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I was seeing a girl with PTSD/BPD for about 3 months. I started another thread on her, but feel this is interesting as it is actual "proof" of what they often do during absences, stories they tell, manipulation etc.

She was having some issues with her ex, so she asked to use my phone to check her email. She didn't sign out of her email account.  For the duration of the relationship things were very odd, so I read her emails.

We just too a beach vacation together last weekend, and spent 7 days in a row together.

A. Emails to her attorney.  She was consistently begging him to send a photo of his "big dick", and how it is the biggest dick she ever saw.  This was up to one day before we left for vacation together.

B. Emails with her and her ex. She described me as a friend of a friend, and that she never did anything sexual with me. It also turns out that they only broke up in January, and not a year ago like she has been telling me...

C. She was actually begging to get her ex back in the emails, as recently as a few days before our trip. She had always been telling me he is an abuser, she left him, he is horrible etc.

D.Her ex was actually inside of my house when he dropped his daughter off.  She told me he never even entered the driveway, but after reading the emails he made a comment about my home he would only know if he was inside.

So if it doesnt feel right, it usually isn't For mew it took reading it with my own eyes.

I confronted her, and of course she had excuses...

She said she needed legal help, and her attorney forced himself on her, and she brushed against his penis... So she was only saying this to get legal help...

She said she doesnt want to be with her ex, but was acting like it to get aq leg up in custody battle.

She also blamed it all on me, as I have not made her my GF, and she is claiming I am in love with my ex.  So she was afraid to get close to me.

As for her ex entering my house, she is claiming the email mean someone else's house...

At the end of the day all of this hurts, but I am glad I found out now...

Based on all of that are you leaving or hoping to work things out? All those different things and not one of them did she admit that what she had done was the truth, instead it was something else entirely. You haven't been together long, but my uBPDexgf and I were together 10 yrs. It has been 7 mos since she left "out of the blue." I was cleaning up in my office and discovered old check books (I keep for tax purposes) and it seems every 6 months I was giving her around $1000 to help her tide her finances over.

You don't have to waste 10 yrs of your life hoping that what she told you here was true or not. You deserve a happy life, and that would include not being with a liar. Best wishes.

BTW, ask her if she wants you to file charges against the attorney. Tell her you can have him disbarred (cause that can happen) and see what she says then... .

Wow, what a stroke of good fortune for you. You had it all laid out plain and clear before your eyes. I have an endless nagging intuition that my uBPDso is lying about randomn things. Haven't had anything so blatantly obvious as that though. If it were me, I would feel thankful for the information and move on! Best of luck :)

The truth is in her actions my friend as she cannot fake her actions. Her words are false. I know you, right now, probably don't see your discovery as a fortunate occurance, and that is understandable, but it is a fortunate occurance nonetheless. I am sorry that you are caught up in this. It is hurtful. You are correct, better now than later. Take care of yourself!

And the sad part is that i am constantly thinking of her...

it is amazing what sex, love, and closeness does to a guy... As an example, before I read the emails we were on a road trip...   She was naked in the car the entire time, telling me how she loves me, asking to be with me forever etc...

After i read the emails, i confronted her... .She made excuses, but was even more in love with me.

Then a light switch flipped and she wanted to go home... After I dropped her off she sent me a very threatening email that she will "mess me up" if i tell anyone what i read...

Then a few hours later she sent me an email that she wants to "keep in touch"

So within 24 hours she wants to have my kids, then wants to "f me up", then wants to "keep in touch"

Constantly thinking about them is normal after the ending. We've all been there. I am about 8 weeks out, and I think of my BPDexgf everyday. It is becoming less and less. Eventually it'll pass.

These relationships are very intense; our emotions are always keyed up, so naturally when it ends it's a long fall. The wacked out sex, love bombing, complimenting, etc. is a strong hallucinogenic. Many Non's think that this is the real "them", but it's not. All of this is just another manifestation of the disorder.

As I said before, the truth is in their actions: I want to have your baby one minute... .Let's keep in touch the next minute. Who could have any type of relationship with anyone that unstable? Life would be chaos and turmoil.

She will land on her feet. Now is the time to take care of YOU.

Other things she was saying...

" I was terrified and running because i was so in love with you and scared"

"You didnt say you love me enough. If you did it would have been different"

After confronting her about her emails, she was crying, hysterical, praying to god out loud I wouldnt leave. Trying to have sex with me all night.

At about 4 am we did have sex... She was begging for me to finish inside...

Then the next morning she was asking to stay the weekend before I went to work. As soon as I agreed, it was  "Take me home, I will never speak to you again"

Seemingly they MUST set it all up so they can be the dumper? Ande exactly... What is "lets keep in touch?

Be careful with this woman! You might become a father!

"The wacked out sex, love bombing, complimenting, etc. is a strong hallucinogenic."

good sentence.

I agree. Be careful man! She sounds dangerous in more ways than one.

It is amazing how there is NO empathy whatsoever. They can go be in a brutal, violent threesome (see my first post) and the day after act like nothing has happened. No sane human being could do that. Even if you ignore the fact that you hurt others around you, you make yourself more and more sick and distorted by keeping the lying up.

Every relationship they go through, every love-cycle they go through, makes them sicker and sicker.

After reading her emails and looking at the dates, within minutes of each other she was telling her ex she wants to work things out, flirting with her attorney and telling him he is the only one that cares about her, and telling me she can't wait to see me for her bday.

What seems to be the hardest is remembering how extreme she had to make our time together.  Constantly telling me how I am the best ever.  How she is in love. How she wants my kids.  Etc.

This was also interesting.  After giving her the best valentines day ever, according to her, she called a couple days later telling me she was moving far away to go to rehab. She changed her email, won't have a phone, or way of contact.

I was hurt, but thought it might be true. 

Then two weeks later she emails me on a Sunday morning just saying "help me.  Come get me"

I email back right away and ask what is going on.  I don't get a reply for 3 days.

Then she writes "oh.  Just needed a drink. Haha"

It turns out she actually moved closer to me and never went to rehab. In way she just wanted to dramatically end everything for some reason, but then she contacted me in that odd manner.

She then said she did that because she is scared and too in love and I am too good

One more odd thing.  When I was taking her home in the morning she was saying how she never wants to speak to me again.

But then she says "I have a question".  I said what.  She said "who have you been texting when you look at your phone".  Like that would matter anyway at this point.  She also told me it is me who is not over my ex.

richardson,

Don't get hung up in her words as she has already proven them to be false. The truth is in her actions. It's not readily clear to me, are you still involved with this woman?

Well we spent 7 days in a row together recently, and have been apart for the last week.


I am no longer contacting her.  I know though, if she contacted me soon I would see her.

In the past she was seemingly able to time it perfectly as to when I was totally gone.  Then I would get a call from her.

You are correct, she is timing it perfectly, that isn't your imagination. She is "conditioning" you, if you will, to expect her to be gone and then to return. The length of time increases over time as she knows that when she needs you for whatever reason you will have been "expecting" her to come back. Ask yourself, do you think, after having seen those emails that she's sitting at home contemplating her love for you? No she isn't. She is probably out on dates, seeing her ex, or possibly even sleeping with the lawyer. But rest assured she isn't sitting there thinking of the lovely life you two will build. I got used to my ex's push/pull behavior. All BPD's use it. This time she, after 9.5 years, hasn't come back. I am living in hell, I can tell you that. The first time it happened all those years ago I should have never let her darken my doorstep again. It's a mistake I won't make again.

You deserve better than this. And honestly, since you've read those emails and seen what she is really like, you are allowing yourself to hurt your own self. And what do you prove to her by letting her back in? That it is all right for her to hurt you too. Only you can say no.

richardson,

Think about this when you meet this woman again: if she happens to become pregnant, you will be permanently tied to the chaos and turmoil that you are now experiencing. You will be bringing a child into said insanity. This is not fun and games; this is life.

And do you believe you're "too good"? The only thing we are too good at is being stupid. You have just joined our club if you believe you're as good as she says.

You sound so naive that I'm thinking that when she gets to the devaluation stage you will be crushed beyond belief with her words. As already mentioned, she isn't sitting at home thinking about you in a positive way. Think of the fisherman with ten fishing lines... .if you throw ten in the water you should be able to catch five fish at the same time. You might not eat them all at once but you can at least have them when you want them.

The problem with believing their tripe little excuses, is that they will actually hate you for your  stupidity and resent you for it. Don't think for a second that you are doing her a favor by letting her off the hook for her infractions particularly when she knows that you know she is lying. They don't appreciate these "get out of jail free" cards we give them - they just hate us more for being such easy pushovers.

Run as fast as you can and don't be a schmuck. Learn where your boundaries are and why you must establish and maintain them. Learn why you didn't have the balls to say, "I will not be abused by anybody and this relationship is not right".

Nobody is going to give you an award for sticking with her. At the end when the relationship fails with a Big Bang, you will be blamed for it. She will be off with the next guy and you'll be left trying to pick up the pieces to put your life back together again. Good luck in doing that. Why not quit while you're ahead?

... Can I ask if she has experienced any bad trauma or issues in her childhood at all... ?  I'm gaining information about BPD/ NPD / PTSD And looking back at what makes theses individuals act and think the way they do... .

Thanks

That's an interesting survey topic but why don't you post a new topic instead of hijacking this one? Richardson needs to focus on himself here rather than her and the sad life she has had.  He might get sympathetic to her unsubstantiated sob story and  forget about his own more important needs.

Please start a new topic - I'm sure it will make for some very interesting reading.

I met her right after being divorced. 3 months ago. So I really wasn't looking for anything "serious"

I was, of course, turned on by all the compliments, attention,sex,  professions of love etc.Quite a change from my horrible last year of marriage.

I would have been fine to keep it as casual dating/fwb, but it was her who was talking of love, future, with such intensity, only to then keep disappearing.

I was actually surprised, after reading all of her emails, that their wasnt more... .If she read mine, although i didn't meet anyone, I was chatting on Tinder, POF, other sites etc.

If she didn't involve the "in love with me" so much I wouldn't even think her emails were strange for a single woman.  How many of us start dating a girl and actually see all of her emails and correspondences?

But what i cant deal with is the inconsistency. Every time we parted ways it had to be so dramatic a day later, like another reason she can never see me again.  Then a couple weeks go by and she contacts me, with the "scared" excuse.


I started a thread in the member section asking if most women have some sort of BPD. Thats what messes with my mind... I think every woman i ever dated, including my ex wife, said the "scared" excuse, or acted flaky. I think the BPD just do it ten times as much with more intensity.

What I do not understand is this...

How many  of her feelings are "real"?

As with most of the guys on here, the women they are seeing are extremely convincing...

When together she is constantly touching, smiling, cuddling, etc... I believe, in the moment, those feelings are real. But maybe not?

The problem arises when we part ways (usually after several days together) and she tells me she cant see me anymore, is just distant, or completely disinterested.

Who knows if their feelings are real? You are focusing on the wrong thing here R. You have absolute prof that she was talking to her ex and what she was saying and she was saying inappropriate things to her attorney too. She then lies away the truth of what you saw with your own two eyes. You are one lucky guy in that you have been given absolute proof as to her character. She is playing THREE guys at the same time! Focus on that, not on some feeling, particularly hers which you have no way of knowing except for her telling you. And she lied about the emails, so who is to say she isn't lying about her feelings?

You've been given a get out of jail free card. Not all women are somewhat BPD. That's something you tell yourself. I've never heard of the word in my life till last fall and my exgf who clearly has BPD traits is a therapist! In 9.5 yrs the disorder never came up, and I listened to her tell me about her work and clients most every day.

If  you think  that is the kind of women you are always meeting, then is it possible you may have White knight issues, or esteem issues, things relating to your Family of origin? That you are twisted up by her this early in the dating does not bode well for your future if you stay. But that's just my observation.

I agree. Richardson needs to focus on the manifestations of this relationship. Not on why she goes around treating people like trash. This woman is blatantly marking him as a target!

Richardson,

Those of us that became involved in a relationship w/a BPD affected person have had to figure it all out from scratch. After a few years, I've started putting the pieces together. By the time that I've figured out what's going on though, I've gotten really enmeshed. Which makes it even more difficult to pull out and leave. You've been given a map, right from the start, showing how her clock ticks. Unlike some of us, who have had to put it together s l o w l y, bit by bit. You've got the opportunity to leave before you get as enmeshed as others of us have. I recommend getting a counselor, or going to some sort of group therapy, to help with the struggle.

Yes.  You guys are right.  Sometimes just need to play it out more until I see for myself.  I had the last straw this weekend.

She has been emailing all week for me to being back a sweatshirt she left at my place. She doesn't have a car.

So Saturday am I tell her I can bring it after work Saturday or anytime Sunday.  She says "thanks.  Let me get back to you". I know she has her daughter this weekend.

So Saturday at 5 she asks if I can bring it that night.  I said I can be there at 7.  No reply until 11 pm.  Said she took daughter to doctor.  I wasn't waiting around anyway, but this is how she wastes time.

So Sunday she emails me and says can I bring it, and I said "sure.  I'll be there in an hour"

Once again no reply so I drive over.  About a half hour drive. I arrive and she sends her daughter to the door.  I ask to see her mom.  She goes back and says "she said she is sleeping". I say ok wake her up for a sec.  Daughter comes back and says "my mom says she is sick"

This entire episode really irritated me.  What kind of game is this. 

I emailed her that this was ridiculous and what kind of game is she playing.  Something allng those lines.

She emails me back that she was about to go to the ER, didn't want to get me sick, was so sorry. Didn't check her email. Didn't know I was coming.  Didn't want me to see her sick.  Blah blah blah

This made me really see what type of games and problems she has.  Can turn so completely cold and apparently just wants to waste my time.  No idea.  Or wanted to show how insignificant I am that she won't even answer door?

Look, every bit of that is typical BPD push/pull behavior. Her asking you to bring the sweatshirt? That has nothing to do with the clothing. It has to do with her seeing if you will do it or not. If you bring it, then she sees she still has control over you.

Emailing you a time then not responding for several hours? Not she's sick, she's controlling you. I see it so clearly now. I didn't for 9.5 years. Fortunately my ex didn't play these kinds of games, but we had them for sure.

Here's an answer:'MAIL her the sweatshirt, even if it is cheaper to drop it off! When she calls, and she will, don't answer.

You don't realize it, but you said yourself her compliments to you felt so good after the last year of your marriage. Someone with BPD will know this. They will know that their compliments will make you feel good and you will give anything to keep that coming. I don't know if your wife had BPD or not. But if she didn't and that last year of marriage was bad for you, let me assure you that was a summer picnic compared to ending a relationship with BPD. You don't deserve to go through that again. Tell yourself that, and be glad you got out early.

I know people will say "just move on", and I am, but I am curious as to why she had to set up an exact time for me to come over, JUST TO THEN send her daughter to the door so she wont see me... .


I could have dropped it off anytime if that was going to be the case... I was obviously thinking the entire point to coordinate a time would be so we would see each other. 

Just to show she doesn't care about me?  Just want a reaction?  In a depressed mood?

It has nothing to do with you. She is doing it for  herself. She's not hoping to see you because you make her heart flutter. She is doing it to "hook" you into her life. And if you have started to cut her off, her not being there is obviously her punishing you.

This woman has already lied to you and tried to manipulate her way out of it. There are plenty of resources on this site that explain what happens to a person in a BPD relationship over time. No one can get in and just fool around for a little while and it won't affect you. Go look on the leaving board where so many people were in relationships that lasted only a few months. They're not having a party. They are deeply wounded trying to make sense of what just happened to them.

I don't know if she has BPD, but clearly she is manipulating you and punishing you. That is part a parcel of how BPDs treat a person. It's spring. Plenty of women who are not BPD are looking for someone like you. Dont worry one more minute about this woman. And in four months when you think maybe she's changed or she calls you out of the blue telling you how wonderful she thought you were, run like the wind. That won't be about you either. It will still be about her.

Ahh thank you... She knows I have my son every other weekend, and this was my free weekend.

In the past, she would say "Lets do something Friday... Call me at 9" Then say she was sick... .Effectively ruining my night... But begging to to something the next night... Next day call her at 7, and she wants to go out... Tells me call her in an hour... .Then not answer... .

So, with returning the sweatshirt, she tried again... First telling me on Saturday she isn't sure if I can bring it over... Then at 5:30 saying "bring it tonight"... .Then when I tell her I will drop it at 7, she doesn't reply until 11... Which i did not reply to... .So she is assuming I am out with someone else.

So, as she is also extremely jealous, that probably was her way of "punishing me" the following day... Setting up a time to meet,repeatedly asking for this sweatshirt, then not answering the door... .Sending her daughter... .

Makes more sense now...

Hi richardson.  I can relate to you here.  Mine was "constantly touching, smiling, cuddling, etc... ", too.  Full on love bombing!  It's unbelievable how many similarities we can all share with these BPD people and relationships. 

One other thing I notice that i am not sure is BPD or not, but it driove me crazy... Basically changing her mind several times a day about what her and I are doing together... BF/GF? Nothing? Friends? FWB? Together forever?

Example... .

We hung out for 4 days on her BDAY weekend... During this time she asked if she could stay with me, as she cant stand her roommate who is making moves on her, she cant stand her parents, and she just needs a good man like me that she loves so much...

Then this idea changed and she asked me to take her home Sunday night. She asked if we could have a playdate the next weekend with our kids etc. That was cool with me... Seemed normal...

Sunday night came, and she asked to spend the night... Take her home Monday am... This was fine... Monday am comes and she doesnt want to wake up, and I have to go to work... She asks me if her daughter can stay with us that night whom she can get from her ex... .I say that is fine...

During the day she calls to tell me she wants to leave, but cant get a ride... Can I take her home when i get home... I say fine...

I get home and she wants to stay the night again... .

I go to work Tuesday, get home, and her daughter is at my house... I am surprised, but to be honest do not mind... She asks me to take them home...   A few minutes later she asks me to stay the night...

This cycle repeats over and over for the next day and a half... She is staying... She is leaving... A cab will get her... Can I take her...   Can she stay for the weekend...   It was driving me insane...

And of course, when she leaves, it has to be with the dramatic "never talk to me again"...

At the end it was turned into "I cant read you... So I am leaving", as though it was me who was doing all of this... Like i did something wrong...

This a psychological definition of the word "manipulation." Do you recognize anything in it?

manipulation: "Manipulation is a way to covertly influence someone with indirect, deceptive, or abusive tactics. Manipulation may seem benign or even friendly or flattering, as if the person has your highest concern in mind, but in reality it’s to achieve an ulterior motive."

This is probably the hard part for many guys when dealing with a BPD type.

Below would describe my case, but others seem to be the same.

A.  The manipulation does not seem to have the traditional goals of manipulation.  Money, dates, gifts, etc.  It seems they are manipulating "to be loved" then will run from it which hurts far more. She would spend a lot of money on me. Never cared "who paid" for the date etc. Was actually happy to just stay in and hang out.

B. she was the typical "poor me".  Bad "luck". Bad decisions.  If she just had "love" and with A "good man" things would improve.

C. So it's sort of like being manipulated simply to be loved.  Then destroying it. It's being good at manipulation, but also horrible at it as it isn't even needed and then end goal isn't reached.

I mean many women who end up marrying millionaires for money are not BPD.  It also seems so many BPD manipulate but are alwAys lost and in chaos.

The ulterior motive doesn't have to be material things. She is clearly looking for someone to latch onto to soothe her abandonment issues. When they are the ones pushing away, it doesn't even remotely look that way. The things you cant see behind their actions is really the insidious part of this disorder.

Hi richardson.  The confusion you have been experiencing from her is classic pull and push of BPD.  She pulls you in because she wants to be intimate (close) to you and then she pushes you away for fear of being too intimate (close) with you.  Running away is often the next stage.  Her attacking "dramatics" and blaming you is her own projection issues towards you.  

It's good for you to put this all in perspective to understand that this really isn't about you or what you are doing wrong, as much as it is about her and her own unresolved issues.  Many BPD people have unresolved issues from being previously abused which is then projected onto others.        

yes, this is the second time she "ran away" within 2 months...

I do not think she will contact me again, as i actually read her emails, so there is no way she can really spin it, and does feel shame.

Another thing I notice is that it is hard to tell what is real, exaggerations, or completely made up... Was she abused? Were her exes abusive? Does she have all these medical conditions? What exactly is she on?

They are seductive as everything about me was so "perfect" to her... But at the end of the day so much of it is just words. I remember her asking to have my children... .if I would love her daughter... if I would be with her forever... .Then to just disappear and never be heard from again...   just bizarre.

Hi richardson.  However it is sliced and diced, one can only conclude that she is really messed up.  It is all beyond bizarre and hard to process. 

i thought this was interesting.  It has been about a month since things ended pretty badly. We havent talked. Never thought I would hear from her again.

She recently emailed asking how my son and I are etc, I emailed back, we joked a bit... .

Then she emails me asking if I want to have a drink with her... .  I asked where she was staying, etc... . She then emails me that she wants to go out on the town, down to the city though... . It was 8 on a week night. So, it wasn't really to see me, but more or less someone to take her to party.


I told her I had to work the next day, can't be out all night etc... . She just replied with "ok"


Now previously she just wanted to see me, come to my house, hang out etc... .I thought it was odd that now, after a month, she asks to see me, but ONLY if I can take her clubbing... . There was no other thought that occurred to her like "Well, lets just stay in then", or "Well, lets do something else... ." 

More or less like I was just a cab/drink buyer, and if i wasn't up for that, well then there would be no point to see me.

This is classic BPD behavior. The disappearing then reappearing as if everything is all right and nothing ever happened before. I hope you don't plan to give in to her should she come calling again. It is clear that she has some of the characteristics of BPD. What you describe is what many posters on these board have described. It's like the pwBPD goes down their "list" of people who they have had emotional attachments to. When they get a "hit" then that person is now their most favorite. You didn't do what she wanted, she moved on to the next person on her list. She didn't want to spend a quiet evening with YOU. She wanted to go downtown. You didn't give her that, she found someone else. The best thing you could do for yourself is to ignore her when she calls. It won't lead to happily ever after in any sense of the phrase.

Also, it might be helpful to reread the posts on your thread here from the last month. Virtually every one of them identifies what she is doing to "hook" you. I think in one it was even mentioned how she would behave if she called after a length of time. She is till trying to play you. I know that may make your ego feel good, but don't let it,hook into that part of you. Her actions are for her, not you.

And she knew to hang out I would have to drive to get her.  Half hour there and back.  Then cab ride downtown, 60 each way, then work the next day.

She also NEVER was able to make a plan ahead of time.  It was always her calling / emailing me last minute. 8,9, 10 pm. Then once with me she would stay for days and not want to leave until she absolutely had to, at which point she would make a drama as to why she can't see me anymore.

It makes me see the selfishness.  No shame in seeing me again IF I can take her downtown clubbing.  No other reason to see me.  And we are basically past the clubbing age, both single parents. 

I think how a prostitute might talk a guy up for money, people like her use the "love" talk so they are not alone when they want company or to get their way.

Yeah, you dodged the bullet.

Just wanted to give an update to those who have helped and maybe this will shed some light on how they behave for others.

I have been dating others and totally over her.

She called again asking to go out, but I had my son that day. She told me it was the only day she can go out for next 3 months (lie) and was sad. 

She then called the next week and asked if I could help her move back to her moms.  Just a box or two. I said I could not as I had my son again. She then called back a couple of times thinking of a scenario in which I could help her that night. I told her I would call her back in 5 minutes.  My son actually wanted to help her as well, so I called her back and said I would do her this favor. 

I call back and no answer.  I text.  No return text. I call again and she says "oh.  I will just lay down.   Can you help me tomorrow instead?  When should I call you?"

I said sure.  Call anytime.

Never heard from her again.

Just odd how she needed help in such a hurry, then totally changed her mind in five minutes. Was it just to see if I would help? 

I think she wanted to be the one to reject you. The emotional maturity. Good to hear you are dating again! Good for you

You never know for sure. But since you are dating other women do you notice this kind of behavior in anyone else you've been out with?

1. I think that is how they try to see if they can control you. They call you to see if you still respond to their request, once you respond (then they know you are hooked) then the game begins. Now they are playing the no show game, just to show you that you probably need her more than she needs you.

BY the way, I saw these similar behaviors with my xBPDgf.

Am glad you are out of the web.