Title: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: goldylamont on March 04, 2013, 08:34:41 PM i have to be honest here, and i'm wondering if anyone else feels the same: the biggest reason i feel at a loss from my past relationship is because of her looks. yup, sounds shallow i know, but this is really all that i can think of now why i would put any value on this person.
it's been over a year since we broke up, about 4 months since last contact. since breaking up i dated a little and now have been in a relationship for about 6 months with someone new. the sex (at one time at least) was great with the ex, but honestly i can say it's *better* with my new gf. also, i had a 4 yr r/s with my exBPDgf, lived together for 18 months, so please don't think i'm saying our whole relationship was based on looks--i'm not at all into "trophy wives" or fake relationships, etc. there was a lot of love in those 4 yrs and having a deep connection and mutual respect are a requirement for me in a partner. it was mutual respect why i felt the need to end it after all. but yeah, after a lot of thought and reflection i've boiled it down to this for myself. i just was really attracted to this person, b/c i know i can find caring and fun love with other women, i know i can have great sex, i have great friends, i'm in a much better position career-wise and financially than my ex. but she was a looker. so with this knowledge at least i'm able to look at one hard truth and understand this part of myself. it made me feel good to walk into any room, party or gathering and be holding hands with this person. i felt at ease when i'd be out alone or out with my friends, meet other really attractive women and know that i had someone even more attractive at home. on the bad side i really have some thinking to do about my own ego, on a really good note i feel really solid that i'm not a cheater or a liar, i can be happy with one woman :) and that's good to know. i dunno if others relate to this in any way but maybe so? Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: glacier_glider on March 04, 2013, 08:48:36 PM I have my take on that. I've been thinking about posting regarding this (more on sexual side) but have not been ready yet.
Yes, the exBPD was a great looking woman but not the best looking in my life. She would probably make top 10, not top 5. But she is beautiful. I am lucky to have had been close with "LA 8s and 9s". I am sorry for the usage of these rude terms, just don't find any better way of describing. It helps understanding that there have been more beautiful women in my life who were not affected by BPD. It helps a lot! Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: sunrising on March 04, 2013, 08:54:43 PM I can relate. I'm sure others can too. As a matter of fact, I have a theory that BPD is more common in physically attractive people (particularly women). My theory is based only on my own experience and hearing so many others talk about how attractive their BPD significant other is/was. Reality could directly contrast my theory and my theory would be hard to "prove" since physical attraction is highly subjective, but my theory is that it could be easier for a physically attractive person to develop BPD traits. Why do I think this? Especially in the case of physically attractive young girls, there can often be a dis-incentive to develop a real personality and sense of self. It seems to me that the focus of so many young girls is to "find a good man". If they can get about any man they want with their looks alone, why develop a true personality and sense of self? In the case of my exwBPD, I feel very certain this phenomenon occurred. She was always a "pretty little girl" (still is) and I am certain her mother emphasized the importance of this over other things. My ex was an only child, an only grandchild, and her grandparents live 30 yards behind her parents. So basically, she was the pretty little princess and center of everyone's attention. I can see how this led to BPD and how BPD could be more common in physically attractive people.
Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: glacier_glider on March 04, 2013, 09:03:42 PM I've been thinking about this a lot.
Yes, they have to be attractive in order to keep us next to them and suffer through their crap. BUT... . Are they really this attractive? Or is it mostly our imagination? I wish we could share some images so other could have their objective opinion. The one that I was with (I refuse to use the word "mine" was a very attractive woman, yet when I went to see my family and friends (far away from where I live) only some of them where impressed (not even as much as I was) when saw the photos. And yet they were super impressed when they saw my previous women. Here is an analogy. A mail-order bride has to be attractive, otherwise no one will be interested. Yet, a beautiful woman would not become a mail-order bride because she'd be able to establish her "happiness" locally. Similarly, a BPD must be attractive in order to lure one of us and the rest is our imagination. That does not mean that some of them are beautiful. Anyway, I hope I was clear. :) Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: goldylamont on March 04, 2013, 09:06:56 PM hmm, that's an interesting take (and controversal too) sunrising. my exBPDgf wasn't the princess type at all, she really disliked these kinds of girls for some reason... . but she's no dummy either. everyone knows their own attractiveness no matter what issues they're dealing with :) even though she was crazy attractive she was also really insecure about her looks, even when we were alone she only wore a nighty i bought her once b/c she always felt "fat", ludicrous, no words i said would make her feel better.
back to the what you were saying though sunrising i definitely wonder if there's a connection physical attractiveness and this disorder? i know this is really horrible to think about, but i've wondered if perhaps sometimes more physically attractive people are picked as children for abuse? i'm sure this couldn't really be quantified at this point but the thought has occurred. Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: AllyCat7 on March 04, 2013, 09:09:15 PM That's interesting and very common... . especially in the relationship between a non male and BPD female. I think maybe because men are not usually given ego boosts regarding their looks (something that's done to women), it can be easy for a guy to not have confidence in his looks and maybe even be insecure about them, resulting in them trying to make up for it by seeking a more beautiful girlfriend or wife. Not just BPD women, but normal women, use this to manipulate their relationships with men all the time. It's so common. There's nothing wrong with wanting a beautiful girlfriend/wife, but it's definitely not worth it if the relationship is otherwise crappy.
With me, my last two bfs are BPD. Both are extremely attractive. One is a 9, I'd say, and the most recent is a 10. I'd say I'm probably an 8. It didn't bother me that the first was slightly hotter than me because he was faithful and reassuring. And I'm pretty confident in my appearance anyway. The second one, however, is a player. He knows he's hot and he uses it to reel in and keep lots of girls at his disposal (girls of all types--average-looking, hot, etc.) He's crazier than the first one, so I guess he needs his extra good looks to keep any girls around lol. I actually didn't like that he was so good-looking. We met online and at first I couldn't tell just how hot he was. I fell in love with his personality, though. He could be such a sweetheart, that one. Then when he came to visit me for the first time, I was thinking ":)amn, he's too cute. I don't know about this" lol. But it still didn't bother me because he seemed faithful at the time. After a while, though, after learning about the other girls, I realized he was just too hot and crazy for me to handle haha. I actually made a joke to my girlfriend the other day that he's a loose man and needs to be put in a burqa and locked away at home lol. I think, though, that I did a good job of not letting his looks affect me too much. I cut the cord based on his increasingly disrespectful behavior. And this is not the first time I've done it. He knows I don't sweat his looks the way some other girls do and I think he's thrown off by that. I care more about respect than looks. My first love was probably an 8 like me and I was super super attracted to him on all levels. He was a solid guy, too. I want someone like that again. He wouldn't even have to be an 8. He could be a 6 or 7. It's all good lol. At the end of the day, though, we have to be confident in our own looks and the more we are, the less we will let the looks of mentally unstable people distract us from the madness of the rest of the relationship! Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: AllyCat7 on March 04, 2013, 09:10:46 PM I can relate. I'm sure others can too. As a matter of fact, I have a theory that BPD is more common in physically attractive people (particularly women). My theory is based only on my own experience and hearing so many others talk about how attractive their BPD significant other is/was. Reality could directly contrast my theory and my theory would be hard to "prove" since physical attraction is highly subjective, but my theory is that it could be easier for a physically attractive person to develop BPD traits. Why do I think this? Especially in the case of physically attractive young girls, there can often be a dis-incentive to develop a real personality and sense of self. It seems to me that the focus of so many young girls is to "find a good man". If they can get about any man they want with their looks alone, why develop a true personality and sense of self? In the case of my exwBPD, I feel very certain this phenomenon occurred. She was always a "pretty little girl" (still is) and I am certain her mother emphasized the importance of this over other things. My ex was an only child, an only grandchild, and her grandparents live 30 yards behind her parents. So basically, she was the pretty little princess and center of everyone's attention. I can see how this led to BPD and how BPD could be more common in physically attractive people. Wow. Your theory sounds pretty spot on to me. Nice analysis! Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: goldylamont on March 04, 2013, 09:11:47 PM ... . BUT... . Are they really this attractive? Or is it mostly our imagination?... . this is true glacier_glider, i'm sure our imaginations color attractiveness and this should be looked at. i have to say though that in my case i think the level of attractiveness was very high without my coloring :) plenty of feedback on this... Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: glacier_glider on March 04, 2013, 09:17:19 PM this is true glacier_glider, i'm sure our imaginations color attractiveness and this should be looked at. i have to say though that in my case i think the level of attractiveness was very high without my coloring :) plenty of feedback on this... Let me PM you. Would be nice to hear your opinion. Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: Vegasskydiver on March 04, 2013, 09:23:21 PM My exBPDbf was out of this world hot and yes, that is what I miss. He was very faithful in fact it was him that always preached that there should never be a third party (friends of the opposite sex) in a relationship). He made me cut ties with all my male friends, facebook, etc. I didn't object because I felt that if it made him feel secure, it was worth it. That was before I knew about BPD. If I knew then that nothing was going to be enough, I would have ended the realtionship as soon as he started to try to control me. But back to the topic, he was the best looking guy I had ever been with. Tall, muscular, shaved head (I have an obcession with shaved heads)... . he had the most beautiful hazel eyes... . But I honestly believe that he didn't see it. Yes he was NPD as well, but I don't think it had anything to do with his looks. I felt so proud to be with him and I knew because he wa so strong no one would ever mess with me, when I was with him.
Having said that, I would take a plain boyfriend anyday over handsome if we could share a healthy relationship any day of the week. I think once you are stung by the BPD bee, it tends to make you look at the world through a differnt color glasses. I put up with the contant having to explain myself, why I was doing what I was, what I was wearing to work, etc... . No thank you. I am still paying the price in gut wrenching pain and I have a feeling that this sting is going to hurt for a very long time! Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: yaryu on March 04, 2013, 09:25:53 PM I know my exBPDgf is extremely physically attractive, only because the way people treated her. A lot different than they treat me that's for sure, ha! People warmed up to her very quickly and men just noticed her on the spot. She has zero problems getting men and women, and were willing to offer her just about anything to get a piece of her. The fact that she's European and had a slamming accent just added to the allure.
I don't judge solely on looks, but I have to be honest, it was definitely a boost to my esteem knowing I had an attractive partner. The thing that magnified her beauty even more is that she's incredibly charming, giving, intelligent and her attention was directed towards me. The first 6 months were critical for her to deliver the best of herself so I got hooked. And yes, I have to admit, when I think about losing her, the thing that popped up in my mind is dang, I'm never going to hear that accent every again, or see her pretty self. And she's not going to be by my side anymore. Is that sad to think about? Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: goldylamont on March 04, 2013, 09:29:23 PM At the end of the day, though, we have to be confident in our own looks and the more we are, the less we will let the looks of mentally unstable people distract us from the madness of the rest of the relationship! haha thanks for that AllyCat7 i was hoping a woman would post about her bf so that i'd feel less shallow and "douche-y" lol. i should add this thought though (which reading AllyCat made me think of)--I think my exBPD was used to "using men up" sooner. meaning that most men would be so caught up in her beauty that they would be head over heals in love with her (and her *initial* behavior) at least and when she started acting up they probably gave way too much or reacted without confidence until they ended up blowing up, giving her an excuse to paint them black, under the guise that they weren't good men. right after we broke up my exBPDgf jumped into a relationship this ugly dood (i feel soo fortunate and lucky he wasn't a denzil/brad pitt!, lol!). she would throw it in my face telling me how great he was and how they were going to go on long trips together (which neither could afford, who you think you're fooling girl?) because she knew she could "trust" him after 2 weeks. Anyways, after taking all this BS during one conversation I told her the reason why she was with this guy was because he was a lap dog and easily controlled, and I distinctly remember telling her "oh yeah, in a few months this guy is gonna be your STALKER!" ha! and lo and behold 4 months later they break up, with him calling her all kinds of crazy names via text and he pretty much stalked her for a few months trying to apologize. I'm saying all of this b/c i knew, even back then 2 things: 1) that guy probably never had been with a woman that attractive, and 2) once he really had to deal with her dark side i doubted he'd have the self confidence to 'take the higher road'. boy was i right Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: sunrising on March 04, 2013, 09:29:29 PM hmm, that's an interesting take (and controversal too) sunrising. my exBPDgf wasn't the princess type at all, she really disliked these kinds of girls for some reason... . but she's no dummy either. everyone knows their own attractiveness no matter what issues they're dealing with :) even though she was crazy attractive she was also really insecure about her looks, back to the what you were saying though sunrising i definitely wonder if there's a connection physical attractiveness and this disorder? i know this is really horrible to think about, but i've wondered if perhaps sometimes more physically attractive people are picked as children for abuse? i'm sure this couldn't really be quantified at this point but the thought has occurred. It seems common, to me, for physically attractive people to be insecure about their looks. My exwBPD was, and was always looking for people to "prove her wrong". Posting provocative pics of herself on FB to get the "wows", etc... . I don't know if my ex was abused, but I would agree with you that pretty little girls could be more often abused. That makes sense. I do know that her looks were a big part of her identity. When she was hospitalized and diagnosed with BPD, the Dr asked her to list her strengths and weaknesses. #3 on the strengths list? Good hair... . I can barely type that without wanting to cry for her. Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: willy45 on March 04, 2013, 09:32:48 PM Arg.
Ok. I am in this same boat. The day to day living with my ex was h*ll. It was long distance and I kept it at that. She would rage and rage at me all the time and was needy as all get out. She was funny. Sure. She validated me. Sure. But I can have fun times with my friends. I can learn to validate myself. But, if I look objectively at everything, she was a nightmare to be with. Super picky. Finicky. Had a major sleeping disorder so difficult to sleep beside (this is an understatement. I spent more time on the floor than beside her). And the list goes on and on and on. A very stressful and manipulative person. But the looks. Oh man. She was it for me. Still is. She looked like a 1950s pinup girl or a woman on the cover of a old detective model. Totally Femme Fatale. And she knew how to flaunt it, which totally killed me. Sometimes, the sex with her was out of this world. And I say sometimes. Because most of the time it was confusing and stressful (again, super finicky and would change her mind about what she wanted about 3 or 4 times during sex... . made me feel very insignificant). But, she had this long red hair, long legs, sexy green eyes. She could sometimes seem like an actress out of high end porn or something. And she would constantly put on these outfits. Man oh man. That, in the end, is what kept me going back. That, in the end, is the biggest thing that hooks me now. I'm starting to work on this in T starting on Wednesday. My sexuality is entirely tied up in her. Completely. I can't really get off without thinking of her or some fantasy she would tell me or some fantasy that I came up with about her. It sucks. And every time I fantasize about her like that, I spend a day or two beating myself up about leaving her, about not committing to her, and blaming myself for everything. It is a terrible cycle. But yes. I concur with all y'all. Arg. And also, blarg. Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: willy45 on March 04, 2013, 09:35:31 PM Oh... .
And it is not for the lack of my dating other women. I've dated women who are objectively way more attractive than her. Just for some reason, she did it for me. Man. This is so hard... . I wish she would just burn out of my brain. Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: glacier_glider on March 04, 2013, 09:41:05 PM Still, "attractive" is relative and subjective.
I wish we could share some images here but somehow I think this would be unethical, even though they are publicly available. Yes, not the best but somehow she was very special... . the way she looked and responded to what I felt. I'll do my post on sex when I am ready. There is something interesting about that. PS. goldylamont, check your PM. Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: sunrising on March 04, 2013, 09:42:57 PM We would regularly be complimented in being an "attractive couple" by strangers. Who wouldn't like hearing that? I don't feel bad about liking that about her. Would be weird if I didn't... . But her looks don't change the other things about her, which are unacceptable to me. Not do they change the things I'm learning about myself, which I'm also not liking all of those.
Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: AllyCat7 on March 04, 2013, 09:48:04 PM At the end of the day, though, we have to be confident in our own looks and the more we are, the less we will let the looks of mentally unstable people distract us from the madness of the rest of the relationship! haha thanks for that AllyCat7 i was hoping a woman would post about her bf so that i'd feel less shallow and "douche-y" lol. i should add this thought though (which reading AllyCat made me think of)--I think my exBPD was used to "using men up" sooner. meaning that most men would be so caught up in her beauty that they would be head over heals in love with her (and her *initial* behavior) at least and when she started acting up they probably gave way too much or reacted without confidence until they ended up blowing up, giving her an excuse to paint them black, under the guise that they weren't good men. right after we broke up my exBPDgf jumped into a relationship this ugly dood (i feel soo fortunate and lucky he wasn't a denzil/brad pitt!, lol!). she would throw it in my face telling me how great he was and how they were going to go on long trips together (which neither could afford, who you think you're fooling girl?) because she knew she could "trust" him after 2 weeks. Anyways, after taking all this BS during one conversation I told her the reason why she was with this guy was because he was a lap dog and easily controlled, and I distinctly remember telling her "oh yeah, in a few months this guy is gonna be your STALKER!" ha! and lo and behold 4 months later they break up, with him calling her all kinds of crazy names via text and he pretty much stalked her for a few months trying to apologize. I'm saying all of this b/c i knew, even back then 2 things: 1) that guy probably never had been with a woman that attractive, and 2) once he really had to deal with her dark side i doubted he'd have the self confidence to 'take the higher road'. boy was i right Haha no problem! I think the looks thing is an equal-opportunity issue. It all depends on our environment and what we were praised for growing up. So don't feel like you're alone. Men, especially, do this a LOT--place value on the looks of their partner. It's actually the norm lol As for me, I think one of the reasons I was so whatever about the 10s looks is that the 9 never snapped out of idealization phase with me. Since he never completely "hooked me", he was pretty much obsessed with me and sweating me the entire time I've known him (I never asked for it). It was so much sometimes that it would make me uncomfortable lol. But to be honest, though, it did give me a boost to my self esteem. So now I'm like "I'm the ___ and I don't have to put up with your crap even if you're hot!" to the 10 haha. So if anyone has the chance to remain in idealization phase with their pwBPD or cut things off right when the idealization is about to end, they will be in pretty good shape confidence-wise for their next relationship haha. Of course I'm being facetious, but it's funny how it worked like that. Also, I totally know what you're talking about in the last paragraph. My 10 does that, too. I think when these super hot BPDs go for much less attractive people, it can totally backfire. They may be able to control them at first, but if the person is insecure and they get hurt, they will lash out like nobody's business or get extra clingy and stalkerish, as you stated. I suspect this has happened with quite a few girls that the 10 has talked to, as I've been on the receiving end of him after he's been dysregulated from other girls. Maybe repetition will teach them that no one will put up with crap for long--confident people will walk away from it and insecure people will eventually fight and lash out against it... . leaving the BPD alone either way. Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: healingmyheart on March 04, 2013, 09:50:52 PM Interesting topic because most articles do ascertain that the BPD is an attractive person and I guess based upon what you all are saying is true. My ex BPD boyfriend was attractive... . tall, gorgeous hair, athletic body but interesting when I first met him, I just thought "he's ok". After a month or so, I thought he was gorgeous which leads me to believe that the spell was being cast on me and seeing him in a different light.
He seemed to know and like the fact that he was attractive. He would make comments like "look around, we are the most attractive couple in the room". For me, it was just a bonus that he was handsome... . and after what I've been through with BPD, I don't think I want another "handsome" guy. I just want someone who respects me, is honest, loves me, faithful to a fault, takes care of himself physically and mentally, oh, like a good sense of humor... . is that asking too much? Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: goldylamont on March 04, 2013, 09:57:19 PM somebody queue up a bong sound... . boong! could it be that these gorgeous and broken people are put into our lives to smack us up and make us put less faith in looks? are the gods telling us something here? is it possible we're all too fooled by looks that this was life's lesson from the gods that be?
hah, really, i don't think it's as simple as that but fun to muse about. i'm out... . boong Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: glacier_glider on March 04, 2013, 10:02:14 PM Do you guys check your PM at all?
Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: sunrising on March 04, 2013, 10:10:12 PM somebody queue up a bong sound... . boong! could it be that these gorgeous and broken people are put into our lives to smack us up and make us put less faith in looks? are the gods telling us something here? is it possible we're all too fooled by looks that this was life's lesson from the gods that be? hah, really, i don't think it's as simple as that but fun to muse about. i'm out... . boong I'm glad you started this thread, goldylamont. For one, it has made me question how much I may have let her looks affect my decisions. Secondly, I'm glad to see I'm not the only person who may need to consider that. Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: Maryiscontrary on March 04, 2013, 10:13:42 PM Well for me it was the genius in him. And he was hot as in the dick van dyke chitty chitty bang bang charming disheveiled inventor type.
Screw that. Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: healingmyheart on March 04, 2013, 10:14:31 PM I think even for guys an attractive women is relative based upon your likes, correct? I would even ask my ex whether he thought a women was attractive or not because I was curious what he found enticing.
Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: GreenMango on March 05, 2013, 01:37:14 AM Want to know when you bargain your values for looks? This doesn't sound like problem with the partner as much as it is a problem with your values and boundaries.
Hey I get it this person was attractive... . but last I checked they weren't making up your mind for you. Huge learning lesson here-what are you going to do differently? Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: goldylamont on March 05, 2013, 01:39:32 AM I'm glad you started this thread, goldylamont. For one, it has made me question how much I may have let her looks affect my decisions. Secondly, I'm glad to see I'm not the only person who may need to consider that. thanks sunrising for the kind words. you know i have thought about it a lot too, trying to parse out how much the looks made me change my behavior... . and, bottom line, as far as changing my behavior i'm not really sure i changed too much. i feel like i spoke up when i wanted and said the things i wanted when i wanted to (sometimes perhaps too much) but then again i do remember the first time realizing that 'something was wrong here' after the first abandonment episode... . and then the last six months of the r/s... . perhaps if anything i stuck around longer b/c of this? after all this time i don't really feel like i gave too much as far as what i did or said b/c of looks and honestly i don't feel like i stayed in the r/s too long (i didn't want it to end, i think i derailed the train before cheating occurred on either side)... . buuut, if anything it affected me the most after the r/s ended and i missed being with someone i felt that physically attracted to... . i sometimes see women that may come close but it's very few and far between. but eff that though really she's not all that she had man hands & feet! (lol, i didn't mind though i used to love em) :) thanks for listening Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: GreenMango on March 05, 2013, 01:43:08 AM but eff that though really she's not all that she had man hands & feet! (lol, i didn't mind though i used to love em) :) thanks for listening It's the little things... . I mean big :) Hang in there. Most of us here have had some uncomfortable revelations. Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: goldylamont on March 05, 2013, 01:53:13 AM It's the little things... . I mean big :) :) tee hee! good one greenmango :) laughter is healing, thanks. p.s. i will say though greenmango (regarding your first post) that i think most people posting on this thread have done so from a self-reflecting perspective. i haven't noticed many people actually complaining about their ex's good looks Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: GreenMango on March 05, 2013, 02:21:24 AM lol not once have I ever read someone complaining that there ex too attractive or too sexual. Mostly its the *surprise* stuff like why does this person cheat, why do they play emotional games, why do they rage... . but Damn if they aren't hot.
Sometimes that prize ain't much of a prize when you see what a person really is about-with or without BPD. But finding that balance of attractive for you, matching values, etc can be a quest. Do you think it will change how you date? What you will be looking for in a mate? Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: trevjim on March 05, 2013, 03:45:11 AM I can completey relate. I loved the ego boost it gave me, my mates sayin wow she is hot etc. But in the end I got burnt. She gets chatted up everywhere which when I felt secure I loved, but as things became rocky it become a bit of a curse.
If I imagine her as really ugly, I wonder why I would be bother at all. But she is just so captivating, and it was something more than looks Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: struggli on March 05, 2013, 04:17:14 AM lol not once have I ever read someone complaining that there ex too attractive or too sexual. Mostly its the *surprise* stuff like why does this person cheat, why do they play emotional games, why do they rage... . but Damn if they aren't hot. Sometimes that prize ain't much of a prize when you see what a person really is about-with or without BPD. But finding that balance of attractive for you, matching values, etc can be a quest. Do you think it will change how you date? What you will be looking for in a mate? I previously thought I was fairly discerning when choosing a mate. Now I have become even more careful. I live in a place with a lot of attractive women and felt I could tell incompatibility pretty quickly and not just fall for looks. My ex taught me that sometimes it can take quite a while for that character to come to light. I thought she was "different" than all the others -- down to earth, friendly, loving,intimate, satisfied with simple living -- and indeed she was different, but in a bait and switch kind of way. "Thank you" to the women who give off the bad vibe right away! I'd rather know in 30 seconds than in 2 years! The subtleties in a person's behavior... . pay attention to them. Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: healingmyheart on March 05, 2013, 06:53:35 AM I know you guys are visual creatures and looks are very important... . at least maybe more important than it is for women.
My ex BPD was extremely handsome and had a great physique. He is a triathlete and had an amazingly toned, athletic body. You would think the sex would have been the best sex I've ever had... . well, it wasn't. Although the sex was good and spontaneous it definitely wasn't the greatest. The thing is the sex seemed to be more about HIM and his needs, not necessarily mine. Actually the best sex I've ever had was with a boyfriend who was short, bald and pudgy. He was the most giving lover I've ever had. I still sometimes think about him and our great intimacies. I guess all I'm trying to say is that having a beautiful ex BPD with a great body doesn't necessarily translate into multiple orgasms. Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: trevjim on March 05, 2013, 07:30:41 AM I know you guys are visual creatures and looks are very important... . at least maybe more important than it is for women. My ex BPD was extremely handsome and had a great physique. He is a triathlete and had an amazingly toned, athletic body. You would think the sex would have been the best sex I've ever had... . well, it wasn't. Although the sex was good and spontaneous it definitely wasn't the greatest. The thing is the sex seemed to be more about HIM and his needs, not necessarily mine. Actually the best sex I've ever had was with a boyfriend who was short, bald and pudgy. He was the most giving lover I've ever had. I still sometimes think about him and our great intimacies. I guess all I'm trying to say is that having a beautiful ex BPD with a great body doesn't necessarily translate into multiple orgasms. I agree, however when you have the sexiest lover youve ever had, and the most initmate all rolled into one, then it becomes intense. Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: sunrising on March 05, 2013, 01:56:13 PM Excerpt I agree, however when you have the sexiest lover youve ever had, and the most initmate all rolled into one, then it becomes intense. I agree that it SEEMED we shared a high level of intimacy, but I've begun questioning what intimacy really means to me. I think it has been easy for me, in the past, to mistake physical intimacy for emotional intimacy; the latter being infinitely more important, and the general absence of it being the root of many problems I had with my exwBPD. From what I've come to understand bout BPD, pwBPD are generally incapable of true adult intimacy. I'm reading Erich Fromm's "The Art of Loving". Fromm asserts that true love is something much more than physical attraction, romance or this "mysterious, inexplicable" thing which is often depicted in movies and songs. He believes it must be worked toward. I'm coming to agree with him as I read more. One thing I know for sure already, is that it didn't exist in my relationship with my exwBPD. Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: goldylamont on March 05, 2013, 08:31:31 PM ... . I'm reading Erich Fromm's "The Art of Loving". Fromm asserts that true love is something much more than physical attraction, romance or this "mysterious, inexplicable" thing which is often depicted in movies and songs. He believes it must be worked toward. I'm coming to agree with him as I read more. One thing I know for sure already, is that it didn't exist in my relationship with my exwBPD. in my case i'm not sure exactly how if feel. i did start the thread to talk about the taboo subject of pure physical attraction, i think it's healthy to leave no stones uncovered and investigate all these aspects of myself and the past. i'm a bit stuck though--i'm not ready to say that there was no "true love" with my ex. yeah, it sucked when it ended, and i saw a totally new side to her the last few months and especially after our r/s ended... . but i feel that both of us did the best we could to try to hold it together. i definitely wasn't perfect and i strongly feel she is BPD and this caused humongous strain on our r/s. but, i'm not going to go so far in my case to say it was all this illusion/lie that we were both living out for 4 years. i never felt rushed into the r/s, it took us 2 yrs to move in together, there were many heartfelt things we did for each other that i feel were done out of love and not manipulation. all holidays were spent together with families and i was never separated from my friends (other than distant women friends from say high school or college who i avoided to my annoyance to avoid fights). sunrising, i totally agree that true love is something that must be worked towards, and in my relationship it didn't last eternally. but, this r/s was the longest r/s i've ever been in and the most committed i've ever been to anyone, and the same goes for my ex. although she tried to paint it all black like everything was a waste of time and i was such a terrible person to her after our break, i distinctly remember an argument where i told her "well you can sit here and act like you wasted 4 years of your life, but I LEARNED a LOT. I got a LOT out of this r/s, i eat better b/c of you, i like big dogs now b/c of you, and now i know that i actually prefer being monogamous and waking up to the same person. if you haven't learned anything from me then you're pretty stupid, b/c you could have learned plenty from me. that's your loss and your fault, don't put that on me." for once, she just didn't reply, what could she say? i may have gone a bit off the topic of physical attraction--but to round things out please don't think that this is all that i'm about. but i am finding out that this is really important to me, and sometimes i'd rather not care so much. sex on the other hand, good sex is simply a requirement for me in any healthy relationship, even casual sex for me isn't good unless i really like the person. sorry but that's a baseline requirement for me :) and to be specific, it wasn't the sex that kept me with this person, i mean it was great but i've had just as good/better sex with others... . although perhaps looks played more of a part than i'd like to think... . Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: healingmyheart on March 05, 2013, 08:55:19 PM See, that's where I'm thinking men and women are very different. For me, sex has very little to do with looks. A man turns me on by making me feel secure and loved. It doesn't matter what he looks like. I have a very dear girlfriend who she and her husband have been there for me through thick and thin for literally years. Her husband is the most committed, loving, caring man I've ever met. He is also around 300 lbs. I could be attracted to him just based upon the fact that he is a loyal husband and father. Of course me being the health conscious person I am, I'd probably encourage him to lose the weight but that's another whole story. The point is sex is an intimacy which is much more than looks. I think women can overlook a lot more than men can. Men are very visual and women are very emotional beings.
I also look upon this relationship as a learning experience... . mainly in my own self assessment. Yes, I did get more physically fit because my ex is in great shape, yes I did acquire new interests which were ultimately HIS interests but still, it opened my horizons. There was a lot of good and I will not let the bad negate the good. I just have to remember the bad so I don't go back. Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: sunrising on March 05, 2013, 09:09:44 PM I agree with what you guys are saying. There were definitely times in the r/s with my exwBPD which seemed intimate. But isn't BPD kind of defined by the fact that a pwBPD is, emotionally, a child? As I've learned more about why my ex acted the way she did (the good and the bad), I have very much come to believe this is the case (she's a child, emotionally). She was very physically attractive (to me), and most certainly had the body of a woman. But if she's an emotional child, could we have shared true adult intimacy? I'm not saying I didn't learn things from her, didn't grow some because of the relationship, etc. I'm just not sure I'm wiling to classify learning, growing, etc from a relationship as the same thing as true adult intimacy. I'd like to think true adult intimacy is something different, which can't be had with a child in an adult body.
Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: goldylamont on March 05, 2013, 09:10:00 PM The point is sex is an intimacy which is much more than looks. I think women can overlook a lot more than men can. Men are very visual and women are very emotional beings. this statement is true stolemysoul. i think you may have misread some of my intention though--i'm decoupling sex from physical looks. i also have had better sex with someone conventionally 'less attractive'. sex for me isn't so much about looks, or being super-romantic and the girl being really sweet and nice. for me it's more of a spiritual experience, i'd say openness and passion are the two aspects that are at the forefront to me (more than looks). i will admit though that men tend to be more visual creatures, but i don't think this is any more shallow than things that may turn some women on (status/position, strength/independence, etc.). when i mention physical looks i'm specifically not talking about sex, i'm talking about my own ego an how safe the little guy felt when he thought he was with the most gorgeous (looking) woman in the world. ego's talk a lot of talk but they're big teddy bears, easily hurt and weak at times, so this is something i'm looking at in myself, how my ego may be a little too reliant on looks. but not sex (at least for me); two separate things. There was a lot of good and I will not let the bad negate the good. I just have to remember the bad so I don't go back. amen to that! no going back :) i really like posting here as a place where i can recall many of the good in a safe place b/c i KNOW that wasn't the whole truth of the situation Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: goldylamont on March 05, 2013, 09:13:24 PM I'm just sure I'm wiling to classify learning, growing, etc from a relationship as the same thing as true adult intimacy. I'd like to think true adult intimacy is something different, which can't be had with a child in an adult body. painful and TRUE, thanks sunrising. ya, i often felt like my ex was acting so childish... the problem being that as an adult (and due to my ignorance) she could inflict more pain... Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: sunrising on March 05, 2013, 09:33:03 PM ya, i often felt like my ex was acting so childish... the problem being that as an adult (and due to my ignorance) she could inflict more pain... I'm sure all pwBPD aren't the same, and it seems to me that pwBPD can exhibit different "levels" of BPD behavior. But I'm very confident my ex has BPD. She was also diagnosed, which of course helps. She definitely handled adult situations like a child anywhere but work (she is high functioning). For example, We never truly resolved a single issue in our relationship, that I can recall. I would try to discuss things rationally, like and adult, and it NEVER worked. I can honestly say I never "got to know her" any better in over 2 years. I came to predict her behavior a little better, but didn't get to know her. Getting to know someone better, and love them for who they really are, seems to me to be a pretty good working definition of true adult intimacy ("real love". Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: GreenMango on March 05, 2013, 09:40:20 PM Awesome posts. This topic about intimacy is really important. |iiii
Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: healingmyheart on March 05, 2013, 09:51:58 PM Emotional intimacy is about making that deep connection with someone. In my situation, I don't really feel like my ex and i ever really got very "deep". He just sorta said the same superficial things over and over again. I don't know if it was because he had his guard up or what but I felt like just reiterated the same stuff over and over. I think he held so much in that he couldn't release very much of himself. Hard to be really emotional intimate with someone so distant.
Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: sunrising on March 05, 2013, 10:08:41 PM Emotional intimacy is about making that deep connection with someone. In my situation, I don't really feel like my ex and i ever really got very "deep". He just sorta said the same superficial things over and over again. I don't know if it was because he had his guard up or what but I felt like just reiterated the same stuff over and over. I think he held so much in that he couldn't release very much of himself. Hard to be really emotional intimate with someone so distant. This was my experience too. My ex would regularly say things that she felt were expressing intimacy, but I could usually use the context clues to determine she was "just saying them" ( they were frequently said at clearly non-intimate times, almost randomly) . I now pretty much feel like she was saying them for 2 main reasons, neither of which are sincere: 1) She didn't want me to leave (fear of abandonment) 2) She wanted me to say the same kinds of things to her (her needs fulfilled) This type of behavior would be consistent with my belief she was an emotional child. I don't think she has a clue what readl adult intimacy is. I'm just starting to fully acknowledge it myself. Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: nylonsquid on March 05, 2013, 10:21:54 PM I was once at a huge dance party and us single boys were scouting. My, very wanted and attractive, male friend was disappointed and said there's no pretty girls. My exBPDgf (before recycle) walked in the front door and he nudged me and said excitedly "oh, God! Check that girl out!" He'd never seen her before and didn't know it was my ex. Case in point.
The funny thing is, when I first met my ex she was NOT my type of girl. However, they ARE charmers and I think that's a big part of their attractiveness to us. Add to that the fact that we have issues of our own that are inclined to pwBPDs and you have a dangerous combo. It really is the vibrations, the unspoken elements that bind us together. Those missing parts in our lives that they can sniff out and provide fillers for. Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: Themis on March 15, 2013, 01:29:20 AM i know this is really horrible to think about, but i've wondered if perhaps sometimes more physically attractive people are picked as children for abuse? i Wow, eerie. :light: But quite possible. Mine looks like a male model. Title: Re: it was her looks, that's about it Post by: jj2121 on March 15, 2013, 01:38:54 AM Yes definitely, My problem was I got hooked in on her good looks alone and thought I was her knight in shining armour after a month. I should have listened when she told me she was weird and not right. I actually cringe about her personality and character.
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