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The night before last, the former neighbor called me. What should have been an 18 minute conversation turned out to be that plus 3 hours  

When she and her husband first moved next door back in the md '90s, my mom came up and told them that they weren't welcome there (so much for the fruit basket!). The acreage that they bought was literally a forest. They cleared a building pad, improved it, and put up a modular home. N said that when they were digging post holes, that my mom would come on their property and watch them for hours. I knew that my mom hated them moving next door, but I never realized how bad (and creepy!) a neighbor she was. That is, until my mom needed something. N reiterated how in all those years, she doesn't remember my mom ever saying thank you. N's husband also used to complain about my mom's smell (animal waste, cigarette smoke, and mildew). We talked more about the dysfunctional people my mom moved in (two families in the '90s and then mid 2000s). How the last "daughter" came up to their house, asserted that she was my mom's daughter, and how my mom owned not only the road, but also more property. My mom has a legal easement to drive past the property on the road, that's it.

I never heard these stories, but given the fact that the stories N told me in common with the same stories my mom told me over the years, I believe them. My mom was a horrible neighbor... .except when she needed something.

I got copied letter in the mail today, the same one my mom got. The morning before yesterday, the county official called me. Forgive me if I already wrote this, but he wanted to make sure all parties with interest in the property got notified. Given the graceful and generous plan the county gave her regarding the back taxes, my impression is that they don't want to seize the property. My mom probably doesn't see it that way.

I saw verbiage where they notified her a year ago: multiple letters, with no responses by her. This is a mess of her own making.

To give my mom a slight break, this was the time when the scumbag felon who assaulted her moved onto the property. I visited her last summer. She said that she had been taking loads to the dump. I couldn't help myself, and looked around how I thought was surreptitiously. She said, "I know it doesn't look like I've been doing much, but I have." I said ok. Then she told me that Scumbag had strewn trash around her yard. Other than a few bins of canned goods (who knows where he got those), I didn't view anything differently than when I was there a few months' previously.

The original note from the county a year ago mentioned abandoned vehicles. One is almost running. My mom could get at least $500 for it, maybe more. No action. I had mentioned it to her when I gave her my truck 6 years ago.

What happens now is that she has been given 30 days notice to start the clean up. She won't. It has to go before the board of supervisors to get the approval for the county to start the abatement. They'll charge her, and put a lien on the property.

I haven't heard from my mom. I don't want to call. I don't want to hear more of her fantasies. It's affected my work, and it's even affected my time here (10 hours of conversations with N over 3 nights). No one has called me. I'm even hesitant to send my BFAM up to check on her. D3's 4th birthday party is this weekend, and it's also my weekend with the kids. Effectively, two in a row since I had them last Saturday afternoon until Sunday afternoon. Maybe I'm a Waif, too, hiding  

Hang in there, Turkish!  I don't blame you for not wanting to call and understand the trepidation of wondering what will happen next.  Take care of you and your kiddos.  I can relate with the hiding.  If I wasn't married with children, I think I would be perfectly happy being a hermit.  Flea or personality trait-either way, I am worn out from my uBPDm and think you more than deserve stress free Turkish and kiddo time.  Enjoy the birthday!

I don't think you are being waif-ish.  Not dealing with your mother on any of your kid weekends is reasonable.  Seems there is nothing going on there that can't wait until next week. 

And even then, if you decide you don't want to call or help or send your BFAM then I still don't think are being waifish.  And h*ll, even if you are, whatever the reason, it is okay (and good and right and reasonable) to not call when you don't want to call.  Seems authentic and real and honest. 

It would probably be honest and real to say to yourself, "I wish I wanted to call my mom, I wish I had that kind of relationship with her."  That is true.  And it is ALSO true, in that moment of not wanting to call, "but I don't have that kind of relationship and for whatever reason I don't want to call."  That is a-ok!

Makes me think of this great cartoon about changing our mind about sex.  At ANY moment about ANYTHING,  WE CAN CHANGE OUR MIND!

www.everydayfeminism.com/2015/06/how-society-treats-consent/

Enjoy the birthday!

XOXO

Turk I’m no expert on this, but it sounds like you’ve done as much as you can. It’s not your mess (in more ways than one). You’ve been an excellent son and your mother is very lucky to have you. Sounds like you deserve a break (Europe’s nice this time of year).

They say with addiction you sometimes have to hit rock bottom before changing, is hoarding a bit like an addiction ?

Rock bottom is being locked up. She's been through this cycle before... .losing everything, even her hoard. She's never learned, mental illness(es) always the excuse, the result of her childhood trauma. I have great sympathy for that, but that was 60 years ago. The SOB's been dead since 1956!

My ex is a bit like this... ."If only I hadn't grown up watching my parents' marriage... ." Or, "I have a 'sickness'." "But I'll never take pills, no way." Meanwhile, we all suffer to varying degrees.

I can understand losing one property or home in foreclosure due to tough times, but three, consecutively? 40 years as a nurse, and nothing to show for it. Except for a mess, that is, which is about to be taken away by the county and hauled to a dump. At least she helped and healed people during her career. She always hated nursing, and I had to hear about this from a very young age.

All of this would be very simple if I could have managed her money. I don't even know if she knows her property tax payment check bounced. I'll know where that $3K went when I get this month's bank statement in about a week, unless she already changed her address back.

My T once said that hoarding was "fear of loss." Fear of abandonment, pushing people away, like a self-fulfilling prophecy, no? Very BPD.

My take on this is like the old joke about the guy lost at sea in a raft. He prays to God for a miracle. A ship shows up. He says, "no thanks, the Lord will provide!" A day later, a helicopter shows up. "No thanks, the Lord will provide!" Two days later, a small boat shows up, asking him if he needed help. The guy gives the same answer.

After dying at sea, he gets to heaven and asks God, "Why did you never answer my prayers?" God replies, "I sent you a ship, a helicopter and a boat, what more did you want?"

The night before last, her former neighbor called me. Apparently, she's been split white again.

Almost a 2 hour conversation. Luckily, my Ex called and unwittingly rescued me.

My mom, whom I still, haven't heard from, has been trying to clean up her property. A friend had pulled a trailer onto the property, loaded it with stuff. But he left and hadn't been answering my mom's calls. He has health issues, my mom told N. I talked to the guy when my mom firstvlivrd with me. He seemed nice. Not to be classist, but that family are Mountain People, and my mom idealized them. They probably never went inside of her house. She had told me that they wanted to buy the property. I had asked if they had money, or credit. No answer.

N, despite a couple of weeks ago sobbng to me on the phone about he much my mom had hurt her, laid on the FOG big time. She asked kevif I could please just this once help my mom. She said i could get friends to help me, after I said that I needed someone as strong as me to help move furniture and stuff, as my mom couldn't do it. I said that I only had one friend close, but that he worked weekends (I texted said friend and he said that N was crazy... .some truth there).

N said that I should get someone to watch my kids, to put my mom first. Then she told me about how she used to drive hours to take care of her mom, come back to open the conviniemce store she managed by 5 am,and often get only two hours of sleep. When she told me about putting D4 and S6 second, it pissed me off. I witheld some mean thiñgs that came to mind.

Despite tell g her the history, and what N witnessed over 18 years, she still, wants me to rescue. I told her that we had been at this point so many times over the years. Borderline crisis; enablers rescue; Groundhog Day. We moved junk onto her property years ago, stuff for which she had dreams, but has lain rotting, both in heat and snow for so many seasons.

N told me that my mom didn't want to lose the property. I told her that the county would just put a lein on it, and it would just be a debt to be resolved if the property were sold. Since she never got it through probate the last 13 years, no excuse, it will eventually fall upon me.

So now I'm the Bad Son, like N thought almost 20 years ago, for letting my mom live as she did. I actually don't have the kids this weekend, though I have yard work and fence repaiir to do around here. Going to work is also needed, though not required.

N asked my mom about her finances. My mom said it was ok. I got another ntice of the bounced property tax check. I said that my mom was lying to her. "Its not lying, Turkish!" Lying is like survival to the Borderline, according to Lawson. N doesn't get it.

I found out today that Mother's Day is next weekend. I'm FOGing myself. Maube I should go up Saturday, a day trip. It may devolve into an agrument. Turkish has all the answers. It's a wonder I turned out functional, but looking back, I did the opposite of what my mom did. No obsessiin with get rich quick schemes. I taught mysef financial savvy.

If my mom calls me tomorrow, I'll drive the two hours. Right now, I'm inclined more to hide. She got a month's notice. I feel like driving up in two weeks. I have the kids next weekend, Mother's Day.

Maybe I'm a bad son? After the thousands of dollars, and dealing with the dysfunctional people she's brought into her life (having rescued her in 2005 when she was in danger), I'm done.

Hi Turkish,  when you are done you're done. It 's ok. Who could blame you? Triangulation comes to mind and boundaries reading this... .In my own experience I no longer do lengthy phonecalls with anyone... .Have done in the past... .Only brought misery and more dysfunctional drama into my life. I also hate anybody 'should'-ing me about anything,  it's shaming. My T told me lately that sometimes when we expand (set a boundary for ourselves) the self - doubt (inner critic) kicks back harder afterwards... .Food for thought?

Best wishes whatever you decide to do.

Hi Turk,

It does look like they’re laying it heavy at your door, but I think your right to put your kids first, as my T said kids need our help and should be first priority over adults who can help themselves. You also have to consider your own health. Tell those flying monkeys to keep flying.

From what you say you’re a great son, but a BPD is expert at convincing us we’re not. If you’re painted black you’re wrong before you do anything, so why worry about stuff you can do nothing about ?

I would also agree that you’ve done a fantastic job at avoiding the flees of your childhood. Personally I think if you can go through the childhood we had to endure, and remain off drugs in work and a moral then that’s a stratospheric achievement. I can't think of a bigger one, except maybe what Gandi did and America winning a soccer game (I assume this must have happened by now). It has been the hardest challenge in my life by a long way. So well done us.  I’ll e-mailing you a massive gold medal. But seriously Turk, treat yourself I think you deserve it.

One thing that occurs is that waifs will always look to get Mr fixer to do it. So the only way to get them to do stuff is simply ensure they know they are enabled to do it, and unable to to get you to do it. But not sure how that applies to a BPD, as I learn't this when I was being trained to manage people in general.

Now if were exchanging jokes, “Why do giraffe’s have long necks ? Because their feet smell”  

Have a good weekend Turk.

smells like triangulation to me... .Maybe give N a break -when she calls find something else to do? Turkish, I have been through times in comparison to which getting out of bed in the morning, getting dressed and on my way to work to feels like winning the Olympics. You do that every weekday. You deserve one BIG pat on the back.

My take is that between two kids and BPD ex you have enough on your plate. Those are people you don't have a choice about. Take care of you so you've got something to give your kids. I've weekend parented myself, in my experience they come determined to get every last drop of attention they didn't get for the last week. And to get enough love to last for the next week. It is exhausting. Save some energy for that. Don't get drained by the energy vampires!

What you do is provide your mom with a choice. it is enough. She'll come home when she's hungry.

As for Mothers Day I reckon BPDF will be very busy. Me, I'm practicing my Gray Rock. I'm aiming for a level of utter boringness that will get uNBPD mom off the phone in double quick time :)  , khib

I called my mom yesterday. I timed it on the way with my kids over to the ex-laws' due to being invited for food in the evening. I didn't have to go, but it was the nice thing to do. The kids had a good time for a few hours.

My mom asked why I was calling. I said that it was mother's day and the kids and I wanted to say hi. She said, "Thank God for Mother's Day then."

She said that her friend, the one that has been helping clean up the property, has a friend who wants to buy the acreage. He had just spent the day there looking around. The creek is running high. Minus the hoard, it's a nice 5 acres. I told her to not accept less than $50K. She didn't say anything. I asked where she was going to live, and she said that they would put a micro-home on the property and that she could live there until death. Yeah, right. We had to go.

About an hour later, I got a call from my mom's former neighbor. They had played phone tag all day and she had just talked to my mom, who said she had talked to me. N is worried about my mom and wants to become her advocate. She said that the friend is a scumbag, and that my mom said that she was going over to the prospective buyer's home that evening for dinner, a stranger. She said that my mom wouldn't give her the guy's number or tell her where she was going. I said that my mom probably felt that N was trying to control her. "But I'm not trying to control her!" I attempted to tell her that whatever my my felt was her reality, but it was falling on deaf ears. I gave up trying to explain it.

She's worried that they are taking advantage of my mom. I said, "maybe, but she can't legally sell the property to anyone since it isn't in her name." Then N told me that my mom told her that they guy was going to pay $100K for the property. With a home on it, it's worse more than that; with a shack, probably about half (here I got into an argument over property values... .I almost suggested that she should Zillow properties in the county). N told me that a businessman nearby was willing to pay $10K, and that my mom had considered it, but maybe $20K. I said that for $10K, I could just write a check. I shouldn't have told N this (never mind that's my emergency fund and the like). "Why don't you?" Because I want no part of this mess.

N said that the businessman had gone down with my mom to the county and obtained records showing her married to her deceased husband, whose name is on the property title. It implied that the property may not have to go through probate. This was news to me, because that's all I've been hearing for the past 13 years.  I also learned that her new neighbor has been going around saying that my mom already sold him the property.

I said to N to back up and think about it, and no one would get away with anything here. Who knows what the truth is at this point since N has only learned of all of this from things my mom said. Who knows that the real story is. N kept saying that my mom needed an advocate, and that she was going to be that advocate. I told her to call APS ("What's that?" Adult Protective Services) if she really thought that my mom was in trouble. "I won't do that to your mom! I need to do something though, since your mom keeps calling me! I'm a wreck!" or words to that effect. I told her that she could simply not answer the phone. "But your mom needs someone!" I told her that being her friend for so many years, she experienced being split so many times. "I'm not your mom's friend, though. I was just her neighbor who did so much for her over the years!" 

N then started talking about the medication my mom was on. That she looked it up and since my mom told me that I gave her one pill a day at night, that it was wrong. She was supposed to take one pill in the morning. I said that I only gave her a pill because my mom would forget to take them. The pills were in a cabinet, not hidden. N said that the wrong dosage would affect her memory. I told N that my mom took herself off the pills late in January, and that she got better. "But your mom said she was on them living with you!" I told her, "what can you believe here? My mom doesn't even recall."

There was more back and forth, and I started getting pissed, even raising my voice. N said "I don't know where this anger is coming from, your mom always ever said good things about you over the years!" I reminded her of our previous conversations, and also my mom getting in my face, calling me a liar, conspirator, a snoop, and my kids snoops as well." But you did get into her mail!" No, I only opened a bank statement and two bounced check notices after my mom left. Neither me nor the kids ever touched her mail. My mom was paranoid delusional.

We went on for a while. She told me to get the friend's number. "Tonight, please, so I can sleep well." I told her that I would log on at work the next day (today). I checked, and then remembered that my mom called the friend on her burner phone, so I don't have it.

Though all of this, I tried reiterating that my mom was mentally ill. "But she sounded good!" I said that she did to me, too, but that she was back into this same pattern of fantasizing about how good people were, and in the end, almost all of them turn out to be horrible, or she splits them black, even me, kind of, while living with me. I related the incident with the weird family living with her back in '04-'05. N remembers them. I told her that the 30 year old woman was going around saying how my mom was going to adopt her (to get the property!). My mom told me that at the time and I just thought   

Another "daughter" my mom got after that I once made the mistake of calling a "flake." My mom angrily replied, "She is NOT a flake!" A year later, my mom said, "you know my friend? She's a flake."

I know who my mom is. I know what's she's done, and probably is going to do. It's been a lifelong pattern. I don't know if there's anything I should be doing. Let N get into the position I was in the beginning of the year, trying to reason what should be done, yet rejected and blocked in all ways. N=CODEPENDENT.



I suppose I'll call N tonight to tell her I don't have the number. It's frustrating, in a way slightly entertaining, but I also get bits and pieces of real information about what's going on.

I called N last night to tell her I didn't have the number after going through my phone records and then remembering that my mom called the friend on the trac phone that I got her (there's over $100 down the drain).

N was better. My mom told her that though she was 74, she knew what she was doing and could take care of herself. I told N that it would be good for her to let it go as I have.

I talked to my buddy, who talked to his mom. She said that if they found the marriage license, that my mom should get the properties in her name. The 5 acres she lives on, and his 2 acres. No probate. So the drama of probate probably ends, including the $700 I gave her 13 ears ago "fr prrobate" which she blew on most likely her "orchard" which is dozens of potted trees she bought, 95% of them dead and unplanted.

Looking back, my mom trusts people she shouldn't trust, and doesn't trust those whom she should. Co-deoendent or not, N genuinely would help my mom, no finincial strings attached. Me, too. But her paranoia rules. She will end up losing everything, as she almost did over ten years ago with the "gypsy" family who moved themselves onto her property, whom my mom called me eventually to kick out, and I did, with support of friends who confronted them. So be it.

Good for you, Turkish! I too made my peace with the material things.  My uNBPD maternal grandfather used to change his will every few months to get attention. Had all his children at loggerheads by cutting the one out and putting the other in, then changing his mind whenever he needed narcissistic supply. He eventually left a will so complicated that ten years later it is still going through probate. Now my uNBPD mom is bored and threatening to change her will. Good idea! I said. Not going there. Would end up spending it all on therapy fees if I paid the slightest attention. I may be poor but managing to stay out of the psychiatric ward. That works for me.  , khib

I got another copied letter from the county this week. It said that an on site visit to my moms property observed some progress (removal of abandoned vehicles), but that there was still a lot of "solid waste" that needs removal. I haven't heard from her Narc-y neighbor who wants the property, not from my mom. I've been getting calls from "number unavailable" the past few days, but no messages. She blcis her number, but I can't remember if it is that or "Private Number." I'm not calling her, though I do want to go up to the mountains to brig my brother from another mother. The kids keep asking, too. It's election season, and I've also not been answering local numbers. Being a people pleaser, once the pollsters ask for my time, I feel that have to give it  

The kids' mom and I met with a T again today for S6. The whole molestation thing from last year may be rearing its head again. She referred us to TBCBT (trauma based). I have enough going on here to worry about a stubborn, paranoid elderly woman, even if she is my mother. Between kids, uBPDx (who isn't bad these days, just annoying and frustrating  sometimes), job which may be precarious, and BPD/PTSD/OCD/Depressed mom, I can only function so much.