Re: Im losing my own mind

[Think About It...]

   Hi Eden,

   Tina has done alot of work, through years of T and meds. It was her committment to get well, that encouraged me to stay.

   I was ready to call it quits, and take the kids with me. Maybe a wake-up call for her?

   Yes there is hope, but that hope should be that your H decides to do the work, because intil then things will not get any better.

   The good out weigh's the bad, by far. Our relationship is by far an even relationship, with both of us working towards the same goals, with mutual respect and kindness.

   IMO, we are only suckers, if we allow ourselves to be abused and remain there or watch it happen to our kids.

   Mark

[been there]

   Hi Eden,

   Tina has done alot of work, through years of T and meds. It was her committment to get well, that encouraged me to stay.

   I was ready to call it quits, and take the kids with me. Maybe a wake-up call for her?

   Yes there is hope, but that hope should be that your H decides to do the work, because intil then things will not get any better.

   The good out weigh's the bad, by far. Our relationship is by far an even relationship, with both of us working towards the same goals, with mutual respect and kindness.

   IMO, we are only suckers, if we allow ourselves to be abused and remain there or watch it happen to our kids.

   Mark

[Liatris]

Hi Eden,

I also recently realized that my H has BPD and I completely relate to the brain thing. The stress of all this has really effected the functioning of my brain - relentless stress does do the brain harm. I am a medical researcher when I am well enough to work and have found some things that help protect the brain against stress -  and one thing that may actually repair what has been damaged. If you are interested, let me know and I will post all of it.

Liatris

[eden]

Liatris,

I am curious about what you have to say.  My functioning has decreased significantly since being with my husband.  I try very hard to be as productive a person as I was before but I find myself being much more "scattered" than I used to be.  It's much harder for me to stay on task, to keep organized and concentrate.  I used to be such a list-oriented person, very organized and driven.  I used to volunteer, have lots of friends, and compete in triathlons.  Now I don't have one single friend (seriously) and finding things to do outside of my husband usually results in me being "punished" when I return.  Most times it's just not worth it.

I am trying to get my life back and feel free again, but this is really going to be a struggle.

[eden]

Mark,

It is nice to hear such a positive post.  I guess I threatened my husband into therapy as well.  I finally said that I would leave, and I meant it.  He started therapy and is on medication.  I'm hoping that he will keep trying hard to help himself, and as a result he'll help all of us.

Thanks so much for giving me hope!

[Liatris]

Eden

Ashwagandha (Withania somnifera) - a liquid herbal tincture by Herb Pharm at 30 drops - two times a day would be the dose (according to studies) that helps protect the brain against stress. I take this brand because it is not sprayed with chemicals (organic) and it is a reputable grower/company. To try to actually repair damage, Lion's Mane mushroom at 5 grams a day (as per studies) of the actual mushroom(fruit body) is indicated. I have not found dried Lion's Mane fruitbody ( the mushroom itself). But a co called Fungi Perfecti does have 500mg caps of the dried mycellium of Lion's Mane that, according to studies, may very well have the same beneficial effect as the actual mushrooms. Mycellium are like the roots of the mushroom. If I find any sources of the dried fruitbody/mushroom - I will let you know. Or f you do - let me know.   Good luck

[John Galt]

Eden, I could re write most of your letter and only edit wife for husband.It is so sickening ,yet eye opening that these stories are so similar.

When I read a post that ''Mark'' wrote it does give me a tiny bit of inspiration,although it seems like he is one of a few.Great news for him that his wife is actively trying to help herself and in turn them.
I do think that without therapy it is a very slippery fast downward slope,
Luck
Marc

[job1925]

ruthless -

Ack!  You beat me to it - I was going to say that I could substitute "husband" for "wife" and the stories would be the same - especially the part Eden wrote about "You just got that from the book!"

Well, duh. . .I'm trying everything I can think of to deal with her illness including some improvised strategies of my own.

My mind and my productiveness has suffered a bunch, too.  Work is such that I can fake being productive but that will catch up with me eventually.  Lately I've taken to checking with my pastor, my therapist, and a few friends for a "sanity check".  "Am I really this prideful, do I really have a grasp of what's going on, am I the prideful, arrogant, insensitive, idiotic, f@#$-ing king of all turdness that she makes me out to be?"  Their answers have been pretty encouraging.  And though it's probably not the most above-board thing to do, I've taken to calling her friends to check and see if they said what she says they said (say that three times, quickly!) - those answers have been encouraging as well and it's a window into how she warps reality to her feelings.

Long walks to relieve the stress, and I've started running again.  Throwing the coffee table into the fireplace like she did the other night would probably relieve a ton of stress but I think it would get expensive replacing furniture.  :-)

Eden, I got overwhelmed by SWOE, too, as well as advice from her therapist at the time.  Now, I'm just working on controlling my own responses to her abuse - later I think we might get to a healthier place where we can talk - really talk - but right now it isn't going to happen.

[John Galt]

Job,
I was thinking about you earlier today and now you write,right.

I did try and say your thing 3 x and wow,it is hard.

Yes ,I am with you on the exercise thing,it does relax you and lets you think clearer,
Marc

[eden]

Isn't it strange that through the fog you can barely see a good life?  I just keep thinking, "Why is he doing this?"  "Why is he ruining this?" "Things could really be good."

I don't know how you men (or women) work away from your spouses during the day.  My BPD husband works from home and I am a stay-at-home mother.  He has terrible paranoia that if I go anywhere away from him that men will hit on me, etc. etc. etc.  This gets to be VERRRRY exausting as I have never, in all the time that I have known him, thought about or acted in any way objectionable with any man.

Are your spouses filled with paranoia?  Paranoia that you might fall in love with someone else?  Paranoia that you might make friends with anyone (even someone of the same sex)? I guess it's pretty typical for them to have complete paranoia concerning anything that can be conscrued as abandonment.

I just can't believe how frightened of the world my husband is.  He is 46 and has never travelled outside of the U.S. and getting him to go on vacation is difficult.  Attempting to get him to travel to see my family is futile.  I don't know when that will ever happen.

[bluemumdaughterbpd]

Are your spouses filled with paranoia?  Paranoia that you might fall in love with someone else?  Paranoia that you might make friends with anyone (even someone of the same sex)? I guess it's pretty typical for them to have complete paranoia concerning anything that can be conscrued as abandonment.

My X was exactly like that, if I had a female friend I was a 'lemon' he'd call me. If we went out anywhere which was lucky to be once a year I was flirting with men and I was a slut. When we would get home he'd interrogate me for hours until the sun started to come up. He'd be little me, abuse me, rape me... you name it than he'd make me accept his apology. Know exactly what it all feels like, believe me it damages your soul and your never get over it...

Blue

[eden]

Wow Marc...unbelievable!

Once my husband told me, "I'll leave, and you can just stay here and do all that lesbian stuff with your sister!"

Funny...I have not given him one reason to distrust me and now I am a incestual lesbian?  So goes the heat of a rage.  I guess if my sister is the only person that I do anything with outside of him then I guess that's all he can pick apart.

I understand jealousy.  I think everyone gets jealous at times, but this just goes way beyond a normal level.

[John Galt]

One of my biggest concerns eden is the escalation with BPDs.
Your sister and your lesbian incestual relationship is now the floor and will be repeated over and over again(I think).

Then when you do not react any more to that,the stakes get raised and other statements are made,worse so they can push your buttons.

The dance and the drama,
Marc

[At_Bay]

Eden, you really have a lot on your shoulders and there's no way to get around it having a detrimental affect on you, no matter how nice he is on occasion. There is always the dread of when will it occur next, how severe, and there goes your peace of mind. Something our brains require to concentrate I think. Feeling safe isn't optional.

There are similarities in our experience in that my husband of 34 yrs never has raged in front of our son, except when our son was in middle school he threatened him with his fist and my son told me about it when I returned home. He'd told his Dad "Screw You." That seems to be the only exception and our son must have been really angry because he didn't talk like that in the home. I told my husband charges would be filed if he ever touched either one of us and he'd better not threaten my son again or I'd leave, and I would have. In my mind, there is no negotiating when a child's development is affected. It could be said that how I was treated and my struggles deprived our son indirectly because of my state-of-mind. Faking it, squashing anger and loss of self-esteem must make us different. My last therapist told me to become assertive and not accept poor treatment in my life. I have control over that and can't blame him.

I was a stay-at-home mom too and my husband was home in the daytime when our son was in school as well as my husband having days off during the week for a long time. This does isolate you and increase the tie to him without changes of scenery and other people to exchange ideas with. Therapy may be very eye-opening for you as it was for me the first time. Even though I was bluntly told I was being lead around by the nose, I protested that I was too smart/pretty for that. Had my pick of eligible bachelors and wouldn't choose a looser. (See the link in resources to Dr. Joe Carver's site kindly provided by Helen.)

Now, 34 yrs of the roller coaster has him in therapy for 2+ yrs and on a medication for rage (Abilify 5 mg), which is effective. Therapy has him admitting his childhood problems and risidual anger at his Mom, but on occasion he wants to give up, return to blaming me or say that he cannot do it because it is too hard. Every decision recalls shaky condition here. I just told him today that I chose against having an accent wall painted in our home because all one color is easier to sell. One of us heading for an exit is always in the back of my mind. Is that the only way it will end? The only way it can?

I hope your therapy and his will give you the life that you, yourself, deserve. You sound like a wonderful Mom and so smart. Stay smart. The fact your sister called the police is a red flag.

My best to you,
At Bay

[moesha]

We teach people how to treat us.?  By allowing him to rage and say vicious things about your loved ones, you show him it's OK to devalue what you hold dear.?  He learns that you will tolerate his demented ravings and cripple yourself to remain in a relationship w/him.?  He learns who will tolerate his BS (you) and who won't (your sister).?  He learns to calculate exactly what he can get away with.?  

Did he say these vile things before you married him?

Eden, it sounds as tho you tend to minimize the effects of his extremely sick behavior, on both you and others.?  So he doesnt' call your kids names to their faces...do you think for an instant that they don't sense his twisted perception of them?  I bet you could cut the tension in your house with a knife.

As for your sister calling the cops, Bravo?  she is not in the BPD FOG that nons float around in.?  She saw he was out of control, and took appropriate action.?  Aggressive, violent behavior = 911. ? Period. ? Zero tolerance for abuse, Eden. ? There is no excuse, ever. ? Not even mental illness. ?

It's fantastic that you are in therapy.?  However, going to therapy once a week and still acting like a monster the rest of the time is not exactly working a program.?  Unless this sick, sick man is committed to recovery, for real, for himself, and not just to keep you around to take his abuse, it will not work.

Have you considered making him leave the home until there is significant improvement? ? It concerns me that he is being as aggressive as he is while on meds and in therapy. ?

[came from chaos]

Eden...I've been married to my BPw 27 years.?  ? Take full advantage of your therapy and take care of yourself.?  ? There is no happy story with BPD, but a complete disaster can be avoided if you take action.  It may even be necessary to abort  your marriage before you are destroyed.?  ?  ?  ?  ?

My wife is in recovery now and life is much, much?  better than its been at any time during the last 27 years, but it still is an energy drain.?  Being non-BP I have to put in much more energy into our relationship than she does.?  ? I began therapy a couple of years ago and its been an epiphany.?  ? It's helped me beyond my expectations.?  ?

Let's put it this way without help, living with a BP can cause a person to slip into very unhealthy self destructive behaviors and coping mechnisms.?  ? My coping mechanism was alcohol.?  I was well on the path to self destruction when I had legal trouble, compelling me to?  seek help in recovery.?  ?  Interestingly this was the point at which I began to take my life back from my BPW.?  ?  My wife's BPD acting out opened up full throttle when I enetered recovery.?  ? Your descriptions of your husband's abuse were just like mine.?  ? Threats of divorce,?  accusing me of being gay, accusing me of having affairs with other women, accusations of me abandonning her, pleas to keep me from attending my recovery program and leaving her home alone, physical violence and rage...the whole nine yards.?  ? There was nothing spared.?  This acting out was all caused by my standing up for myself and doing what I had to do for myself.

It wasn't easy.?  ? Not at all, but well worth it for me in the way it made me feel about myself.?  ? My wife's last extreme stint/episode of acting out extended over a two year period when I first entered my alcohol recovery.?  The previous 24 or so years before I entered recovery?  were periodic episodes (it seemed one crisis followed on the heels of another) of?  extreme behavior, black and white thinking, crusades, rage, self destructive behavior, ultimatums, demands, righteous causes, drug and alcohol abuse, a littany of self inflicted physical accidents that would have made a football player cringe, etc. Extreme episodes of her acting out became more frequent and extreme over time, and seemed to be worse under times of stress.   

Over that long period of time I caught fleas and abused?  alcohol to cope.?  ?
 
My standing up for myself (in a proper way) , and her fear of abandonment, eventually caused her to seek the recovery she needed.?  ?

Yes things are far better now.?  ? I learned of BPD a little more than 1 1/2 yrs ago and obtained a confirmation  of her BPD just a litte more than a year ago.?  ? Things were happening hard and fast so I hadn't time to contemplate the implications of the disorder.?  ? She entered a recovery program for substance abuse which is also providing her exactly what she needed for BPD.?  ? I've worked closely with a therapist who guides me through the living with a BPD maze.?  So far so good.?  Like I say it's been working quite well.?  ?

I've been split white for a while now and I'm enjoying being in her good graces for the present time.?  ? I know it could change, but I'll worry about that when and if it happens.

In discussing?  my wife's recovery with my therapist he put a perspective on the whole thing I found intriguing.?  Why some BPs seek and respond to treatment and why others don't.?  ? He put it this way, there are the BPs with a soul and those that don't have a soul.?  ? The ones with a soul under the right conditions will seek help and put the effort in to heal.?  ? The others he believes are sociopaths and there is no help for them.? These are the utter hell makers and it would be best to leave that kind of relationship.   It?  sounds rather simple. I guess the soul hypothesis can explain a great deal of the completely outrageous, unremitting and unrepenting  behavior most prevalently written in this message board forum.?  ?  

In your case?  I guess the proof in your husbands sincerity (as opposed to going to therapy to placate you)?  to obtain help?  is whether or not you see any changes in your husband as a result of his therapy.?  ? Changes take time but are definitely observable, if he truly believes he has a disorder that needs treatment.?  ? So take care of yourself first.?  Sometimes that's the best thing you can do for him.?  In my case it worked out that way.

[eden]

I do believe my husband is the "soul" version.  I know that there are many here that would try to convince me otherwise, but he does hurt.  He knows he is messed up and he hates it.  He tells me that he wishes he could change the thoughts that race through his head but he just doesn't know how.  He realizes a lot more lately how ridiculous these thoughts can be.

He trusts me, more than he's trusted anyone in his life, but these wild thoughts just take over him and he doesn't know how to cope.  We've had a lot of good, calm talks lately and he is so scared right now that our relationship is on it's way out.

I tell him over and over again that there are 3 sure fire ways that I will end this. 1) If he physically abuses me or my children. 2) If he carries on sexual e-mails or phone calls with other women. 3) If he stops therapy and quits working on it.  I truly am fully prepared to leave if any of these occur.  I know that I am not deserving of the way I am treated, but I do love him and I want for him to get better so that he can live a happy life...whether it's with me, or without me.  Hopefully, we can live a good life together.

Sometimes unfortunate things happen in relationships.  One partner can get in a car wreck, become paralyzed, be inflicted with alzheimers...and spouses still stand by their side.  It's hard, very hard, but I do see his sincerity as well as his slips and falls.  And although I suffer a lot of bumps and bruises along the way, I see how much he hurts inside.

My first visit with the therapist went well.  My husband went to his and then we all met together to talk about communication between us all.  My husband is very fearful that if I get stronger that I will leave him.  This is the inferiority complex that these BPDs live with every day.  Two weak individuals do not make a healthy relationship.  I want to be strong...and want him to be strong...and our relationship to be strong.

I still hang on to hope.  Sorry if I vent on here too much but there is so much that I have not let out to anyone.  I guess here it feels somewhat safe.