how does our BP cycle compare with yours?

[Think About It...]

My wife's cycle (i guess OUR cycle) goes something like this: 

1. loathes me, tells me to leave, isolates, restricts me from seeing her or her daughter, talks of "doing our own thing"  "we'll talk in 2 weeks"

2. Blames me for anything & everything - stating it's the reason she's mad & lost desire to be married and/or work on us

3. usually asks me if I've been driving thru "her neighborhood"  (I don't have that kind of time on my hands)

4. emails me and/or texts me about insignificant things, just to force things & get me to respond - and also puts any of my belongings I left at her house out on the front step.  Because she doesn't want to "see" me, and she has "nothing to say" to me.  And I think it makes her feel better - like she reinforces in her own mind that she's "putting me out". 

5. goes a day or 2 no contact.  I just go with the flow and do not contact her.  Most of my contacts now are only in responding to her...I rarely initiate contact anymore.  However if I don't reply to her, she b__tches about that too.

6. she starts easing up.  Usually around full moons, and her ovulations.  starts sending me email jokes

7. calls me or texts me about something superficial.

8. calls me more (usually weekends) and ends up asking me to come over...usually using her daughter as the reason: "Hannah has been asking about you"

9. sexual energies fly rampant, best friendships rekindle, family environments strengthen, starts feeling "the way it should be".  And I start becoming hopeful once again.

10. Physical, mental, & emotional needs are met for both of us.  Ultra high sexual activities, almost addictive in nature.  "make up sex".  She plans for it with hints & comments.  She talks dirty to me & wants me to be "rough" with her.  Sleep together.  Family activities - fun - laughs - games - dinners.  True enjoyment.  She freely asks me for advice on whatever her concerns are (only related to HER, not US).  We are best of friends.

11. My feelings remain consistent & loving.  I mentally plan how to address our strategy for "working on us" at a time when I feel she may be receptive.  She begins to get "edgy".  She lets unneccesary comments slip out - with a hint of blame attached.  She starts asking me pointed questions about whatever, and in rapid fashion...keeping me off balance.  I respond honestly and forthcoming.

12. no matter how kind, diplomatic etc - I attempt to "talk" with her...she cannot remain calm, & drifts quickly into the land of OZ...losing her temper...complaining about anything & everything, with fingers pointed directly at me...as the scapegoat.  No words of soothing, standing up for my beliefs, or even detachment by quickly leaving can stop her destructive motion in progress.



Start again at #1.

[spouseofbp]

My wife's cycle (i guess OUR cycle) goes something like this: 

1. loathes me, tells me to leave, isolates, restricts me from seeing her or her daughter, talks of "doing our own thing"  "we'll talk in 2 weeks"

2. Blames me for anything & everything - stating it's the reason she's mad & lost desire to be married and/or work on us

3. usually asks me if I've been driving thru "her neighborhood"  (I don't have that kind of time on my hands)

4. emails me and/or texts me about insignificant things, just to force things & get me to respond - and also puts any of my belongings I left at her house out on the front step.  Because she doesn't want to "see" me, and she has "nothing to say" to me.  And I think it makes her feel better - like she reinforces in her own mind that she's "putting me out". 

5. goes a day or 2 no contact.  I just go with the flow and do not contact her.  Most of my contacts now are only in responding to her...I rarely initiate contact anymore.  However if I don't reply to her, she b__tches about that too.

6. she starts easing up.  Usually around full moons, and her ovulations.  starts sending me email jokes

7. calls me or texts me about something superficial.

8. calls me more (usually weekends) and ends up asking me to come over...usually using her daughter as the reason: "Hannah has been asking about you"

9. sexual energies fly rampant, best friendships rekindle, family environments strengthen, starts feeling "the way it should be".  And I start becoming hopeful once again.

10. Physical, mental, & emotional needs are met for both of us.  Ultra high sexual activities, almost addictive in nature.  "make up sex".  She plans for it with hints & comments.  She talks dirty to me & wants me to be "rough" with her.  Sleep together.  Family activities - fun - laughs - games - dinners.  True enjoyment.  She freely asks me for advice on whatever her concerns are (only related to HER, not US).  We are best of friends.

11. My feelings remain consistent & loving.  I mentally plan how to address our strategy for "working on us" at a time when I feel she may be receptive.  She begins to get "edgy".  She lets unneccesary comments slip out - with a hint of blame attached.  She starts asking me pointed questions about whatever, and in rapid fashion...keeping me off balance.  I respond honestly and forthcoming.

12. no matter how kind, diplomatic etc - I attempt to "talk" with her...she cannot remain calm, & drifts quickly into the land of OZ...losing her temper...complaining about anything & everything, with fingers pointed directly at me...as the scapegoat.  No words of soothing, standing up for my beliefs, or even detachment by quickly leaving can stop her destructive motion in progress.



Start again at #1.

[flowergurly]

I've only recently started posting here but I've been suspecting for a year that something was radically different w/my SO and for 2 months I have been educating myself.

I cannot tell you how comforting it is to know that all the things I have experienced are almost exactly like so many others here.  For the first time I've felt I am not alone.  and in some ways it is very sad because w/my SO he refuses to acknowledge there is anything wrong w/him so i have to admit and accept that he is never going to change and there is nothing I can do to convince him otherwise.  it kills me to walk away but I can only be pushed so much.

But,  the cycle you write about is almost exactly mine for the last two years.  thank you for posting that, it really has been a "light bulb" moment.

Bless you,  flower

[JoannaK]

Spouse, let's face it.  You may need that high and that low.  You may not be able to remain with somebody who doesn't treat you like dirt, who doesn't do the push/pull stuff. 

There is one way to break these cycles (and my cycle with my exh was similar, but not as exaggerated as yours.  Plus we lived together...  we jointly owned the house.):  That is to LEAVE the relationship.  That is to stop idealizing the abusive spouse as "the one" who can be...  whatever.  To work on yourself and understand why you stayed so long in such a lousy relationship.

Your wife is not committed to anything right now.  Not to you, not to therapy, not to anything.  The problem here is within YOU spouse...  and it's not that you are such a good, tolerant guy.  The problem is that you invite this chaos into your life for some reason that you haven't yet figure out.   

I wonder...  how many truly genuinely decent women did you pass up before you became so enamored with this dingbat?

Stop trying to analyze her and why she does this or that... and start looking at yourself and why in the world you are still hanging around waiting for crumbs.

[tonyel]

My EXs cycle was al follows...

Year one...
Intro, likes me, month 3, loves me, loves me, jockeying for position in my family, some issues wit abandonment, but still loves me.

Year 2
Loves me, loves me, loves me...lots of romantic e-mails going back and forth

Year 3
Still Loves me, loves me, loves me...still lots of romantic e-mails going back and forth

Year 4
Still Loves me, loves me, loves me...still some romantic e-mails going back and forth.  Got engaged mid year in 2004.  Still everything seemed OK.  Started looking for a house together.

Year 5
Still Loves me, loves me, loves me...not as many romantic e-mails going back and forth, but still some.  End of 5th year something outside of our relationship triggered a problem.  Unknowingly I was split to black .

Year 6
Still loves me for about 2 months of the 6th year then...BOOM...don't love you.  You shoud find someone that does and thinks about you first thing in the morning and at night when apart...I don't, yada, yada, yada.
Over, don't want to get married, we let our true sides show once we got engaged and we're not compatable...blah..blah..blah..

Mine really wasn't a"cycle" it was more of a straight line continum to hell!

Tonyel

[istayed]

Hi flower,

Welcome! I've had so many lightbulb moments here at BPDFamily--it really has made a difference in my level of sanity!

Spouse, I think a lot of us have cycles. My BPDh and I never get up to Levels 9 or 10 anymore, but neither do we reach the point of one of us ordering the other to leave the house. I'd say our cycle stays on "Bad" most of the time, with occasional fluctuations to "Better" or "Worse"  (Hey, maybe this is what the marriage vows meant by "Better or Worse!")

My friend, you have analyzed and re-analyzed, and you know what? You're still on the road facing the two tunnels of pain. One tunnel leads to Nos. 1 through 10, over and over again, ad infinitum. The other tunnel may be long and difficult, too, but it does have an end, and you get to create that end yourself. You have to decide whether getting No. 10 once a month is worth the other crappy numbers the rest of the month. That No. 10 keeps drawing you back. It feels so good. It gives you hope. I understand how powerful it is. You think, "If No. 10 could just last a little longer. If I could just figure out what I'm doing wrong that causes it to end. I wish I could just extend No. 10." But your experience shows you that your wishes are not based in reality.

Go down the right tunnel, Spouse! Get to the other side! There's healing there. You'll be whole again. Someday, there might even be some worthy lady there who you can share No. 10 every day for the rest of your lives! You're worth it!

spam

[spouseofbp]

thank you for posting that, it really has been a "light bulb" moment

Your welcome, tho' I'd rather post about 'kodak' moments! But then I guess I wouldn't have to be here.  I have had the same "deja vu" experiences here many times, reading other members stories.
It is a good feeling, and as spamlady said so well, it keeps us somewhat sane.

You may not be able to remain with somebody who doesn't treat you like dirt, who doesn't do the push/pull stuff. 

hmmm...maybe.  I HAVE left many relationships (short term) when I became 'bored' with them.  This certainly is more of a challenge than I expected!  High Maintenance?...an understatement.  I could be happy with a little less of a CONTROL FREAK! as a partner...

I wonder...  how many truly genuinely decent women did you pass up before you became so enamored with this dingbat?

I met several since my divorce in '96, & was single for 7 years.  I was strong, & had only 2 relationships lasting more than 6 months.  Why have I been so stubborn?  I MARRIED HER.  Partly not wanting to let # 3 become a failure.  Sounds like Tonyel got out just before getting married.  Wish we would have.  At 7am the morning of our wedding, we stared at each other, wondering whether or not to call it off.  Seriously!  Finally we said..."oh what the hell..."   oops!

Go down the right tunnel, Spouse! Get to the other side! There's healing there. You'll be whole again.

I truly believe this.  And I truly believe I'm headed to the other side.  I am accepting it, slowly, one step at a time.  And with each step I feel a little stronger.

Thanks to all

[JoannaK]

spouse, I really do believe that many people at BPDFamily can't (or couldn't) value someone unless the person was a high maintenance b*tch or jackass.  The sex wasn't exciting enough if it was reasonable and available.  The person wasn't exciting enough unless he/she was difficult, reactionary.  I believe that many people at BPDFamily interpret "strong" and "independent" to mean that the person insists on having his/her way, and see the inability to compromise, the communication snafus, the stubbornness in the early days as a plus...  Wow!  This person won't give in!  What an independent, strong character!  What great self-esteem!

Unfortunately, people who are difficult, demanding, narcissitic, BPD-ish, etc., have terribly weak self-esteems and they are not internally strong...  that's why they act up all of the time.  They live in fear of someone pulling them off center, of not being in control. 

I don't know how as a culture we stop associating btchiness and controlling nastiness with something good and desireable. 

[izzymae]

hey spouse,

I know you have been going through a lot of soul searching as have I and everyone here at BPDFamily...I think there is so much to be said for what JoannaK says about us being drawn to the push/pull. I had my second T session with my new T today and we are working on EXACTLY that...why have I stayed in this for 9 years? What do I REALLY get out of it? why do I tolerate the abuse when I never would from anyone else or standby and watch my good friend do that without raising He*^*^!

I am on the path of trying to figure out how to deprogram that aspect of myself and to choose healthy relationships from now on...not staying on this crazy roller coaster ride.

I don't know what the answer is for you or what you'll choose but we support you and it sounds like, overwhelmingly, think this isn't good for you, it doesn't sound like there is any hope for real change on her end...but there is an infinite amount of hope comparably on your end for change...change yourself...take care of yourself...even if that means walking away from that mess...

[spouseofbp]

spouse, I really do believe that many people at BPDFamily can't (or couldn't) value someone unless the person was a high maintenance b*tch or jackass.

Well said.  I can be a bit of an extrovert myself - as I have performed music for 27 years in the spotlight as an entertainer.  In fact that's where she found me...coming out of a 1.5 yr relationship while still married to a former, she would watch me perform (I had no clue) for what she said was at least 3 months. 

I remember what attracted me to her when I finally "met" her, was her outgoing nature, off-the-wall comments - almost a passion for "daring" others in a humorous way...(but many times going off the deep end, as I discovered later)

Unfortunately, people who are difficult, demanding, narcissitic, BPD-ish, etc., have terribly weak self-esteems and they are not internally strong...  that's why they act up all of the time.  They live in fear of someone pulling them off center, of not being in control. 

...and because of this they "over-control" others - pushing, forcing people to see it their way, even on trivial issues.  Well said! 

Her T called me after that first session, and as we talked she commented, "she certainly wants to control the way things proceed.."

Last night we stayed together.  Mini-re-engagement.  This morning in a rush she acted-out about the dog, it's "too late" - "that's when we were married" - "My T & I laughed about how you can't shut-up!"  "she told me you left a message just rambling"  "get out - leave"  which I gladly did, calmly, and just shaking my head in amazement.   

This was the woman who laughed with me, confided in me, dressed up in lengerie & had her way with me, said 'good night I love you" to me, woke up with a smile...then started the 'blame game' within 30 min.  I was going to shower there but screw it - went back to my friends.

I want to call the T & get her email, just so I can describe the passive-aggressive behavior of the last 15 hours.  Amazing...

but there is an infinite amount of hope comparably on your end for change...change yourself...take care of yourself...even if that means walking away from that mess...

Yes izzy I know.  I am a great person.  One who's lost himself in this mess, but is slowly finding a way out.  So my greatness can flourish once again.

[istayed]

Hi spouse,

You're talking the talk, but not walking the walk. The tunnel to a happy future does not start in her bed.

I know this is like my pot calling your kettle black, but when she whistles, snaps her fingers, and says "Time for sex," the healthy answer is not to hop in her bed.

I realize this may be a "man" thing. I've heard that men hardly ever turn down sex, especially if she's dressed for the occasion. But you know what you always have to put up with later! Is she so hot in bed that it's worth the humiliation? (It's okay to say yes, if that's true!)

Hoping that the apartment will make a difference, but if you keep acting like an obedient dog, she's gonna keep treating you like one.

Wishing for strength for you,
spam

PS: Without breaking any anonymity, what type of music? Are you working now?

[spouseofbp]

oh Spam - I read your post over on Caribou's thread - & I have compassion for you too.

As much as I have good thoughts and intentions on sharing in post responses...I don't know how qualified I am to give much advice

Yes she's pretty hot when she turns it on.  And I treat her & give her just what she's looking for in lovemaking. 

But she separates SO decisively by her actions & behavior of this morning.  I feel like texting her - "thanks for the good time last night.  Sorry, I'd rather have a wife, not just a lover"

The only reason I went over there last night was when she called - "I have to make a decision about this pool & need your advice"   (She's having an in-ground pool started today)

Personally I think she's nuts for putting in a $50k pool.  But I DO NOT DARE mention a word!  All she wants (again) is to be stroked, to be seen as the hostess with the mostest, to be the life of the party, to

It will deplete what equity she has (got a 2nd mtg to do it) and is NOT a financially sound decision - the association dues are $500/yr and includes a very nice pool.  No other home in the addition has a pool.  I sold real estate for 15 years & know she will never get her money back. 

But that's ok...as long as she puts it in for enjoyment only, and not resale.  It's HER house.  The pool will only keep us from ever buying OUR house - and as JoannaK said:

Remember, spouse, a relationship or a marriage in which one person lives in the other's house (vs. at least emotionally owning the house together) never works.

So this morrning, she started in again, about the added chaos because of the 4 dogs - they're taking down the fence - so she wanted me to take one dog to make her life easier - and since I'm getting an apartment...etc.

I calmly told her I can't.

w- "but it's your dog"
"it's OUR dog.  And you wanted 4 dogs"
w- "OH GREAT!  SO IT'S ALL MY FAULT!  WELL SHOOT ME DOWN! CALL ME A ____!"
"I'm not saying that"
w- "I wanted 4 dogs because this was when we were still married!"
"ummm...we still ARE married"
w- "you know what I mean!  And I'm taking care of these dogs" and paying for them"
"I just gave you $50 yesterday"
w- "YEAH...yesterday!  Leave! Just go!"

bye bye haveaniceday.   And inside my head thinking: "Sorry, I'd rather have a wife, not just a lover"

[JoannaK]

In defense of men, there are some men here who have rejected their BPD partner's advances because they were so tired of the abuse and the b.s.  Spouse, it's clear that she doesn't understand what it means to have a husband and that she really doesn't want one.  She wants a slave of some kind.  I've known people who are in the bdsm "lifestyle" and I've never been able to figure out men who are content to be "submissive".  I'm not saying that's your role, but, boy, it sure seems that way.  Perhaps you are happy with the way things are between you...  perhaps you do enoy her "punishing" you.  I don't know. 

I just don't see her every allowing you into her life as a husband.  The house thing is very, very telling.  You can never live together unless she moves...  what are the chances that is ever going to happen?

[spouseofbp]

yes - i have been her "love slave" at times.  And she's been mine.  Actually if we'd show the love & respect outside of the bed, that we do in it...our world would be a better place.

Yeah, this pool thing pretty much 'cemented' it.  it's her house, her rules, her stuff...in HER control.
I do not understand her logic.  Don't think there's much there.  Just mostly NPD-ish needs for being the center of attention, etc.

Spam,
To answer your music question: I majored 4 years in music performance at a top college.  Performed professionally for last 27 years.  Worked for 4 years with one of Prince's former backup singers (she's now in Nashville)  Had 2 positions at local churches as music director over a 12 year period.  Proficient at vocals, piano, keyboards, saxophones, harmonica.  Taught music & voice lessons. 

Met my bpw in a local popular club I was performing. 

Now she doesn't want me to do it anymore...jealous but won't admit it.

[istayed]

Spam,
To answer your music question: I majored 4 years in music performance at a top college.  Performed professionally for last 27 years.  Worked for 4 years with one of Prince's former backup singers (she's now in Nashville)  Had 2 positions at local churches as music director over a 12 year period.  Proficient at vocals, piano, keyboards, saxophones, harmonica.  Taught music & voice lessons. 

How magnificent! I love music--rock, broadway, classical, bluegrass, motown, folk. Most anything except rap, country, and opera. My brother (piano and trombone) and sister (piano, sax, clarinet, oboe, guitar, banjo, voice) are both performers, but not professionals. My music performance genes died out after 3rd year piano and three guitar chords, but I've got plenty of the music love genes! How I envy you! And to be able to do it professionally! You're so lucky. If I had the talent, I'd use it. I wouldn't let my BPDh or anything else stand in my way. When you have a gift like that, sometimes it's easy to take it for granted. Don't! Make the most of it. If you have to go to Nashville, do it! (Us southerners aren't so bad!)

Thanks for sharing. This helps me see your whole picture better. Now I'm really gonna be a &itch when you need to be taken to task! (In a friendly way!)

Best,
spam