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Many people commend me for hanging in there, they say I am strong. I am wondering if it is a weakness. Wouldn't it be better to say "no thank you!" move on. Why take the beating? It seems that fear might be the reason for hanging in there, rather than getting out, setting firm boundaries, your time with your children is your time, get into a healthy relationship. What say you?

Those "many people" don't have to go through what you do. They see only the surface. Only you can determine when enough is enough. However, when I was struggling with this decision, and analyzing pros/cons over and over, a therapist said something very true... .  

When the pain for either one of you becomes too much then one of you will leave.

It was fear and not being willing to give up the dream that kept me in my BPD relationship.  I don't think you need to look at it from a weak/strong staNPDoint but it definitely takes strength to leave and I am not sure about the strength it takes to stay... .  from the posts I read on the staying board most of the people sound beaten.

Inaction is a choice just as much as action is a choice.  Inaction when action is appropriate seldom works.

I've often commented that Staying - or hanging in there - is not a decision based only upon you.  There are various factors to consider... .  

You must reserve for yourself the right to re-examine your decisions whenever appropriate.  For example, if you promise to stay because the other person promises to improve, then if there isn't much significant improvement then you have a right - and obligation - to reconsider that decision or promise.

Meanwhile, work on yourself and educate yourself... .   about the disorder, coping methods, communication skills, etc.

Meanwhile, don't obligate yourself more than you already are... .   about having children or having more children (complicated custody issues if relationship fails), joint purchases of homes and vehicles (complicated to undo), hiding the poor behaviors (hiding doesn't help and often enables even more poor behaviors), etc.

Decide what Staying must require... .   Do not 'stay' in a dysfunctional and unhealthy relationship if it doesn't soon start improving and clearly heading toward becoming functional and healthy.  If things are so bad that it brought you here, then likely the relationship shouldn't continue 'as is'.  If change isn't happening within a reasonable time period, then reconsider that staying urge.

That's why I refer to it as "Staying for Now" - until you discern whether there will be significant and lasting positive change.

ForeverDad makes good points.

Vboy, staying or leaving is not in itself showing strength or weakness - it shows inactivity - not making a decision/being undecided and living a life in limbo is really tough going – for you and those around you.

If we make a commitment to stay – we need to work on some communication tools to help you. Without that commitment nothing gets better.

If you want to leave – we need to work on disengaging while you make plans to leave/get your finances in order/build your support network.

Decision Making Guidelines (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=111890.0) can help you move towards finding what you want.

Wow your posts to me a really helpful! Thank you so much for your support. I am working no on "Taking a Step Backwards" Amazing stuff! This support group was a found treasure!

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The order is important - tempting to miss out the "Stop the Bleeding" - if there is one thing that is crucial to making our situations better is to learn ways to respond rather than react.

Reacting is injecting our own fears/inadequacies and childhood wounds onto another person to relieve the frustration/shame/guilt

Responding is validating/listening/responding without needing to fix/rescue/enable

Breaking the cycle of conflict - takes two!

At this point, I am working alone, but the "stop the bleeding" techniques there are still very applicable. Since I am working on this alone, accepting that I am working alone helps. I really like that "Accepting doesn't mean I have to agree with it."

It is a bit of fear that keeps me here, but more importantly I so desperately want a happy, HEALTHY marriage for us and our daughter.  I don't want her growing up in a single parent home, I don't want the divorce label. So maybe it's a matter of selfishness and pride for me as well. Although, really, there is nothing healthy or happy about our relationship, and THAT is not fair to her.

But fear, too, because I don't want to hurt him or feel like I've abandoned him (he has nobody to turn to outside of parents and sister), I don't know what he may or may not do to himself, and I'm afraid of the effect that it will have on our daughter. Many people have told me that I'm teaching her right now what a marriage should be... .  I DON'T want this for her, but at the same time, I don't know what the effect of divorce will have on her.

Sounds like you are deep in the FOG.

There is no easy way to know when and if you should leave... .  it seems everyone just has their breaking point.

I would say your daughter has a better chance of being happy with one parent in a healthy relationship than from sticking it out with a person with BPD and modeling a bad relationship.

GreenTea, what kind of support do you have for yourself and daughter?

Vboy, right now it's a handful of friends and this board. My family is supportive of whatever decision I make as well. English speaking therapists are not to be found where I live, and the few counselors that PCS in are here for 6 months and then move on to another base. The one I had been seeing left in March. I have been in counseling for a total of 5 years in and out. We've see a chaplain once together and another counselor once together. I know in my head what I should do, it's just letting go of a dream that I thought I said "I do" too, taking that step of faith and letting go.

My friends have said that it's harder to stay than leave. But at my vantage point, the hard part is taking that step and leaving.

And yes, hithere, it is the FOG. Nasty stuff. 

One thing that I have found immensely helpful is keeping a journal. I call it my "angry journal"   Instead of reacting to him, I get it all out on paper. I've stopped the bleeding, still voiced my thoughts and opinions, and have documentation if ever needed.

Green Tea I feel for you!  I am glad you have support, that's important.

I feel the same about the dream being shattered. Everything we were working for is crumbling before my eyes. The pain of having the kids in a broken home is a lot to bear. But I did not choose this. It is what it is and I am learning from this support forum how to accept my new reality. I wish things could be different, but they are not. I am not sure how much long I want to hang in there. But, at one point if things are not going to change in the terms that my wife can begin to see the value of our marriage and that we can make it work, I will need to hit the reset button and make a new life that would not include her other than being the mother of my children. I like what ForeverDad says, he makes points that make sense to me. I'm "staying for now" but I'm not locked in to it. There will be positive change, that I know. With with her or without. While I hope with her, I am getting myself ready for that change. If this dream doesn't work out, I'll just dream a new dream! I can do that!

A few decades ago the book Solomon's Children - Exploding the Myths of Divorce had an interesting observation on page 195 by one participant, As the saying goes, "I'd rather come from a broken home than live in one."  Ponder that.  Taking action, as appropriate, will enable your lives or at least a part of your lives to be spent be in a calm, stable environment - your home, wherever that may be - away from the blaming, emotional distortions, pressuring demands and manipulations, unpredictable ever-looming rages and outright chaos.

In short, you can choose to make the best of a lousy situation, whether you stay with demonstrated improvement, "stay for now" pending improvement or whether you go.  The reasonable best.

Your decisions of course will be affected by your spouse's actions and behaviors.  But it's always up to you to decide what boundaries you will set in your life, what you will do or not do, etc.