BPDFamily.com

Hello,

For anyone that missed it - here's the background before the discussion was locked:

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=196878.0

Arabella - Thank you for replying - I know you have such a lot on your plate at the moment -am honoured you took the time to help someone else out

I was worried that he might go off the rails badly, drinking, doing dumb stuff, breakdown etc. My friends has just said try not to worry as he's with his mum. She said give him space today.

I am giving myself space too. PatientandClear - your message really really helped me. It stopped me feeling so powerless and trampled on and made me see that this could be the best shot at an "aha" moment he will have. Yes the contradiction button has been pressed - as you said "he knows it's wrong but he wants me to allow it anyway. There it is staring him in the face."

Wow that makes me feel better about all this - that there might be a point to this last row and space before he goes away. I hope he gets it. That helps so so much. Thank you.

Any more input on this greatly appreciated!

.

There are consequences to our actions.  He is taking an action, and the consequence that his r/s with you is jeopardized or even ends is a very normal and natural consequence to the actions he is currently choosing to take.  Your lack of cooperation  is a reasonable consequence to his actions.  It's the natural consequence that will make you look like a persecutor in his mind, no matter what you do or how you do it. There was no avoiding this, you are not powerful enough to win over this disorder... .   you are not that powerful... .   the only way to forstall this would be if you were willing to actually bite your tongue,  go along with his plans and lovingly pat him on the po-po on his way out the door to his holdiay with the F buddy.  Even then he would likely still up the ante.  Yuck.  This isn't really about you  or her, in terms of what he is doing.  Any manner of "NO" is going to have him feeling persecuted because that's how the disorder works. If you don't say no to this, he'd find somethign else you would have to say no to... .   tag you're a persecutor.  It's how the disorder works, it's not about the individual players.  A no, a boundary, all of these feel persecutory to him, that's how the disorder works. You cannot rescue him from his own tortured thought processes and this disorder.

You can only rescue yourself.

You don't have to work so hard to try to stage it to help him have an epiphany while on the trip.  Stop it, you can't make this work that way.  He doensn't think like you do, anyway.

The only way out is by focusing on your own self care which is a loud and clear... .   NO.  Up front, and repeatedly... .   NO.  This is the experience he needs, not more games.  Your answer was no, and you let him know that.  If you were more compliant he would see that as validation for his actions.  You do not want to validate the invalid.  His plan is invalid.


If he did do these things, it is also a choice he his making. You can't rescue him.  You are not that powerful.

The only person you can rescue is yourself. 

You are the one who needs self-care right now. 

Believe me, this is not his first rodeo.

One other observation in this connect... .   You are still trying, really hard, to 'make' him get it.  you are turning yourself inside out trying to get him to see how distorted his actions are.

But he can't.  He isn't capable of it.

And he presents to the outside world a distorted view of reality. 

It's not fair.  It's frustrating like mad.  Detachment from this, especially what others might think (likehis mother et al), is the only healthy response.  Let your own actions speak for you, and leave it to the rest ofthe world to seethus or not (some will, some won't)

I'm just glad I have this community for support so that I know it's not just me! While I don't want anyone else to live this sort of nightmare, it is still comforting to know that there are others out there and I'm not alone. You're not alone either, connect. 

So long as he isn't in imminent danger of serious bodily injury, I'd let him be (call 911 otherwise). I mean, really, you sort of want him to have a breakdown - that's what an 'aha!' moment is going to look like. Don't run off to soothe him, that will just reinforce in his mind that you aren't serious about your 'no'. He needs to live with his choices and their consequences. Hang in there with me, connect!

Well... .   I'm sure you wish you had handled it better. We all have those days. 

But that doesn't change the bigger picture. He's setting out to do something that you find unacceptable. If he does it, he's made that choice.

The form of twisted logic, rationalization, and full package of crap he tries to feed you to justify it, or blame you and everybody else for it won't change his actions.

Remember--you have no obligation to believe his crap.

Hello,

Thanks arabella - if we were in the same country I would take you out for coffee and consolations! This support group is amazing.

Grey Kitty - yes I dont have to believe his crap about this holiday. It hurts that he knows its wrong and is still doing it without even trying to help me. Something like suggesting I meet her to put my mind at ease, come and join him there for a few days etc etc - any crumb would help (I know a crumb is unhealthy but he wont give me anything)

I am not feeling good today. The clarity and numbness from yesterday has gone to be replaced by anxiety and worry about my state of mind. I didnt go to work today and slept for hours. I need to look after myself but he has drained the energy out of me. I am staying at a friends house who is away for two weeks. I talk about nothing but this holiday with my friends who are all worried about me. I feel dreadful. I want to see him but I have not reached out to him. He has not contacted me at all for 28 hours. Now I think he will not talk to me before the trip and assume we are "on a break". With this in mind I think he will allow his ex f-buddy (who is in love with him) to pamper and coddle him on holiday - he will drink too much and sleep with her. I see it in my mind. Today is Tuesday and he leaves for the holiday on Friday. I cant see him wanting to see me or change anything before then.

He said to me last week that as I was having so much trouble coping with this his suggested way to help me was for us to reduce contact until after the holiday. This is not the actions of someone who loves me - this is purely for his own comfort. I am worried about him too though. This is so unhealthy. I look at this r/s though and I see traces of my father in there - I had to walk on eggshells around him too. My T also says this is likely. It could explain how I am drawn to him due to familiarity and why I put up with so much (I had to learn to put up with a lot when I was growing up) I am really seeing this but dont see how I can change how I relate to him esp when he promised so much to get me to be with him. Esp since dispite all this cr*p I still love him. He keeps telling me he is sorry he arranged the holiday and he desperately wants this r/s to work. Its screwing up my mind.

Sorry for the rant - I knew today would be hard. Just need to sort myself out and find the energy to do it from somewhere.


I am going to have a bath and put some make up on and hope it helps. I have got through some tough times in my life before but this is very very hard for me. I am trying not to think about him but its hard as this board is the only place people understand which means I am still thinking of him.

 

Just wanted to say hi and you will be okay.  It probably doesn't seem like it now, but you will be okay.  It's all f-upped, this crazy stuff.  To be so gaga over a man who treats you like poo!  I feel I can say this because I am in the same boat!

It gets better and it starts to hurt less.  I can hear how strong you are, in your head you know you deserve better, your heart just needs to catch up.  Unfortunately, this takes a while.  For me, going on three (well 10+) years!  It's a process, take it one step at a time, try to live in the moment. 

Hugs connect.

   

Connect,

Just chiming in to give you some support.  I've been through a similar, but not the exact same circumstance.  I believe you may find it's going to be very, very, very hard for you when the actual departure time comes if he does follow through. 

I'm saying this so you can try to prepare for it and know you will get through it.  It was something for me I thought I'd never get past.  Excruciating because there's part of us that wants to believe they won't go through with it and will come to their senses at the last minute.  If that doesn't happen the realization of no turning back and no way to undo what they've done can feel like a weight of unbelievable oppression. 

I hope you post, I hope you have support.  I hope you can remember to breathe and know it's probably the hardest part.  The rest of the time intrusive thoughts may tear at you until the holiday is over, but once the initial hammer has fallen... .   the hammer has fallen and after getting through that I hope it gets better for you at a certain point if it does, you may find some peace in total acceptance after a bit.  You will get through it.  Please don't be afraid to reach out.  Have support for yourself and take care of yourself. 

We don't even know each other, but this makes my whole body cringe remembering what it was like.  It was very hard, I just couldn't believe he was truly capable of it.  And I send you thoughts of strength.     

Be well friend, and remember it's not about you.  It's about them and the disorder.

My thoughts are with you.   

Keep taking good care of yourself.  |iiii

I always wonder if some of the people on here really are close by. I like to at least pretend that some of them/you are! :)

So he leaves Friday. It's only Tuesday. What's your plan for the week? I know you said you doubt he'll contact you, so that he can pretend you're "on a break"... .   I say F-that - why can't you contact him at some point? Even just to let him know that you certainly are not on any sort of 'break'. Pfft. As if. Do whatever makes you feel better about it - you have nothing to lose. (I'm sorry if I'm being rash here, I'm just getting tired of letting my H call all the shots and I see the same sort of frustration in you and, well, I don't like it!) If you have another idea/plan already then just ignore me... .   and, uh, share with the class so that I can steal some of your ideas?

Connect ... .  

This is inevitably a bad, hard time.

You've done the right thing(s).  You've told him your view of this situation, a view which 99% of the population would share.  You've given him a chance to hear and respond to you.  Instead, though he acknowledges he shouldn't be doing this, he is digging in.  You've left.  He's given you no reason to think he is swerving from his absurd, self-sabotaging course.

This is where it gets so hard for me: when you do the right thing and there's no instant reward or payoff except that you did the right thing, not the wrong thing where you abandon yourself & it feels even worse in the long run.

What happens now between the two of you depends on choices he has to make.  You have to give him the space to make them or you will never know what he will do on his own.  You've done your part and you've done well, and you've done the very best thing for this relationship, no matter what he chooses.

Another thing.  You're feeling wretched and superficially, it probably feels like he is feeling great, about to go on this sacred trip for which it was worth screwing up your r/s.  Undoubtedly, though, he is in turmoil.  Now he got what he "wanted," and you aren't in his way ... .   and it probably won't take long for it to dawn on him that this doesn't feel very good, either.  Just don't save him from that experience.  It is going to take some processing for him to make his way through that realization, though who knows where he will take it.

You've taken this as far as you can take it on your own power.  Give yourself a break, relax a bit, tell your anxiety to check back with you later -- you handled this well.

Hi guys,

Thank you as ever for your replies - lifesavers to read - I cant wait to log in here during the day as I know there are so many great, caring people with sympathy and help  

When he is away I will be paying it forward by responding more to others here to see if I can offer an ear too.

4now - thank you for saying I sound strong in my head that I deserve better, that made me feel strong! You sound it too!

yeeter -  

seashells - wow - so you have been in a similar boat? Would love to hear what happened. Will look at your earlier posts. I can feel your sympathy coming out of the screen - it helps. Stomach churning rubbish this is isnt it? You describe it perfectly as something you never think you can get past... .   Also what you say about once he goes out of the door that there is no way to undo what he has done? Yes that for me will be a big moment. That will shift something in my head. Not being able to undo it. And although I KNOW he is going I cant seem to believe it yet - that moment will be very very hard. You mention total acceptance - how do I use this here? x

patientandclear - Thank you for saying I have done the best thing for this r/s. It makes me think that if it ends I will have retained some dignity. I also agree that he is in turmoil at the moment, perods of disregulation and wierd kind of highs, obsessions/ocd type of things coming out, changable. I also agree that when he gets his "sacred" holiday he will find it doesnt feel good - I am banking on that one. Not that I am sure I would get a truthful answer from him ref if he enjoyed it but I cant see he will enjoy it as much as he thinks he will. He hates being cooped up, smoking will be hard with the kids there, drinking too much will be hard, 3 kids running round and 24/7 of her and her manipulative ways. We shall see. You hit the nail on the head though that I do feel he is feeling great but I can see he isnt somewhere deep down. I need him to get in touch with that part.

maybeso - thanks x you too x

arabella - thanks as ever x I thought the same as you last night. No contact all day and at 8pm I though "F this - you are not getting a "break" mate - too f-ing convenient for you" so I went round to his house. He was all over the place and acting wierd. You could see he wasnt in a good place. He said he didnt want to talk about it and then proceeded to talk about it. He did verbally attack me as usual on this.

He said it was all for his son. He said he is worried about how I will be when he is away (empathy I thought?... . no ) he just thought if I was upset I will be contacting him with a "barrage of phone calls" to spoil his holiday (charmimg). Bit of an ego thing here. Only one time in 12 months have I repeatedly rung him and that was when he was at her house and kept hanging up on me so I kept calling back.  Hanging up on someone is so rude. He projected big time onto me. Again he validated my feelings but this is odd as he doesnt seem to care that I feel them. I stayed over (no sex) as I insisted.

Went round again tonight and he seemed in a kind of high mood. He says (and I agree) that recently coming off the antidepressants has made him a bit crazy with me. He said there is something wrong with his mind (he did have a traumatic brain injury 12 years ago too - I understand some BPD can come from this in some instances) Am going to stay there tonight and tomorrow. I want him to feel as uncomfortable as possible and if that includes packing in front of me then so be it. Nothing to lose here anyway. I am just not giving him a nice comfortable "break" which he can twist into crazy justification.

It may sound like I am being weak and maybe he will think that but he will find that I initiate NO contact when he is away, will remove my things from his house and will be waiting for a bloody good 180 degree turnaround on his return if he wants me in his life.

I dont know what Friday will be like (I imagine he will try to keep me out of his house on thursday but tough t*ttys) I dont know what next week will be like. Am calm at the moment with flashes of HUGE anger every now and then. Next week will be a revelation on both sides. Who knows what I will be thinking at the end of it? It wont be nice though.

Remembered something else he said last night... .  

I told him that I had taken the day off sick and also that I had next week booked off work (he knows this is because I was originally invited on the holiday). He referred to these things later in the evening. He said he felt angry because they made him "feel guilty" and he "doesnt like feeling bad about himself"   Classic BPD

Connect,

I don't believe I posted about it previously.  It's so bizarre I will send you a pm with the background, so as not to be too obvious.

I understand what others have said about the damage already having been done, and there is no doubt about that.  However, any recovery is harder if there's actual follow through.  And as I said even though I knew it logically;  until the moment it actually happened I realized I'd been holding out the slightest bit of hope he'd come 'round to his senses.  The moment you have to let go of the hope, it is a learning experience and not a pleasant one.  It shatters basic trust in someone you love to not hurt you, and does so in a very deep way.

If he follows through, Trust Yourself, you will get through it.  Let the emotions out, and then accept it. And keep repeating the same again and again until the peace comes.  I remember walking outside several times, stretching my arms up toward the sun and the heavens and the stars and silently asking to be healed and repeating to myself "I accept it".  Once something is done, I cannot change, I find all there is left is to accept it for what it is.    If you hang onto it, it will hurt you even more. 

And I will say this now, looking back this should have been my end.  If he goes, I hope you are able to take care of yourself.  This will be an opportunity to move on. How you handle it is your decision of course.  I think many of us hope it will get better "someday" and I've read the success stories, they are very heartening.  It seems most of them have a component of DBT therapy involved.  Without that, I think the prospects are very dismal.

I wish you well, peace and comfort to you. 

Seashells - thank you for that - you really do understand where I am at the moment. It helps. I will be on here a lot over the next few days. Yes I am getting prepared for it. It is 4.30pm now and he leaves tomorrow morning. I am pacing like a caged animal. Am struggling with the difference between "radical acceptance" and feeling like a doormat - how do I diferentiate between the two feelings?

I stayed there last night and he seemed wierd again. Half angry with me and half looking at me to gauge my feelings. I said it has been discussed enough now. He said "why are you here?" I said "beacuse you are my boyfriend and I want to see my boyfriend" I am full out passive aggressive at the moment. He said "I feel bad". Before bed he kept walking around sighing really really loudly. Not sure why, if that was due to my presense or due to him feeling bad. He couldnt go to sleep for ages. Nor could I. We both slept through our alarms this morning.

I remembered somthing he said a few days ago. I asked him (considering the last six months of me asking him to reduce contact with this person, and him agreeing some of the time) what he expected my reaction to be. He said he had no idea it would be this bad. He really didnt seem to expect me to react like this. How could he not work out that I would react like this? Its so obvious.

Am staying there later. I am trying to make him feel uncomfortable by making him go straight from me to a holiday with her. It's all I have left apart from waiting for some kind of revelation on his part whilst he is on his holiday.

I will say one more thing to him about the trip tonight. That will be this: "When you are on this holiday with her which you both claim is purely for the two sets of children I want you to remember this. She will continue advising you that I am unreasonable as you two are "just friends" I want you to remember this when she spends 7 nights trying to get into your bed. I want you to remember that you have given her the green light to do this. I want you to remember that I was trying to protect our relationship from this scenario"

What do you think?  

Also I want to ask him not to get undressed in front of her or walk around half naked (he is unselfconcious in front of people) I feel this is probably a waste of my time to ask. Do you agree?

From tomorrow I have no idea how I will be feeling.

You sound like you still expect him to react and behave like a normal, rational, not mentally ill person. He doesn't get it. He's not going to get it. There's where the radical acceptance comes in. You become a doormat when you say it's okay - not when you accept that you can't control it. So, no control = acceptance. Telling him (or showing him) that what he does it okay even if it hurts you = doormat.

Tell him whatever you need in order for YOU to feel like you said everything you needed to. It's not about making a difference, it's about living with your decisions and being happy with your own efforts. I like your first speech (in blue) but I think the second (re nudity) will just muddy the waters - like he'll focus on that rather than the bigger picture. And really the nudity is a minor thing, it's the overall actions and the effect that matter so don't get hung up on details here. Just my .02 on that!

I hope that once he leaves some of the pressure will be off you for a few days. I find that the anticipation is the worst part. Then the grieving process starts - but at least then you will be making progress rather than being in this nauseating holding pattern. Hang in there!

connect, what you are planning to ask for doesn't sound like what you want.

*IF* (big and unlikely hypothetical here!) he was able to go on a vacation with her, for both their kids, and purely acting like "friends" without any inappropriate intimacy (or sex) would you be at peace with that?

If I remember what you were saying, you weren't sure you could handle having him go on this trip at all.

Giving him "rules" or "requests" that he can try not to break is just setting yourself up to be disappointed, especially if you won't even be happy if he stays within them.

What are your limits on this?

Radical acceptance is the cure to being a doormat.  it has nothing to do with accepting assclown behavior in the sense of TOLERATING it.  it has to do with accepting that he is acting like an AC and will continue this behavior and that is the REALITY and getting clear on the reality of the situation... .   instead of fooling yourself with denial and control fantasies.  Radical acceptance of WHAT IS is the antedote to putting yourself into a doormat positon because it requires you accept the reality of what is happening and take care of yourself, rather than fooling yourself... .   this isn't really that bad, I can fix this, this will stop, this will go away and I can change him if I just do xyZ... .   THAT is what keeps us stuck.

Staying to make him feel bad, expecting him to change, telling him not to undress, staying to guilt him,  is not going to work. You cannot contol him.

You are trying to control the uncontrollable.  This is very common, we have ALL DONE IT.

It doesn't help.  I won't work!  It keep the attention on him, which you have NO control over and never will. 

Turn you attention to yourself.  What do you as a human being need to do for yourself when your lover (any lover) is acting like such a jerk?  If you were nurturing yourself like you were your best freind, what would you be counseling yourself to do for your own self care right now?  If your best gf was in this situation, what would she be saying to you?  You only ever have control over yourself.  That is what you need to attend to, not him.

Yes, yes, and yes agreed to all that has been said.

Connect, this is not a place where you make 'conditions' if he goes... .   that implies you've accepted it, unless you have.  If you do that's fine, but that's not the impression I've gotten in regard to your feelings. (and if you said it to him anyway, don't beat yourself up over it... .   give yourself some slack for being put in this position to begin with)  

This is the Catch -22 I end up getting in at times, I will respond and then re-evaluate my stance with one who tries to hold me accountable for a decision I'm making in a position I shouldn't have to be in to begin with... .   KWIM?  I am not a victim, at the same time after considering all things, and especially the "sway" of the logic presented to me, I tend to sort it out later on my own.  We question ourselves.  This is one of the parts we consider "crazy making".  Yes?

My "acceptance" is knowing I can't change it, it is done.  I have no say in the actions that have been taken by another.  I can hang onto anger and go in circles in my head about how wrong it is, how much it hurts, or I can accept it is what it is and I cannot change it.  So, I try to find peace in accepting it for what it is.  

Doormat?  Hard not to feel that way sometimes.  One of the most difficult aspects of it for me as I remain in touch is having to constantly evaluate my boundaries or values.  Question whether I'm giving in to being manipulated after having too many hurts and boundaries crossed, or being stubborn for the sake of it, or  

It's part of the situation I think in dealing with them.  I keep thinking it shouldn't be this hard and this much work all the time.  I shouldn't have to over think everything.  

Make sense?   Hard to explain.

I will try to check in often in the next few days.  I'm geographically in the same area as my pwuBPD traits right now again.   And getting ready for a major trip again.  He is freaking out a bit right now realizing how bad it's been and that I won't be here much longer... .   and I'm resigned that this visit has been much like the others.  So, we can try to support each other.  

Hello guys,

Seashells - thanks for checking in on me - I really appreciate it   I understand radical acceptance now. It's the bargaining and trying to control the situation that causes even more hurt to us on top of the original situation. I can see it now. Also I agree that setting "conditions" (ie dont walk around half naked in front of her on the holiday) implies that I am tolerating the situation on my part. I came to this same conclusion before I read your post and so I did not issue any "conditions" last night. The trip you mention - is that you going away from him?

So here's my update. It's 10am and I left his house this morning just before/as his child arrived ready for for their holiday. I don't feel anything much at the moment except numb and also a feeling of relief that I dont have to deal with him at the moment. I also feel I did all I could.

Last night when I was over he was trying to avoid speaking to me by playing computer games online with his friends so I had a shower and fed myself etc. When we spoke it was stilted. As he was drinking I needed to say my piece while he was fully "there" so I told him to listen carefully and said:

"When you are on this holiday with her which you both claim is purely for the two sets of children I want you to remember this. She will continue advising you that I am unreasonable as you two are "just friends" I want you to remember this when she spends 7 nights trying to get into your bed. I want you to remember that you have given her the green light to do this. I want you to remember that I was trying to protect our relationship from this scenario"

That triggered him and he was off - he told me he couldnt handle this and told me to get my things out of the house while he finished packing. (He has a friend looking after his pets when he is away as I wont stay there-not that I was asked) He then said he didnt want me to stay the night (as I predicted) but I refused to leave. I did get very upset here but reined it in eventually. He then came back to me and kind of did that whole trance like thing for half an hour saying he was "in a hole" and I had done this to him.

He said that how I was acting right now was the thing that was destroying our relationship - I told him he was projecting as it is the thing HE is doing now that is destroying it and I am having a normal reaction to that. He joked that he thought I would kill him in the night - he said I was crazy and acting crazy. I was calm anyway after I had said my piece. He kept asking me what I would do when he was away - he wanted to know my movements and plans as he didnt like not knowing what I was doing with my week off. Very ironic considering he has not even told me exactly where he is going - just the county - what a joke.

We went to bed with him saying to me he knows I am hurting and he wants me back how I used to be. He tried to reassure me. He said he was in a depressed hole. I did get upset and said "tonight there is another woman feeling excited about going on holiday with you - its inappropriate to go and live with another woman for a week when I am your girlfriend" He said I dont trust him, I said its not that, its about inappropriate intimacy. Another mini row and then he cuddled and attempted to reassure me saying "we have to be nice to each other"

This morning I put all my things in the car. He cuddled and reassured me again. At the door I said "you can say you love me if you want" (yes I know not one of my finest moments... . ) he responded with "I cant say that after the week of turmoil you've just put me through" then started to rant again. I stopped that dead and said I am going. He apologised saying he doesnt know what he is saying as he is in a hole - he cuddled me, said he will text me and I left. His child was being dropped off as I drove off.

So there it is. at least for the next week you guys dont have to hear all my dialogue with him as I am out of his little cozy triangle so I can only post about what I feel instead of what he says.

Its p***ing down with rain and its freezing whch is some kind of consolation as a start to his magical holiday... . ha ha.

I have no doubt my emotions will be extremley up and down this coming week. I am 100% painted black and persecutor to her saviour - do I care? I know I bought into the continuing drama last night but I needed to do and say what I did for MY piece of mind. I will be doing a lot of evaluation about this r/s. Have an appt with my T this afternoon. I will be on here a lot. It feels like he is a stranger - not what I thought. Thank you all for your help getting me through this horrible period.

The moment of truth connect:

You made a boundary for yourself.

He is going on holiday with the other woman.

What are you going to do?

(btw - he IS NOT what you thought.  A form of a stranger.  That makes sense because what he seemed to be wasnt real, and its only now you are faced with a scenario where you see him more clearly)

Let us know how you're doing when you can.   

Hello,

Hi Yeeter - I know... . my boundary was I would leave the r/s. This is harder than I thought. I think a tiny part of me never thought it was a boundary I would have to enforce even though I believe what he is doing is a dealbreaker (perhaps he saw that). I am seeing how I evolve this week when he is away. Right now I feel sick even thinking about contacting him. I certainly have no rise tinted vision of flying into his arms on his return. My head doesnt want a r/s where I am treated in this way. My heart loves him but the "him" he is now is not what he said he was.

Seashells - thanks x

Just come from a meeting with my therapist. I didnt enjoy it and it made me more angry than when I went in. She doesnt like these types of sites and seemed to be a bit finger pointy with me in general. She said my bf doesnt have to have BPD he may just not want to commit. She saw him 2 weeks ago and I think he must have been in full victim mode reading between the lines. I have always found her excellent and was disapointed and upset. I wanted a different sort of session today. Especially as this is the day he f-ed off on holiday with his ex - although she did raise some good points in the session regarding acceptance. I know sometimes the uncomfortable sessions are good for you but I couldnt handle it today.

Am p'd off and my boyfriend is on holiday having his dinner cooked right now by his in-love-with-him-ex-f-buddy ready for her 7 nights of seduction starting tonight. I am so p'd off. Sorry for the rant... .




 

Hugs connect

Thanks Yeeter - thank you 

Ugh! I'm sorry, connect, what a horrible state to be in. How are you holding up?  

Does it matter to you if it's a BPD thing or if he "just doesn't want to commit" or his BPD traits are making him not want to commit? No matter how it's explained his actions are the same and still inappropriate (to put it mildly). Yeeter is right - this is not what you signed up for and this is not the man you fell in love with.

Thanks Arabella -

He has all the BPD traits with some n thrown in for good measure. I knew there was something "off" and I have had long and short term stable calm r/s's and they have never been like this. No-one else has made me feel like I am the crazy one before. He isnt logical in his thinking at all and blames and projects, black and white thinking, remembers things wrong, triangulates, dysregulates, rages, victim mentality, depression, push/pull the whole caboodle... .   of course the rest of the time he is the man I fell in love with lol. I think I resented what she said as it made me feel even more that I am the crazy one! I know that I'm not. She doesnt live with the day to day inconsistancys of it. I have had boyfriends who dont want to commit so I know what that looks like in a "normal" relationship. This is beyond that.

And as for the does not want to commit - I think its because of the closeness we had built up as he reguarly sabotages things after a close period. I am not excusing him as there is no excuse. No excuse for this.

I am working on acceptance so that I can evaluate this. I am not too bad but so so SOO angry... .   !

Connect,

I'm glad you're checking in and getting through it.  The anger, yes I can relate.  In my situation I was very resolved at that time it was a done deal, so the grieving was next.  (of course it didn't stay that way a month later)

It must have been very frustrating to get that impression from your therapist, today of all days.  Really.

I know when I try to explain things or "vent" to some of the mutual friends of my pwBPD, they don't always seem to get it.  Strange though, one of them suggested it to me first the other day as they have a relative in therapy for it. 

This one is a very hard one.  I hope you can be really clear in what you want for yourself and feel grounded. 

I don't doubt that you're right re him having B/NPD. I have the same issue with my H's doctor - he just doesn't get it (even though he knows H had BPD, he doesn't get the implications of that). He doesn't see the day to day inconsistencies or the craziness. It makes me want to scream. How can mental health professionals be so oblivious? argh!

But back to you... .   So basically his lack of commitment, or lack of having a 'normal' brain, or whatever the heck you want to attribute it to, all boils down to you accepting it and then deciding what you want to do with that information. I'm trying to do some evaluation over here too. Wading through cycles of grief and anger. I think the anger is more productive so congratulations on that? lol  Seriously though, keep posting as you work through this - I hope you're able to come to a place where you can find resolution for yourself at least.

Connect ... .   I've had similarly invalidating experiences sometimes with therapists in processing my mind-twisting experience with my uBPDex.  The truth is you know a lot more about this at this point than she does.  It is vastly more complicated that "doesn't want to commit."  Or the other unhelpful things people say like "he doesn't feel about this the way you do," as if the problem was that you feel strongly & he feels less strongly.

That is NOT what this is.

It is the "strength" (weird concept here, but ... .   ) of his feelings that leads to these behaviors.  And it is the fact that he shows you a strong connection with you & a strong desire for you, at the same time that he then undermines & sabotages your r/s, that causes you so much confusion.  A simple lack of interest on his part would be so much easier to process and deal with.

As Arabella says, though, back to you.  This boundary ... .   if you don't mean it & enforce it, there's no reason for him to think he cannot do this again and again.

If you do enforce it, you are doing it not to get him to do something -- but because you prefer not to be in a r/s where this occurs.  Since you do not presently have a choice of having a r/s with him where you are safe from this kind of betrayal ... .   those are the alternatives.  A r/s with him where this can occur, or not being in the r/s with him.  I wish there were a Door #3 but there is not, not unless he undertakes a long, hard, transformative journey that he hasn't even begun & is not even talking about beginning.

|iiii   Those really nail it right there. 

High functioning borderlines aren't hanging from the ceiling and taking regular trips to the ER. They mostly just make people they are close to nuts.

My ex was just like what you are going through.

Here's the rub. It's not illegal nor even a huge red flag in our society to be a confusing, projecting, mind twisty relationship partner that isn't very nice.

What does start to look unhealthy is putting up with behavior we clearly find damaging and hurtful and unacceptable and doesn't meet important stated needs.  Yes he is crazy making, but really, if you focus on his actions and not his words,  it's pretty straightforward.

I agree with your T,  he's not available for commitment. He may offer other nice things, but he is not committed.

His actions are not those of a committed, caring partner.  He isn't that person.

That is hard to accept emotionally, true. But it's straight forward. All the talking just invites all the confusion and blame and projection and mixed messages.  

His actions convey none of that; his actions show he is not available for a committed

relationship.

You get decide if that's ok with you or not.

Also, many folks with BPD don't have affairs and triangulate this way; it's not a criteria. Stephs husband (recovered from BPD)  never did this N stuff, but mine sure did!  It certainly

shows up a lot on this board, but not always. No matter his Label, it's still your choice about

what your values and needs are in any relationship.   |iiii

Hi Connect

I just wanted to say I've followed this thread and it triggers me because my exwBPD dumped me by pretending he wanted to be single because he was 'recovering' from a suicide attempt following a divorce and wanted to 'make the last steps of his journey alone'. He said we had to stay best friends though or he would kill himself.

What he actually wanted was to sleep with another woman he had found and he isn't really unfaithful so it was easier to just move me out and do what he was doing. When he found out she didn't quite meet his needs as well as me he wanted to sleep with me again. Your boyfriend's behaviour reminds me very much of my ex.

What he wanted was to have his cake and eat it too and how dare I question or challenge him on wanting that or even suggesting that was what he was doing. I knew nothing about BPD then I just thought he was treating us both horrendously and I withdrew from the friendship. I then discovered this site and went NC.

It hurt like mad and still does a little. I could not believe my sweet boyfriend could do this to me. I could not believe it; I wanted to believe anything but. His behaviour made no sense to me.

You can't make him change. You can pretend that he feels terrible for the hurt he inflicts on you. That may be so at times but I don't believe that people with BPD feek bad for long, or they wouldn't do it to the people they are supposed to love. I believe they can switch off their feelings about us when away from us and that's how they inflict such hurt. Your boyfriend seems to be doing a lot of projecting on to you right now.

He is nicely getting his needs met and I am so sorry that he cannot meet yours. Facing that he cannot and will not will be immensely painful, but staying in it long term and allowing him to treat you like this will be a long slow burn that will damage you more. Please take care of yourself. You deserve it.

Hi guys,

Thanks - a tonic to read your messages when I got home tonight.

Seashells - thank you. I seem to be stuck in the anger phase right now but I am sure that will change. I didnt know I knew so many swearwords... . Hope your situation goes well for you.

Arabella - thanks - I hope that your cycles of grief and anger get you to a resolution too. Its a rubbish situation as I know that I am "out of sight out of mind" to him. I feel like I am turning myself inside out and he is doing exactly what he wants without a care.

PatientandClear - thank you for clarifying what I was thinking and what my therapist didnt see about this. What I want from him is the door 3 you spoke of - a long transformative journey. I cant carry on with him otherwise after this.

Maybeso - thanks - I have been looking at your first posts and can see that you have come on a huge journey and learnt so much. I am listening to your points. I kmow that he cannot meet my needs at the moment, we are in very different places. I have put so much money in his slot machine that it is hard to not collect the winnings. I know all this intelectually but it is tough.

Maria1 - thank you - I am sorry that you have been in a similar position - it sucks. You are right about the projecting - he is doing loads of it and accusing me of spoiling the r/s with my reaction to his actions. He also did this strange thing of getting angry with me and almost stealing the kind of things I should be saying to HIM! He said things like "I wont say I love you after the week of turmoil you've just put me through" I'm thinking, hang on, isnt that MY line?  !

I hear what you are saying guys - thank you - I have had not a glimmer of an urge to call him btw x

  Just wanted to say that I've been watching this thread, and I ran out of things to say or felt like somebody else had already said whatever I was thinking as well as I could have or better. My heart goes out to you--watching this come at you like a slow-motion train-wreck.      Hang in there and take care of yourself.

  just wanted to send you good vibes. Sorry about your r/s. can you spend some time on you this week? Any chance you can go do yoga or go running? Any chance you have a hobby you've been neglecting that would put you in good spirits? Wishing you strength and clarity to take care of yourself. You can't take care of the relationship when your partner doesn't show up. I know I've been dealing with a similar scenario. Find peace as fast as you can. 

Hello,

Thanks Grey Kitty

Whereisthezen - good advice - I have arranged two days this week of something creative that I have been neglecting - it will be good for me. Yoga would be good to re-start again too.

Wanted to check in tonight as I am feeling very low and cant sleep again. The anger is reducing but am crying a lot. The intrusive thoughts about what he is doing keep coming at me. I keep thinking of the good times with him. I miss him (never not been in contact with him for this long before - he went Fri am and its now late Sun) I keep thinking of the sex too - it was amazing. Keep thinking of him. Its horrible. Didnt leave the house today but will go out tomorrow evening.

No contact from him - I havent and wont try to contact him as I will not condone his behaviour and what would I say to him anyway? Dont know what to say really - I have nothing to say about boundaries, what I will do or anything at the moment. Just feel horrible and wanted to post. I could say a lot about how hard this is but I am sure you all know. Feeling sorry for myself tonight.

Thanks for helping guys

I'm so sorry you are feeling so low. I remember it as a wretched physical and emotional pain that feels unbearable. I never imagined I could get to a point of not desperately wanting him in my life, needing him in my life.

I have got to that point. I don't miss him and I don't feel pain any more. I am glad to be out and using what I learned from the r/s to try and grow myself. I say this because I'd like to give you hope of something different where you are what matters.

Because you matter more than him. Because you would not do to him what he is doing to you, that's what hurts so much but that's what gave me strength too. 

Thank you Maria1 - that means a lot.

I didnt expect the pain to feel almost physical - I wish the anger was back - it felt more productive. At the moment I just feel weak  :'(

That's what I was talking about earlier - the anger feeling more productive than the grief cycles. It only feels that way though, really the crying is productive too, it helps to heal. I'm sorry you're going through this, it's not fair and you didn't deserve to have this happen. I know how that physical pain feels, it's so awful. I like to take a hot shower/bath as I find it helps to alleviate some of the tension (and the stuffy nose lol). You aren't weak. Think of those tears as weakness leaving your body, leaving a stronger, more determined version of yourself to fight through this!

Dear Connect,

It's a very tough thing your going through, please don't be hard on yourself.  I remember feeling "gutted" for lack of a better word.   I get what you mean about the physical aspects.  I had a lot of stomach problems which lead to those other kinds of problems  ... .   after the stomach part of the anatomical process.   

At least for me, the first few days I found any small comforting distraction welcome.  It will get better, but it's sure hard to see when you're going through it. 

I thought of this post by Blazing Star I read and thought maybe it would help you.   I think when you are ready to do things, for comfort you will.  I hope you don't compound your grief it by feeling like you HAVE to do something right now if you don't feel like it.  Be as good to yourself as you would to any one of your friends who were going through it. 

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=198573.0

I've read it all. i'll take some time to find the proper words to write. But, as you know, I've shared a very similar experience. and the pain is too much before and too much after. As someone has written: the sole idea of the vacation, even if the project was aborted, is a mortal wound for the relationship. In some way, doing this, they are trying to take control and manage to fit us in the place they are choosing for us. In my case, he was showing me what my place was from now on: staying at the window, waiting for him do decide when he'd make me the great favour of his company. That is to say, no longer a Gf, just a woman in his harem.

Good Morning connect

Wanted to post a link to an article about a break up causing physical pain:

www.shine.yahoo.com/love-sex/love-hurts-no-really-it-hurts-new-study-links-rejection-to-physical-pain-2469497.html

This is the yucky phase, but it is your first stage of NC and its good that neither one of you are trying to contact the other b/c it would bring you back to the FOG.  NC allows you to de-FOG, but does it feel lousy!

It might be helpful to read some of 2010's old posts about abandonment depression.

Also, clearmind posted a link to a free interview series in Taking Personal Inventory called "The Self-Acceptance Project".  I only watched the first one so far about "Being Compassionate to Your Inner-Critic", but I mentioned it to you b/c I thought some lessons in mindfulness and compassionate self-talk might be helpful to you during this time.  I know I find it very helpful!

You are in my thoughts this week.

Hi Rosanadanna,

Thank you for those links! I will look at those this evening when I get back in. I really appreciate it  :) I will look at 2010's posts as I have heard other people mention these posts... . Thanks also to Maria1, arabella (you're right baths do help), seashells and billa xx

Am up and about today with make up on and everything. Still tearful but with make up on at least.

I tracked down and have made an appt this week with a therapist that specialises in BPD and speaks to clients and/or their partners. We had a long chat over the phone and he says BPD sounds very likely and the patterns I described are typical of it. I will see him in a few days as it will help me clear my mind that I am not at fault in my reactions. I am looking forward to it - it was WONDERFUL to speak to a therapist that "gets it" It felt like a great weight off my mind to speak to him about this madness x

connect,

I'm sure your feelings will continue to be all over the place, but at least you sound a better right now :) Here is an extra hug or two in case they are down when you login next.   

|iiii I'm glad to hear that you have a sympathetic and knowledgeable therapist lined up! That should help you a lot.

I started on those "The Self-Acceptance Project" interviews. The first one was good, and I haven't gotten farther yet. I noticed mindfulness in several teacher bio's, and think that is a good sign--I've gotten a lot from that sort of practice.

Thanks for the virtual hugs Grey Kitty - very kind 

Had a better evening and went out and listened to some new songs by my favourite band (The National) that I hadnt heard before. Cheered me up and reminded me of what I used to be like before the rollercoaster.

Still feeling very delicate but the appt with the new T is something positive to focus on. Will see what tomorrow brings.

Hey Connect- just have to say I love the National. Saw them with exBPD year before last and they were fantastic. They have got me through some tough times. When I'm feeling low I put Bloodbuzz Ohio on and I'm lifted up.

Funnily enough one of the first things BPDex messaged me with was that he went running to the National. Looking back I think I liked them loads more than he did.

Glad you had a better evening

Hey Maria1,

Hello fellow National fan! Greatest band in the world - seen them lots of times (first time I saw them they were unknown and played to about 100 people-great gig)

Here's the new single:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=N527oBKIPMc

Here's the lyrics:

www.songmeanings.net/songs/view/3530822107859454648/

The line "I sincerely tried to love her, Wish that I could rise above her." rings true for me at the moment. Although you would have to replace her with him lol

Hi guys,

Got my first text from him today from his holiday.

"Morning honey" at the start... .   then:   He said its raining. His child has been ill. He also said he is now currently ill with a bad stomach.

Any thoughts as to whats going on in his BPD mind? I know I need to be focussing on myself (which I am - I really am - honestly) but I am very curious as to what you guys think about this sort of message. You all have more experience with this then I do.

Thanks

Things going bad there he looks to you for good. You can make it all better. Good mother.

It was always going to happen.

What do you want now?

Emotional manipulation.

Good Mommy, Feel sorry for me, and don't stay angry, look... .   I'm not even having fun on my vacation with my F buddy. I stole the cookie from the cookie jar but didn't really enjoy it!

(also... .   If you stay angry with me, even as I suffer, it shows how unreasonable you are. Bad mommy)

Head games.

In my experience . . . it doesn't really matter what's going on in his BPD mind.  It's always tempting to wonder, I know. 

But you said this was a deal breaker.  He knew it.  He went anyway. Was this a deal breaker?  Does it matter if he had a terrible time, got sick, had lousy weather, or if the kids were a pain in the rear?  If this is all true, does it make a difference to you?     

Thanks Maria1, Maybeso and Briefcase,

Similar responses from you guys then... .  

I havent forgotten the dealbreaker scenario Briefcase - am working through all this in my head this week. Seeing two T's this week about it too, one specialising in BPD, to clarify my thoughts.

He just sent another text saying how ill he is, that the food is awful and he has only been able to eat bland stuff.

Anymore input would be VERY gratefully received! This week is about me and not him - but I would love to know what people think about these messages.

Thank you all

I think he is trying to make you believe that he is not having a good time on his vacation so that (in his mind) you won't have a reason to be mad at him when he gets home.

For instance, if you refuse to see him when he returns, he will reply with "why are you so upset? I didn't even have fun.  I was sick the whole time, the food was bad, etc.".  This is his form of rationalizing his behavior.

And he may not actually "get" why you are upset about his going in the first place. He may believe that the reason you are upset is because he is doing something fun without you, so if he makes on like he's having a bummer of a time, then you won't be mad anymore when he gets back and life will go on as usual.

But, again, who knows what they are thinking.  BPD is a whole different world.

Yup, I totally agree with the previous responses.  So the only question is, where do you want to go from here? You can't just let it slide (tempting as that may be) because then you're just setting yourself up for this sort of behaviour to escalate in the future. If you can't make yourself dump his sorry arse altogether - what other options are there? (And there are always options - just have to think of them!)

FWIW, I agree with Maybeso.

He is feeling you out right now.  He wants you to accept this and act like it's normal   and nothing out of the ordinary has happened.  He will then be able to juggle back and forth between the two of you at will. 

If it were me, I wouldn't respond to him especially while he is still away.  Think about what you want.  At least in my situation responding normally under circumstances like this would signal acceptance to him. 

The part about this that becomes so difficult is no one in a healthy relationship would do something like this and expect to be able to return to it.  Yet, it seems some of them do try to pull it off,  repeatedly if they can.

Do not fall for it!

He IS having a good time! I've heard similar and I don't buy it anymore. When this happens, it's just to downplay their behavior. I highly doubt he's having a bad time. If he was really having a bad time he'd call, come HOME, go to therapy. Not likely this is happening so I'm more inclined to tell you he's lying to get you to BITE. Do not do it as soon as you do his brain will no longer focus on anything but having a good time and telling you more lies.

I wish I could hear me when I need it! Be strong! Stay away from him.

|iiii. I have nothing to add to this, great advice

Second guessing what he is thinking isn't productive.  Even less productive is painting him black and accusing him of manipulation, name calling, etc.

Take the high road. 

It's simple.  You have a boundary that is about YOU.  At this stage it has nothing to do with him

It's simple on paper, but it is not simple or easy in practice.  But,  I sure wish it were.

It is true, Connect, that ultimately this all about you and your boundary.  

I don't think I am wanting to paint him black in letting you know what my take on his messge is.  I don't think this guy is all bad and I don't see him that way.  I just think he is very, very emotionally immature. I think I'm am trying to keep it real, if doing so is unflattering to him right now, so be it.  But I still think my analysis of his message is probably pretty accurate and I do think there is some productivity in getting some real, if unflattering, feedback.

The feedback you are getting regarding emotional manipulation is important only in that... .   it's kind of standard operating procedure for how these relationships work. I think there's a learning curve to this, and you are in the middle of a learning curve right now.  It's also important because this involves YOU.  Manipulation isn't exactly just something someone does to us, like getting high-jacked.  It's more complicated than that, but usually, if we are being manipulated successfully,  it's because we are participating with it to some degree.

Connect, my ex did this kind of stuff all the time, and then the "oh I didn't even enjoy it" kind of thing was part of it, for the very reasons I just gave you.  It doesn't make the men we loved all black, it makes them very immature. It's a very immature style of relating.  This IS a form of manipualation, but really, it's not even all that sophisticated or clever, it's fairly transparent, and it is only manipulation if we buy into it.  

I bought into this kind of manipulation and allowed it a lot.  As much as I might be angry or rail against his 'manipulations' later when he would just pull another fast one, the true story is this:

I went along with a lot of his manipulations (like this one)  not because I didn't see through them myself at some level... .   but because it at least gave me some wiggle room to go further into denial instead of staying in radical aceptance abou the man I loved.   Ok he isn't really having a good time.  So,that means maybe this really isn't all that bad, maybe his stomach ache even had something to do with me and missing me and knowing how bad this was to do this to me,  that this  has made him sick.  How can I really justify sticking with my original boundary when it wasn't really even a very good trip? If he was sick, then he probably didn't really enjoy his time with the other woman, either.

The fact is I often didn't want to stick to my boundaries with my bf because he had some really appealing goodies that I was pretty much addicted to having and keeping my boundary meant giving up the goodies!  And I didn't want to!  This made me suseptible to some pretty transparent manipulations. You had me at hello, you know?  So I would go along with his ridiculous manipulations because on some level,  it served me to do that. I went along with manipulations when it served me in some way. But I wasn't as honest with myself and I could have been.  I didn't have to reallly own reality or my choices.

He is offering you a crumb that can help both of you sweep this under the rug.  It's not a very honest crumb, and while it may give some wiggle room for both of you in this current delimma, the fact is, this will keep happening.

So, stay with him, or break-up with him, or take a break and decide later, or something in between.

You can have whatever boundary  you want and change whatever boundary you want at any given time!  

This is your life!  Your choice! For your own reasons!

Whatever you decide, Connect, what will serve you well,  is not fooling yourself. Stay in radical acceptance. Whatever happens on this trip... .     this man you love, does this kind of stuff, cause he's really pretty emotionally immature. That's radical acceptance.

It has nothing to do with you or the other woman, it's just that he's really very immature and will be immature this way for a long time.

And knowing that, you get to decide! Just stay honest with yourself, it will serve you well no matter what you decide.  |iiii

Hi Folks,

Thanks for your responses 

My take on it was it could be one or more of the following:

1) He is trying to downplay the holiday by making it out to be negative

2) He is feeling guilty/bad (he gets stomach problems when this happens)

3) He is faking/exagerating this illness to me

4) He is testing the water with me. He wants contact but under the circumstances he cannot say anything positive about the holiday or ask me how I am as it would open a whole can of worms so this is the only way to do it.

I am more concerned about me than him at this point. I doubt the "illness" is affecting his holiday that much to be honest. I dont know what to post really as I am still going through a lot of things in my head this week and working through some heavy emotions. Just letting you know what's going on.

Thank you guys

You get to take as much time as you need deciding what is right for you.  |iiii

Hi Maybeso,

We crossed posted! I read your post after mine went up and it made me laugh as I wrote:

2) He is feeling guilty/bad (he gets stomach problems when this happens)

Yep you called that one allright! You are right it IS a steep learning curve and I am bang in the middle of it! Am not used to this kind of dynamic at all and have only starting gathering information since February. Thank you for all you wrote and calling on your own experience to help me out here. Thank you   Yes I am aware that it is manipulation and I do agree that going along with that "buys me some time" He knows I look after him when he is sick, we both know he gets sick when he is unhappy, he knows he is portraying a negative holiday. But what he doesnt know is that I do see this now. He doesnt know that his messages p***ed me the f off as it's his ex f-buddy who is the one that is looking after him. THAT riled me. THAT triggered me. There is nothing he could write that wouldnt trigger me except that he was wrong, it was a mistake and he's coming home.

When I first got the message I saw it was from him and felt steaming angry - didnt read it for 2 hours then turned phone off for 3 hours. Of course I would rather he contacted me than didnt (am only human) but it made me angry. The next one made me feel the same. I did answer saying "yes eat bland food" no kisses, no "honey" or "darling". I feel really wierd on here saying I answered as dont want to look weak :-( But best tell you guys... . I answered with awareness of what he's doing. I suppose I am buying myself some time. I think I didnt want to ignore him as I am being passive aggressive in a convoluted way that I dont even really get myself   something to do with stopping him thinking he is single while away with the ex f-buddy perhaps... . spoiling things for her too... .   you'll have to excuse me here as I am working things out in my emotional/tired/progressing mind. It helps posting on here as it forces me to examine myself. It is still in the forefront of my mind though that he has chosen to go on holiday with his ex - that is VERY firmly in my mind. That is thought is a keeper. On a lighter note... . I really hope she gets diarrehea too. ha ha.

I am really working on radical acceptance and have two T sessions to aid me this week. The real crunch time will be when he is back and my choices. I cant imagine my emotions (esp the anger) will be dissapated at all - in fact I think they will be esculated but hopefully clearer.

Thanks again and be gentle with me... .   lol

Ha!  I second that!  lol

Hi Connect,

The guy I'm 'friends' with has exhibited these sorts of things, too.  Which is one of the many reasons I don't consider him my SO and I have no idealistic fantasies of him becoming any different without serious therapy.  I do not want to live with him, but I do enjoy spending time with him.  If I were looking for a serious committed relationship, I would look elsewhere.

I've known him long enough to recognize his triggers, so I make other plans... .   on say certain holidays.  Sometimes I still get thrown for a loop, but have enough tools in my toolbox now to not let his actions affect me to the point of losing myself, my dignity, self respect etc... .   depression.  My eyes are wide open to the depths of his emotional immaturity.  I can stand alone and recognize what 'his stuff' is without becoming part of it.

Hang in there   It's an awakening of sorts, what you're going through right now.  Keep the focus on yourself and what it truly is that you want out of life   He's shown you the depths of what he's capable of in terms of hurting you and will continue to do just that without the proper long term therapy that he wants to get... .  

Take care of yourself. 



   

*mod*

We've made it to four pages again and this thread has to be locked.  Of course, you can continue the discussion by starting a new topic if you choose.   :)