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As I am out of the FOG I have been thinking of all the different signs and hints my xBPDgf gave me. In effect she gave me a lot of information early on. She said to me that she was a 'chameleon', that her only really serious relationship 10 years ago told her to never ever contact her again and left her. That's how she got into therapy (she has been in T for 10+ years now). She told me that a co-worker of ours called her a man-eater and waited for me to react. She told me about her crazy sexual encounters. Not to mention talking about kids in the 3rd date. By the first month we were selecting children names... .She gave me me hints and in your face evidence about who she was very early on. She didn't hide anything from me. What on earth was going in my mind?Now that I think of all this again, I think it was entirely my fault that I got involved with this person. This person didn't deceive me. She was just out to have some fun. She knows her relationship patterns. She is 37 and had numerous numerous freedom33's before me and more to come for sure. She laid it all out there in the open for me to see. And I willfuly got involved. What can I say other than take full responsibility for what happened to me. Maya Angelou is right 'when someone shows you who they are believe them'

I would say that I received many such hints.  Mine told me early on about her libearl drug use and tendency to get into fights when she was young, but I brushed this off as "oh, she was young then, things are different now."  She works in a hospital where there are a number of borderline patients and told me "these patients remind me of me when I was young, except I didn't cut."  Again, I just said "oh, she was young."  Along the way she was so clear about who she was that in retrospect it's painful.  "I push away the people closest to me."  "I've made horrible choices."  Telling me about a series of recent inappropriate relationships. And on and on.  Like you, I willingly got involved. For me, I think it was a combination of a) not wanting to believe that serious problems from the past were ongoing because I was too infatuated and b) believing that I was the person who could conquer any problems that were ongoing.  In my case I think she was out for more than just having some fun, but I don't think she really understood what she was out for (and still doesn't), which was part of what made it so confusing. 

oh wow there were so many many hints and I'm really mad at myself for not paying attention to them.

she told me she was a drug addict but managed to tell me in such a way that it sounded more like an experiment during one summer. while she's not actively abusing drugs, she definitely has an addict personality and has had slip-ups during our relationship.

she told me she had multiple personalities and that they "raped" each other early on. why did I believe all this?

she used her intelligence to justify everything and I thought because she has advanced degrees, she couldn't be that crazy, right? HAHAHA!

she said she gets attached to people very quickly and later said she fell in love with me on our third date. THIRD DATE!

oh god there are so many I can't remember them all... .

I am glad this topic came up because earlier today my BPD exbf popped into my head unexpectedly. (I have come an extremely LONG way in my healing so he's not always on my mind).  I had a flash of a yellow sticky note on his dashboard that I wrote, "I LOVE YOU".  When I saw it there I was so touched he put it there to see constantly. (now I realize that was is object constancy reminder note).  Anyway, one day it was gone and when I asked what happened to my note he said he got the car washed.  I never gave that a second thought until today.  He must have been in the process of splitting me black and threw it out himself. Now, my first gut reaction to recalling this was sadness and a little embarrassment, but then I remember... .what would a 3 year old do? That thought equalized everything.  A 3 year old would act out their feelings like that. They are 3... .period.

As far as signs early on, I had too many to count.  He actually bought a plague that said, "I didn't say it was your fault, I said I'm blaming you."  He thought that was GREAT and he had to have it.  He left a gf on vacation, excommunicated many close friends and all of his ex's. I could go on but I don't even want to give this that much thought.

Yes, there were signs and not reading them or being willing to see them is some of our issues, but we need to let ourselves off the hook some too.  Becoming the fantasy partner and sucking us in is part of their M.O. We are not trained therapists looking for signs of this type of behavior.  We are good people looking to give and receive love.  Unfortunately we came across these unhealthy people, but now fortunately, we know better.

Take responsibility so you can take control back and do better from this moment on, but it was through no "fault" or our own that we became their victims.

xo

Hints yeah,  lots of them at the start. 

Then the night we got really close finally she basically admitted BPD.  Honestly she basically told me she had it, listing all of the main indicators.  At the time I didn't know anything about PD's and stupidly thought we could just work through it.

After I became completely broken I google how she had made me feel and saw a page about BPD and was like wow that's her. Classic waif.

Not so obviously the first time around. He did say that he had left his previous relationship in his mind much earlier than he physically left.  That they didn't argue, he was just bored and felt nothing.

On the recycle, he told me he can't bare being alone, he's bored, feels empty. 

He is empty, he is boring!

All the clues were there, and now I see them, but at the time... .

They do give you hints. Mine told me she could cut off her feelings.

mine did also. but I figured that she was just talking. if they tell you they are the devil child believe them.

Biggest hint -"yeah... .my mother had a little touch of something wrong in the head" (she molested him repeatedly) " and I think she passed a little something on to me too" ( that's the understatement of the year)... .

Mine also was the "I've made bad choices" type.  I got told that a lot when I was trying to nail down some sort of commitment.  "How can I when I've made so many bad choices" arhhhh infuriating to even think about those round and round conversations.

That's so sad

"most guys don't make it 4 months with me"

"I'm close to god. I know the bible says no sex before marriage but if I want sex, I go to the bar and get sex"

"I had my daughter with a man who I knew was married, but he was married so he did something wrong, not me"

"When I'm done with a guy, I have no use for him"

"I don't let anyone in, I can't get close to anyone"

"I have many demons to work out"

and the best for last, word for word

"I'm crazy"

I'm a F'n idiot, what the hell's wrong with me? The bad part about it is that I still love her and it's so hard letting her go. Life's a hoot, go figure... .

Great question--one I had to spend a few hours pondering, so I'll point out the early warning signs (hints).  Not sure he "gave" them to me and not sure I "received" them; nonetheless, they were there: 

1.  On my first "date," I called to say that it was raining, and I needed to go pick up my computer--that I might be a few minutes late.  His answer, "You're not calling to cancel, are you?"  To myself I mumbled, "Great--another needy one."

2.  Met him for the first time and brought my computer into the book store.  During the first few minutes of our discussion, he began talking about how I had overpaid for the computer, that it was a really lame computer, and that he is in the computer business, so I should have asked him.  NAME THAT TUNE.  He is superior, and poor little me NEEDS him to help with my computers.

3. During our conversation at the book store, we began discussing our divorces--he told me she cheated--that he caught her on Facebook with a guy who went to her high school--he was sure she was trying to hook up with him.  NAME THAT TUNE--unfounded jealousy and accusations to which I retorted, "I have lots of guy friends on Facebook who were dates from high school but none with whom I have any intention of cheating (this would be used on me many times in the future--especially the fact that I said my former spouse had accused me of cheating:  something I was very sensitive about).

4.  The mirroring started on the first date.  He loved everything I did; we had children the same ages; wow! We're exactly alike.  Although he did look rather alarmed when I said I had worked on contracts in the justice system.  I would later learn he was living in a half way house after spending three years in federal prison--the one deal breaker, in his mind, was that I had been a "Fed"--or was it?  He probably thought he hit the jack pot!

5.  I told him I was leaving town the following day and would be attending a conference, so I would be out of touch.  He incessantly called me the entire time I was attending the conference.  I would later learn that he had been borrowing other people's contraband cell phones while he was living in the halfway house.

HELLO? WHAT WAS I THINKING? Oh yeah, I wasn't!

started to control me, wanted me only to go certain places.

If I made a joke and she though I was leaving her , I could see the scary look in her face (just like she seen the devil, eye rolling, etc)

Had two personalities, where one of them she got a strange look/energy in her face.

"I have scared away most of my boyfriends"

"I am awaiting my prince"

"wanted us to move in together VERY early"

tried to kill herself after being impregnated by a abusive boyfriend

Copying, mirroring , attention seeker.

I had known my Bpd ex gf for more than six months when she referred to herself as having "been" an alcoholic. With friends in recovery and a mother who works with addicts and alcoholics in treatments programs, I know that addiction is a lifetime problem. But she only drank once while we were together, so I assumed--or at least hoped--it was hyperbole. I should have taken her at her word. Her addiction took literally days to fully control her life, after relapsing near the end of our relationship.

Almost from the beginning she was incredibly needy, sending dozens of texts and numerous phone calls during the day, while I was trying to work. She also insisted that we work together, on our laptops, at a coffee shop. I gave into this for a while, until I realized that she needed my attention more than a quiet place to focus. But allowing me to concentrate on my work alone during the day provoked a lot of battles that even numerous phone calls or video chats could not prevent.

Even on the days that we spent together, by the evening she would tell me that she missed me, a couple of hours after we parted. If we did not see each other two days in a row, she would accuse me of "never" wanting to see her. However, her taking a day or two away from me was different, because she needed to concentrate on something "important." In the end, I gave up things that were important to me to placate her.

Because she lacked a car, I also ended up running errands for her, such as dropping off packages at the Post Office or UPS. With a little extra effort, she could have done this her self, on foot. We had many arguments about this, and I felt taken advantage of. Her anxiety made her incapable of going into convenience stores at night by herself (although by the end of our relationship, she could). She presented herself as helpless in many situations. Typical waif behavior.

Her psychiatrist told her that she was lucky she was not dead or homeless due to her past drug and alcohol use. I assumed this was an exaggeration, but the one time she did drink, I held her head so that she would not choke on her vomit while passed out. The next day she discussed her past drug and alcohol use sanely, and seemed resigned to the fact that she needed to stay away from ALL intoxicants, for the rest of her life. She maintained sobriety for another eight months, with the exception of taking a few narcotics leftover from surgery earlier in the year.

Why did I stay? Because, despite the warning signs and all the drama, I saw her as a basically good, honest, trustworthy person that had worked harder than anyone I knew, while pulling herself out of grinding poverty and a dysfunctional family and culture. She was a stellar student and committed to working for the greater good of society. I admired her for turning her life around and finding purpose. Strangely, she felt very insecure about her future, as though her dreams of a middle class life and professional success were an illusion, a place she did't belong.

I will never understand how she could fall so far so fast. I certainly never suspected her of being able to lie to, cheat on, and abandon me so suddenly. She went from being admittedly difficult and demanding (but often sweet and charming) to become the most destructive person I have ever known. Certainly she had problems, but I never suspected such cold-hearted brutality from anyone, let alone someone I thought I knew so well.

I imagine there were lots. Only, I didn't know what I was dealing with and by the time I thought "hold on a sec... " I was already hooked.

- Very short term prior relationships

- She said that she cuts people out of her life completely if they cause her any kind of upset

- She'd seemingly get offended at things very easily (kept in well in check at first)

- Asked me lots (too many) of questions about my exes (later used as emotional blackmail i.e. you loved her more than me... No? Then PROVE it to me!" etc... )

- When we were apart, always wanted to know what I was doing. It wasn't 'normal... it felt accusatory and made me nervous…eggshells)

Blah.

Let's see:

Told me she loved me only a couple of weeks into the relationship.

Non-stop sex.

Wanted me to impregnate her a couple of months into the relationship.

Dumped all of her friends to hang around with me.

Got very jealous at times.

Flirted with other guys all of the time.

Here is one that I am realizing, and I am not sure what it all means.  After all of our sexual encounters, it seemed like she had to recap it.  She had to compare it to sex she had in the past.  Many times she said it was the best ever.  It seemed like she always had to be in control sexually.  I think it was her way of getting control of me.

Because she always compared the sex we had, I began to feel like it was more of a "performance" than it was sex. 

I guess that I had the odd exBPD, lol. Mine never initiated sex in 3 years, never once performed oral, and just kind of laid there in like she'd rather be getting a root canal. Always told me that due to past rape by an exbf that, "sex means nothing to me" and "I would go the rest of my life without sex and it wouldn't bother me". However, since sex meant nothing to her, it didn't stop her from cheating on me and currently banging new supply a few times a week while I still live with her. Also, before me, it didn't stop her from having a child with a married guy and then needing a DNA test because she was screwing another guy at the same time. I feel cheated, I wish that I had gotten one of the nympho BPDs, lol.

You may be better off.  Living without the sex after it was freely given to you over and over was the hardest thing I ever experienced in my life.

It was almost humiliating in a way.

The woman who put me on a pedestal and couldn't keep her hands off of me started acting like she was repulsed when I touched her.  It was tough.

I'm not sure this is at all helpful to others, but it helps me to recognize that the sex was yet another control mechanism in their tool chest. It didn't work on me; other mechanisms did. Maybe it's helpful for us to evaluate what did and didn't work that they used on us. My BPD waif was freakin brilliant decoding me; thus he has left a path for me to decode myself. I wanted to be adored; I needed to be helped; I loved feeling loved--sounds like a Cheap Trick song, but trust me; sex is A LOT better when it's mutually fulfilling and passionate--we were just being played.

This is very true. Sex was used as a means for control. First she showered me with it. We spent literally entire weekends in bed. I have very high sex drive so this was a HUGE hook for me and one of the main tools of control the first few months. So sex bombed really at the start and then she started withholding. Sex would be whenever she wanted and on her terms. When I was initiating I was constantly being rejected.  There was usually some ailment, belly, headache, busy, tired you name it.  And if it happened then she 'd need to be in control - that was a prerequisite for her in order to climax. And even when she did I am not sure if it was actually genuine or not. What got me unhooked was when I realised how fake the whole thing was. Later in the relationship I 'd just observe her giving this big show and see under the mask the insubstantiality of it all. Then whole thing was demystified and it lost its power over me.

It's actually embarrassing how much I ignored because she made me feel, in equal measures, so good and so bad about myself. She'd been sectioned, she had a very strange obsession with all her exes and was always stalking and trying to reconnect them, unless they were painted black, but when I was in the doghouse they turned white again, she was extraordinarily overtly sexual with no hint of bashful ness very early on and was quite worshipful of me... .I thought it was Christmas.

I knew at the time these were red flags but she was like a drug to me, one I was always trying to escape, I'd get other girlfriends and do wreck less things just to try to get my mind off her, and this gave her fantastic ammo to sling at me for the next 5-7 years - great guilttripping stuff, I should have stayed away, I'm older for it, poorer for it, fatter for it, greyer for it, weary from it, I have truly damaged my health from this toxicity. But the time has come now, I mount now stop wasting time. I've bought a book... .Let's see!

Big ditto.

I thought I never reached the witholding stage, but now i realise that the "let's be friends" period was actually this in action.

What amazes me was once when we were dating and having sex, this awareness came over me.  It was like, "what are you going to do when she takes all of this away?  How are you going to handle it?"

I quickly shrugged it off and thought, she will never take sex away from me.

Oh yes... .

- After our 4th date she told me she was abused and that we may never have sex

- Coworker who has a pd(really nice guy though) would avoid her like the plague. He was scared of her he once told me. He could probably see through her masks.

- Bad with money(don't want to pay bills, because bills are stupid)

- Was easily frightened, even when you walk up to her. She didn't notice you, until you said something sometimes.

- Ailments(bad eating patterns, acne, allergic to mosquitos, allergic to shampoo and deoderant, asthma, stomach ache, back and neck problems)

- Forgetting things

- Weird views on the world

- Seemed to be in her own little world sometimes. Not responsive.

- Me, me, me, me. It's all about me!  

- I couldn't tell anyone at work about us, she would freak out when people seemed to know.

- Big mouth about various topics, when in fact she's a quiet little girl inside

- Doesn't seem to have any sympathy to other people's opinions.

- Would say "A", but behavior said "B"

- Afraid people close to her were dead/ or being injured, when they showed up late and would get angry with them

Ummm... .DITTO... .:/

WOWoodness!  The first 6 months of our marriage were him asking me the GORY details of a past relationship... .and me trying to reassure him of my love for him... .We still deal with it to a certain extent... . 


This has caused me to stop even thinking of things to try/suggeset, which is not good because I really want to get out and help/serve people for God with my kids... .Lose/lose situation right this sec... .

She had to know every interesting detail of my past sexual history, and them had to out-do them or replicate them.

High confidence in some situations that would make most people a little nervous, yet couldn't cope with ordering a takeaway on the phone... .

Hi all

ExBP and I were friends at first, and he crashed on my sofa as a friend in temporary need.

Homeless 2 years, unemployed 2 years. Later found out he wasn't actually homeless at all, (went between his elderly parents, older brothers, other women he had casual flings with, to sleeping in his car several nights per week).

He said he was only looking for 'friendship' with me, but seemed to demand a lot of time and ask lots of questions about other male friends in my life, for someone who was only interested as a 'friend'.

When I told him that perhaps we shouldn't hang out as much anymore, since I was becoming attracted to him and didn't want to be hurt, he then admitted that he felt much more for me and wanted more than friendship, I asked if he wanted a relationship with me, and he replied 'yes', then tried to warn me away from him, (this seemed strange since he had been big-noting himself so much to be this great, honest hardworking down to earth guy).

We talked about becoming involved, and he demanded we have STD tests before sleeping together. Almost 2 months later, we finally had those tests and were fully involved. His job seeking ended about this time, and several  extreme   s had already shown up.

I had already been SEX BOMBED big time, (prior to the STD tests) and I very quickly became addicted to him, and fell hard as well.

However, his insane and dangerous jealousy had already reared its ugly head, and I overlooked it.

Then when he knew he HAD me, the devaluations started big time, accusations of cheating several times per day.

One set of rules for him as per time out, (during fights or otherwise) absence, phone etc.

Always rabbiting on about his ill health and his starving all the time.

Always tired and napped several hours every day, (but didn't actually work!)

Thought nothing of showering several times per day, (never asked)

Stole things from sites I was managing and sole in charge of, whilst I was busy working, he would be casing the joints out and stealing, and would own up months later as to where he got the stuff from, (this was embarrassing and never once did he care if I lost the jobs if he was caught on camera or something).

Stole from others as well, and the community at large

Stole mail from our letterbox all the time

Broke our property, or damaged things and then accused me of having someone else at the house when things turned out to be damaged.

Broke what he thought was a CCTV camera, (was actually only a Solar Spotlight at the front door  :))

Turned off one CCTV camera when he was up to something

Made out he was 'at risk of violence' from my family living with me, (the truth was actually the opposite since we were living in fear of what he might do all the time).

Damaged my vehicles, kicking them and throwing things at them.

Tried to kill me several times, once was premeditated

Threatened to kill his parents, and his elderly Father copped that threat and physical violence twice. The last straw for them finally, (after 13 years of helping their son BP out for free with accommodation, dog sitting, car sitting you name it) was September 2012, they gave him a years warning, that they were going to sell up and buy a smaller, (easier to maintain) home, and BP would have to 'move out and move on'. BP scoffed that they would never actually do it, and did nothing to help himself.

September came last year, and they had sold up, re-brought and moved, and BP was released back to his car.

For the first 2 years BP was with me, he lived at mine, but I stood firm on a violence boundary at the end, and asked that he either make an effort to change his behaviour, or he return to his parents. He flew off in a rage, vowing to NEVER return, and that he wasn't welcome at his parents anyway so I made him 'homeless' (pfft he was back there lying about my home/me/my family the next day).

I hear from in-laws that BP is now 'living with friends' but that the environment isn't that good for him, (choke... .thinks he is Nelson Mandela or something).

I would bet that he has found another victim to parasite off, and its likely a woman, since we are the nurturing types and this is his pattern. GRRRRRR

It is my fondest prayer that (if it is a she) that she is smarter and more confident in herself than I was, and doesn't let him back after his first blow out act.

Oh Glory be to that... .

Roller

Yes... the biggest hint was probably how quickly and deeply she fell for me, became obsessed with me. Not knowing about BPD, I just thought we were soulmates.

Shortly after that, I started to get my first What the heck feelings when the push/pull stuff started. I can remember in our 3rd month, we were out having a good time. Something I did set her off, and she stormed off proclaiming she'll "find her own way home"... We had my car, and of course, i chased after her, we were staying in a hotel that night. She remained cold, I laid in bed next to this cold person and I couldn't grasp the cognitive friction of how this person who claimed to love me like she's never loved anyone before can basically shut me out/want to leave me over something that was so trivial I don't even remember it any more.

I broke down, she heard me sobbing and ignored me for awhile. Until she finally gave me a crumb and put her arm on me. After the 4th or 5th time she did this, I stood up for myself and told her that I won't accept threats to leave me any longer. That stopped it for a few months, but then it was back again, and I never stood up to her again. The weaker I got, the worse she got, the more she trampled all over me.

This is the same for me. The more I accepted her assertions that I was too dominant, and the more subservient I became, the more she became a monster.

Yeah... .I wondered  what I had done wrong. The fact was,  I'd done nothing wrong, I'd just outlived my usefulness .

Mine actually said to me, out loud, to my face, "I have never mirrored anyone this good before". I think he was actually thinking out loud and didn't mean to say it. Another time, when he was trying to get me back after we had broken up, he said, "I just want to bounce your light back at you".

The hints I got early on:

--He knew his thinking was black and white and was quite proud of it.  I told him it was immature, that the gray was where growth happened.

--He never asked me anything about myself in our first conversations, only talked about himself.

--Jekyll & Hyde type of thing where he'd get upset over seemingly ridiculous things.

--Nothing I did was ever enough.

--Didn't have any close friends other than his brother.

--All his past gfs cheated on him which was his excuse to his jealous behaviour not long after.

I never knew anything about BPD, he had a brain injury so he always blamed everything on this.

Mine had to have guy friends. I believe so she could use them for money because she did not work. We had lots of issues with trust due to her guy friends. Now I have no problems with a woman having guy friends but when you talk bad about me behind my back to other men and lie about it, we have a problem. And ALL her friends but maybe one or two had drug related pasts. Yet she "hated" drugs and drinking. She simply refused to admit she's ever stolen or had a drink. She is purely innocent. She would tell me things then months later the story would completely change! What a mind f***!