BPDFamily.com

So, I'm in a partially broken up status with my pwBPD.

The reasons I ended it were jealousy, alcohol use, rages and dishonesty. We've continued contact somewhat regularly. We talk most days but only see other a couple times a week and pretty much no sex or very little sex - it would probably be more but I'm going through a major crisis with one of my kids so I'm a basket case. It's a long complicated story. He promises to work on his behavior but it never lasts very long.

Anyway, he's insanely jealous of one of my clients - I'm a consultant.

Today I believe he followed me to my client's office or went there to check up on me. When I told him I needed to go to work today he insisted I hadn't told him, which I know I did - I am careful to give him a heads up because of his jealousy. After work, when I was pulling out of the parking lot, I rounded a corner and there he was.

He said he had to drop something off in the same complex for something related to his work but he was unshaven (for days), not showered, and wearing shorts and a t-shirt - not appropriate work attire. He grilled me on why I was working so late (I don't believe I'd ever said how long I'd be and anyway, it wasn't quite an 8-hour day - I was done before 5). He wanted to know where we had lunch, what we did etc. Mind you it wasn't just me and the client - it was a group of 6 people working on this project all day.

A few weeks previously when I had to work with the same client he called and texted about 10 times and then when I returned his calls after work, announced "I think there's something more going on then work with you and your client." I set a boundary that I would not discuss it with him - it was his issue and I wasn't going to defend myself every time I had to work.

I'm used to handling the insecurity, but the idea of him following me is frightening - I have to say it's the first time in 9 years I've felt truly afraid of him.

Last night I met a girlfriend for a drink on the spur of the moment. He usually has no problem with me hanging out with this particular friend but I usually give a heads up. I didn't this time because we met late afternoon and I didn't expect to hear from him for hours - he contacted me earlier than expected. I told him what I was doing and even invited him to join us. He declined and then texted me that he "needed a break", which was just a bs attempt to punish me. I just said "ok" and that if he was launching into an episode not to call me until he'd worked through it. He called this morning, tying hard to act normal but clearly still miffed.

On one hand, I think well, there could be a scenario in which I would be miffed by him going out for drinks spontaneously - but even so I wouldn't tell him I "needed a break" over it. On the other hand I feel like adults who don't live together shouldn't have to clear their activities with their partner? Or should they? Was it discourteous of me to go out for a drink without telling him before I went? I told him hours before I ever would have seen him that evening had he wanted to get together - it was about 5 when I told him and normally I wouldn't see him until 7 or 7:30.

And then with this client, this guy really tweaks him because he's wealthy, single and something of a ladies man. I've tried every which way to reassure him - I've known this client for a decade and I genuinely have zero interest him and think he's kind of a narcissist but I could see where he might make someone insecure. So, is it a little reasonable that he's jealous? I certainly can be jealous but following me? That seems over the top. It is over the top.

But it's crazy - I'm crazy - I'm so used to this that I justify his behaviors and don't really have an internal compass anymore -  I don't even know what I think is normal behavior.

I think for some people - maybe my partner - the couple/family comes first and everything is run by the partner and even then, you just don't have a huge social life outside of your primary r/s. I can see where this makes everyone feel comfy and secure. But I am more the kind of person that meets friends for drinks on occasion (like once or twice a month) or spontaneously will want to grab a bite after work - it's completely innocent. I'm generally a nervous wreck when I do those things because even though I'm always considerate and tell him - I never go MIA - I know even if he says it's okay he's likely to be set off by it.

This is a difficult status. I had that too, for months, and the lack of clarity (really just a clear decision on my part) led me to also feel confused about what I owed him in terms of explanations or heads-ups and was probably a really tough and weird place for him. Anyone might have trouble with shades of grey like this, but BPDs in particular. Remember - emotionally constituted like children - that's the easy way I found to help me remember :)


These are very good reasons. But how did you end it?


That's good you set a boundary.


So it's not happened before? This could then be because he feels the possibility of losing you as an attachment in a new and more immediate way than before.  Did you say anything about this at any point afterwards? It's definitely a new boundary that's been crossed. Panicky and controlling behaviour.


This is very familiar from my own relationship, Samanthal. The checking up, the decision to not join up, the wounded silence afterwards. He doesn't know where he is in the relationship at the moment, he doesn't know what's expected, or how to "be" (how to act, which self to perform). 


It was not discourteous. In a healthy relationship, people come and go and keep each other in the loop to varying degrees at different times. It depends and people give each other rope and the benefit of the doubt. And they are happy to hear that their partner has had a nice time with a friend for a while!
In a relationship with a BPD such behaviour can create feelings of insecurity, a fear of abandonment, jealousy, and the attendant childish behaviours.


You're not crazy.  I totally know what you mean and how it feels that way! But you are not. You are tired and stressed from this kind of jealousy and adjusting your behaviours incrementally to not give rise to them - to not trigger him.   Walking on the proverbial eggshells, tiptoeing around his sensitivities, and dealing with inconsistencies can lead to a sense of not knowing what's normal anymore.  You have to define normal for yourself, we all do. This was probably not "normal" in previous relationships, I'm guessing?

Makes sense.


I ended it very plainly and my true intent and desire was to have it be utterly over. He'd been in a step-father role with my son so I hoped he would continue that r/s but I was prepared that he might not.

Basically, I explained I was very unhappy, had been for a very, very long time and I didn't want to be in the r/s anymore, that I cared about him and wanted him to be happy but that it would never be with me.

He badgered and begged and vowed he would wow me with changes. Went into therapy, drank less and honored my boundaries in terms of staying away but asked that he be able to talk to me by phone periodically, so I reluctantly agreed. It snowballed a bit over time. My son missed him - he played on that, offering to take him out to eat or other things. Then my son began having problems and he pitched in with that.

I wavered at times - thinking maybe there was a way we could be together without it killing me. I never actually articulated that to him but I'm sure he could see it.


I have suspected spying behavior but never caught him red-handed. I'm sure this isn't the first time though.


Well, as it turns out last night was a new low. I went out with a friend for her birthday - something I'd warned him about in advance - it was an early night - just dinner. He texted me something childish at dinner and said he was going to bed. When I got home he called quite drunk and angry. I tried to get him to go to bed. Often I can persuade him to hang up and sleep it off but not last night. He called incessantly. I told him not to come over or I would call the police but he came. I locked myself in a room and called them. They came and gave me a lecture about giving mixed messages (that was humiliating), cuffed him and ultimately decided not to charge him with anything (i didn't want him charged).

They drove him home and within ten minutes he was back pounding on my bedroom window, yelling. Scared me out of my mind. By the time police returned he had gotten into his car and drove off.

I was called in the middle of the night by victim services. Apparently after they came out the second time they went to his house and arrested him for DV. He was held in jail overnight.

I feel like such an a**hole. I never wanted him to get into legal trouble. I was very frightened - although he's never hit me, he's another person when he's drunk, raging and irrational and he owns firearms - lots of them. The cops certainly made sure I knew how much they thought I'd overreacted or had brought it on myself for not cutting him off totally a long time ago.

I hear what you're saying - given their make-up a pwBPD can't handle undefined or limbo-like scenarios. It wasn't my intention to string him along. I guess I was hoping that either we could be friends or that he would magically get help and we could actually try again. The alcohol makes the BPD behaviors 1000x worse and if he just could've gotten that under control, I would've jumped back in - for better or worse and dealt with the BPD.

I guess this is my rock bottom. Have to end the r/s totally. Not sure how I will break this to my son. I know my bf is going to come around at some point (when he's allowed - judge ordered no contact) and beg, go to AA meetings etc. I'm hoping I won't waiver. I feel like he needs a year sober for me to even consider. Once he had 4 months and as soon as he got me back he started up again.

I just think about all of this ridiculous eggshell walking I have to do just to take a friend out for her birthday or go to work - going to work triggers him. And, in those instances he's not drunk. When we were together I would have a lot, and I mean a lot - 2x a day, of sex with him to keep him placated, as well as daily gourmet meals waiting etc - even then there were eggshells - so I don't know if even not drinking will cover it. I doubt I can go back.

Just to answer a few questions I forgot to address:

I did address the spying behavior but he made up a story as to why he was there and once he lies, he commits to it for life, so there's no point in belaboring it. I let him know I was disturbed about it.

My previous (healthy) relationships haven't involved this kind of "accountability," reporting in, rages and insecurity. My second (and last) marriage was to an emotionally abusive and controlling guy but his variety of crazy didn't involve jealousy and fear of abandonment.

All of my relationships except the last two - to my husband and now my current guy - have been what I would describe as normal - no eggshells, no rages or over the top jealousy or cheating.

I think my abusive marriage primed me for this current r/s. My partner wBPD, while also controlling and emotionally/verbally abusive, was actually an improvement. Despite his sometimes horrid behavior, he was very often kind, loving, considerate, helpful and affectionate. My ex-husband was a jerk 24-7.

Hi Samanthal,

That sounds like a really rough night you had. You did the right thing in contacting the police. You were frightened, he appeared out of control - that is the time to reach out for help! I am sorry that the police chastised you - I have read here a couple of other references to the not always well-informed and sensitive behaviour of police officers in situations like this. Poor training and people skills that results in the 'victim' feeling like they've done the wrong thing. It's actually inexusable.

What happened after that should set your mind at rest about your reaction. The fact that he came back after having been handcuffed, and ended up spending the night in jail obviously means that the police did take his behaviour seriously enough, finally.

I understand you feel bad about the effect on him - but you did not cause that situation. He did. His mental illness combined with the alcohol led to these behaviours that put you in danger and under a lot of stress.  There were many times I felt I skated pretty closely to these kinds of situations - although mine never fully lost the run of himself to the point of my needing to involve the law. It occurred to me more than once that this was a possibility in the future and I couldn't really wrap my head around it and am not sure how I would have handled it or how I would have felt about it.

It seems that it would be better for you to accept that continuing to be in contact with him is not helping either of you. I understand completely your wanting to maintain his contact with your son, but that burden of care is too much for you in the sense that you can't structure it the way that you would like it to work. Your BPD is not mature or healthy enough to set aside his own feelings enough to step up and continue a supportive relationship with your child. Is your son at all aware of any of the behaviours that cause you upset? There is definitely an age-appropriate way to explain your reasons for not being involved with this man anymore. Let's think on that.

I am sure that other members here will chime in with some solid and practical tips - but for now, can you consider being in no contact? Have you read this: https://bpdfamily.com/bpdresources/nk_a110.htm   It's about No Contact. I think it would be helpful to you right now.

Once things start to escalate the way you describe, there is so much drama that none of the involved parties can function normally anymore. Right now, you need to think about giving yourself a break from it all.

The work of figuring out how your past 'primed' you for this relationship is valuable and important, but all in good time. First thing is to create a bit of a space around yourself to give yourself a chance to think and rest up.   

 
 

Yes, that makes sense - the first order of business is sorting out how I explain this to my son. He's certainly capable of understanding the concept of drinking too much and behaving badly - he's had his own recent incidents of behaving in ways that frightened me and thus having to leave the house for a period of time.

I suppose he's going to get stuck on why my partner gets tossed permanently. He may wonder if that's in the offing for him as well - not necessarily a bad thing at this point. My son might benefit from a dose of reality. Truly he too could be tossed more permanently if he continues to be aggressive and frightening.

It will be devastating for him because my partner is a father figure. 9 years he was around and for most of it, every day. He really looked up to the guy - not entirely a positive. My son is almost 18 so I guess they could have an independent r/s. My ex-partner could pick my son up from work or school, spend time with him and then drop him out front. I'm not saying this could happen anytime soon but down the road and with strict guidelines including he can't come in the house. I could be sure to not be home at the anticipated drop off time. That can be worked out later because I'm not allowing in the near future.

The other piece is if my son knows xpwBPD scared me - if I decide to go that far in my explanation - he may be angry with my ex and not want to see him. That's okay too.

The thought of helping him through a grieving process around this is a bit daunting. I've got a lot on my plate emotionally as it is. But, generally, he's only gotten terribly emotional around girls he has crushes on and even with all the drama with his bio dad and the estrangement that's gone on - he was never overtly depressed or acting out around it, so maybe it won't be so bad.

The final piece is all my ego - my son, due to his disabilities, is the town cryer - he will tell everyone and anyone whatever I tell him related to this break up. If history is a guide, it will be mortifying to comical and everything in between.

I particularly hate the idea of my abusive ex-husband/bio dad having this information. It feels like the most embarrassing failure to not only have another r/s terminate but to have had one with someone who is alcoholic and abusive. I'm sure my ex husband will use this to further perpetuate the notion that my accusations against him were all lies and that I am a "psycho". Not sure why this bothers me - doesn't every dumped-guy say his ex is a psycho? I have to get over it.

Luckily, I have a pile of work to attack. I hope I can dive into it and just forget this for a little while.

Never thought I'd be writing something in defense of the police, but here goes: I've heard that domestic violence incidents are the number one reason that police officers get injured or killed in the line of duty.

Having mistakenly dialed 911 in an argument with my husband, where I was holding the phone and had dialed "91" and was saying that if he advanced further in my direction, I'd dial the next "1"--and I did, and he backed off, then I hung up. Of course, they called back and I told them it was a mistake, but that we had been arguing, and the dispatcher said they had to send officers out anyway. So I met them at the gate alone and it took a lot of talking, but I convinced them I wasn't in any danger.

I have compassion for them because they're frequently called to the same residences for ongoing disputes, which often become increasingly violent over time, and I think they want their presence to serve as a wake-up call.

That said, I think you did the right thing calling the police, both for your ex-partner and yourself. I was in a longterm marriage with a pwBPD who started off badgering me and tracking my whereabouts and the verbal abuse over time escalated to physical violence. I regret not calling the police on him so many times. Finally, I'd had enough and broke up with him. Some years later he was arrested for assaulting his next wife and they ultimately fled the state before his arraignment and he had an active arrest warrant for years.

So I think it's a good thing that you called the police and hopefully this will serve as a wakeup call for him before he engages in any behavior that might keep him behind bars for more than overnight. And I think this is important for you to see that his behavior is considered serious enough that it warranted him being arrested. 

And your son, regardless of his disabilities, soon is legally an adult, with the right to see whomever he wants. If he and your ex-partner truly have an enduring relationship, they can continue without your approval. I think it's appropriate to explain your fear about his behavior to your son and let him decide if he wants further contact with him. Otherwise, you're enabling a fantasy for your son about him.

And yes, it is embarrassing to know that your son will likely blab the story around town, but as you have learned reading here, not all relationships are what the appear to be from the outside and it's likely many people will have compassion and understanding for your situation. Is is really a "failure" to get out of an abusive relationship with an alcoholic pwBPD? I don't think so. I had no idea how, or if, I was ever going to get out of my marriage with my violent ex, but when I finally made that decision, I never regretted it for a minute. The only thing I regretted was that it took me so long to do it!

   

Yes, I do get it about the police - I'm sure you can get jaded really quickly dealing with dv calls. But to be lectured and disbelieved by a twenty-something year old young cop was just humiliating. Maybe if he could have laid off the judgmental commentary that would have been helpful.

I don't know that my ex would ever get physically violent. I may have overreacted to some extent. He badgers me for hours when he gets like that, will come and go several times throughout the night. I doze off and suddenly I hear the door open loudly and he's in my room ranting and it's very difficult or impossible to get him out. I become broken down very quickly, sobbing, begging for him to leave me alone, trying to keep the whole thing quiet if my son is home (he wasn't the night the cops came). Sometimes I would hyperventilate from it.

I actually forgot this when describing our break up last year - that was the main reason - it got so I would hyperventilate when I saw him. I had no control over it - he just caused that much anxiety in me. I had no choice but to end it - hyperventilating on a daily basis is obviously not an option.

He's escalated now because in addition to our being in this half-in-half-out set up my son has been in crisis for the past two months, which has meant I have nothing left over for my partner - whenever that happens he can't keep track of the "why". He spirals into insecurity and paranoia and resentment about not getting his "needs met" and becomes convinced I'm sleeping with someone else, etc. I have to keep reminding him that I'm dealing with a crisis and I will be able to focus more on him later.

Yes, truly the mindset of a child.

And, I too regret not getting out much, much sooner. Their were massive red flags within months of dating that I overlooked.

I think  C<||| Cat Familiar put it well: "And your son, regardless of his disabilities, soon is legally an adult, with the right to see whomever he wants. If he and your ex-partner truly have an enduring relationship, they can continue without your approval. I think it's appropriate to explain your fear about his behavior to your son and let him decide if he wants further contact with him. Otherwise, you're enabling a fantasy for your son about him. "

You're still the mother and the boss of the house and the boss of yourself. For now, you get to decide who gets to come in, who gets to hang out, and who keeps away. Something like " BPD has always had issues with alcohol. They are not under control at the moment and haven't been for a while. I didn't want to make a big deal out of it because I know he's important to you and that is important to me. However, right now it's not  good for me or this house for him to be in contact. I don't want him around for that reason. We'll see how things go and review it in few weeks"

I don't know how you speak to your son, obviously. So how firm a tone you take, or how gentle you make your voice when you say something like that to him would make a difference. It all depends on your relationship with him and how you are as individuals. 

I guess my point is you can be vague, and give him less actual information that he could impart to others. But you need to give him enough so that he gets that you mean it and that it's for real.

I don't know if that's of any use to you, I hope a little.

It's very helpful.

Cat Familiar and Vit C - thank you so much! There's a lot of wisdom on this little website - I'm so incredibly lucky to have found it.

I love what both of you've written - Cat - you're right - I need to stop perpetuating this fantasy of what and who my ex is and what our r/s is. It doesn't serve anyone. And, anyway even if I could sell it to my son, it's so unhealthy - to have an alcoholic with untreated mental illness and abusive tendencies in a parenting role - what was I thinking? And then to pretend everything is wonderful, like a true codependent - it's not good - it's got to stop immediately.

Vit C - I love the language you've come up with. It's honest and real but doesn't include a lot of details I'd rather not share with the entire town  My son, though disabled, is aware enough to hear that. He may not like it, but he will grasp it. If he wants to spend time with my ex at some point down the road, I will allow it though I can't imagine allowing it before his case is adjudicated and we get a few months beyond the break up.

It's easy enough for me to not be home when pick up and drop off happen so I can avoid contact.

The last few days have been surreal. Is it really over? Coming out of this insanity should be interesting.

I think codependency is on a continuum and it is a positive to be optimistic and see the glass as "half full" but I've certainly been over the top with hoping and believing that someone with a personality disorder can once again fully become that wonderful person they were able to show me at the beginning of the relationship.

I'm reminded of that wonderful quote that I'll undoubtedly misquote: "When people show you who they are, believe them."

In my case it stems from growing up with my mother. "When she was good, she was very good and when she was bad, she was awful." I put this in quotes because I think I'm stealing yet another famous quotation.

So as a result of this, in spite of all odds, I believed that the good would yet return again. And it did on occasion. (Intermittent reinforcement) Because of this, I had a sunny optimism--I was even called "Pollyanna" in my youth. Fortunately that belief in eventual positive outcomes didn't result in a gambling disorder!

Ha - A gambling disorder might be an improvement over the drama I've had the past 9 years

Optimism is good, caring about people is good but of course there's a limit. It took me a long time to understand the big picture and see that his symptoms were part of a larger disorder and not situational. At first I thought he just needed reassurance to get past his insecurities, that in time he'd loosen his grip and I could again spend time with friends or work in the evenings (he used to leave if I had to work at night - even when we were for all intents and purposes living together) or travel to see a relative.

Gosh, when I think of how manipulative he was - he would walk out if I took a phone call from a girlfriend or if he came home and I was on the phone, he'd walk out and then either give me the silent treatment or start a huge fight. He's refuse to eat dinner if I'd already eaten - this after he'd arrived home 2 hours later for supper.

And intermittent reinforcement was huge - you want to believe the good self they show is the real self, when almost always it's the bad self that's real.

Live and learn - just wish I'd figure all of this out much, much sooner.