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UBPDh was at an event recently and heard a woman speak. He said that I should have heard her because he thought I would be 'encouraged' by her. I got a transcript of her speech, and it seemed pretty basic and fairly good to me. I couldn't understand why he felt like it would be really encouraging to me. So, he said that he thought that she was very 'nurturing' in the speech. There wasn't anything in it that seemed 'nurturing' to me, so I asked what part of it seemed nurturing to him. She shared about her experience (having crackers in her car and feeding kids easy meals because she was very busy). He thought that a 'man' would have shared something different. I commented that I had heard the same thing from men.

Then he said that he appreciated her viewpoint because it was different than men's, and as a man, he couldn't understand women because they are women and have different experiences. I said I kinda think we have enough commonalities that we can understand one another. Eventually, I said that I do understand people (I have a couple of degrees in areas of people-study, and I'm really good at it, others have said so). He decided that I was being prideful -- and 'called it out' as sin. Then, I was taken aback, trying to figure out what he was talking about. How is that prideful? (and offensive, it seemed) I was pretty offended at being called out for a sin that I didn't commit, and wasn't sure how he thought it was sinful. He decided to 'test' me on what I 'understood' about him. I eventually stopped it by saying I didn't like the testing that he was doing. 

So, I decided to try a different approach, what did he hear when I said 'I understand people'. He heard that I didn't have to listen to them anymore and had 'put them in a box'. I reassured him that I didn't mean that at all -- in fact I meant something quite different, more like curiosity. He heard 'I completely have mastery over you because I know you completely.' He 'feels disrespected' when I indicate that I 'understand' (I don't use that word usually in conversations with people, or with him).

Thankfully, at the end of the discussion, he felt like it had been a productive one.

I'm just trying to think back and process things.

Hi empath. This is BPD all over. I am so happy for you that you were able to successfully "decipher the code". It is often an almost impossible task. Your exchange really displays not just difference of opinion, or differences in values, or between the sexes, but the disordered thinking of the disorder itself. Although I understand you mightn't have enjoyed it, it should have felt like it was productive for you too. (I don't use that word usually in conversations with people... . but I make an exception for you).  :)

A small win for both of you. I Love it!.  |iiii

empath,

I understand :)

Seriously, "I understand" falls a bit on the invalidating side for exactly the reasons your uBPDh said. If there is one thing one can usually trust a pwBPD - they smell invalidation from afar. They also appreciate validation - good speakers and sales persons typically provide plenty.

"I understand" is a statement about myself and that by itself is not really validating - more the opposite. It is often better

  - construct sentences without "I"

  - demonstrate understanding and not claiming understanding

In dealings with most people "I understand" will be given a pass and accepted - we however are in relationships with "experts" on validation and invalidation - unfortunately our expert has not yet learned to self validate and avoid invalidating others . Being "validation expert" also does not prevent them from passing expert judgments and demonstrating a judgmental "expert attitude" in the process.

an0ught, I don't generally use "I understand" in conversational contexts and didn't use the phrase to indicate 'understanding' of how he was feeling. I don't find it useful in talking with people about their experiences. The problem seemed to be that he couldn't separate out the different usages of the word 'understand' in the context. So, I offered a different word which he thought was okay. I was able to validate that using 'I understand' as a way to reflect feelings in a conversation tends to be very unproductive.

Something that I just noticed was that it seemed like that phrase is a 'black' phrase to him. He thinks that saying "I can't understand you" is validating rather than just shutting off conversation. Hmm... .