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I love you, and I don't know why, there's something mysterious about you and I can't seem to figure it out, or at least something along them lines, if so, what did they mean?

She was probably talking to herself.  :)

Hard to say, we need more context and probably needed to be there, but when my ex said she 'loved' me it meant she needed me.  Borderlines are need driven, and she kept an emotional distance from me, partly because she was convinced I would abandon her, because everyone did, and she associated 'love' with pain, but mostly because she was literally incapable of coming to me emotionally and intimately, which I knew early as all the 'lovey-dovey' stuff, her phrase, rang false to me and sounded empty, like she was reciting a script that had worked before.  Yet I stayed.  So bottom line, when she told you she loved you, did you believe it?  Did it ring true for you?  Did you ignore it and stay anyway?  I stayed because I was grasping at tidbits, trying to get to a depth that was never and could never be there.

"I loved you all the 8 years we were together. I still love you. " less than 48 hours later he took off and sent an email b/u letter.

Ive had about 8 relationships with only 3 of them id consider serious, and with my last relationship what I still struggle with is the do you think she loved you? I understand BPD/NPD but, sex and intimacy never felt real, it's hard to explain, it's almost like, every time it happened I was about to be be filmed on a porn set.  There were many times where as soon as I became intimate towards her she would become submissive through role play, would say things like treat me like your little ___, and would make it known that she was having sex.  For example, even if my parents were in the house she would scream to the point where I started to hate it.  There were times where she was like I want James tonight (my name) and we would be very sensual and all those screams for attention disappeared. The reason why I'm highlighting this Heels is because, your probably one of the most knowledgable people on this forum in my opinion, and I would like to know your opinion on this.  What I'm trying to get at here is, loving relationships or should I say healthy adult ones don't induce these kinds of behaviours, yes we can all have great sex, but what I experienced was like her saying I want you to abuse me, and as a kind loving person these kinds of events have made me question whether these experiences are normal in a mature adult relationship.

I think deep down they don't know what they want in relationships or out of life, they seem so out of touch with reality and some how expect us to guide them even though they treated us so badly.

Or about herself... .

So true! :)

In my opinion role play etc can be normal and healthy but my pwBPD did take it to new levels although I was never uncomfortable with it I can see how some people would be.  

In my relationship we did have what I feel were genuine moments of intimacy but to be honest they were when she was idealizing me so maybe even they weren't real.

I dunno it's tricky

Don't get me wrong I enjoyed it, but she took me to a place I didn't experence before, she liked being hand cuffed to the bed and told not to touch me until I was ready for her, light choking and some other pretty extreme things that I won't voice on here.  I understand that couples like to try new things after the novelty has warn off over the years, but this stuff was instant, like within the 1st month we were talking she would skype me, in the nude at random expecting me to call her master, I would then end up telling her to do literally anything sexual and she would do it. Is this because BPDs/NPDs loathe who they are to the point where when they role play it makes then step outside themselves, because my ex was so controlling towards me but during sex it was like now you have the power.  It's hard for me to grasp whether or not these kinds of things are normal in healthy relationships, because the intensity was instant. does this make sense to you guys? Like is it normal to be that extreme and I tense so early on?

That could have been her getting her needs met, a replaying of the punitive parent in her head, how she grew up expecting to be treated, so it became arousing to go there.  Also, someone who is emotionally underdeveloped, like children, crave discipline and direction, even though they rebel against it, all part of growing up and creating a self, but in a safe environment; mine was certainly in that mode, and maybe yours was too?


Folks make sex mean a lot of things, but for healthy adults to become both emotionally and sexually vulnerable to each other, and have it mutually accepted and respected, is how true intimacy is formed.  There's no better feeling, and exposing that level of vulnerability is also risky, we might get hurt, but it's where the juice of life is.  Sex can be a tool to amplify intimacy, but we need to be sure there's intimacy outside the bedroom too; my ex used sex as a tool to control and a way to escape her pain with a little physical bliss, but the robotic techniques she got from porn were transparent, and silly me I thought I could navigate through that to get to the real her, only to discover there was no real her there.  Sometimes we need to see what true intimacy isn't to remember what it is.

One of our members here named (Blimblam) has in his signature line the following quote:

"Read what you wrote about her backwards if you want to know the truth."

Let's apply his concept here to solve this riddle my friend, ok?

I will break this down (the backward text) into small sections in the attempt to bring forth to you an understanding as to the actual meaning thereof and therefore ask you then to draw your own conclusion to the validity of the interpretation regarding this matter.

Original Quote: "I love you, and I don't know why, there's something mysterious about you and I can't seem to figure it out."

Backward Quote: "out it figure to seem can't I and you about mysterious something there's, why know don't I and, you love I."

out it figure to seem/

Backward Translation: She figures it seems that she's out of her mind.

can't I and you/

Backward Translation: She's telling you that your relationship is not going to work out unfortunately.

about mysterious something there's,/

Backward Translation: she senses someone has sent her some junk mail and it is there in the mailbox.

Alternate Backward Translation: She senses Fluffy (her cat) left something there in the litter box that will have to be disposed of after you and her finish your conversation.

why know don't I/

Backward Translation: "I know a lot of things, don't I? I graduated from school."

you love I/

Backward Translation: You love her.

Thank you Heels, that's really helped me understand, especially the wanting to venture back to what they were used to but in s safe environment, it makes a lot of sense.  I agree with you when trying to wade yourself through the porn like intimacy to find the real her and bond, I can totally relate to that!

Could you try and explain this a little bit more clearly it would mean a lot, thank you!

Consider it alien-speak, crossed wires, anything but worth you giving it too much thought.  Conscious stream of confused thought processing at best.

Honestly the easiest way to decode messages full of projection is to play around with switching the the You and the me's/I's around.

Also the he's and she's with I's.

Then you also have the meta message where you read the body language and intonation.  You have to sort of use your third ear and not take it personal.

This makes sense, when my ex was giving me the "I'm leaving you" speech   she said "look at all I've done to you", which would translate to "look at all you've done to me", she also said "I love you" that was the last time I saw her, so that would also translate to "you love me". So weird. Creepy actually. I wonder if when she said "I don't want you anymore", she really meant, "You don't want me anymore".

Mine never broke up with me either time she left. I was always blunt telling her it was over. My ex never really raged and went on and on.

That level of intensity early on can be a red flag. The intensity and extreme-ness of the sex is a microcosm of the intense, extreme relationship. pwBPD go full blast from day one, so everything is amplified.

As for whether or not it's normal in healthy relationships... .well, "normal" is a relative term.  I'm a woman who loves these kinds of things, and although my T keeps insisting I'm mentally healthy, I certainly wouldn't classify myself as "normal." lol These things aren't particularly common, but they're capable of being part of a healthy relationship.

Healthy relationships can look like, well, pretty much anything... .as long as there is true mutual intimacy, respect, acceptance, and understanding between/among all involved parties.


|iiii

Jammo, it sounds like your ex put you in a position you weren't entirely comfortable with, and without much discussion or concern over what you wanted/needed. To me, this shows the lack of intimacy on her part. Not the specific acts themselves. A healthy sexual relationship is fulfilling for everyone involved, not just one person. There's a genuine mutual desire to please, to learn, to enjoy.

I love you because you seem to be the perfect victim who will supply all my needs.


As a bonus you also seem to make/have a couple of bucks. So my needs should be met quite easily.

Actually I think the correct backwards quote is "Tuo ti erugif ot mees t'nac I dna uoy tuoba suoiretsym gnihtemos s'ereht ,yhw wonk t'nod I dna, ouy evol I".  :)

I agree Jammo, they want us to guide them and yet they want to be in control. I am sure my ex has no idea what he wants out of life. He is impulsive - buying this toy then another thinking that will fill the void. He has no purpose or drive and is not inquisitive about why he does things. Part of the illness I know.

He thought a replacement would solve his issues with me and of course get him out of the impulsive act of asking me to marry him. So interesting, yet hard to heal from all of this craziness we try and make sense of.

Yeah.

He told me in August "I will always love you no matter what.", 3 weeks later he was sending a notice letter to the landlord to have us kicked out the kids and I, and another to the benefits office to have my supplies stopped.

And that was supposed to be endless love... .