BPDFamily.com

I have been back and forth on this board many times. My relationship with believed to be BPD partner is 3 years old. I've had warning signs since the beginning, but the good times are reallyyyy good... and this is my first serious relationship as I am in my early twenties so I've always held on to the relationship the entire time. There's been probably 3 times I've tried to break it off with him, but he always brings me back somehow. I'm so incredibly sick of his mood swings. I still love him, but find more and more I'm dying to be alone. When I'm lonely and I call him, I find I'm doing it more just to be with someone than to be with him. Sometimes we have great times together but a lot of the time I feel kind of like if I'm not doing what he wants to do, I'm out of luck. He's suffering economically and I pay for most everything, and that wears on me as well. I really love him and care about him, but I have this feeling like this is the wrong path for me. I can't fully be myself because he disagrees with some of my beliefs. He quilt trips me all the time for not doing certain things... i dont know how to end this. I'm like 80% sure at the moment, I should end it. I don't want to hurt him. I know he'll never understand, and never forgive me. I will likely never hear from him again. I'm scared because I don't want to regret leaving him, I'm scared I will regret my decision and want to be back with him. That's the main reason I don't just do it. I don't want him to hate me, and I want to be sure that leaving is the right thing. This man is my first love, and we have so many memories together. I'm more afraid than I've ever been before. I need advice please

  Someone123,

What you describe is a lot of how I felt when I was with my exBPDbf (he is nearly 50 years old!) and breaking up with him (about a year ago) still haunts me (a little) because I know he is sick and I could not do anything for him or us for that matter. You're young and should be able to be yourself and feel good about who you are. When a person blocks you from this it can be very damaging down the road! I know you're hurting about leaving him, but it sounds like you have a good handle on the situation and know that there's really no healthy and well-balanced future with him. You will be in pain and you will miss him, but you will also gain a lot if you stick it out and move on from this potentially destructive path. You've already seen the red flags. Ask yourself... .  what is the very worst that can happen if I leave him?  

Listen to what your gut is telling you. Do you have a therapist or a good support system in place?

H S123-

I just logged on to post something very different--really, the end of what I thought was the relationship of my life.  You'll hear a lot of insightful things from more insightful people than me, but since I'm sitting in front of a computer thinking and feeling at the same time as you, I'll respond.

You are on the Leaving Board, the relationship sounds deeply unbalanced (your report sounds more than fair, what you are feeling and not a bunch of exaggerated details) and you are young.

If you recognize yourself, at this age, in this stage of a relationship, finding similarities to what people have experienced here, one thing should be clear:  you shouldn't expect the other person to radically change or improve or suddenly get insight; you either have to accommodate to him or her (to God knows what lengths, for God knows how long) or you have to look at where you are, make a bold move, and thank your lucky stars that you steered clear of something more dangerous and life-draining than what you already know.

If you already have the insight to be here (how I wish I had), then you have the brains and emotional insight to know it isn't where you want to be.  Turn off the tap, slowly, get a T, bore the hell out of him, move to a foreign country, switch sexualities, take the high road or the low road, but in any case get out while the getting is good.

(Too directive, but reflective of my own regret.)

Godspeed.

If you are quite confident that he has BPD, then I think everyone here will agree that you should just simply get out... .  regardless of the difficulty of the transition.  Relationships with pwBPD seem to, by nature, offer a greater illusion of hope than should be believed - and the prospect of the relationship ever eventually becoming closer to what you need is extremely unlikely.

In the case of BPD, it should also be considered that to simply decide to "accept the bad with the good" forever is a choice that eventually may be taken away in the most painful ways possible.  In my case, for example, I probably would have accepted my exBPDw's outbursts and instability for the rest of my life if it meant maintaining my family, retaining the "reallyyyy good" times, and getting to share my life with someone that I really did love so much.  This decision on my part ultimately ended with her betraying and abandoning and lying in ways I could never have imagined any real person ever doing.  I now, of course, can see that I should have left long before we ever even had the kids or made our supposed lifelong commitment.  I think this is a relatively common result of the determined decision to "stick it out forever".  It really just usually doesn't work.

However... .  

If you are not confident that the person has BPD, then the question perhaps (possibly) becomes more complicated.  From what you have described, it seems entirely possible that this person is toxic and harmful whether he is mentally ill or not... .  but, honestly, it is also difficult to ascertain that fully from your description.  Whether or not leaving this relationship will ultimately be the best thing for you is therefore hard for me to say with certainty.

In short:

If you really believe he has BPD, then leave.  If you really believe deep-down that you should leave regardless of whether or not he has BPD, then leave.  If you're not sure about either of these, then I'd suggest the conversation here continue until you gain a greater level of certainty on these points.  Talking it out in detail may give you more clarity.

Hi someone

I feel familiar with your story. I was in a very unsatisfying rs, was the only breadwinner. So I can relate very much with you.

I agree with Sabine, about having your therapist. I did this and it is one of the best things I did the last years.

You started your posts on the Staying board. Did you read the Lessons there? I would focus on the parts about "us". Understanding your role in the relationship (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=56206.msg913188#msg913188). I had a huge benefit from those Lessons. It helped me to come to decision, together with my T.

Thank you all so much for your responses, I do not currently have a T so this board is kind of serving as that for me. I'm so confused. I posted this yesterday after spending a day with him & experiencing his nagging, crankiness and indirect insults. At the end of the day, he wanted to spend the evening together. I told him I'd like to be alone this evening. He got furious... said I hurt him, made more little insults... but I dropped him off. Later on he messaged me, sounding upbeat and happy... and said he was coming over. I gave in and said okay. Once he came over he was in a totally different mood and was happy. I'm soo confused.

In addition to therapy, I would really recommend processing your confusion by reading everything you can about BPD.  If you are confident the warning signs and symptoms describe your boyfriend, then you will need to think about all of this in the context that he may very well be genuinely mentally ill.  A relationship with someone with this mental illness will definitely be confusing - and one cannot expect to fully understand (or predict) their thoughts/behaviors simply by using the powers of understanding and interpretation that had guided us "nons" throughout our lives prior to the r/s.

If by reading, you cannot acquire confidence he has BPD, then perhaps explain here exactly why you have come to suspect it.  What has he done throughout the relationship to make you believe he might be mentally ill?  In my (brief) experience on these boards, I've found that people here are very good at relating to another persons' stories and helping them understand how to interpret what it all means.

Someone123

Yes, the mood swings are confusing! They are parts of the mental illness. I would recommend you to post a while on the Staying board. Reading through the lessons. The communication tools are important too.

The members there can be very helpful to feel less confused. 

Hi Someone123.

Well, BPD or not, the way you describe your relationship, it sounds very unhealthy.  

If you choose to leave him (and from what you've desribed, I hope you do,) you probably will go through a period of regret.  When we contemplate getting away from these kinds of destructive relationships, it's hard not to idealize the good times - placing way more value in them than they really have.  

Think about how much of the time you are unhappy or confused.  And every time he is allowed to get away with this behavior, it sets him up to do it again.  And... .  then that behavior generally escalates. It's no way to live.

If you contemplate a future with a person like this, how do you see it playing out?  How would you feel if he treated your children this way?  You are young and your life is not entangled with his yet.  You are not married, you don't have kids, you don't own property together, etc.  When all of these things are in place, dealing with the stress of a dysfunctional relationship is way, way worse.

Would you regret not being subjected to his mood swings, his digs, his nagging, his crankiness, and so on?  These negatives are clearly significant enough that they brought you HERE.

Even if this person isn't BPD... .  all of the things you've described are part of who he is... .  and that likely won't change (unless HE wants it to)... .  not for YOU... .  not for anyone.  Leopards don't change their spots.  

If he were to recognize that his behavior is inappropriate and get help for that, perhaps there could be a good outcome, but are you willing to wait around for that?  And... .  it doesn't sounds like he has any awareness of how his behavior affects you.

turtle

and one more thing... .  

One of the things I came to realize about myself was that the longer I put up with poor behavior, the more "normal" it became.  I would just shrug off behavior that others might think was horrific because I had become desensitized to it.  Then... .  as my xbf's behavior escalated, so did my acceptance of it.  Until... .  it was so over the top that it could not be ignored and it had grave consequences.

You're having a lightbulb moment NOW.  I'm glad for that for you!

turtle

I remember too many times I had those moments, and just flicked the light back off, thinking now that I saw the problem more clearly I could change it somehow for the better. Or I'd just hit the dimmer switch, and try to make it so the light wasn't as bright, as if I couldn't take it/ was too sensitive in those moments. Turning the light off = Denial. Dimming it= Denial. The reality is right there before you, right NOW. Is it easier to see what's really going on when the light is there, or not? It's hard to leave someone you care about, and love, even when they're hurting you or spinning in their disordered patterns. It does come down to what is best for you and your own life. If you are following your own path, you will find others on a similar path. While feeling happier and more sure along the way. At a certain point, we find that some of the people we thought were coming along with us are not. Another  :light: to pay attention to. Best wishes.

The barest part about it... is that once there's been an argument or difficult time... I begin to feel like okay, now it's time to move on. And then he turns around and acts all happy and sweet and I feel guilty even thinking it... I love him... but at the same time I've had this underlying feeling like I need to be alone, like I can't fully satisfy who I am as a person with him. At the same time, I'm scared. I've never loved anyone like this, he's my first love and someone I've discussed many future plans with. I do deeply care for him. But I honestly want to be free. I feel burdened almost. Another problem... Is I've tried to break it off with him multiple times. One of them I was very strong in my decision, and kept telling him no matter how he begged that it had to be over. Hearing a grown man cry somehow weakens me to the core. He probably knows that. Because of a mixture of guilt and the fact that I still love him tremendously, I end up hoping things will work out and going back to him... despite having a feeling in the put of my stomach that says this isn't right. As horrible as this sounds, I've prayed over and over for an end to this... because I'm unsure if I have the strength to end it myself. I've wished and dreamed that I could put the responsibility on someone else... .  I know I can't do that. I just don't even know how to do it... and I'm scared to death of my own regret. This is a man I've imagined having a family with one day... who's the closest thing to my best friend... it shatters my heart and scares me so much the thought of him hating me, me never being able to talk with him... but it also scares me the thought of staying and living through his dramatic ups and downs. I feel so alone...

Someone



"Love" should not make you this miserable.


This is such an insightful thing to say.  Listen to it!


"Love" should not make you feel burdened.


Your own body is warning you.  Listen!


Think about how your life would be impacted by this, but even moreso... .  think about how innocent little lives that are being shaped by their parent would be impacted by someone that behaves the way he does.  Look what his behavior does to you!  It's confusing to you. Can you even imagine how confusing it would be to a little child?


This should scare you. His behavior is not acceptable.  The guilt he pours on you is pure manipulation and it's working! He turns on the water works and then you don't leave.  MANIPULATION.

Blocking the door so you cannot leave is an act of hostility.  Not cool.

At a minimum... .  a MINIMUM... .  his behavior has to be addressed before you would even consider remaining in a relationship with him, much less before you ever had a family with him.

I know it's hard Someone.  Believe me.  I know EXACTLY how hard it is.  However... .  you are here to deal with it and you are not alone here.  Every single person on this board is in, or has been in, your shoes.  It's tough, but you will get through it!

turtle

I need help developing a plan. I don't want to be dragged back in. I'm depressed with my life right now and I know something dramatic has to change. As sick as it is I almost wish he'd cheat or something to make it easier to leave. He lives very close to me, so that makes it kind of difficult. I'm so afraid... .  I know I can go ahead and say it... but the hardest part will be enforcing my decision over and over. I can pretty much tell you exactly what will happen. I'll tell him I need to end this. He will transition between anger and tears and eventually blame me for things, and finally storm out. Then later on he will begin texting, messaging... whatever basically guilting me. Telling me he loves me, he's hurt, he doesn't want to be alone etc. What has happened in the past is at this point, I finally feel guilty enough and start to want him and be afraid of being without him myself and I message back with I'm sorry, I love you this is what I have to do. But eventually, it turns into I'm back with him... and he continues this whole I'm hurt thing... and I feel like a bad person. Do you reccomend ending it in person, on the phone... a note... or what? Should I just do it now... or wait until I'm out of town for a few days to give some space or something? I'm just so afraid I'll regret this and want him back.

I've been in that place where you're just hoping they do something so flagrant that it would give you a "good reason" to leave.  Well... .  he's already doing things that are flagrant... .  you've just become desensitized to it.  His behavior -- as it is -- is unacceptable and that is a GREAT REASON to leave.

Even if his behavior wasn't so horrible and YOU wanted to go down a different path,  THAT is a valid reason to leave the relationship.  You aren't married, you don't have kids, you don't owe him your future.

The thing that's working against you, is that when you tell him it's over, he's not going to believe you.  He believes that if he cries and begs, you will change your mind again.  This has worked for him in the past so you have to be ready for the pressure he will apply.  It will be heavy!

As far as how you do it, I can't tell you exactly what to do, but I can tell you what I'd do.

Because he has shown signs of physically restraining you, I would do it over the phone. I would keep it very short, to the point, and then end with saying there can be no contact.

Then the hard part begins.  YOU have to enforce No Contact.  He will NOT respect the fact that you've said there can be no contact. You can count on that.

That means... .  you don't answer phone calls, texts, emails, etc.  If he shows up at your door, you have to not answer the door and if he escalates, you have to be prepared to deal with that.

History proves that if you give in... .  you will be right back in this same place -- feeling "depressed with your life."

If you are planning to leave town soon... .  as in today or tomorrow... .  then I think it would be good to do it then.  However, if leaving town isn't in your immediate plans, don't wait for that.   It's clear from your description of your own life that you are miserable TODAY.

Does any of that make sense to you?

turtle

I hare this... whenever I'm really close to leaving... I just have this back and forth sort of tug of war in my mind... .  I think I'm going to leave, today... then no... I can't... back and forth over and over. I think about those good times. In reading all the BPD articles I've read, I've realized more and more... my parents did sort of raise me into a "people pleaser." Although sometimes I can be rebellious and hard headed... I also hate to displease people. My father is often the same way. Throughout my life, as an example if I had plans with someone... I usually feel awfully guilty if I have to cancel plans. I hate when people are unhappy with me. I believe this is a huge factor that holds me back and enraptures me in guilt when I try to leave. It's weird, because as soon as I've pretty much made up my mind to leave... the good times seem better and I start second guessing myself again. Thank you all so much for being here for me. I have very little strength now and very few to no one I can really talk to about this. It is even worse, because as I'm making these plans... he's talking to me in a happy & upbeat mood. I'm so afraid... .  

Someone

did you ever consider attending a Coda Group?

Reading your post I am thinking about co-dependency. Perhaps a group could help?

People pleaser or not, I think it's pretty normal not to want to hurt his feelings. Most people don't look forward to being "the bad guy."  

The thing is, if you are as unhappy as you say, you aren't doing HIM any favors be remaining in the relationship.

There are many on this board, including myself, who are co-dependent. I'm not nearly as bad as I used to be, but I'm ELEVEN years out of my relationship with crazyx and I've done a truck load of work on myself.  It takes time.  My codependency was at it's highest when I was with him and because HIS behaviors were so flagrant, I never had the time or energy to look at my own behaviors.  Once I did that, I realized that I never should have been in a relationship with a person like that in the first place.  And... .  it was my "people pleasing" that landed me there.

Maybe this fits for you, maybe it doesn't, but the "people pleasing" part sounds like a fit. I think you should be applauded for taking such a good look at yourself at such a young age.  You have your whole life ahead of you and you are already looking at yourself, your choices, your values, etc. This bodes well for you Someone!

Kudos to YOU!

As far as your fear... .  we all understand. It is real. You will decide to do this when the pain of remaining is greater than the fear of leaving.  Only YOU will know when that is!

turtle

cross posted with Surnia!

I was also going to recommend CODA.

I did attend CODA, but only briefly because of time conflicts in my area.

I also attended ALANON and found that to be very helpful.

This board is immensely helpful.  I found this place long after crazyx and I had split - and I don't really post that much anymore because I've moved on with my life... .  and I'm here to tell you... .  You don't have to live in such misery!  It wasn't until I found this place that I started a significant turn around in my dealings with crazyx.

There are many books that are helpful, but being here... .  with others who were also experiencing the same things is the thing that helped me most.

turtle

I don't normally recommend books, but there are two that I think are very worth while.

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=56458.0

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=59097.0

I had read both of these books before I ever came to these boards. Once I found this place, I read them again.

Out of all the books I've read - these two helped me the most!

turtle

I'm so afraid of losing the good times. I really am... but I feel almost like his love may be more for his ideal of a relationship... not as much me as a person. He hates some of my interests. Doesn't agree with some of my beliefs. One of the largest things that's irritated me lately is that he doesn't want to get a job, and because of that I end up spending a lot of my money on food, etc. He gets upset that I'm not "romantic" or planning outings, but I dont because it will just mainly be my money being spent. Sometimes were together and laughing and generally having a good time together. Other times he'll randomly be in a bad mood like this weekend, and if I express any emotions that are not totally positive... he acts like I'm a burden and ungrateful. I thought he had an item I was looking for, and he stated in return he thought I had it. When I realized I did have the item, he snapped back with "I told you." When I expressed I wasn't having a good time during am activity he grew frustrated and said I was making him miserable. Man... I don't know. I still am afraid of leaving... although I know I feel that's what I should do. I really love him.

Someone123, sorry this is hard for you. So many of us have been or are there. We feel for you and know this is a hard decision for you to make. It really does come down to what is best for you. I stayed with my now-ex for years thinking somehow we would figure it all out together. Offered her the helping hand so many times, and got it chewed off almost as many. I love her, too. I wish it could have worked out for us somehow. She couldn't meet me halfway though and I couldn't keep deluding myself into thinking I could carry her. She has to face that for herself, now, just as I do. I wish her well.

I was afraid to lose the good times, the marriage we planned, the friendship... .  But honestly, were any of those things really possible? The good times usually included walking on eggshells, the marriage was just a dream we shared, and the friendship didn't prove to last. She hurt me deeply. While that is just my own sad story, it's also so many others here. At a certain point, whether you are with the best person for you or not, you need to take your own steps in life, follow your own heart, and path, and if they're really there with you, this other person, then great, you have a partner. If not, then you go it alone. Either way, you need to follow where you feel to go. Sometimes that's towards something wonderful. Sometimes it's away from something terrible. Sometimes it is both. We need to make the best of what we have, no matter what.

Speaking as someone who also found it very hard to let go of the relationship, and all the promises it held, I really know what you are going through. While it has been hard emotionally, and lonely, working through this grieving, it's best that the patterns of abuse, lies, break-ups, etc. have changed. It's better for ME. As it will be for you, if that is what you decide to do, too. Best wishes to you as you go through this, and peace.

Someone123

Your story rings so true for me. I started my relationship in my early 20s, I thought he was the love of my life. He didn't have a job when I first met him.

I've always been a people pleaser and I find my identity in always being the " nice guy".

I too started to get the sick feeling in my stomach. I kept telling myself I had to be absolutely sure I wanted to break up. He was an all or nothing kind of guy and I thought once I left he would never take me back.

Fast forward 6 years, I'm still here, planning to leave. The good times became less and less the bad times became worse. His disagreements with my belief turned into a big issue. He ended up calling my fami,y " religious fruit loops" which really hurt because they've been nothing but wonderful to him. Him being critical and turned into him shouting at me and calling me names. I am now a sad shell of my former bubbly self. I even prayed that God would show me a way or a sign to make it OK to leave him. I too said to my therapist " sometimes I wish he cheated on me, or hit me or something"

I could go on but I feel like I am just repeating both your story and mine back to you.

I agree with what someone said above that the more you're exposed to it, the more " normal" it becomes. It's not though.

Please get into therapy, I agree that co- dependent no more is a great starter book.

I can't tell you what to do. At the end of the day no one can guarantee you there will be no regrets. You will probably miss the good times. You will probably feel bad for hurting him.

I'll tell you what you won't have. No more being made to feel bad about your values or beliefs. No more insults or always being criticised. No more crazy making behaviour where one time he's really mad at you and the next he's the happiest person in the world. No more feeling like you act out of guilt and not genuine want or desire. No more obsessing about what he's thinking, feeling or how things affect him all the time.

Something tells me you won't miss any of that stuff in your life.

Only you can decide on leaving or staying, either way we are here for you.

I've been where you are, I didn't think my ex really KNEW me and we didn't have much in common... .  and it was brutal to be around that. I was walking on eggshells all the time, too many times I waned to be alone with my own life than to 'try' to share it with him. I felt lonely when I was with him, I wasn't able to be who I really am... .  on and on. And I too wanted him to do something (or catch him doing something) that would 'give me permission' to end it. Truth is, he had already done enough, shown me enough, and it was up to me to let him go, bite the bullet and rip the bandaid off. I had to find out why in the world would I hold on to this kind of 'love'? What was I so afraid of?

Turtle said it all... .  love is not suppose to be this much work, it is not suppose to feel miserable... .  

Curvy girl... .  have we dated the same man lol! Wow. your story sounds so similar. That's what I feel is the worst part, you're unhappy... but there's enough good times scattered to make it seem like there's not a good enough reason to leave. The past couple days I've spoken with my BPD bf a little less than normal, he's already freaked out. Yesterday I spoke with him throughout the day but didn't call until that evening. He grew very angry. Makes me feel better that I'm thinking about leaving... I can't imagine that in a healthy relationship someone would get angry over something like that. Then he tries to guilt me, make me feel like a bad gf by listing off the different things I do "wrong"... .  His main arguments are that I don't plan enough outings, I went to see my parents for the holidays and he couldn't come because he doesn't get along with them... he wanted me to ditch them for him... no. He also says "you constantly threaten to break up" Avtually, that's only happened 3 times... and it's been months since the last time. And, they were never threats. I was serious... and I stated that. But he guilted/pleaded me to come back. He should know my underlying feeling for about a year now is that this needs to end... I don't understand. I just hang on because of love and care for him... and because honestly, I don't want to be without him... it's easier to stay in a comfort zone. But I can't discuss certain avtivites with him, he dislikes them... he gets upset I'm not interested in his hobbies which honestly, idk why I would... he's not into mine and his hobbies don't interest me at all... I especially wouldn't care to learn about them when I feel I'm practically being forced to. I'm feeling I may end this today... or very soon. I hate this feeling of like being in a fog right now, part of me is screaming no, don't do it. But the logic in me is saying just say it before you look up and another 3 years has passed by.

Just made a list of the benefits of leaving & staying. Benefits of leaving- I'm free to be myself, no more fear obligation & guilt, I can spend my money on myself or save it, no more pressure, no more stress, no more arguments & criticisms

Benefits of staying- just have one... not being alone. That was all I could come up with, no joke. That made me realize even more, I'm mainly just staying for my own comfort and because I don't want to hurt him or have him upset at me. I'm staying purely out of comfort, even though the relationship tears me down more than comforts me. But I have decided, it is happening... later today I am telling him that it needs to end. Breaks my heart, but man I have to look out for myself at a certain point. I've made a list of things that I will do in the future to keep myself occupied and focused on things other than thinking of him. I also texted a friend who I've spoken to about the relationship and told her of my plans and to keep me accountable. I plan on also seeking a therapist... and I will need you guys! Thank you all so much... because I know I probably wouldn't ever be able to get through this without you all. I will certainly continue to need your support through the time to come.

There is relief in making a decision.

There is freedom in sticking to it!

Good for you for deciding not to settle for so much less than you deserve.

Stay close here, Someone!

turtle

Another question... I'm a little concerned he may try to attack me on facebook, make me look bad etc. I guess there's nothing I can do about that now. I pretty much can predict his reactions, and I know he is going to react with tons of anger. I'm planning on telling him today, giving a brief description why... and staying no contact or as little as possible. I'm sure he'll likely be over to my place in a rage later, though. Mainly that scares me because of how much stength it will take. I've grown weak in the past, and I still love him. I have few friends. Any advice on how to get through these times? I know my issue isn't the first part of telling him... it's staying strong through his emotions after that.

Take your facebook page down!

turtle

Block him on FB right now. If he shows up at your house in a rage, do not answer the door... .  call the police. You must show him that you're serious. Avoid contact with him since you're vulnerable right now. You need to keep your strength and resolve and the only way to do so is NC. Block his emails and phone number. You're too fragile at this moment to be able to stay strong if he's allowed to text or anything at all.

Hang in there!

I just said it. Any minute now craziness will ensue... I'm shaking, I'm so afraid. I can't believe what I'm doing... I know its right but I just want to go back to being comfortable with him

Good for you Someone!

I would challenge you to stop thinking of being with his as "comfortable."  It clearly was NOT "comfortable."  You were VERY unhappy and even now, you are fearful of what he might do.  In a "normal" relationship, if people decide to part ways, there might be hurt, tears, etc., but there generally isn't the fear that someone will retaliate in hateful, hurtful and destructive ways.

The fact that you KNOW the craziness is about to start, is very telling.  You may have to experience some extreme discomfort for a period of time and that's okay.  It's necessary to go through that to get on with your life and live free from this insanity.

The most important thing now is to do as Reenehsv said:


Stick to your decision and prove to him that you mean it!  Be prepared to do whatever you need to do to honor your decision and to protect yourself.  Did you tell him there can be no contact?

Stay close here!

turtle

Well. Needless to say... .  that already failed, I guess. I told him through text, long text and was very assertive in saying it needed to end. He called, running over to see me. He hugged me, told me he loved me and totally can't be without me. He offered to go to counseling and that we could also go together. Guys... .  what on earth do I do.

Ugh.

Well... .  if it were me (which it isn't,) I would tell him that yes... .  counseling sounds great and you are glad he recognizes that this would be a good thing for him... .  and he should pursue that on his own -- without you and away from you.

Agree with Turtle.

You decided it's best to break up with him. Stick to it. He's just using manipulation, messing with your feelings to make you feel pity for him and have hope (counseling). My bet, if he's like most other BPDers, is he'll promise you the moon to win you back, but once he's back in your good graces, his actions will be completely opposite.

If you really want to end this, try to see through his manipulations and stay strong.

I feel so confused. I feel so determined, focused... and then that happens, I'm in his arms and a bit of hope is seen... like maybe things could change, maybe I am just too codependent... maybe some of these issues are because I don't communicate well enough... he says he wished I would just put him in his place when he acts in a way I dislike. But at the same time, a part of me thinks almost like he's acting when he acts sad... and he knows exactly how to react that draws me back in. Sometimes I feel like he really loves me and things could actually change... and then others I feel he's just mainpularibg me through these actions. I really love him so acting or not, when someone I love is begging for me like that... hardest thing. I don't know where to go from here now... .  

Why is it up to YOU to put him in his place?  You're not his mommy.

These are not new issues between the two of you.  His behavior has bothered you for a long time, but all of a sudden he's going to play the counselling card?  IMO, it's pure manipulation.  He knows that's what you want to hear.

I'm no psychic, but my best guess is that he won't go, or if he does, it will be effortless on his part and short lived - and he'll punish you in some way for "having" to do it.

You say you really "love" him.  What is it you love about him?  You've said he makes you pretty miserable the majority of the time. Earlier today, you made your benfits of staying or leaving list and only came up with one very weak reason to stay.

I know you don't want to hurt his feelings or have him be mad at you, but is that worth being miserable most of the time?

Even if, by some miracle, he does go to counselling and embraces that, you won't see significant change in him for a VERY long time.  And... .  it could very well get worse, not better.

turtle

Honestly, it sounds like he's manipulating you to get what he wants. If he truly wants to go to counseling, he'll go whether you're together or not.

My stbxh (uBPD) tells me constantly that I'm not a good communicator. I believed him for a LONG time. It's just not true (in my case at least), just another way for him to degrade me and make me think I'M the problem.

Is this where you want to be in 1 year? 5? Chances are, he's not going to change.

My stbxh and I did go to counseling. He manipulated the T, making me sound like a horrible shrew and she sided with him on every issue. He used that to "prove" to me that I was the problem, not him and that I needed to "work on myself." He was correct, but not in the way he meant it. My h claims he loves me and cannot live without me. I finally stopped believing him when he told me he loved me, then immediately said I "drove him" to yell obscenities at me and treat me badly.

Only you can decide what to do.   Good luck!

Another thing I've found is everytime Ive tried to break it off he says how embarrasing it is. I find that weird... .  he said today, like imagine how embarrasing it would be if we were married... like what other ppl would think

I just read straight from one of the articles about the manipulation and blaming you for being "embarrassed" from a breakup... I don't know what to do right now. As crazy and dramatic as this is, I'm going to tell him again... it's over. He's planning on coming over tonight. Should I tell him before, or then?

If you are serious about this, tell him now.  There's NO REASON for him to come over if it's over!  If he comes over, this gets harder.

What freaks me out is how blinded and mainpulared I am around him. I'm in a daze of love, and he knows exactly what to do to make me weak and fall back in his arms. Right now, my mind is clear again. Whenever I'm away from him for a while, my mind grows clearer and I realize I may miss him and love him but that the relationship is certainly troubled... most of the times I've tried to end it have had longer periods of us being apart preceding them. When I'm with him, I think he knows exactly how to push my buttons.

He knows how to push your buttons because you've shown him it works and that's why he keeps it up.

Mine still tries and it's been almost a year! I ended it in Feb and forced myself to block his phone and emails. He continues to send letters, presents, and cards in the mail to my house. (The last one was just last month!) I have to ignore, ignore, and ignore. For awhile I had to hold on to my anger to keep myself from caving in. I had to remind myself of how he sounded, what he said, and how I felt when he raged at me. I had to remind myself how utterly lonely I was when I was with him. I had to remind myself that he is an adult and I am not his mother. I had to remind myself that I made the right choice in leaving him- for me. I stayed very close to the boards. I stayed away from places where I might run into him. I had to reconnect myself with my likes, my life, and my serenity. I had to go through the whole gamut, the whole series of emotions, because my head knew it was not a healthy relationship. I learned as much as I could about r/ss with pwBPD and that what he was doing was not love. I had to look at my own issues on why I'd want to stay with someone who behaves this way... .  in time you'll get there. Give yourself a chance, tell yourself to give yourself a chance! you can do this... .   

You have to do whatever it takes to detach.

Hey Someone123 --

Just curious how you are doing today.

Yesterday, you were posting quite a bit and today you are not here.

Let us know what is happening so we can know how to support you!

turtle

Looks like were giving it one more try... I tried to end it a second time, we had a long talk... talked about how to improve things and I got really open and honest with my concerns. I told him my concerns about some of his behaviors and that I've been discussing it with others who also have advised us to get therapy... I ended up feeling more hopeful than I had in a while. I'm going to really put my all into this, try my hardest to get this to work... one last try. I'm going to start going to a t myself asap...

I think the best advice I can give you is to just go into this "one last try" with your eyes wide open regarding what BPD really is.  To my knowledge, you have not asserted on this board a strong *certainty* that your BF is in fact BPD.  Use this next attempt to evaluate that question more seriously... .  and perhaps do so with the help of one of the other boards here (perhaps "staying" or "undecided".

If he is a troubled, but healthy, person, then your plans for "putting your all into this" and "trying your hardest" may indeed be a possible (although perhaps unlikely... ?) path to success.  If he has BPD, though, then the challenge really is very different - and the causes for optimism are greatly diminished.

Do not allow yourself to get trapped due to inertia or a fear of loss.  If it is a relationship with a pwBPD, then a sense of loss is all but inevitable... .  be it now, a year from now, or in your old age when you look back at how different your life might have been.

I wish you the best.  I'd love to hear more of what happens, and the questions you may struggle with along the way.

Start working with a T is anyway a very good plan!  |iiii

When you are willing to try again, I would recommend you to go over to the Staying board and post and read there. It really helps!

Hi Someone123,

Believe it or not, that was going to be my next suggestion. Sometimes we have to 'test the waters' so to speak one more time to be sure. I know I did. Therapy would be extremely helpful for you while you try one more time. just_me_500 gave you great advice "Eyes wide open!" and listening to your gut at all times. Don't lose yourself Someone123, don't be too shy to open up on the Staying Board and share your feelings and how things are going... .  it's your safe zone! 

Guys... I've been researching into the concept of "~." I'm trying to asess if he legitimately does want to change and improve things and will put forth an effort... or if this is just a manipulative tactic. He is saying now that he is incredibly hurt and insecure since I tried to leave... kind of clingier than normal I guess. In a conversation, I stayed away from the phone a few minutes and returned to a large amount of messages proclaiming love and how things will change. I myself am having a difficult time dissecting what could be BPD/abusive or manipulative behavior or what is truly sincere I guess... after reading so much on the topic I almost feel practically everything said is a trait of BPD or narcissism.

Excuse me, "~" nor recycling

I'm growing very resentful and I can't contain it today... I'm just angry. Angry at the world... angry I'm in this situation and don't know what to do... angry at how confusing this is... I want a break... .  I want to feel numb and not have to dissect the meaning of everything he says anymore. I don't want to feel anymore.

Why are you so angry?  Did something more happen?