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Relationship Partner with BPD (Straight and LGBT+) => Romantic Relationship | Conflicted About Continuing, Divorcing/Custody, Co-parenting => Topic started by: Nope on August 15, 2014, 09:30:24 AM



Title: Waiting on a court finding...
Post by: Nope on August 15, 2014, 09:30:24 AM
Right now we have temporary emergency custody, which we went back and got after the full custody hearing. So I'm not even sure the reasons for temporary emergency custody can be included in the reasoning in the full custody decision.

Originally we were told the week before last that we'd probably have an answer last week. Then we were told last week that we'd probably have an answer this week. Well, it's Friday and we are waiting. We live three states away from the kid's BPD mom and school is supposed to start out there this coming Tuesday. It doesn't start until September here, but naturally the BPD mom is freaking out

Despite the fact that we have a current court order stating that the kids will remain in DH's custody until the full custody decision comes out, and the BPD mom is not to have parenting time with the kids until the full decision comes out, she tried yesterday to say that he had to bring the kids back no later than Sunday because they have school next week.

I mean, she seriously asked DH if Saturday or Sunday worked better for him for dropping the kids back off to her. Like we hadn't just dragged her into court and got an emergency order and it was the most normal question in the world to ask. When he said he was not obligated to return them she then tried to FOG him by saying they are missing soccer practices (she signed them up and has been talking to them on the phone about their soccer teams knowing full well they might not be going back) and they were missing the school open houses. As if he was doing something horrible to them by making them miss important things out there because, naturally, they are going back. Ugh! She has no idea what she sounds like.

Anyone following the story knows we have a very strong case. Lots of evidence, teachers testifying, and a GAL report 100% in favor of the kids being moved. But, the BPD mom is still the mom and this would move the kids three states away from her. She also has a history of majority time that is more than 40 weeks out of 52 every year (due to distance).

So... .with school starting up there on Tuesday, and the magistrate not even bothering to render a decision until today at the earliest, any thoughts on how this might go? Humor me, I know I'm torturing myself.


Title: Re: Waiting on a court finding...
Post by: bravhart1 on August 15, 2014, 07:25:34 PM
ohhh, I'm so sorry this must feel like torture. I know we waited two weeks longer than promised for our mediation report last time and it was so hard.

Just keep telling yourself what will be will be and it's going to be what it is no matter when you find out.

I got into trying to "guess the outcome" and that was making me so frustrated.

I know when your little ones lives hang in the balance it feels like such a tremendous decision to make someone wait on.

Know that you both have done all you can do, have some really great people on your side and that it will happen like it's supposed to.

Just because she is acting like she's confident that the kids are coming back to her doesn't mean she's right or sure, it just means she has disordered thinking. *)


Title: Re: Waiting on a court finding...
Post by: Nope on August 15, 2014, 08:42:23 PM
Yup. Waited all day. Nothing. Oh well, at least we get to enjoy the weekend. The magistrate is fully aware that school starts back UN BPD mom's town on Tuesday. She was even reminded of this fact during a conference call with both L's last week. I can't help but think the fact that they are still here is a good sign.


Title: Re: Waiting on a court finding...
Post by: david on August 16, 2014, 07:53:13 AM
Sounds like a good sign to me to. Stay focused on the kids and try to disregard, in a nice manner, BPD mom's chaos.

If the court waits until after Tuesday they may be hoping mom gets it. If she escalates the courts get to see that too. That would only reinforce the decision.


Title: Re: Waiting on a court finding...
Post by: ForeverDad on August 17, 2014, 10:26:46 PM
As my lawyer and so many people here have reminded... .

Follow the order.  Don't be pressured, coerced, intimidated, manipulated, obligated or guilted.

With temp custody then as long as that order is in effect, then he takes care of schooling, etc.  She can't be stopped from trying, but that order says it all.  Court has legal authority greater than a parent.  Right now she has no authority to tell him what to do.  Contact should be limited to reasonable telephone contact with the children and only very brief contact between the parents.  Letting her talk more than necessary only enables her to try to mess with his head.

And if the court is in no rush to send out the trial decision while he has temp custody, then that states volumes.  The court has left him in charge as school approaches, he is correct to handle their schooling until ordered otherwise.


Title: Re: Waiting on a court finding...
Post by: Nope on August 18, 2014, 10:07:00 AM
As my lawyer and so many people here have reminded... .

Follow the order.  Don't be pressured, coerced, intimidated, manipulated, obligated or guilted.

With temp custody then as long as that order is in effect, then he takes care of schooling, etc.  She can't be stopped from trying, but that order says it all.  Court has legal authority greater than a parent.  Right now she has no authority to tell him what to do.  Contact should be limited to reasonable telephone contact with the children and only very brief contact between the parents.  Letting her talk more than necessary only enables her to try to mess with his head.

And if the court is in no rush to send out the trial decision while he has temp custody, then that states volumes.  The court has left him in charge as school approaches, he is correct to handle their schooling until ordered otherwise.

We will begin getting them signed up for school here today using the temporary order. I had a long talk with him about not trusting his BPD ex's perceptions. I think on some level he still doesn't understand her illness and is having a hard time understanding how she can be so totally calmly sure she should get her way if she wasn't somehow in the right. Fortunately, we haven't heard from her since. Though she did talk to the kids on the phone this weekend.

I'm hoping it's best to stop worrying about when we'll get an answer. Hopefully the only thing an answer will do is lay out what kind of visitation she'll have going forward. In which case we'll miss the relative calm of a temporary order saying she gets none. *sigh*


Title: Re: Waiting on a court finding...
Post by: Thunderstruck on August 18, 2014, 04:59:29 PM
What behaviors did you point out that you feel made the strongest case for gaining the kids? Inquiring minds want to know.

I think the teachers would testify in our favor but we're not quite at that point yet. We're just trying to figure out how to organize the massive pile of "evidence" to fully illuminate what a cruddy situation SD9 is in over at her uBPDbm's place.


Title: Re: Waiting on a court finding...
Post by: Nope on August 18, 2014, 08:07:07 PM
What behaviors did you point out that you feel made the strongest case for gaining the kids? Inquiring minds want to know.

I think the teachers would testify in our favor but we're not quite at that point yet. We're just trying to figure out how to organize the massive pile of "evidence" to fully illuminate what a cruddy situation SD9 is in over at her uBPDbm's place.

Organizing our massive files of evidence was somewhat of a nightmare. Keep in mind I'm bot a lawyer and can't give legal advice. I can only offer my experience. What seemed to help us the most was proving patterns. No one incident (unless it's intentional and horrible) wins these cases. It's more a series of provable instances backed up by hard evidence. Example: We found out she wasn't taking them to the dentist so we started taking them. Then we saw they both had untreated warts so we took them to the dermatologist repeatedly for treatment while she did nothing. Then she was getting headaches while reading and he was squinting at the T.V. so we took them both and got them glasses. Then when it came time for the GAL to go get records they hadn't had regular checkups. We didn't do that because we only get the kids for a few weeks a year and we're out of state so clearly their PCP should be in state. Also, we always told their mom after we brought them to the appointments so she wasn't unaware. She just wasn't going to be bothered doing all that herself. This is a pattern of failure to provide proper medical care.

Another example is the laundry list of dead or missing pets the kids had over just a three year period. Cats, dogs, rabbits, etc. This shows a pattern of failure to provide proper care to any other living things in the household. We actually opened with this one in a thirty page "Summary" we submitted into evidence. Not because it was super important in the grand scheme of things but simply because it's pretty disturbing.

This was my formula:

Title of section

A few sentences about what the issue is.

Most on-point example of the issue.

Other examples to prove the pattern.

Hard evidence noted that proves the examples. (Paperwork, screen shots, recordings, etc.)

How the issue impacts the child.

Any steps you've tried to take to fix the issue.

Any response or obstruction by the BPD.

Maybe one sentence about how the court can help.

Once we completed this for every issue we submitted the whole thing to the L and she went through it and picked out what would be the focus during court and what was secondary that we'd get to only if we had time. The L tailored her approach to the fit the factors our particular court must consider when determining custody. Every court has a set of factors like that but some courts factors appear to differ from others. The goal is to have more factors in your favor. By the time we were done, the only two things the BPD mom had going for her were a history of majority time and that one of the two children is well adjusted to life in that area.

However, now that I've said all that, I just found out today that although the court that has jurisdiction in my case works this way, it is only because the standard for custody is "best interests of the child". The court with jurisdiction over the BPD mom's other case is different because she and the father of her youngest were never married. In that court, a change in custody would require, not what's in the best interests of the child, but that she be found to be "unfit"!     My jaw dropped when I heard that. So it's important to ask your L what the standard is before deciding your approach.