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I’m too stunned/numb to cry much yet. This follows on the heels of yesterday when we met with a counselor and told me she wants a divorce after 20 years.

This morning I’m still in a state of shock, can’t work, so I thought I’d pull up her cell phone log. It completely explained why she emotionally detached weeks ago. A typical day shows 40-70 texts and long phone calls between 11pm and 1am.  (And I felt sorry for her as she seemed so tired lately…she said she just wasn’t sleeping well!)  Through some reverse number lookups, I determined it is a younger guy who is her employee.

Okay, I did break down and bawl really hard when I checked the night of my birthday.  As was the tradition with us, she put on a sexy nightie and walked me upstairs for my once-a-year “royal” treatment, where she does all work and I just tell her to do whatever I want.  Well, I saw that she started texting shortly after we finished!  And kept the texting up for several hours in our living room while I slept upstairs. (Wonder what she told him “He wasn’t very good and I can’t wait to get your clothes off”?) 

I haven’t slept with her since.  She’s been busy though.

Another gut-ripping revelation was her frequent contacting with him while her and I were together at the coast over the long Thanksgiving weekend.  It felt so romantic…she was warm and sexual as always, and we had a great time with her extended family. One of her nieces is a photographer and she took family and couple pictures on the beach. My wife plastered these all over her Facebook page the day we got back – us laughing together holding hands, hugging on the sand, me carrying her on my shoulders in the surf, all smiles. But now I know why she seemed so happy. The glow was from being in love. WITH HIM. Her phone log showed that she was texting him as often as she could steal away from me day or night. Can you say, B-E-T-R-A-Y-E-D?

But wait it gets better.  Over the Christmas break, she told everybody she was going to take a little trip and stay at a spiritual retreat center to rest and recoup.  That was somewhat plausible as I’m have  encouraged her to take a B&B weekend by herself to rest, write and recuperate from her stressful job as the Executive Director of a non-profit for abused women. Except that it was Christmas and she wanted to get away for a damned 10 days!  That raised a lot of eyebrows and pissed off our grown children. But what could I say, she didn’t ask me, she told me. As it turns out, sporadic calls over five days placed her in …New Mexico?   What?  That’s several states away and she knows nobody there. But the calls and texts between them stopped completely during that time period so he of course was with her. Next I did a reverse lookup on a NM phone number that she dialed, and it traced back to a residential line of a couple with the same last name as his. Yep, his parents. Pastors of a church no less. Nice picture of them there on the church web site.

So, my wife leaves her husband, kids and grandkids, takes this guy 12 years her junior to go home to be with HIS family for the holidays. (Wonder how he introduced her to the family…”Hey everybody, meet S----.  She’s a fantastic person, so respected in the community; you’ll love her.”  Leaving out, “Oh, she’s still married, but she’s going to take care of that soon.”)

Hang on, the best part is coming. First though, some background. A few months back she got an apartment because she needed some “time out.” It was something I reluctantly acquiesced to, as she had been growing increasingly angry at me over the last year, and her BPD seemed to be getting worse. So I helped her get settled in. She insisted we weren’t separating, that some “space” would do us good over say, six months. She continued to assure me that we were destined to be together.  We were relating as any married couple with issues but still in love… sleeping over at one another’s place 2-3 nights a week, doing weekends together, and checking in with each other consistently pretty every day. However, in November something cropped up that I never felt before  –emotional chill. For the two decades we’ve been married, she has always been very clingy and needing assurance of our connection constantly.  Naturally I started getting anxious, because I know the classic signs of someone else entering the picture.  I asked her point blank several times what was wrong.  She assured me there was nobody else in her life; that she was just processing with her counselor some painful issues and it was causing some numbness.

Keep in mind I just discovered the infidelity today. Plus I am extremely dismayed  from finding out yesterday she wants a divorce. We were sitting down this evening to talk about logistics – when to tell our families, how to break it to our S9, what reason we would give for divorcing, could we try to use a mediator, etc.  Distraught, I had called my counselor earlier in the day and he cautioned DO NOT confront her about the affair by yourself! She’s high functioning but she can dysregulate and succumb to major cognitive distortions in a flash!  Plus it’s a rule of thumb for me to take  time to calm down and think through my response first.

   

So I decide that I’m not going to say anything tonight about her in-your-face lying while banging-another-dude’s-brains out behavior.

Well, she comes home and we sit down to eat the nice dinner I made. She is beautiful; I’ve barely seen her at all the last month. And we haven’t had sex since early December, so I am feeling it.  There is an unexpected longing to hold her and kiss her.  The prospect of asking for one last passionate night did flash briefly in my mind. I start to feel sick; she’s got a fresh young buck all over her body and I think I’m going to turn her on?  It sinks in that the mental imagery of today as I pieced together her whereabouts for the last couple weeks ---is of the enjoyment he has been having with her.  All afternoon my imagination  devastated me on one level,  but revved me up on another. What’s wrong with me - this is stupid I tell myself... .  she’s a freakin tramp. Problem is, I still love her.  I actually  feel more sorry for her being ill than angry at her bad choices. A perfect codependent. I try not to look at her  because her hair looks attractive and her face is beautiful and when I glance at her it is too much.

We clean up and go to the living room to talk about mediators, splitting assets, etc. She begins to cry and blames me again for “making” her divorce me.  Perfect BPD  thinking! I tell her I didn’t want the divorce (it’s the truth --I didn’t, yesterday.)  It starts getting uncomfortable as she offers the idea of just filing a separation and see if I would pursue her more (REALLY?) and possibly make it work.

Now I finally get a bit PO’ed… if you’re going to have a torrid affair, keep a shred of decency and divorce me cleanly. I almost blurt out something about her love-texting minutes after my birthday “present”, or the 70 texts they exchanged on Dec 18th our anniversary, when she canceled our traditional romantic getaway at the last minute because she “had work to do.”  So I ask  to see her phone. There’s an app that she wanted a while back and I need to put it on.  I watch in silent amusement as she fumbles with her purse and pulls her phone out. Trying hard to act non-chalant, she checks her texts and deletes several.  “It’s Shiela texting again.”    Right.   I’m usually pretty dense and unsuspecting so she thinks she is getting away with it.  She finally she hands me the phone.  I can tell she is still worried as I start playing around with it.  Yeah, I should have pushed the game farther but I’m too much of a softie to enjoy seeing her squirm too long.

Ok enough fun, I want to end this awkward face off.  Tell her I’m tired and am going to take a shower.  She says indignantly, “I guess we’re done talking?”  I say, “Yes. Good night.”  She points to her  briefcase that she brought in (oh... .  why’d she do that?) and says she thought about spending the night (remember that it’s been five weeks since she’s done that.)  I said “If you want to stay for our S9’s sake, I’ll sleep on the couch.”   She says, “Maybe I want to stay for both of you.”  (Why is she doing this to me now? Did her boyfriend just cool it with her?)

Without looking at her, I respond firmly “No you don’t.”  To which she teared up and choked out a “you NEVER believe me!”  and left in her car.

One more thing, maybe the weirdest part. The guy is in a freaking residential treatment program/facility for alcoholism, AND has a court order of no contact with his kids! WHAT?  I am a college educated professional with a good reputation, zero addictions, kind, generous, a committed Christian, plus I’m fit and good looking. I’m far from perfect but I bend over backwards to  treat her like a Queen. SO WHAT IS SHE THINKING?   I wonder if she really needs more of an a—hole, loser-bad boy type, and she’d be happier.  Sorry though, that’s not me.

I'll add a question to what was the longest post ever... .  

I asked my therapist how someone who assists victims of domestic violence could be so careless/clueless about their secret cell phone use being exposed. He said maybe she wanted to get caught. Does anybody think she possibly wanted me to know?

As I read your post I shook my head a many times especially when you got to the conversation part.  This is pretty awful.  I wish I had great advice... .  I don't really but just to take really good care of you and the kids. 

To answer your question though I think some people do things to sabotage themselves... .  especially if they have BPD.  It's part of the schema, or script, they live.  It's hard to watch and live through with them.

She wanted you to at least suspect, and hence validate her "attractiveness". Probably was getting angry at you because you were supposed to suspect and get jealous, and pursue her more,but didn't (she dropped that hint) and so just kept pushing it further. This other person is part of the triangulation (read definition) (https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=121673.0) need.

The "bad boy" type is to get an injection of the newness and daring buzz. Probably wont last then she will try recycling you with a dont take me for granted attitude.

The way the affair developed and was discovered, along with your reaction is quite typical.

When you bring it up dont be surprised if you get a huge dose of it being all your fault, you made her do it. How readily she admits it or not will be an indication of whether it was done to provoke you or not.

At the end of the day what do you want? I know it will take a while to work that out, as this sort of thing is hard to process subjectively. While trying to process this try not to get too bogged down in the details, stick to causes, reasons and potential resolutions if you can.

I have been on both sides of this situation in the past and know how the real issues can get lost in the blame game

This was tough to read.  Can only imagine what it's been like living through the last 24 hours.  I am not sure how long you can hold onto this new information before it literally kills you.  I understand there's a child involved, but it sounds like the mother has been living outside the home for quite some time.  So there's little to be gained by maintaining the status quo.  Sounds to me like you have allowed her to do whatever it is she wants for a while now,  between the apartment and the holiday vacations.  The jig is up for her.  If it's any consolation, the sooner you end this the sooner the thrill of this other relationship is likely to lose its luster.  She will be depending on him constantly soon, and through very little digging you have discovered this man to be unavailable and almost undoubtedly incapable of providing this other part that you've been giving her for so long.    


I have noticed that this is a consistent them written about on these boards.  That the woman was treated like a queen.  I have come to the conclusion that women don't really want this from their man.  I don't necessarily believe they want to be treated poorly.  Just that they don't want a man whose life revolves around their happiness.  The women we write about here are like an extreme version of the female.  They're so needy that we change how we operate and who we are because the promise of who they once were to us is that great.  Remember this as you move forward in the days and weeks ahead.  I know I will never get so far away from who I am for another woman ever again.  

This is true they do need boundaries and limitations imposed, they rarely respect a pushover. A pwBPD thrives on conflict, if you just rollover they are not getting that need met, maybe thats why they like "bad boys".

In good times I have often been told she respects me because i have put my foot down at times, even though at the time she called me the most abusive things you could think of.

My God Vinnie! How are you able to write my story?   :'(

All I can say is that I have read it twice and got misty eyed. I so feel for you bro as I have been there too. In my case it was a young useless foreign college student living two hours away that she met online and yes. She did some pretty amazing sexual things to me which in hindsight had not a damn thing to do with me but were all for him. Long story short, the wretch and I are almost divorced and she is on number two or three. These loosers are 20 years younger then me and guess who is home with the kids when all this takes place?

As I have learned by reading here and doing research, it is not about you with what they do, its all about them. Always was and always will be. They seduce and are warm and sexy but only because of what we give them in return. Then its on to the next one. Sexual predators

I hope you keep talking to your conselor.  Good Luck!


-John

This is consistent with my experience as well. 

I didn't go to sleep last night but typed her a seven page letter and am delivering it to her in one hour. I included copies of text logs for certain days for which the betrayal was particularly blatant so I can let her know how it makes me feel. Don't know if anybody is interested but I'll post some of the excerpts.

Debilitating depression today.

Last night when she told me she wanted to stay the night for both our son AND for me, I found that despite my best efforts, my heart started to get excited about the prospect of making this thing work! But it didn't take long for that to come to a screeching halt when I went online to check her texting and saw that she actually had an exchange with him right before she got to the house last night.  Here is what I wrote to her about that (this is definitely the harshest and most angry part of the letter I'm about to hand her):



Last night, Jan 17th  So you were texting him at 6:00pm, right before you came over to be with us? Knowing that he would probably text back you were here, which he did?  Don’t get me wrong, you can text him or *** him in lieu of a salary or do anything you want to do with him.  But just don’t claim you were going to spend the night “for both of us.”  How dare you mess with my heart like that.  Don’t play me like a pawn. What did you text him, “I’m here at ***hole’ s house, let you know how goes”?  It was obvious how you checked for texts to erase when I asked to see your phone.  You both can kiss my -blank-.  I am so angry now that I don’t give a -blank- if we need to throw down and get lawyers.  Hope you enjoy him.

Yeah I know, probably does not comport well with the communication tools on this Board.  I guess it's making up for all those years of just zipping it and playing nice. But it's also a strategy.  There's a real danger that I will take her back and have to live in a prison of oppressiveness again.  This letter will help that not to happen.

I wrote one of these letters too.  And that statement was why did too because the "lets try again" appeals, lies, and denial was too much.


Word of advice if you haven't sent this is stick with the facts.  Keep out the emotion, curse words etc. 

Also see an attorney ASAP and post on the Family Law board ASAP too.  Check in with your therapist too depression can creep up hard and fast ... .  Take care of you.

I feel for you and know this place. 

Hi Vinnie,

I'm so appalled and sorry about your situation.  The whole Facebook thing reminds me of my sister. She has a deep facade that things look good to the outside.  She had the best marriage, best job, etc...  When she told my mom and I that her and her H were separating going likely to divorce, we were shocked!  We couldn't understand, thought there must be some other way, cuz H was such a great guy.  She got MAD at us!  For not supporting her in victimhood of this bad marriage with this guy who wasn't treating her well enough.  For a separation/divorce that she was initiating, not him.  What?

Then she arranged to go on a trip to Europe with a guy that she had a huge crush on.  She said it was "innocent".  Me, my mom and her best friend begged her not to go.  It was SO mean!  She had been planning a trip to Greece with her H, which fell through.  Now she was going to put this in his face after leaving him?  He loved her so so much, and wanted to fix things and work things out.  Ugh.

One person described my sister by saying that she sees herself as the Benevolent Queen.  She is always the one on top, she's always right, her needs need to be attended to.  If you cross her, she will make sure that you pay.  She sees it as, you did something wrong, so you deserve this.  She has no empathy and is completely cold in her execution of your punishment.  The punishment is likely 2-10x worse than whatever the affront was.

Her husband also treated her like a queen.  I knew what the rules were too, and tried to follow them so that I wouldn't be "punished".

Your wife seems really disconnected in some ways.  She has been living a double life.  If you look back on the years that you've known her, do you see any hints of this in other places?

With my sister, I do.  She is quite the story-teller, and will rewrite a situation to suit her own needs.  It can be confusing.  It can seem so sincere, this new story she is telling you.  You think, maybe I'm wrong, or we should just agree to disagree.  But I think it's due to a deep commitment to keep up the facade.  From what I've read of NPD, the facade is everything to them.  It is their whole identity.  They will do anything to protect it.  BPD may have something similar.  Also, I believe that deep down, she is a scared and insecure 3 yo.  She does do some things that remind me of BPD, but I don't know if she's disordered.

So, if your wife is anything like my sister, be ready for a huge attack, and the meanest coldest behavior you've ever seen.  You think the heart and integrity betrayal is bad now, just wait.  They don't like to be called on their ~.  She may have already written a story to herself about why she can abandon her family and kids to be with another man, and lie about going to a Spiritual Retreat, no less!  S**t!

I agree with GreenMango - try to keep the curse words and such out of it.  It's better for you the "cleaner" that you look.  She'll have less to throw at you to blame you.  And you will do a better job of holding up a mirror to show her who she really is.

Hi Vinnie,

I just read a little bit of your back story.  When your financial investments went awry, why didn't your wife say, I'm so sorry, honey!  What can I do to help?  We're in this together.  Why would she need to go 1/2 an hour away and have you spend money on an apartment for her?  That doesn't make sense to me.

Anyway, I'd say be ready for a bunch of projection - that you're abusive, irresponsible with money, selfish, mean, critical... .  etc etc.  I hope that I'm not right, but I have a feeling it's not going to be pretty. 

I wouldn't put anything past her as far as what she'll say or do to protect herself from a real or perceived threat.  Whether it's to her character, her control, her financial situation, etc.

I think it's really important to not give her any unnecessary ammunition against you, so definitely my advice is to try to keep your cool even though the situation is just appalling.  And make sure you get some solid support around you.

Best of luck, and like I said, I hope I'm not right.

Well, I handed her the letter, saying, “I said a lot of strong things in this letter, but please read the whole thing. My emotions are all over the place the last 24 hours; I won't feel the same forever.  Please know I am not angry with the real S---- that I care about, I am angry with the person who is doing these things, and that is not the real you.”

Playing dumb, she says  “I have no idea what you’re talking about.”

Me: I know what has been going on with him. I have phone logs.

Her (angry): So you CHECKED UP ON ME?

Me: Yes, you asked for a divorce the day before yesterday so I thought I’d better see what was going on.

Her: NOTHING is going on!

Me: Stop it. I know about the affair and you going out of state with him.

Her:  We stayed at his parent’s house. They’re pastors and we slept in separate bedrooms.

Me: You spent five days out of state with him and didn’t sleep together?

Her: That's right!

Me: Are you saying you never slept with him, ever?

Her:  We never slept together! You know I would never do that before God… (what was I going to say to that?)

Me: You were having an emotional affair at least

Her:  That didn’t start until Dec 12th, after you and I were “separated” (wow, didn’t know we had become “separated”)

Me:  Please don’t say anymore right now. I have the text and call logs for November. For an example, I printed your texts over the Thanksgiving weekend

Her: I text late with a lot people. I was probably texting Sheila.

Me: The logs show his phone number

Her: (wide eyed): We were probably just discussing work.

Me: You texted him through the whole weekend, mostly late at night. Read my letter, I printed the logs.

Her: Nothing happened!  We have just stayed friends.

Me: Would YOU believe ME if I told you that?

Her: You never believe me about anything.  This is totally your fault! (rapid fire listing of reasons)

Me:  I agree I messed up and failed alot and hurt you deeply. I take ownership of that

Her (shaking, crying): Why did you do (X, Y, Z)?  You ruined our lives! You destroyed this marriage!

Me. silence, looking at her, shaking partly from the cold and partly from emotion

Her: How many people have you told?

Me: No one except the therapist.  I promised in my letter I wouldn’t reveal this to anybody else.

Her: You told HIM?  I was hoping we could meet with him again next week, but FORGET IT NOW! You’ve succeeded in getting him to think I’m this sick, horrible person.

Me:  Please read the letter. I will see you later.

Then she called me a bit later:

Her: How much are you going to sock me for alimony?

Me: I hadn’t planned on asking for alimony.  Please don’t start assuming I’m going to take you to the cleaners…

Her: I didn’t do anything wrong! I was depressed and he took me to his parents to get prayer and rest.

Me: Did you tell his parents you were divorced?

Her: No, but divorcing. He (her boyfriend) likes you and is very conflicted about being in this position.

Me (getting very emotional): I think that is BS!  Why on my birthday did you guys text for 3 hours right after we were passionate with each other?  When I saw that, I cried so loud I thought the neighbors were going to call the police!

Her:  Nothing was going on! You won’t believe me; you always think the worst of me; why even try anymore?

Bottom line, she started out denying the texting.  Then she lied about when the “friendship”actually started.  She lied to me and her whole family about where she was over the holidays. I don’t believe her for a second that she hasn’t slept with him. When I met her she came on to me sexually on the second date, and never let up the pressure for the next twelve months (as a Christian I was trying to refrain from sex before we were married).  So I know restraint is not really her nature.

Hope is such a powerful drive. But if she won’t come clean, what chance is there to work on things and ever have a functional relationship?  Pretty much none.

I agree guys, I need to calm down.

So conflicted. I want so much to have her back, and I want so badly to avoid that very thing.

Not a drop of empathy or concern about the consequences of her actions.

Simply flat out dial and attempting to project blame on to you.

This is the normal response of a pwBPD when confronted

You need space now, before the gas lighting starts

Honestly almost impossible by your standards.  Functional by her standards it's possible.

I think you know this but she's blamed, rationalized, lied, lied by omission, minimized, accused, projected, and a number of other very dysfunctional things.  She didn't even say I'm sorry.  Right now she's operating under plausible deniability and is incapable of taking ownership... .  this, especially when trying to repair a marriage after an affair, makes healing from this very unlikely and that's with a partner without a mental illness like BPD.

If you want to try and work this out I recommend talking less to her right now... .  and thinking about your dealbreakers and then ask for them when you are feeling balanced and don't budge.  Get some space first.

Ex. Consistent individual therapy for both of you consistently then couples therapy, or therapeutic separation, or Her coming clean and total transparency for a X amount of time, or ending the affair, or separation/divorce, etc.

And, talk less with her either way until you work out what you want first and what your limits are... .  quit talking to her about divorce terms too.  And talk more with a therapist and a lawyer (I can't express this enough) and let them talk for you for awhile.  That distorted perception of reality, the gaslighting Wave talks about, is poison.

Seriously, talk less with her (business only by email if possible)... .  she's circular argumenting all over the place and drawing you into her emotion maelstrom so she doesn't have to deal with it.  Consider yourself mirandized here: what you say and do can be held against you in a court of law.  You can't come a good resolution for yourself and have conversation while you are feeling this way... .  give yourself a break and put yourself in a time out til you feel a little better.

Have you read up on a therapeutic separation with a BPD partner? 

The decisions you make now can seriously alter the quality of your life in the future... .  do you love her or yourself/kids more?  Just think about it.

Being in this position really sucks and I wish I had people around me who had been through the chaos before to bounce stuff off of.  Keep posting too... .  on Legal especially.

Vinnie. Wow. I feel for you. It's... .  (shakes head)... .  I echo the other replies. She denied it, was mad you had proof, tried to lay it off on you... .  You can't go back to that. There's no trust there, no honesty on her part. How could you believe anything she tells you?

Sorry you are going through this. You need to stay away, and not get sucked into a situation where you lost your cool and did something you regret, or that she could really use against you. Not that you would (I don't know) but just to be sure.

When you said, "Would YOU believe ME if I told you that?", I bet that's a line just about everyone on this site has at least thought at some time with their pwBPD, if not said aloud. Good luck as you proceed. She's living life by her own rules, in her own way, so leave her to it and do what's best for yourself from now on. It's much better than the me-me-me she's 'offering'. Not playing into it will help you in the long run.

Vinnie,

as a woman, a wife and a partner... .  I am so sorry for what you are going through. Not all women behave like this! I would never betray my H... .  even as ~ty as he's been. (cue violins for GL)

there's plenty of women out there who would give anything to find a supportive, caring, genuine, honest man. remember that.

this is going to be a rough road.

protect yourself as her brain and her common sense are likely to remain AWOL, protect any assets, don't make threats, don't believe her-and take care of your kids. stick to what your therapist and your lawyer tell you. Stay very LC if you can. it's about YOU now.

and you are not alone by any means... .  

GL

Thank you. I am taking to heart so much of the insight you all have shared.

Hi Vinnie; I have just read through your thread, your story, your life with a BPDw (undiagnosed?)... .  I am so sorry... .  

I believe that my sister is Histrionic Personality Disordered and my brother in law is JUST NOW realizing that she had "an" affair... .  she has filed for divorce, detached from him and had gotten rid of the one guy she was seeing but has one "waiting in the wings" for her as "soon as the divorce papers are in her hands, she will be contacting him" (her words... .  funny though, on FB, his status is "in relationship" with someone else... .  I haven't mentioned this to her)

I TOTALLY agree and support your "hard stance"... .  it is the ONLY way to detach and "let her do what she wants to do" and stop all the blatant lies and denial of her behavior. You deserve better. She needs HELP... .  if she isn't on meds, maybe she should look into it. Hoping that you are doing better now. Again, you do NOT deserve this... .   Wishing you well and DON'T back down or back peddle... .  you have come too far (finally?) to give up freedom from this. It is never "what we really want" because we do love them, but WE DESERVE TO BE LOVED IN RETURN and when that is not possible (?), we can be good to ourselves, believe the truth, don't deny what has happened or how we feel about it and "stand our ground"... .  You can do it... .