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On my phone so please excuse any mistakes.

So today my SO was supposed to meet with an attorney.

I looked her up.

She is a bankruptcy attorney.

On Memorial Day 2013 or 2014 my pwBPD had told me he was going to withdraw his divorce and file for bankruptcy.

In September 2015 I found out no divorce had been filed.

I pointed this out to my pwBPD and he got extremely defensive and told me he had asked me to find a lawyer for him. Both my dad and I had told him to call up the bar association. I called my dad and verified with him this was a good plan of action.

I told my dad I didn't know why my pwBPD was acting this way when my dad told me my pwBPD knows what to do.

So is this poor executive control on his part?

He canceled the appointment with the bankruptcy attorney and said I had to find him an attorney I liked.

I would define poor executive control in terms of his ability to handle cognitive and emotional regulation. Stretching it quite a bit, perhaps this might qualify under poor cognition.

However, I believe you said that he had filed for divorce and then withdrew the filing. Did he use a bankruptcy lawyer to file his previous divorce petition?

In any case, it is so NOT your responsibility to find him a lawyer that is acceptable to you. This is a precursor to blame-shifting.

He hasn't really done anything to advance the divorce, has he?

I forgot who he used to file the first time he said he was filing for  divorce in this marriage but there was no record of that filing in the court system .

Blame shifting, I don't know that term.

He just accused me of breaking up with him because I established this boundary with him.

This is the second time he is divorcing this woman, this is actually his second marriage to her.

I told him my dads suggestion to either call the bar or use the lawyer he used the first time he divorced her and he said it was my job to find him a divorce lawyer I approved of.

I'm going to try to stand my ground. Previously I've not been able to but I think I'm ready to now.

What lesson would blame shifting fall under?

Hi Unicorn,

blame shifting is an abusive tactic to avoid taking responsibility.   it often comes in the form of,  if you hadn't done X I wouldn't have done Y.    If you hadn't made me so mad I wouldn't have hit you.   

'ducks

Thank you ducks, I'm reading skips article on the detachment board  https://bpdfamily.org/2010/12/leaving-person-with-borderline_28.html?m=1  (https://bpdfamily.org/2010/12/leaving-person-with-borderline_28.html?m=1)

I'm very confused right now.

My pwBPD is telling me it me my job to choose a lawyer for him.

I know it's not.

He is claiming I complain about the lawyers he is choosing.

All I said to him this morning was his attorney was a bankruptcy attorney and he told me he wasn't filing for bankruptcy , canceled the appointment and told me it was my job to find him a lawyer I approved of. I told him to call the bar association and ask for a referral to a divorce lawyer and let me know when he had done this. He's refusing to do that and insisting I call the bar for him.

I don't know what to do.

Hi unicorn2014

I have been reading your posts and keeping up on your situation. I can see that it is causing you a lot of distress. I am sorry you have so much to deal with.

Excuse me for being blunt- I don't intend to be hurtful in any way, but why do you want to make things work with this guy? He's married to someone else. As far as I can gather he has taken no steps to fix that, and even when he does, why do you want him? It seems like it's been years and years of trouble. Daily drama. Do you imagine life with him will be peaceful once you are married? I understand you goal is to get him to actually file, and you are trying to assert a boundary on that. But what then? What are you going to do once you "win" him?

And you have a 15 year old daughter, right? How would you feel if she was in a situation like this? Is this the example you want to model for her?

Once again- I don't mean to be hurtful. But for your 15 year old daughter I think the best thing you could give her is a stable, peaceful environment to mature in. That's what so many of us on this board didn't have. And it's drama all the time now. Marrying this guy isn't going to fix that.

This is brinksmanship.  He keeps moving the bar and setting it higher and farther away.   It seems very unlikely that engaging will get you any positive results.

Hi daughter and, my daughter does have a peaceful and stable environment. I have already taught my daughter what to look for in a guy so she will not end up divorced like me. This isn't about her. My pwBPD wants to marry me and in order for him to do that he has to divorce his wife. I'm giving him an opportunity to do that. If I decide to leave in the future I will move over to the leaving board.

Baby ducks when you say engaging what do you mean? I have told him what I expect him to do, to call the bar and ask for a referral to a divorce lawyer, and to call me when he's done that. I haven't said anything to him since. I assume you mean saying anything other then what I've already said to him. Is this correct?

Hi Unicorn


Is your currently married pwBPD who you have mentioned deceived you what you want to teach her to look for in a guy?

And I didn't mean that you aren't providing a stable peaceful environment for her at home, I apologize if it sounded that way. But many of your posts highlight erratic, drama filled behavior from your pwBPD. If and when he does get divorced and marry you, will the home environment be peaceful for her once he lives with you?

I think perhaps his executive control is just fine.

I wonder if he doesn't actually want to or plan to go though a divorce so his actions make perfect sense.  He is manipulating you and blaming you to distract from his dishonesty and never-ending delays.

Daughter and mom he will not be moving in with my d and I.  

Right now I'm trying to focus on him calling the bar and asking for a referral to a divorce lawyer.

I'm also trying to learn more about brinksmanship .

My daughter knows that I have set a boundary with my pwBPD. I think it's good that I have now taught her to do this as she will need this skill herself. My mother did not teach this to me. I am also potentially the daughter of a BPD mother. I am currently reading understanding the borderline mother and posting about it on the coping board. You're welcome to join me over there to discuss that.

Adventurer I will take you what are you saying into consideration. This is like going back to square one for me. I thought I knew everything there was to know about BPD but apparently I didn't.

I'm really not sure what to do here.

Thank you for your input.

correct.    I would suggest you consider walking away from the conversations now.   you have delivered your thoughts.     

Ok thank you baby ducks. He just texted me this, the first paragraph is a copy and paste of mine and the second is his, I deleted the county name for anonymity.


I have not replied.

I am aware that he is trying to manipulate me.

Gack!

You don't want to be involved with his divorce or any of his lawyers in any way.

I'd suggest you tell him this.

It isn't your job to get him divorced. In fact, if you get involved you are stepping a toe across the line to working achively to end a mans marriage. Something that I doubt is consistent with your values.

Unicorn, hi.  I posted about this on your other thread and also PM'd you.  THIS IS NOT THE BOUNDARY YOU SET A FEW WEEKS BACK.  He told you shortly after you set that boundary that he HAD spoken to a lawyer, said she should expect a call from you, etc., or that he would tell her she should expect a call from you to confirm that he was setting a divorce in motion.  He resented it, he felt humiliated, etc., but he was going to give you the name of that lawyer.

The idea that it is Dec 29 and he does not even have the name of a family law attorney is his attempt to redefine the boundary.  If you let him, I'd guess you'll have a very hard time getting him to believe you mean what you say in the future.  If you told him today that all you expect by the end of the year is that he call the bar association and get the name of a lawyer,  you have bargained down your own boundary to near nothing-ness.

As I noted on the other thread, it seems to me the time has come to remind him that the expectation you had for staying in the relationship was that he have taken concrete steps toward divorce -- that you would have been able to independently confirm at this point.  I recall you discussing that with him and with us -- that he only had a few weeks but with effort that should be do-able.  Well, he squandered those few weeks and apparently did nothing. If you don't enforce the boundary you set, you're going to have a credibility problem going forward, and no clear lines or markers anymore for what you are expecting.

He is calling your bluff.  :)id you mean it?  Then don't erode or shift it backwards.

 

Patient and clear, I responded on my other thread and privately as well.

He has met with a couple of lawyers over the past couple of months but they have not been divorce attorneys.

The attorney he met with twice last week and was going to meet with a third time yesterday was a bankruptcy attorney.

When I pointed this out to him he canceled the appointment and told me to pick a lawyer for him. I refused to do that and told him he needed to call the bar and ask for a referral to a family lawyer.

I think he is scared.

I don't know if you know the back story or not but a year or two ago but he said his wife threatened to sue him for all he had so he withdrew his divorce to file for a bankruptcy. After a year or two of this I told him I could not continue on like this and that I needed him to refile his divorce. So yesterday when I pointed out to him that the attorney he had been seeing was a bankruptcy attorney he dropped that person like a hot potato, insisting that he was not filing for bankruptcy. When I had asked him what kind of law she practiced he said he didn't know, so I looked her up myself.

I don't know how his brain works, that's why I started this thread. When I was talking to my dad on the phone yesterday I was telling him I did not know why my partner acted the way he did, which was the truth.

I don't have a problem helping him pick a divorce lawyer if he provides me with names to look at.

As I said before I think his is a high stakes divorce and I can understand if he feels a bit anxious. I certainly would not have made the same choices he made if I were in his situation. As I've said many times I got out of my own marriage before something like this could happen to me.

My concern is that you are moving your boundary when he flagrantly did not meet the one you set earlier.

I'm also thinking about how you toughed it out with your other irritations and annoyances in the last week because you wanted to see if he would address their root cause -- the non-progress toward divorce.  Well, he didn't -- which leaves you right back in the thicket of all those other cruddy feelings you were going to get back to after you saw what he did about this divorce issue.  What's the stopping point for that?

No doubt he is scared or avoidant about this divorce for some reason.  He is finding new ways to avoid the thing, by all this skirmishing about the selection of a lawyer.  If he can keep that going, he surely will.  But you will then be stuck indefinitely in the situation that led you to post the various side threads about things he was doing to assert an ongoing relationship that were bothering you.  What will be the terms of going forward, if you are not clear about the boundary and it is not clearly ascertained whether he met it?

Patient and clear I am actually at peace tonight.

If he actually does call the bar in the morning and give me three names of family law attorneys he wants me to look at then he will have met my requirement. I had asked him to call the bar before, but he refused, saying he didn't operate that way.

He and I did not facetime tonight, and had very limited contact on the phone.

The two threads were about two different behaviors, dealing with how I feel when I find out he hasn't been eating, and then yesterday's thread where he told me I had to call the bar for him. He reminded me of my D15 when he did that. I do have compassion for him when he's acting emotionally immature. I have a lot more sympathy for that then I do for his irrational behavior around not eating when he doesn't feel safe. That I have no patience for. That to me is a symptom of a mental illness that needs to be treated, but that's my other thread.  :) :) :)

Hi unicorn,

This doesn't look like poor executive control to me either. I'm with adventurer who says:


In an earlier post, you said:


It seems to me that his wife sueing him for 'all he had' and him filing for a bankruptcy are mutually exclusive and there is something wrong in the story he is telling you. If this is a high stakes divorce, he'd have too much for bankruptcy.

My apologies, because I suspect this could hurt, but have you considered the possibility that he is still in a primary relationship with his wife and you are the back-up supply? It's not a nice thought, but it's a possibility.

What would happen if you just drop the divorce issue and watch? My BPDxbf was still married when we got together and so was I. I instituted my divorce which came through in 9 months. At that point, he hadn't progressed his divorce at all. We nearly got into the kind of stand-off that you seem to have got into with your pwBPD. I cared greatly that he was still married. I pushed him to see solicitors and he'd make appointments and then cancel them an hour beforehand, saying he was too ill to go or he'd lose his daughter if he asked his wife for a divorce. Eventually, I suggested we shouldn't see each other until he filed for his divorce. He dysregulated saying I was controlling him by saying he had to get divorced to see me.

At that point, I choose to step back and see what happened. I dropped the issue having decided upon my boundary (for myself and without telling him) that there was no way I would ever move in with him until he was divorced. It brought me peace because I knew I'd never have to fight with him under my own roof to have him be 'mine' and not 'hers'. My BPDbf never took any further action to file for divorce. He's still married but separated.

If you step back and watch as I did, you may just find that he conjures up other things to argue about instead. Mine did. It's the arguments that keep the relationship from becoming too close, if you ask me. The arguments prevent engulfment. Those arguments eventually led to the demise of my relationship. I realise that your relationship is long distance so you may feel pressure to settle the issue, but it is in his power to move to be close to you if he wants to. Marriage doesn't have to be the first step. Indeed, I think time spent with each other prior to marriage is time well invested. The longing involved in long distance relationships produces a false indication of love which suggests sustainability that isn't really there.


Love Lifewriter

  Unicorn, I did a quick scan of your posts to get caught up.    Bars (boundaries) have been set and moved a lot.  Very confusing.  Boundaries only work with consistency.    What is being posted about now bears little resemblance to the end of the year boundary set a few weeks ago.  That being said, I think taking a bigger picture look at things shows a continued negative trend in your relationship.  The redefining of the end of the year boundary is just a symptom of the negative (toxic) stuff that continues to build in your relationship.  I'm concerned about the shifting issues and strategies to deal with them.  Stepping away (getting space) will help.  I'm rooting for you to take action for you and to consistently do so.    

FF  

Life writer I hear you and no he's not in a relationship with his wife. I will make him put some effort into choosing a divorce lawyer and not just give me three names to choose from.

FF I do not have the energy to play Russian roulette with this man. I also don't want to be held responsible for his behavior.

Life write I asked him not to move out here until he got divorced.

I don't feel any longing.

I feel major frustration.

   This is an example of the Toxic behavior and the thinking that drives it coming from your side of the relationship.    Your desire for him to be divorced and to be able to focus on you is natural desire.  Fine thing for you to want.    As you work through trying to set your boundaries, it is critical that you set them on yourself as well.    He gets to own his actions and should not be "pushing" you to do things.  Same for you.  The only person you can make do things is you.    

FF

That's fine.

He  sent me a list of three divorce lawyers at 7:30am his time and told me to pick one.

He hasn't responded since.

I'm not interested in picking one.

That's his job.

He was talking to me like I was a business associate.

I am not happy.

So how do I hold my boundary in a BIFF way?

Unicorn - you know this stuff.    BIFF,  You are the person who needs to make this decision.   I will be interested to hear who you picked.

 Unicorn, We are all rooting for you.  We are also rooting for your relationship to work out.  I saw lots of encouragement and good advice as I scanned your threads when I was catching up.  It's been a while since I've talked about good, better, best.  BI  

FF is a better response, and if you are focused on just this one interaction it is likely the best response.  My encouragement to you is to try to "back up" and not focus on each interaction but to look at the relationship as a whole.  When I look at that I see pain and hurt everywhere.  I see two people still dishing this out to each other.    Space is what is needed to help  both sides heal from this.   I'm convinced that is the "best" response to the numerous issues that you have brought to the boards.  Can you help us understand the avoidance of taking space to heal?     

FF

Yes form flier I understand.

Him throwing me a list of lawyers and not responding to me since is not taking space, that's the silent treatment and that's a deal breaker. My dad does this that, my child's dad does that, I will not tolerate that.

Since my SO is ignoring me I think I'm going to turn off location sharing and take him off my calendars.

I have had enough.

He's taking his space, apparently, although he said he's working on a project. He said he would be available to "take and receive calls" until 7pm my time.

The way he is talking to me today is really irritating me.

I feel like he is winning right now and he is the one who is married, not me.

He is the one with the untreated personality disorder, not me.

I just don't understand.

Didn't you agree last night that he should send you two names (and then it became three) and you'd pick one? I don't remember which thread it was in and can't find it now, but I seem to remember you writing to us that you were fine with helping him pick one because at least that would mean he put in the effort of calling the bar like you asked. Did you communicate that to him as well?

Yesterday your boundary was no talking until he calls the bar and gets a referral for a divorce lawyer. You did a good job of enforcing that by refusing to Facetime with him last night. This morning he called the bar and got referrals for divorce lawyers. That's a success!  |iiii

But now I'm worrying that it's devolved into more squabbling. It might be the right thing for you to pick a certain amount of progress toward the divorce and hold the boundary of no contact until he reaches that point. But you can't keep moving the target farther and telling him you still don't want to talk to him until he does this other thing. It would be terribly frustrating for him to first hear "don't talk to me until you call the bar and get the name of a lawyer," he wakes up early and does exactly that, you agree to help him pick one and then change your mind, and now it's "don't talk to me until you've picked a lawyer" (or signed a retainer? I don't remember). Do you see how that could be frustrating to him?

I also think you should focus more on removing your contribution to the high level of conflict, specifically the pecking away at little things. Turning off the location sharing and calendar would probably be helpful if it were connected with stating a clear, firm boundary. But in the current atmosphere of inconsistency and frustration on both sides, it seems more like another little thing that increases the level of conflict and drama. And I personally believe the location and calendar sharing is way inappropriate and should never have happened in the first place. Just not sure now is the right time to turn it off.

It seems like you have a lot to figure out, about what you're willing to radically accept and what you aren't, where do you want to set the bar for his divorce progress, and what are you willing to do if he doesn't meet that standard. And especially, how can you lower the temperature in the relationship, do your part to resolve problems in a low-drama way, and not feed extra conflict. Even if he retains an attorney tomorrow, this divorce could take years.

Do you think you could take some time--maybe a few days or a week--to think about all of this? No talk with him about divorce or the nature or status of your relationship, no little jabs like turning off location etc, just time for you to think and process.

This again, it was his choice to send me three, not mine. He sent me a business text this morning with three names, no I love you, wishing me a good day in the city with my family (didn't make it), and hasn't talked to me since. I'm really mad at him. I feel like he's giving me the silent treatment now. He hasn't responded to my texts or my calls, and its been over 6 hours.

He just threw three names at me and asked me to pick one.

I am not ok with that.

I'm supposed to pick his lawyer while he's working on his project?

I don't think so.

I need him to show me that this divorce is a priority to him.

He's not treating it like a priority at all.

I know that is what people have been telling me.

I'm really mad that he's giving me the silent treatment right now.

That is a deal breaker for me.

I feel like the one with the personality disorder right now because I'm all upset and he's just doing his own thing. That's not right. I can't talk with him if he's ignoring me.

What does "a deal breaker for me" mean?

What could he do to show you that the divorce is a priority to him?

Do you have a concrete benchmark for showing that the divorce is a priority, or does it depend on how his communications make you feel? Yesterday you asked him to call the bar and get lawyers' names, and he did exactly that. I'm wondering if you would have been more satisfied if he'd said I love you or wished you a good day. I'm also confused that calling you Sugar Boo is allowed, sweetie is not, and I love you is required.

Did you say anything to him last night about his plan to send you two lawyers' names and have you pick? I found the old post:


I know the silent treatment hurts, but here it could be a blessing in disguise. What do you think about refraining from all relationship-and-divorce talk for him for a few days or so, while you process and plan?

I think user thisagain has a good suggestion, some sort of break where you can cool down and think about all this stuff carefully and free from the usual daily strife.  I know the boundaries have been moved a bit but you wrote earlier... .


and now you write


so I'm not sure if the waters are just getting too muddied and a break would help, or if I'm missing something here.

Perhaps tell him you approve of them all, so he can pick the one that works best for him?  Then decide what you want the next steps to entail.

This again, I don't allow or not allow him to call me sugar boo or sweetie, that's his choice, but today he called me nothing, didn't say I love you, just wished me a good day in the city with my family, which I didn't even make. Now he's ignoring me. He's definitely triggered my adult child feeling of abandonment.

I picked a lawyer for him and he still hasn't responded. He's been ignoring me since he sent his text at  7:30am this morning (I've been trying to reach him since 11:30am), after he told me he'd be available from 9am to 10pm.

I don't know what his problem is.

To use his language, I feel like I'm being jerked around.

Yes, I expect him to tell him he loves me, not call me sweetie, not call me sugar boo, but if he doesn't love me, none of this is worth it. If I want a business associate, I'll go to the employment center.

I'm feeling hurt, angry, lonely, confused.

I'm trying to work my ACA 7th step around this because my father also ignored me this morning which I suppose I should post about on the coping board, even though he has narcissistic traits and not borderline traits.

I'm in a world of pain this afternoon.

I wasn't prepared for this. He's caught me off guard and I feel like a mess.

Adventurer, he is totally ignoring me now. Here I'll post his text without the lawyer names.


I have heard nothing from him since getting this text, he hasn't answered his phone. I feel like an idiot.

   Unicorn, You know the answer to this.  You are posting on a board to discuss his problem.  It's BPD.    Do you see the pattern where you are both inflicting pain on each other?  Critical you consider and directly answer this question.    

FF

Formflier, he's ignoring me today, and I need his help. My dad's ignoring me, the owner of the gym my daughter's going to is being mean to me. I really need his help right now and he's not there for me. He's the one who's hurting me right now. You read his text. He said he would be available to receive calls between 9am and 10pm and I've been trying to reach him since 11:30am. Its now 3pm.

Yes, I know his problem is BPD, and he totally denies he has a problem, he thinks he's fine.

Yes I turned off location sharing.

I hid his calendars on my calendar.

I don't know what else to do.

I don't think I have what it takes to be in a relationship with a person with BPD. I'm not that strong.

I just broke down in tears in front of my daughter because of all the problems I'm having today.

I'm trying really hard to keep it together myself.

My partner gets offended when I call the parental talk line for help or my dad and my brother for help and says I don't need his help.

He's all but abandoned me today because he thinks I went to the city with my daughter to meet my dad but that didn't work out. He doesn't know that. He doesn't know my dad is ignoring me.

I'm just shaking my head.

I'm trying to paint and I might go to my  gym later, in case you or any one asks what am I doing today to take care of myself. I'm also planning on going to a meeting tonight. I ate a nutritious breakfast. I'm trying to encourage my daughter to go to the gym but she's just lying in bed. She alternates between wanting to be left alone to wanting to go out and I'm trying to be supportive to her while maintaining boundaries.

Remember a couple of months ago when she got in trouble with the  sheriff for smoking marijuana? Well, her gym is in that city, so I'm having to set really firm boundaries with her. I can't post about her on the parenting board because she refuses to see a counselor, and has for 3 years. I don't know if her problems are normal teenage problems or if there is something else going on. I have gone to meetings for parents of kids with drug problems, so yeah there's something going on with her too.

As you can see I'm having a heap of problems today.

I'm not good at the BIFF response.

Baby ducks says I know what to do but I don't.

I'm an adult child.

I think I need to post on the coping board about what happened with my dad today.

So, I don't have a partner right now.

Do you see the dynamic in your relationship where you are both inflicting pain on each other?  

Formflier, he is ignoring me after telling me he would be available. I am not hurting him. He is hurting me. He assumed I was with my daughter and my father in the city.

Tell me, how am I hurting him?

I am willing to listen.

My opinions of your hurtful behaviours does not matter.  The critical thing is for you to take time to consider your behavior from his perspective and how that behavior could be hurtful.  What have you done or said in the last 24 hours that he could be hurt by?  Same question but for a longer timeframe.    

FF

Sure form flier, he thinks I "blew him off yesterday" and therefore that justified him ignoring me for 5 hours while I was dealing with a crisis with my dad and my daughter.

So since he thinks I hurt him he can hurt me in return.

However you and I both know I did not "blow him off" yesterday.

Yesterday I was trying to uphold my boundary.

Is it any wonder why it is so hard to uphold my boundaries?

I uphold my boundary for one day and I get accused of blowing him off.

Then the next day I'm greeted with silence from 7:30am to 4:30pm.

I don't know if I have what it takes to be in a relationship like this.

   Do you believe that since he has hurt you you can hurt him in return?    

FF

Of course not, but I didn't hurt him today or yesterday. He thinks that I broke up with him yesterday. Grey Kitty said I didn't have tell him I didn't break up with him. He thinks his thoughts and feelings are in order today because he thinks he was responding to what I was saying to him yesterday.

I don't know how to deal with that.

I don't know how to deal with a disordered person who thinks they're ordered.

I don't know how to deal with a disordered person who projects their disorder on me.

I'm not that strong, I don't have that good boundaries.

I lost control today, I got furious with him for ignoring me for 5 hours and he justified it saying that he didn't think I wanted to talk to him after what I said to him yesterday.

I don't have the energy for this kind of relationship.

   I understand you may not be intentionally plotting and thinking of ways to hurt him.  Rest assured you are doing lots of things that are hurtful to him and the future of your r/s.  Rest assured that we understand that he is doing lots of things that are hurtful to you (no need to explain any more, we get this)  Are you interested in focusing on your behavior and choices you can make to improve your r/s and stop sending hurt his way?  I understand you don't believe you are sending hurt his way or as much hurt as many on these boards think you are sending.    

FF  

Yes I am interested in focusing on my behavior and choices I can make to improve my relationship because it is untenable to me right now. He is convinced that he acted correctly to me today based on what I said to him yesterday. He is basing his behavior towards me on my behavior towards him. Problem is he is misinterpreting my behavior but he is convinced he is not. So tell me how do I work with that?

I allowed him to get into an argument with me about his behavior without dealing with the matter at hand:

He sent me three names of lawyers.

He didn't check his text messages before the end of the business day.

You saw his text, he said he would call the one I picked.

So you tell me, what do I do here?

I'm at a loss.

Unicorn, for what it's worth, I thought his text this am was respectful and honored your previously-stated boundaries. It sounded like he was taking seriously what you've asked for (I would not put too much weight on that and again, I think your own boundaries have shifted so he is meeting a lower threshold than you specified a few weeks back.) But. To me, that text was unobjectionable.

It almost feels to me like ANYTHING he does is going to hurt/upset you at this point, because he's globally been so deceptive and slippery and that hurts you a great deal. So, as has been discussed in your other recent threads, your resentment of that seeps out even when in the instant, he's not really doing anything offensive, or is even being (without a small frame, not factoring in the deception), kind, warm and appropriate.

If that's correct, it's not that your feelings are wrong! It's that they need a place to go and be processed and become clear without thrashing your partner daily as you decide what it all means.

You know I think he is NOT meeting your boundary as previously announced. I am NOT advocating for just proceeding as if all is well. But I suspect the core problem is that he has not met and still is not meeting your boundary--but you (understandably!) don't want to take the step that that would indicate.

   What is the most consistent advice you have been given about what you can do to reduce toxicity and give your r/s a chance?  As I scanned your threads while catching up, the advice has been consistent for a while now.  Please don't think about advice about todays issue, or yesterdays misunderstanding, or the hang up that happened a day or two before that.  The advice is broad advice about something you totally control.    

FF

Patient and clear wrote


Right, but then he didn't check his text messages until after the end of the business day so his message was null, it meant nothing. I told him he call the lawyer first thing in the morning and get back to me.


Yes I told him he has one more day to get this straight and I told him to call the lawyer in the morning and then call me. So he did that strategy of raising the bar and said he would call me after he met with the lawyer. Now, tomorrow is new year's eve, how likely is it that he's going to be able to meet with the lawyer tomorrow?

I asked him to do a simple thing, call the lawyer in the morning, and then call me. He refuses to do that. He wants to have things his way.

So, I need to get used to the fact that I don't have a partner right now.

I think form flier said to not depend on people with disorders.

Form flier my partner said he would call me after he meets with a lawyer. I asked him to call me after he called the lawyer. I will lose this battle to win the war. He can have his way. I will take a step backward.

I agree with this and am quoting it all in hopes you'll read it all again :) His text this morning was respectful, exactly what you asked for last night (send you names of lawyers for you to pick one), and probably consistent with the BIFF tone that you'd been using with him yesterday.

He did exactly what you wanted. In the big picture, him identifying options for divorce lawyers is a pretty great step. He didn't dysregulate over your boundary last night, he did exactly what you asked, and he informed you of it in a respectful manner. And then you were upset that he didn't say I love you, or didn't check his phone for a few hours. Do you see what we mean about how your overall resentment is making you overly reactive to little things?

And it's hard to tell from only his side of the conversation, but I didn't even think his messages last night were that bad. Sure, he shouldn't have accused you of holding the relationship hostage or breaking up with him, and he should have realized it's his own job to pick his own divorce lawyer. But like I said yesterday, it's not too surprising when you consider the history of high conflict, squabbling and poor boundaries.

A few times yesterday and today I've pointed something out to you and asked if you understand why he could be feeling frustrated. I don't recall you responding to any of those. I know you don't feel like understanding his feelings right now, and I get it. We've all been there. But the kind, low-conflict thing to do when you're unable to understand and validate his feelings is to take a break, get some space, take some time for yourself. You can't be in an active, talking-every-day relationship with someone who you don't want to validate or empathize with.

   If you don't win any battles you will loose the war.  If you don't change the dynamic in your r/s, the r/s will die of the weight of hurt that has built up.  He has once again backed you down from your boundary.  This is your choice.    When you are ready to make different choices and hold to those choices, your r/s may survive.  I understand you are hurting,  , I'm very concerned for you that you are repeating bad choices.    

FF

This again wrote


Did you read his text to me today?

Form flier he is bullying me.

I am trying to stand my ground.

What do you suggest I do?

   Again, back to the question of the most consistent advice you have been given over the past month or so.  What is that advice.    

FF

When did you ask him to call the lawyer in the morning? My recollection of what you two ended up agreeing on last night, was that he would call the bar in the morning, get names of lawyers, send you the names and you'll pick one. As far as I can tell, he did exactly what you asked. I did read the text today and agree with Patientandclear that it seemed respectful and not objectionable.

If you're upset with yourself for lowering the bar so much, when you had previously wanted him to file by the end of the year and now he hasn't even retained a lawyer, that's another issue. I know it's really hurtful that you're in this situation, and it's really frustrating that you can't just ask him to get a divorce and trust him to follow through. But you did express to him that you'd be fine with him calling the bar this morning and sending you two names of lawyers. And it sounds like he did that.

I can't tell whether you picked a lawyer but it seems like one of you did, and now you're telling him not to call until after he calls the lawyer. That sounds an awful lot like the "brinksmanship" you wanted to avoid. You can't be threatening or going NC to enforce him taking every single little step of the divorce process. There could be a lot of steps to the divorce. It could take years. That's why I really think you need to focus on the long-term, big-picture ways that you can reduce the strain on you.

Do you see how the moving targets could be confusing and frustrating to him? Do you see how you going NC, and being unclear or inconsistent with what he needs to do before you'll talk to him again, could be triggering HIS abandonment fears?

Take some space.

I asked him to give me the consideration of letting me know when his appointment is so I can know when to hear from him.

He refused.

I asked him to look up the hours on the internet to see if they are open tomorrow.

He refused.

That's fine.

I get it.

He wants to have things his way.

Ok.

I will lose the battle to win the war.

I will let him take his space how he wants to take it although if I did that to him he would be nasty as heck.

thisagain, I will repost his morning text.


I tried to text, call, message him for 5 hours with the name of the lawyer I picked and he ignored me.

He's not fighting fair.

I tried to text, call, message him between 11:30am and 4:30pm PST and he was not available.

Do you see where he said he would be available between 9am-10pm EST?

He lied to me.

And he justified it by saying I broke up with him yesterday.

I'm supposed to work with that?

He thinks he's perfectly sane.

He contacted me at 4:30pm PST, well after the close of the business day EST.

----------------

   |iiii  You've got it.  The longer you delay making this choice, the more hurt will be piled up on the r/s  At some point there won't be a r/s to save.  You won't see that point coming.  How do you think it best to take the space you need?     

FF

The space thing is a really good idea.

I hear you saying that he is asking you to pick an attorney.  Your frustration and hurt are evident. Possibly hoping he will just man up to the job, tell you HE picked a lawyer, when his appointment is, and to keep you reassured and apprised. You do deserve that.

As FF pointed out, sadly your partner has BPD, so while he is doing technically what you are asking ( and at the last minute!   ) his spirit towards you is very bad. That's hard to bear on top of the inherent feelings of devaluation you may be feeling from how he is handling things. So hurtful 

My best advice to you, for your well being, is to pick an attorney, let him know who it is, and step waaay back from this guy.

I know that is hard, because you are really feeling the need for his comfort and support. You were strong for many years without his support. I hope you are able to reach inside of you for that right now. It may be possible part of his apparent belief that he is the ONE in control of everything is because he thinks you need him more than you need your own self. A step back and some detachment on your part... .and suddenly the power balance shifts back to you in control of you and you handling your things, which means he only has the leverage of his own wonderful self to convince you of anything at all about him.

*mod*

This thread has reached its post limit, and is now closed. This is a worthwhile topic, and you are free to start a new thread to continue the conversation. Thanks for your understanding... .