table and get into hard core DBT, maybe with enough time she could come back to me.

And yet, DBT doesn't work for everyone, and moreover, from reading various books it appears that DBT can cause remission of symptoms, but in terms of holding down good jobs long term or having meaningful interpersonal relationships, the odds are still long, especially the lower functioning/comorbid a person is.

My spouse is low functioning in a variety of areas, and long term I'm not sure how functional she could ever be given the most optimal outcome she's capable of achieving.

It's a bitter bill to swallow.

[Gina1960]

thank you to the community members who have already replied. its already a huge source of emotional succour  to know that what I am trying to address is not that unusual.

But I still have to find way of balancing mine and his desire to have a relationship on equal terms - where we both behave as mature intelligent beings but where it seems I have to take responsibility for how the timing and content of our discussions must always be sensitive to his hyper sensitivity? I wish I could rise above the resentment that has been growing in me in the last 5 years - the time period through which conflict and distress has been such a dominant feature of our 25 year+ relationship.

Its been insightful for me to observe the deep exasperation with myself that has emerged as I colluded

/facilitated the removal of the opportunity for a respite by living together part time. I find myself asking if I really do have a grip on what is really happening for both of us and what are the best next step decisions... .

[Bpdsupporter]

Codependent relationships are a type of dysfunctional helping relationship where one person supports or enables another person's addiction, poor mental health, immaturity, irresponsibility, or under-achievement.

This is the definition of codependency. Do you think that you enable your husband's poor mental health or do you think you are trying to support and understand his mental illness better to help heal your marriage?

BPD is a complicated mental illness and there will be alot of challenges you will have to face being the non-BPD. I had to really change alot of ways I communicated with my partner. The book loving someone with Borderline Personality Disorder by Shari Manning really helped me alot. And the tools helped us become closer. So now when my partner gets dysregulated in his emotions I just listen and tell him to tell me all about it in detail. I use active listening skills and validate him. I began to see instant results. And now our relationship is better than ever. It's not easy though and I had  to really learn how to set boundaries too and take care of myself in order to be there for him.

Anyway all that to say I use to think I was codependent. But I've never been one to enable him to continue in negative or harmful behavior. Based off the definition of codependency do you think you do that... enable your husband to stay in poor mental health and behavior?

[Thread]

Bpdsupporter

thanks for that info I'm not codependent then maybe more dependent. I want to help his progress and self insight so I totally don't apply. I do feel by staying I am enabling the treatment towards me.

Gina

where we both behave as mature intelligent beings

This may never be the case. Because there are not two mature emotionally intelligent people in the relationship. I just want to highlight that so that you can know expecting that may not be practical. I try to constantly make sense of things to my husband BPD and try to say things in different ways of address things at the right time or, or, or, or... .It just doesn't. The only thing I have been able to control is not allowing his triggers to escalate into "I'm gonna kill myself."

At some point very recently I've hit my ceiling of being able to keep at it. Constantly monitoring how I say things, how I look, or the tone of my voice can set him off. For me waiting until that moment is so stress provoking because I never know what is going to cause it. Even as we speak he took off a midnight to grocery shop. What's triggering him,... I have no clue. The positive side is he left. And I'm not trapped in it.

My only recommendation is take care of you like BPDsupporter said eat right, exercise, get a good therapist, meditate, etc. it's hard living in a whroolpool of BPD.

[JWstillhoping]

I just wanted to provide an expanded definition of codependency, one that I've found helpful:

Medical Definition of codependency

plural codependencies

:  a psychological condition or a relationship in which a person manifesting low self-esteem and a strong desire for approval has an unhealthy attachment to another person and places the needs of that person before his or her own ◆In codependency, a person tries to satisfy the needs of another who is often controlling or manipulative and who may have an addictive or emotionally unstable personality. ; broadly :  dependence on the needs of or control by another

A lot of us have found ourselves tiptoeing around and catering to the whims of our loved one with BPD in the hopes of keeping the peace. Doing this can often be detrimental to our own health - both physical and emotional. that is why it is critical for us to get support and strength, separate from our loved ones.

I've found therapy, support groups (this & al-anon type) have been helping me to put the focus back on myself. For years, my life revolved around my partner and the roller coaster of emotions. I was also weary and felt hopeless. Now, I'm learning how to better deal with the situations, while also finding time to do what I love that had been abandoned when I became unhealthy & codependent.

Bottom line is that you need to take good care of yourself... .Make your health and happiness a priority. You can support and love with empathy and the tools learned here, but if you're feeling worn down, it's a signal to step back and love yourself too. It is possible to support without feeling trampled. Keep learning about healthy boundaries and find ways to improve your self esteem. ive been following this advice myself lately and am feeling more like my "real" self every day. I wish you all the best.

[waverider]

Just to clarify boundaries. These are not something that you negotiate and both agree on and therefore expect the other to comply with out of mutual respect. They are simply agreements.

Boundaries as normally discussed here are about protecting oneself from harmful environments, whether physical or emotional. They are set by the individual based on how a situation affects them, they have nothing to do with fairness, they are bottom line self preservation, and they are enforced by actions taken by that individual and do not need input or cooperation of the other party. Otherwise they become nothing more than demands, and often just wishful thinking.

Boundaries are fall back for when agreements are being transgressed. If agreements are being respected then there is no need for a boundary.

[Gina1960]

all the responses are augmenting my perspectives. so far, all I have figured is I need time (days, not hours) apart on a regular basis to just be and then recharge. I also need to re-engage with  my social network; I have allowed it to go a bit dormant over recent years because of all the upheavals with overseas relocation and family illness taking up so much time and energy. this is going to take some time to rebuild.

my husband also needs time to explore if/what  therapy can do for him

then our relationship needs time to recover - there is so much hurt and bad experiences over the past 5 years.

in the short term, however, i think we are in crisis and need some way of getting through the next day, and the one after that, and the one after that etc.  for example, in a recent argument - that I did in fact exit once it was clear he was in a full blown rage - he told me he didn't believe my explanation for something that he was perceiving as an outrageous sin driven by bad motives. in a later text interchange where communications were gradually brought to normal adult interchanges,  I asked him how he would feel if I had said the same to him. he replied by saying he withdrew the statement. the ambiguity of this comment - maybe still disbelieving but brooding. maybe on reflection, no longer jumping to low trust conclusions - was not surprising. nor was the lack of apology or recognition of its hurtfulness of course.

So, I refrained from making any comment or response and we got back onto an even keel briefly. but within 2 days he blew up again and repeated he didn't believe my explanation and accused me of very black motives. I resisted responding/retaliating at all the second time.

I am sharing it with this community because I am at a loss to know what lessons to take from it. whilst I can often attribute things that are said in rage as simply cries of pain, when he does something like this, it seems to me he is being calculatingly cruel. furthermore, i am asking myself if,  by not gently (is that even feasible with a BPD?) challenging his rather mean spirited 'withdrawal' of his accusation, I am leaving myself open to him attacking me where it really hurts. he knows honesty and integrity are hugely important values to me personally and ones that we have both consistently agreed are fundamental to our relationship if it to survive. I will look at how to set boundaries in future interchanges - i think i have a fundamental need to not be cast as a liar -  I need to figure how to do this effectively and with minimum risk of triggering another tirade ... .

[waverider]

Just a pointer in regards to the on off switch used to regurgitate old issues. pwBPD struggle to work through emotions and issues, they can switch them off and appear to be over it. Yes it is no longer in the forefront of their mind but they haven't worked it through,as would be similar to the way people grieve and come down slowly. The whole emotion is packaged up and filed away somewhere. Consequently when there is a similar emotional trigger, they pull out the old issue which still is carrying the old strength of emotion and pile it onto the current issue, so it comes back with a venom. These issues can compound adding to the fury.

Further to this their recollections are often like a selection of accurate quotes and snapshots, but have been filed without context. So when they are recalled they can be cut and pasting "facts" around a new context to validate the emotion of the monument. This is why they can make the retold stories sound realistic. Its not all nonsense, its just the way the context has been skewed.

The most toxic of untruths are the ones that are presented in the reflections of a distorted mirror