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Title: enabling Post by: liesal on February 25, 2013, 09:29:33 AM I hear so many stories about validating the BPD's feelings and sometimes it seems that all that is really doing is enabling the person. Basically, the root of a BPD's disorder is misperceptions, and by validating these misperceptions, I do not see the person with BPD changing. I am not going to work on those terms, I will not validate something that I do not believe in. I am moving on.
Title: Re: enabling Post by: Somewhere on February 25, 2013, 10:02:11 AM Yeah, I hear you.
Had to step back and look at that, as well. Maybe think of this as Hallucinations? www.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hallucination You understand I am just speaking sort of metaphor? Usually folks think of that only as Auditory or Visual -- e.g. Hearing Voices or Seeing Things that are not there. Not really an emotional hallucination -- more like a delusional [emotional] perception, but you get the idea? So if someone is Hallucinating driving the down the street and says "I SEE leprechauns crossing the street! I am going to run them over!" We as a Non -- in the passenger seat might Yell -- NO there are NOT! (invalidating) OR We as a Non could say -- Yes, they sort of look like leprechauns, (validating) but really you see this a School Crossing and those are kids going to school . . . so we should probably not run them over . . ." So the validation and redirection keeps the kids from being ran over, at least for today. -------------------- But really we must ask ourselves -- Why in the world are we in the car with a crazy person driving, and who gave them the keys? :) Title: Re: enabling Post by: Clearmind on February 25, 2013, 03:02:45 PM Validating is not agreeing with the person, its understanding the emotion behind it. Validation is about not making the person wrong and us right, but rather understanding there may be a grain of truth in how they feel.
Enabling is "doing" it for them - support is supporting the emotions around it because you are not them and for them their emotions are valid. https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=95263.0;all]SELF-AWARE: Are you supporting or enabling? (http://www.) Communication using validation. What it is; how to do it (https://bpdfamily.com/content/communication-skills-validation) S.E.T communication tool is used to validate and provide truth - TOOLS: S.E.T. - Support, Empathy and Truth (https://bpdfamily.com/content/ending-conflict) Have you got a particular concern liesal? Title: Re: enabling Post by: hithere on February 25, 2013, 03:27:17 PM Excerpt Validation is about not making the person wrong and us right I think this distinction is tough with BPD. Much of my ex BPD's life was spent reacting to either imagined wrongs or situations she manufactured herself. When I validated the feelings associated with these it was the same as agreeing she was right in making crazy. For example, she felt she should not be expected to give her sister a wedding present because we had to spend money on the wedding (clothing for us and the kids) and her sister was marrying into a wealthy family, so she should either not have burdened us with these expenses nor expect a present. This turned into a huge family fight. The logical thing to do here was to purchase a card and a small token present. But she was furious for months about this slight. So by validating the feelings that she was taken advantage of, used, her family had unrealistic expectations, I would be saying she was right in the decision she had made. Title: Re: enabling Post by: liesal on February 25, 2013, 05:12:16 PM If my partner with BPD says she is angry because I was talking to someone else for 5 minutes and she felt left out, I do not feel that is a valid emotion to have based on my morals, So it is not okay or right for me to validate her feelings.
Title: Re: enabling Post by: Clearmind on February 25, 2013, 05:24:24 PM The logical thing to do here was to purchase a card and a small token present. But she was furious for months about this slight. So by validating the feelings that she was taken advantage of, used, her family had unrealistic expectations, I would be saying she was right in the decision she had made. Hithere, you are right – this is where you use S.E.T – validation mixed with truth. It takes one person, usually us unfortunately to exercise some emotional maturity. Its unfortunate our partners lack this. If my partner with BPD says she is angry because I was talking to someone else for 5 minutes and she felt left out, I do not feel that is a valid emotion to have based on my morals, So it is not okay or right for me to validate her feelings. It’s not a valid emotion to you! To her she feels completely justified. We can either counter-attack and escalate the situation - where we end up in a conflict cycle or we can use S.E.T – SET is not just about validation its about truth as well – this communication tools allows you to put your point of view across. This excerpt is from the right --> Choosing a Path Excerpt End the destructive, pointless, circular miscommunications that you are having with your partner. Step 1 - Stop the Bleeding You are probably asking yourself, Why was she doing this to me? Why does she think I am the cause of all the problems? Why is she so unreasonable and hurtful? Why is there such a double standard? You are probably feeling either hurt and defensive, or resentful and angry, or both. Often we find ourselves caught up in a cycle of conflict. We trigger reactions in them. This in turn triggers reactions in us. And so on. You may be living together - yet alone and in cold war. You may be separated and fighting. What should you do? The same thing we do for any wounded soldier: "stop the bleeding". This is not a long term fix for the soldier and it is not a long term fix for you. But if we don't stop the bleeding, nothing else really matters. What does it mean in this context to "stop the bleeding"? It means to end the destructive, pointless, circular miscommunications with your partner. This can only happen when one party stops. If your partner has BPD or BPD traits, this is not likely to happen unless you initiate it and stay strong. For you to do that, you must first believe that "stopping the bleeding" is in your best interest - and far more important than all the things that are driving the cycle of conflict. Unless there is physical abuse, stopping the bleeding is more important. How do we stop the bleeding? First, we stop fighting back. This goes beyond just 'not arguing'. It includes: no pouting, no passive aggressiveness, no silent treatment, no saying "whatever". Second, we use proven communication techniques. Everyone wants to be heard and understood. After food and shelter it is one of the more basic of human needs. Giving this to the pwBPD (or with BPD traits) is a powerful way to break down the immediate trauma. It is possible to stop making things worse and it begins with learning a new way of responding and listening. And it includes learning how to ask for what we want in a constructive way. There is a formula for speaking with someone that has a better chance of success if used properly. Our attitude, tone of voice and body language has a huge impact on how our message is interpreted. Communication techniques are discussed here. They take practice. They take time to work. Be patient. You may get frustrated, but keep trying as the payoff could be a new, healthier relationship. Title: Re: enabling Post by: almost789 on February 26, 2013, 09:07:46 AM I'm not very good at validating the illogical mind myself. I have alot of difficulty too with validating these feelings they are having which are NOT based in truth. It's hard for me to say. I understand how you could feel this way, when I REALLY dont. It seems phoney to me. Now if there is a piece of truth to it, I can validate that. For instance when my pwBPD says I am too angry and an emotional wreck. I can validate this because I REALLY am an emotional wreck and too angry when trying to deal with him. I don't think most of us find it easy to validate the illogical and that causes us problems. It goes back to CAREMANS post the "disordered" brain vs the "NON" brain. There is only so much one can do trying to operate under these circumstances before the NONS brain goes... . zzzztttt. Because our brain doesn't work this way. I see validation as a SURVIVAL stategy and that is IT. Survival in a situation you have no control over. The other option is to leave.
Title: Re: enabling Post by: hithere on February 26, 2013, 09:11:51 AM Excerpt I see validation as a SURVIVAL stategy and that is IT Bang-on with that statement and that is why I found it impossible to consider staying as an option. Why be in a relationship just to survive... . Title: Re: enabling Post by: almost789 on February 26, 2013, 09:29:12 AM And how does one validate lies? Just complete untruths. Your BPD says... . " this, this and this happended" and you know it did not! How do you validate that stuff. Ugghhh... . You say that's not true? Well if you say that they freak out most times. So, what do you do when they are just point blank lying (and probably actually believing their own lies)
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